Journalism and sexism in the games industry

[Ganrich]

So, a few things I would like to add.

 

1)  http://www.zenofdesign.com/in-which-i-acknowledge-and-apologize/

 

I don't agree with Damion Schubert on many things, but this is pretty amazing.  Also:  http://www.gamepolitics.com/2014/11/11/long-overdue-correction-and-apology-brad-wardell#.VGKie8lbTII

 

I can respect anyone that publicly state that they were wrong on such a grievous issue.  I have heard some others apologized, but didn't find the articles.  Admittedly, I am being lazy, and I want to actually play some video games today. 

 

2)  Stephen Totilo said they are no longer agreeing to embargoes that keep reviews from releasing until launch day.  Apparently, the AC Unity Embargo kept a review from launching until 12pm (not sure which time zone).  This was well after the midnight release.  Here is his article on the topic:  http://kotaku.com/regarding-post-release-review-embargoes-yesterday-i-1657482663/all

 

It doesn't mean that they won't still sign embargoes, but at least this can potentially keep them from being silenced for half the day of launch. 

 

3)  TB is awesome, and I agree with the pic from above. 

 

4)  Also, I love Double Dragon.  Sue me.

 

5)  I was listening to music earlier while reading this thread and poking through twitter reading the GG goings on, and this song stood out.  It seems somewhat relevant. 

 

 

Lyrics are in the video if you can't understand him. 

[PK htiw klaw eriF]

****, someone I know has been trying to get me into Clucth and now I may have to listen to them.

[Orogun01]

****, someone I know has been trying to get me into Clucth and now I may have to listen to them.

Is a bit too southern country rock for my taste.

[Ganrich]

Most of their stuff is blues-centric actually.  Neil Fallon's vocals are the big issue for most people.  You grow to love his voice, or hate it.  I will link some of their different stuff in the music thread so we can keep this one on topic.

 

http://forums.obsidian.net/topic/69240-music-must-go-on/

 

EDIT:  Fallon's lyrics are also amazing.  Just saying.

Edited November 12, 2014 by Ganrich

[Volourn]

"I don't agree with Damion Schubert on many things, but this is pretty amazing."

 

\He's a piece of crap and his fake 'apology' proves it. Not to mention the close of comment. He's too much of  coward to face his punishment for being a doo doo brian.

 

Also, James Fudge's last name is fitting. Another scumbag.

 

 

"Receiving review copies is a professional courtesy afforded to us by game creators both big and small. It's not a right,"

 

100% right on.

 

 

"We nevertheless also think it would be a courtesy for publishers to allow any reviews based on early copies to be published in time with a game's release, not a minute later, not 12 hours after a midnight launch."

 

100% wrong.

 

The demands these pieces of crap make are hilarious. They owe you NOTHING.

Edited November 12, 2014 by Volourn

[Shallow]

So the whole GG scandal began 3 months ago, what would you say are its biggest achievements so far ?

 

In other words how would you dispute a view that said " GG hasn't accomplished much and never will "

 

We've made our people aware of better alternatives, which means even when this ends we'll never ever be looking at reviews from the sites we're fighting now, we've gotten a few sites I expect we'd otherwise be fighting to adapt acceptable ethics policies, though we've yet to see if they follow them, and we're bleeding the sites we're fighting of advertisers by showing the advertisers what terrible people they are. We've accomplished part 1 of the 3 things I said we needed to accomplish regarding games journalism, we're well on our way with part two, I haven't seen much work on part 3 yet, but part 3 is the hard part.

[Hurlshort]

I'm still confused about the idea that anyone takes gaming websites seriously when it comes to reviews.  That just boggles my mind.  

[Shallow]

I'm still confused about the idea that anyone takes gaming websites seriously when it comes to reviews.  That just boggles my mind.  

Personally I haven't visited most of those websites ever, I've been to a couple of them one or twice though. But reviews still have power, think of that stuff with New Vegas and metacritic, granted I doubt New Vegas got bad reviews for not being progressive, but it still goes to show that reviewers hold some slight power. Besides, if you don't know other gamers and don't like to hang around forums, without reviews you'll have no way of finding out what the chances are that you'll like a game before buying it.

[BruceVC]

 

So the whole GG scandal began 3 months ago, what would you say are its biggest achievements so far ?

 

In other words how would you dispute a view that said " GG hasn't accomplished much and never will "

 

We've made our people aware of better alternatives, which means even when this ends we'll never ever be looking at reviews from the sites we're fighting now, we've gotten a few sites I expect we'd otherwise be fighting to adapt acceptable ethics policies, though we've yet to see if they follow them, and we're bleeding the sites we're fighting of advertisers by showing the advertisers what terrible people they are. We've accomplished part 1 of the 3 things I said we needed to accomplish regarding games journalism, we're well on our way with part two, I haven't seen much work on part 3 yet, but part 3 is the hard part.

 

 

Okay and just be clear what are the better alternatives when it comes to gaming websites? As you know I use websites like RPS and Gamasutra but if there are other options that offer the same information I would be interested in hearing what they are. ( And of course there are dozens of gaming websites but I am looking for the ones endorsed by GG )

 

And final point question apart from Intel and Gamasutra what advertising has been pulled from any particular website due to the endeavours of GG?

[Shallow]

Okay and just be clear what are the better alternatives when it comes to gaming websites? As you know I use websites like RPS and Gamasutra but if there are other options that offer the same information I would be interested in hearing what they are. ( And of course there are dozens of gaming websites but I am looking for the ones endorsed by GG )

 

And final point question apart from Intel and Gamasutra what advertising has been pulled from any particular website due to the endeavours of GG?

This site has a list of what it deems alternatives, I don't know about all of them, but the ones I've looked at seem alright. http://gamergate.me/approved/

 

I haven't been keeping track about which advertisers have dropped, so I can't say who, we've gotten a decent amount of advertisers out though. I'm sure someone here has been following that more actively than me, to get a quicker answer I'd advice asking at the 8chan gamergate board if you're able to stand the general atmosphere.

[Orogun01]

I'm still confused about the idea that anyone takes gaming websites seriously when it comes to reviews.  That just boggles my mind.  

Yes, there are some people who haven't read enough articles to realize that these people are crazy.

[Longknife]

I've never watch Anita's videos so I can't really say if she's reasonable or not. I get the impression she isn't though.

 

 

Go ahead and give them a watch. It's a good exercise in seeing just how reasonable/unreasonable someone you disagree with is.

[TrashMan]

Come on guys this old view that  " words don't matter and you must just ignore them because its the Internet" is so pre-GG its actually hilarious that on this very thread people are making that point and expecting the rest of us to believe it

 

One of the foundations of the creation of GG is about the insult associated with the word "gamers" and the outrage and offense that certain gamers felt.

 

So lets stop suggesting that words are irrelevant because that's not how most of you who support GG have been acting

 

There is one crucial difference here.

 

This isn't some random Joe saying hurtful things. This is organized journalistic media engaging in a large smear campaign. This is people peddling serious accusations, and spreading lies to the public.

This is people attempting large-scale censorship.

 

This does bloody well effect a LOT of people and in a very bad way.

[Longknife]

My god...

 

http://www.reddit.com/r/KotakuInAction/comments/2m16oi/polygon_accepted_750000_from_microsoft_to_create/

[kirottu]

My god...

 

http://www.reddit.com/r/KotakuInAction/comments/2m16oi/polygon_accepted_750000_from_microsoft_to_create/

 

Soggy-eggrolls posted this on the comments:

[namelesshero]

Do you guys just brush off the fact that most devs are against you?

[kirottu]

Milo really went balls to the wall with this one:

http://www.breitbart.com/Breitbart-London/2014/11/12/The-authoritarian-Left-was-on-course-to-win-the-culture-wars-then-along-came-GamerGate

[Gorgon]

 

I'm still confused about the idea that anyone takes gaming websites seriously when it comes to reviews.  That just boggles my mind.  

Personally I haven't visited most of those websites ever, I've been to a couple of them one or twice though. But reviews still have power, think of that stuff with New Vegas and metacritic, granted I doubt New Vegas got bad reviews for not being progressive, but it still goes to show that reviewers hold some slight power. Besides, if you don't know other gamers and don't like to hang around forums, without reviews you'll have no way of finding out what the chances are that you'll like a game before buying it.

 

If a metacritic score determines whether a contract pays out a bonus then I'd say reviews matter. 

[Fighter]

Do you guys just brush off the fact that most devs are against you?

 

Are they?

[Blarghagh]

I'm still confused about the idea that anyone takes gaming websites seriously when it comes to reviews.  That just boggles my mind.  

 

I'd say that statement, if anything, is a pretty clear indication that they should change and should have changed a long time ago.

 

Do you guys just brush off the fact that most devs are against you?

 

Even if that were true (it's not), here's a fun quote for you:

 

“I’m a AAA producer. … I’m the one booking your flights, [paying for] your bar tabs, and spa treatments… We’re plying you with payola. We’re not just expecting you to not be impartial, we’re ****ing banking on it.” - Alex Lifschitz

 

It is in most of AAA corporations' best interest to stick a feather up journalists' butts. That's why the most prominent supports of GamerGate have been either indies or anonymous. It's why Blizzard puts out statements that don't actually name anything so both sides can pretend it's supporting them.

[Lexx]

Milo really went balls to the wall with this one:

http://www.breitbart.com/Breitbart-London/2014/11/12/The-authoritarian-Left-was-on-course-to-win-the-culture-wars-then-along-came-GamerGate

So gg is right-wing and anti-gg is left-wing now?

[Hurlshort]

My god...

 

http://www.reddit.com/r/KotakuInAction/comments/2m16oi/polygon_accepted_750000_from_microsoft_to_create/

 

That sounds like a fantastic business opportunity for Polygamygon.  How could you possibly turn down $750,000 as a small gaming website?  

[Gorgon]

True, but not really the point. 

[Blarghagh]

 

Milo really went balls to the wall with this one:

http://www.breitbart.com/Breitbart-London/2014/11/12/The-authoritarian-Left-was-on-course-to-win-the-culture-wars-then-along-came-GamerGate

So gg is right-wing and anti-gg is left-wing now?

 

 

That may be what Milo likes to espouse (as a scavenger who is just piggybacking on #GamerGate for publicity) but that's not accurate. The only serious polling has shown that the vast majority of pro #GamerGate participants are left-leaning, just like the vast majority of anti #GamerGate participants. The difference was mostly the axis of libertarian vs authoritarian, with the pros being libertarian and the antis being authoritarian.

[Meshugger]

He even calls GG a libertanian phenomenon in the article, but never mentions the individual political leanings of the participants. I would say that is a fair description of it.