New build feedback

[morhilane]

 

People keep saying that the number of "trash enemies" was reduced but I had 6 wolves after the update in the ruin (one was an elder wolf too) which is more than I usually encountered there and there was as many beetles as in v278 at the entrance of the crossing for me.

 

There's less trash mobs if you take the optimal route with avoiding fights and it's a lot easier fighting one beetle at a time instead of four. I don't fight wolves.

 

 

I don't think they removed mobs, they just spaced stuff farther away so that some are easier to avoid now.

[Sensuki]

No they removed beetles. Trust me I've defeated those beetles probably 30 times on Hard already, there are less beetles.

 

Engagement UI could probably be built into the targeting reticle, rather than having a separate thing for it

Edited September 26, 2014 by Sensuki

[Uomoz]

One of the best thing they did there is that the selection circles are on an horizontal plane and the engagement arrows are on a plane perpendicular to the horizontal. Very nice way to easily separate the two elements at a glance, while keeping the green-good/red-bad.

[Sensuki]

Different UI elements for backer npcs is a HUGE nope for me. It's incredibly immersion breaking. This should be at the very least a toggle in the options menu.

 

Immersion breaking isn't it. I would be okay with a *slightly* different colored name tooltip, but that's it. I can send you my mod if you want to play with it removed.

[Uomoz]

Totally agree, those icons are immersion breaking. I do think they are simply temp though.

[Matt516]

Nah. Thanks though. I play the Beta just enough to find the latest bugs. Immersion isn't really a thing when my Fighter is taking over Charname's character sheet.

 

And I have to disagree - ANY kind of UI distinction should be a toggle. The UI exists to convey the game world and mechanics to the player in the most efficient way possible. Outside considerations (like who designed an NPC) have no place in that. Unless there is something in-game that justifies those NPCs all showing up differently (like them being part of the same society of adventurers or something), special icons and coloring are unacceptable.

Edited September 26, 2014 by Matt516

[Starwars]

One thing is clear though.

 

We still need a feature where we open the bloody door to another area before zoning into it. I hate how we just transition into a house without opening the door first, gah!

[Sensuki]

^ This x100

[pswendel]

I don't, sure it allows you to see who's engaging who but it's very intrusive and could easily be handled in a more IE style, probably with an on mouse hover/on selection floor indicator rather than a rotating arrow.

 

I removed the code from my game, that's how much I disliked it.

 

While I've been extremely attentive and appreciative of all your contributions to the beta backer, I just don't understand you're need to mod and remove code introduced by the developers. Were I a developer, I would completely disregard a tester who is not using my most recent build. I do not understand your need to modify what we're meant to be testing and reporting on. Do it in the release or stop ...testing?

[Hormalakh]

Here are two other engagement UI's I came up with. They would be parallel to the selection circles. Forgive the very rough animation. Did this in like 5 mins and can't be bothered to "pretty it up. It gets the message across.

 

Edited September 26, 2014 by Hormalakh

[mutonizer]

Not precise enough I think, especially when engaging 3 or 4 mobs at the same time.

[Kaz]

Targeting reticles are coming, don't worry.

 

@Hormalakh: I had a similar idea kicking around. It looks pretty good on paper, but quickly becomes noisy with multiple engagements in close proximity. This is partly due to the fact that selections circles are often touching each other with no buffer zone in between them. This is not to say it wouldn't work, but you'd have to balance visual clutter vs how well you can see each arrow. (too big and it's a mess with multiple arrows, too small and it starts defeating the purpose of having one in the first place etc.) Thanks for the suggestions / feedback guys.

[Sensuki]

What styling are you using

 

You did a nice job with EvilLore's portrait too, I'm sure he'll be impressed with that.

Edited September 26, 2014 by Sensuki

[Hormalakh]

Here are a couple more Kaz.

If you make the engagement UI mouse-over only, the multiple engagements will not be as much of an issue. I'll be working on showing multiple engagements next, so that hopefully we can see how it fully fleshes out.

Edited September 26, 2014 by Hormalakh

[Sensuki]

Stuff like this should only show upon mouseover or selection like the IE games.
 
I'd also prefer the element to be non-moving, as that is distracting. I don't need a moving element to be able to notice it.
 
You could use the same shader that you're using for the stealth circles under party members feet, change the color and have it between the selection circles to show engagement or something
 

 
and ONLY on selection or mouse over, the LESS CLUTTER ON THE SCREEN THE BETTER

 

Gonna be so good when combat huds aren't required anymore to tell what's going on too

Edited September 26, 2014 by Sensuki

[Malignacious]

I absolutely HATE the new mouse over highlighting, is there any way we can turn that off ? Why the hell was that added in, it's totally unnecessary ...

 

Oh hell no!

I despise when developers screw up their games like that!

 

I actually uninstalled Company of Heroes 2 because of it, when you hover over every single unit it freaking changes color, like it's not a solid part of the world!

 

How the hell can developers be that f**cking clueless?!

[mutonizer]

Chill man, something like that is just a broad stroke to test the water and is very easy to change/tune and whatnot (imagine, took us 2 seconds to mod it out, change alpha, change colors of it, so on their side, it's peanuts). That's not core mechanic or anything.

 

The idea here is: does it help you figure out combat better, or not?

Personally I think it does, and yes I HATE the color and crazy highlighting, but it does the job.

 

Now, fine, from here, needs 2 things:

1) Toggle on/off for people who want to keep their visuals pure

2) Find a way to make it as useful, but less like it's an 80s party.

edit:

Alpha value helps a bit. Tested with 50% alpha and 25% alpha on the hue, it's less intense, but still easily noticeable so does the job still. Colorblind blue is also less...psycho, at least for me, but that might just be down to personal preference.

Edited September 26, 2014 by mutonizer

[Sensuki]

Right click cancel works again now, you can rebind cancel to RMB (Mouse1) and it will cancel your action and then move, woot!

 

Anyway, made some mods, reported some bugs, had my say - probably won't be able to do much more until Sunday night. Cyas then.

Edited September 26, 2014 by Sensuki

[Kharador]

Well sincerely. The beta is still unplayable for me.
Lots and lots of major bugs. The combat is still a holy mess, yes, improved holy mess...
Disappearing items, disappearing enemies, exasperating handling of the npcs in combat.

Dudes there's still a lot of work here... Pretty disappointed.

 

Good points:

Improved inventory (yeah!!).

Item selection and drop display improved (Minor fix for me)

[Sensuki]

You deleted your saves right? 

[Quadrone]

Really? People are that up in arms over the highlighting?

Sure, could be done a bit more subtile but overall I have to agree with mutonizer,... it helps.

[Sensuki]

I complained about selection circles being the wrong color and too thick, so you can bet your life I will complain about unit highlighting 

[mutonizer]

Really? People are that up in arms over the highlighting?

Sure, could be done a bit more subtile but overall I have to agree with mutonizer,... it helps.

 

There is a "feel" to some games (all games?) without which you just cannot get into the mood of the game itself. It varies from person to person of course but usually it's UI, pacing and visuals, plus that "little something". When I say it's not a big deal, I mean right now, because of the purpose of the change.

That said, it cannot be left as it is that's for sure and needs to be a toggle, no doubt about it.

 

For example, the new NPC backers. Upon loading a new character on the new build, I went around the church and noticed them. For some reason, the icon, the color and disparity from others NPCs totally broke it for me, that "feel" I mean, it simply pulled the plug on my fresh PC and broke any sense of immersion there usually is after I create a character and go "let's adventure!".  

And even though there are no such NPCs later on, nowhere but in town really, it stayed with me. Why? Go figure man, but first thing I did was to mod their icons out..and now it's fine, and I don't get that disconnect anymore when I create new PCs to test the build. Well that and changed the highlighting hue to 25% alpha...

 

So all in all, it's not a big deal..for now...but it's not nothing

Edited September 26, 2014 by mutonizer

[Ignatius]

Any screenshots of the new beta? Has it changed enough to warrant it? The characters fading into the scenery was a particularly big issue.

[Roby Atadero]

 

Really? People are that up in arms over the highlighting?

Sure, could be done a bit more subtile but overall I have to agree with mutonizer,... it helps.

 

There is a "feel" to some games (all games?) without which you just cannot get into the mood of the game itself. It varies from person to person of course but usually it's UI, pacing and visuals, plus that "little something". When I say it's not a big deal, I mean right now, because of the purpose of the change.

That said, it cannot be left as it is that's for sure and needs to be a toggle, no doubt about it.

 

For example, the new NPC backers. Upon loading a new character on the new build, I went around the church and noticed them. For some reason, the icon, the color and disparity from others NPCs totally broke it for me, that "feel" I mean, it simply pulled the plug on my fresh PC and broke any sense of immersion there usually is after I create a character and go "let's adventure!".  

And even though there are no such NPCs later on, nowhere but in town really, it stayed with me. Why? Go figure man, but first thing I did was to mod their icons out..and now it's fine, and I don't get that disconnect anymore when I create new PCs to test the build. Well that and changed the highlighting hue to 25% alpha...

 

So all in all, it's not a big deal..for now...but it's not nothing

 

 

The Backer NPC UI and system was functionally put together a while back and our design team just got around to hooking up the backer NPC data to the characters. So at this point, this is the first time these things have hooked up so the whole team can get a look at it all. Currently, we're more interested that everything is in and working properly. Small things like background colors and icons can be tweaked or removed once our leads and artists have gotten time to do a major review of the overall look. The UI art team has been working a lot on icons on portraits lately as there have been quite a bit to get done.

 

Just remember guys, each patch you guys get has only been about 3 weeks apart. Some of the things you see may have been added earlier that week and haven't gone through a full official review pass by the leads and the rest of the team. Rest assured that we will do various passes on things added and you may just be looking at the first go.