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I'd be highly disappointed if a game covered the RAF throughout WWII but left out the strategy of favouring the targetting of civilians over airfields and the bombing of Dresden. It would be like a game about the pacific theatre that's comprehensive apart from it makes no reference to the mass murder by nuclear weapons of two cities.

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I guess I missed the part where millions of British soldiers were repeatedly surrounded and wiped out by the Germans.

 

Until Kursk, with the notable exceptions of Moscow and Stalingrad, the war on the Eastern front was a series of catastrophic disasters for the Soviets.

"Moral indignation is a standard strategy for endowing the idiot with dignity." Marshall McLuhan

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I guess I missed the part where millions of British soldiers were repeatedly surrounded and wiped out by the Germans.

 

Until Kursk, with the notable exceptions of Moscow and Stalingrad, the war on the Eastern front was a series of catastrophic disasters for the Soviets.

 

Oh, they were surrounded, it's just that Hitler was a famous anglophile and let the brits evacuate from Dunkirk, almost half a million of them in fact. Brits were his big pals. They gave him Czechoslovakia, then they gave him Poland, they helped him sell plundered gold, they even declared a phoney war on him when they were put under pressure from their own citizens. They let him prepare for a real eastern action, because at that time Germany didn't even have enough ammunition to last a week, so they couldn't just go ahead and start a REAL war on him now, could they.

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I guess I missed the part where millions of British soldiers were repeatedly surrounded and wiped out by the Germans.

 

Until Kursk, with the notable exceptions of Moscow and Stalingrad, the war on the Eastern front was a series of catastrophic disasters for the Soviets.

Meh. Apart from the Battle of Britain and (marginally timewise) El Alamein- which involved 3 understrength jerry divisions instead of an Army Group for Moscow and a full army + bits of a panzerarmy for Stalingrad- Britain lost every major battle against the germans over the same time period too.

 

German losses in the first 6 weeks of Barby were more than their losses over the entire war up to that point even with the poor russian performance.

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I'd be highly disappointed if a game covered the RAF throughout WWII but left out the strategy of favouring the targetting of civilians over airfields and the bombing of Dresden. It would be like a game about the pacific theatre that's comprehensive apart from it makes no reference to the mass murder by nuclear weapons of two cities.

You don't need to look to Dresden to find cases of selective memory.

Any game about RAF is almost guaranteed to ignore the bombing of France.

And even if we accept that bombing cities was murder then the list of targets is far longer then just Hiroshima and Nagasaki.

 

And something a little more relevant to the topic:

The (pre)history of Thief.

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Oh, an actual expansion? I'll take a good expansion over truckload of crappy dlc any time.

 

Hopefully they tweak the camera a bit, don't know who at Firaxis thought it would be a good thing to force the camera at grass level while throwing grenades. Or let the game change your zoom level when ever it wants to. Free rotation over the four angles too please.

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I guess I missed the part where millions of British soldiers were repeatedly surrounded and wiped out by the Germans.

 

Until Kursk, with the notable exceptions of Moscow and Stalingrad, the war on the Eastern front was a series of catastrophic disasters for the Soviets.

 

Oh, they were surrounded, it's just that Hitler was a famous anglophile and let the brits evacuate from Dunkirk, almost half a million of them in fact. Brits were his big pals. They gave him Czechoslovakia, then they gave him Poland, they helped him sell plundered gold, they even declared a phoney war on him when they were put under pressure from their own citizens. They let him prepare for a real eastern action, because at that time Germany didn't even have enough ammunition to last a week, so they couldn't just go ahead and start a REAL war on him now, could they.

 

Actually it was 200 thousand British, and about another 140 thousand French and others. Let them escape? Let's at least not make up history.

 

 

 

I guess I missed the part where millions of British soldiers were repeatedly surrounded and wiped out by the Germans.

 

Until Kursk, with the notable exceptions of Moscow and Stalingrad, the war on the Eastern front was a series of catastrophic disasters for the Soviets.

Meh. Apart from the Battle of Britain and (marginally timewise) El Alamein- which involved 3 understrength jerry divisions instead of an Army Group for Moscow and a full army + bits of a panzerarmy for Stalingrad- Britain lost every major battle against the germans over the same time period too.

 

German losses in the first 6 weeks of Barby were more than their losses over the entire war up to that point even with the poor russian performance.

 

Soviet forces were also proportionately hugely greater than the British, so that's neither here nor there. The point is the disasters for the Soviets (whatever the reasons, and I don't mean to denigrate the bravery of the Soviet soldier in any way btw) were orders of magnitude greater than for the British, so to draw any kind of equivalence there is ridiculous. Edited by Wrath of Dagon

"Moral indignation is a standard strategy for endowing the idiot with dignity." Marshall McLuhan

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German losses in the first 6 weeks of Barby were more than their losses over the entire war up to that point even with the poor russian performance.

 

 

The German Generals' impressions of the Red Army were interesting, and often illuminating. The best appreciation in a concise form came from General Kleist: "The [soviet] men were first-rate fighters from the start, and we owed our success simply to superior training. They became first-rate soldiers with experience. They fought most toughly, had amazing endurance, and could carry on without most of the things other armies regarded as necessities. The Staff were quick to learn from their early defeats, and soon became highly efficient."

 

 

Blumentritt stated, "It was in this war, however, that we first learnt to realize what ' Russia' really means. The opening battle in June, 1941, revealed to us for the first time the new Soviet Army. Our casualties were up to 50 percent. The 0GPU and a women's battalion defended the old citadel at Brest-Litovsk for a week, fighting to the last, in spite of bombardment with our heaviest guns and from the air. Our troops soon learnt to know what fighting the Russians meant. The Fuhrer and most of our highest chiefs didn't know. That caused a lot of trouble."

 

http://www.amazon.com/Other-Side-Hill-Germanys-Generals/dp/0304292435/

 

Poor? France and the 44 days - that's poor. Germans losing only 56 thousand soldiers in the whole European campaign - that's poor for Europe. Germans losing more than a million in 1941 - that's not poor, that's counter-attacks.

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Soviets lost 4 for every German in the war, 7 tanks for every German tank in 1941 even though the Soviet tanks were the best in WWII. Sounds like great performance to me, very efficient, first rate. Since you think the Soviets were so great you must think the Nazis were Übermensch. All those quotes say is that the Soviets were brave and could do better than the others in low supply conditions, unlike the Germans which is what I said. Soviets fought a war in 1939-1940 as well, losing 5 times more men than the Finnish, Soviets losing over 3000 tanks to under 30 that Finland lost, so if a Soviet soldier is so great, how good is a Finnish one? Terrifyingly.

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In 1991 the documents have been declassified, in 1993 a two year research by Colonel General Grigoriy Krivosheyev called Soviet Casualties and Combat Losses in the Twentieth Century has been published. To make it short, 8 million 668 thousand 400 soviet soldiers were killed. The soviet losses are 4 soviet soldiers to 3 nazi soldiers. The difference is due to the fact that most soviet prisoners of war were killed in the nazi concentration camps while the nazi prisoners of war enjoyed full meal and even money for their work.

 

However, it's true that 27 million russians in total have been killed. It's because the nazis were implementing Plan Ost by massacring civilians in the captured cities. And the Finnish were going to massacre all of Leningrad with a few millions of Russians, so they're the right kind of people too.

 

Go be fat somewhere else, you are blocked.

 

(gentlemen, any of you mind telling me where the block button is?)

Edited by Bester
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In-depth historical lessons/debates can be interesting (or exasperating ;) ), but that's more a WoT type of subject. Let's leave it out of this one...or I'm going to be pulling out the pruning shears.

“Things are as they are. Looking out into the universe at night, we make no comparisons between right and wrong stars, nor between well and badly arranged constellations.” – Alan Watts
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L0L Totaliarian Russia vs Nazi Germany? Who is better? Who is worse? Discuss.

That entirely depends. If you live in Nazi Germany and you're a white guy, then its cool beans, as long as you don't find out what the regime is actually doing.

The area between the balls and the butt is a hotbed of terrorist activity.

Devastatorsig.jpg

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In 1991 the documents have been declassified, in 1993 a two year research by Colonel General Grigoriy Krivosheyev called Soviet Casualties and Combat Losses in the Twentieth Century has been published. To make it short, 8 million 668 thousand 400 soviet soldiers were killed. The soviet losses are 4 soviet soldiers to 3 nazi soldiers. The difference is due to the fact that most soviet prisoners of war were killed in the nazi concentration camps while the nazi prisoners of war enjoyed full meal and even money for their work.

 

However, it's true that 27 million russians in total have been killed. It's because the nazis were implementing Plan Ost by massacring civilians in the captured cities. And the Finnish were going to massacre all of Leningrad with a few millions of Russians, so they're the right kind of people too.

 

Go be fat somewhere else, you are blocked.

 

(gentlemen, any of you mind telling me where the block button is?)

 

Not to mention USSR didn't just fight the Germans. There were the Romanians, Japanese, etc. And even insurrection in some of its own republics. Vlasov's collaborators. 

 

I didn't play CoH2. But I can imagine it's another 'Enemy at the Gates' type bull****.

Edited by Fighter
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Actually III Reich is EU predecessor, conscripts from whole Europe fight on East front against Soviets. And IRL war loses of III Reich and Soviet Union almost equal (for example only France alone lose ~ 500 000 men's on East front, 1 000 000 Austrian conscripts fight agains Soviets ), but Nazi exterminate 13 millions civilians also.  Only one Kiev before Nazi occupation have ~900 000 citizens,  but when freed in 1943 left only 150 000 citizens..

Europe_under_Nazi_domination.png?uselang

 

This game is typical stupid russophobic propaganda. Someone just have  butthurt yet, because Nazi ancestors.

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To take a break from the several pages of military history propaganda.  X Rebirth has some new ridiculously gorgeous videos and, get this, a release date.  An honest to goodness release date!  November 15th.  Of this year, even!

 

http://www.rockpapershotgun.com/2013/08/08/eyegasm-5-minutes-of-gorgeous-x-rebirth-footage/

 

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NEbL1p5vZpw

 

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OhT2zmF7ip4

 

/jaw drops to floor

 

It looks so ****ing good.  Maybe the seemingly endless wait will be worth it!

:biggrin:

Edited by Keyrock
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breen_tuna.gif.f209371d450243737d37ca9251849aff.gif

 

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To take a break from the several pages of military history propaganda.  X Rebirth has some new ridiculously gorgeous videos and, get this, a release date.  An honest to goodness release date!  November 15th.  Of this year, even!

 

http://www.rockpapershotgun.com/2013/08/08/eyegasm-5-minutes-of-gorgeous-x-rebirth-footage/

 

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NEbL1p5vZpw

 

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OhT2zmF7ip4

 

/jaw drops to floor

 

It looks so ****ing good.  Maybe the seemingly endless wait will be worth it!

:biggrin:

First time I see this game and ...WOW.

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