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Dear God.

 

Found this gem on a related thread elsewhere - http://forums.eidosgames.com/showpost.php?p=1943475&postcount=399

 

LOL! Everybody needs to calm down and relax.

 

This is such a non-issue. You can absolutely jump and move through the world fluidly and freely. The game has been designed specifically to achieve this goal. You're looking at this like you're losing a feature, but the reality is that you're gaining dozens more.

 

Anybody claiming the game will somehow be ruined because you can't free jump, when there is no reason to be jumping, would have to agree that Gran Tourismo is ruined because you can't choose to pop the trunk - right? No, of course not.

 

Saying that immersion is broken because of the absence of a feature allowing you to physically break out of character is akin to dividing by zero. Garrett would never randomly hop, skip and jump through the world. He just wouldn't. Honestly, if you need to spam the jump button continually for no reason to truly feel immersed a game, or need to be able to randomly pop yourself into the air like a grasshopper with the hiccups - then hell, maybe Thief isn't for you. But, check out Team Fortress 2 - it's free to play and you'll probably love it!

 

As someone who has played the game more than anybody else outside of the dev team, I can assure you that free jumping would ruin immersion. Pogo hopping through the world like a shop manequin on a spring would seem incredibly out of place, dated and overly simplistic within the context of the rest of the rich and tactile mechanics that have been created soley to make you feel like a Master Thief slipping through the world.

 

Like I said yesterday, this is not tomb raider, this is not The Last of Us, this is not an early 2000's game with cheesy pre-programmed hot spots. Forget what you know about the word "contextual" - it's been turned into a dirty word of late, but don't make the mistake of judging Thief on how "contextual" actions have been handled in other, completely unrelated games.

 

Consider that this only has become an 'issue' on the forums here after someone quoted a snippet of a text interview. It was never brought up when you guys first saw the E3 gameplay footage. Nor was it ever brought up as an issue by any of the journalists who played the game - including the few more 'critical' reports. MT didn't even scream bloody murder or beg the team to change the feature after he played the game. Why? For 1 very simple reason: It's just not an issue. Nobody felt restricted. Nobody felt they were missing anything. Chances are when you're finally playing the game, neither will you!

 

You can't free jump just for no reason - but you can jump whenever and wherever you need to jump. It's fluid. It's slick. You tap the jump button in the EXACT same way, with the exact same timing as if you had a free jump. In fact, if you weren't told that you couldn't free jump, and only tried to jump when you needed to jump to, you would have NO idea that you couldn't bunny hop around like convulsing jack-in-the-box. It's only when you tap the jump button while standing in the middle of a room with nothing to jump on that you DON'T jump.

 

So, I hear you asking, what happens when you DO press the jump button, but there is nothing to jump on?

 

You SWOOP!

 

It's AWESOME - just like a very small dash. In fact, if Garrett didn't hunker down to avoid being seen, you would say that it feels like a jump, in a way (be clear: It is NOT a jump). The swoop is used to empower stealth gameplay, and can be used in any direction - forwards, backwards, side to side. You can even rotate/change direction while you're swooping. It cannot be spammed for a continual speed boost. It offers total freedom and mobility, completely aligned with the movement and grace of a master thief who makes his living by sneaking from shadow to shadow. Those hoping for Garrett the Master River Dancer will be disappointed, everyone else has nothing to worry about.

 

Coincidently, we actually touch on the swoop in a Thief podcast that will be coming out on the last Friday of this month (also news: We'll be releasing Thief podcasts on the last Friday of every month starting this month!)

Just by the CM though, but still :)

Edited by Malcador
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Why has elegance found so little following? Elegance has the disadvantage that hard work is needed to achieve it and a good education to appreciate it. - Edsger Wybe Dijkstra

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Just to make it clear, since I've seen a good chunk of articles pop up stating that this is the case: Hepler didn't quit because of harassment. Her and her family had to make a choice because her husband had different job opportunities and it was a chance to move on to something else.

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im not attached to thief at all, so i get to be interested in the new game

 

fingers are crossed for something as good as dishonored

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Killing is kind of like playin' a basketball game. I am there. and the other player is there. and it's just the two of us. and I put the other player's body in my van. and I am the winner. - Nice Pete.

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Eh, I'm not sure the whole people-power thing should be taken as anything more then background character of what's happening in the city. It doesn't actually mean Garret's going to be directly linked to it... just taking advantage of all the opportunities such chaos might unleash. :shifty:

"Cuius testiculos habeas, habeas cardia et cerebellum."

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I don't get popular notions sometimes, apparently Russians are bad but communism and revolution are good?

I'd say the answer to that question is kind of like the answer to "who's the sucker in this poker game?"*

 

*If you can't tell, it's you. ;)

village_idiot.gif

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tumblr_mdbt3eved11rju9slvb.gif

 

With some of the lines in the trailer, they could have, could have, made it sound like it was the original Garrett saying them despite having different voice actors. Just a little bit of good VA direction required. Less regret, more smugness, less seeking for justice, more shaking your head how stupid everyone's being. There are some weird differences in the attitudes of these 2 Garretts

 

"I've changed"

 

Well you can say that again.

Edited by Nordicus
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Amnesia: A Machine For Pigs, the sequel to the absolutely terrifying Amnesia: The Dark Descent, is now available for pre-order and will be released on September 10th.

 

Can't wait for this, thanks for the heads up.  As for the new Thief, I'll try it when it goes on sale eventually.  I never played the old ones so I won't feel insulted by how different it has become.  

Save RPGs

 

 

Saying Dragon Age 2 is the worst recent Bioware RPG is like saying the Ferrari California is the worst Ferrari. It's still a Ferrari; an elite, top-tier, without much competition in today's industry.
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im not attached to thief at all, so i get to be interested in the new game

 

fingers are crossed for something as good as dishonored

Yeah, also the dxhr trailer wasn't really related to the game, either, so I'll just wait for the game to get released before I decide whether it sucks or not. ;)
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You're a cheery wee bugger, Nep. Have I ever said that?

ahyes.gifReapercussionsahyes.gif

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Amnesia: A Machine For Pigs, the sequel to the absolutely terrifying Amnesia: The Dark Descent, is now available for pre-order and will be released on September 10th.

 

Can't wait for this, thanks for the heads up.  

 

Weird but I find myself actually agreeing with you on this topic :biggrin:

 

I loved the first Amnesia games, they were indubitably the scariest games I have ever played. I am going to smoke some weed, turn the lights off and use my headphones to play this one. Its doesn't get more atmospheric than that

"Abashed the devil stood and felt how awful goodness is and saw Virtue in her shape how lovely: and pined his loss”

John Milton 

"We don't stop playing because we grow old; we grow old because we stop playing.” -  George Bernard Shaw

"What counts in life is not the mere fact that we have lived. It is what difference we have made to the lives of others that will determine the significance of the life we lead" - Nelson Mandela

 

 

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Noooo, another game in September. This is pure madness. ArmA3, Saints Row 4, Rome 2 and the new Amnesia... I don't know what to play first. I can't remember a month in the last 10 years, where so many games have been released that interest me a lot.

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"only when you no-life you can exist forever, because what does not live cannot die."

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Noooo, another game in September. This is pure madness. ArmA3, Saints Row 4, Rome 2 and the new Amnesia... I don't know what to play first. I can't remember a month in the last 10 years, where so many games have been released that interest me a lot.

 

What game are you going to play first?

"Abashed the devil stood and felt how awful goodness is and saw Virtue in her shape how lovely: and pined his loss”

John Milton 

"We don't stop playing because we grow old; we grow old because we stop playing.” -  George Bernard Shaw

"What counts in life is not the mere fact that we have lived. It is what difference we have made to the lives of others that will determine the significance of the life we lead" - Nelson Mandela

 

 

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Standalone aircraft for Flaming Cliffs 3 now available for Digital Combat Simulator World, starting with the A-10A for those who can't be bothered to read the 600+ page PDF manual for it's slightly more digital brother the A-10C. Like the Su-25T that comes free with DCS: World, it can be picked up in an afternoon (as opposed to a week at minimum for A-10C, Ka-50, P-51D, and UH-1H). 

 

Quote
"Turned wrong way round, the relentless unforeseen was what we schoolchildren studied as 'History,' harmless history, where everything unexpected in its own time is chronicled on the page as inevitable. The terror of the unforeseen is what the science of history hides, turning a disaster into an epic.”

 

-Philip Roth, The Plot Against America

 

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I've been told to buy A-10C precisely for that reason 

Let's Play The Temple of Elemental Evil (Complete)
Let's Play Neverwinter Nights and Hordes of the Underdark

Let's Play Baldur's Gate II: Shadows of Amn

I was struggling to understand ths until I noticed you are from Finland. And having been educated solely by mkreku in this respect I am convinced that Finland essentially IS the wh40k universe.

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Problem with Thi4f at this point is just the lack of leaning, jumping, rope arrows unless the developers let you, no? Oh right and the Focus thing.

Why has elegance found so little following? Elegance has the disadvantage that hard work is needed to achieve it and a good education to appreciate it. - Edsger Wybe Dijkstra

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The problem with Thi4f is they have openly admitted to making the game "cinematic", rewarding you with exp for headshot skills, and probably scrapped any sense of tension by allowing you to instantly kill enemies with QTE melee attacks.

I made a 2 hour rant video about dragon age 2. It's not the greatest... but if you want to watch it, here ya go:

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Problem with Thi4f at this point is just the lack of leaning, jumping, rope arrows unless the developers let you, no? Oh right and the Focus thing.

 

Direct quote from one of the devs:

 

 

“Today’s gamers are a lot less patient. They expect a lot more from the developers in terms of features and so on. Even for menus that are easy to use. For a lot of things that weren’t as extensively developed back in the day. For example: control inputs.

 

“It took a while to learn the complex controls. Numbers 1,2,3,4 – There were different types of peeking: peeking forward, peeking sideways, peeking upside down. They had all these things that were very complex and it worked for the hardcore gamers, but a lot of people backed off early on because it was very difficult.

 

 

Source: http://www.vg247.com/2013/04/04/thief-dev-wants-the-challenge-to-be-in-game-not-in-the-controls/

 

Pretty clear indication that the game is from casual players to casual players. While I'm not very intersted on the game myself, I still hope it sells nicely, because I sure wouldn't mind another Deus Ex game.

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im not attached to thief at all, so i get to be interested in the new game

 

fingers are crossed for something as good as dishonored

Yeah, also the dxhr trailer wasn't really related to the game, either, so I'll just wait for the game to get released before I decide whether it sucks or not. ;)

 

To be fair, they didn't cut jumping from Deus Ex because of "narrative reasons", so it was a bit more understandable to have confidence in that team's efforts.

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