I need Ironman mode because I have poor impulse control

[ncguthwulf]

I have seen many arguments about ironman mode and save scumming, etc.

 

I want to have ironman mode in this game because it will help me to avoid reloading games when I should be paying the price for my decisions. Too often, if an auto save at the beginning of the level is available I will reload it because I really messed up and dont want the character to die or face the music.

 

I dont think ironman mode and clever programming should be dedicated to countering save scumming. If people want to get some sort of ironman accomplishment by End Process save scumming / save game back up system, whatever. No big deal.

 

I just want two options:

 

1) standard auto save system that allows me to reload, perhaps for my first play through while getting to know the game.

 

2) ironman mode for when I am ready to really give it a go with no easy way to reload a game. This gives me a real nervous, edge of my seat feeling when making big choices in the game because I know they are final, at least for that character's story.

[freche]

Wouldn't mind an Ironman mode, I too tend to reload way too often if the outcome is not what I desired.

[Sacred_Path]

Gize,

 

will PE be bug free enough to even make Ironman a viable choice?

[simon_templar]

You don't relay need any iron mode, if your hero died etc., you can always can start a new game.

 

I barely use autosave (only before entering a new location are good ones) if something happens you have only 1 save and mostly it is too late to change something. Don't forget that this game will be big, and time is short, there will be game bugs, and all forces after the premiere will be set to do something new.

 

For me better will be no god mode in the game, if someone want to finish it - he should be able to do it on it's own.

Edited November 9, 2012 by simon_templar

[High Octane 881]

Gize,

 

will PE be bug free enough to even make Ironman a viable choice?

I'm concerned about this. I'm sure we have all faced game breaking bugs and wished we had saved that one extra time to avoid backtracking 4 hours.

[ncguthwulf]

I have to reluctantly agree about bugs, especially very minor ones that cause huge problems (quest item disappearing from inventory).

 

What about a single save system? So every time you save you overwrite but it does allow you to go back some... Not sure if it would work.

 

My main reasoning is that I need a way to trick myself into not reloading when something goes wrong. It also adds suspense.

[High Octane 881]

I could be wrong but I do believe what you're describing is exactly what one of the modes being placed in the game is.

 

"Trial of Iron is like Temple of Elemental Evil's Ironman Mode. When starting a Trial of Iron game, player has one save game that persists for the entire campaign... or until player characters die. And if they die, the save game is deleted."

[ReyVagabond]

I love iron man modes but only after i won the game a couple of times and i know what to do.

[Tigranes]

There is an ironman mode.

[rjshae]

I love iron man modes but only after i won the game a couple of times and i know what to do.

Does that really count as ironman mode?

[AGX-17]

Gize,

 

will PE be bug free enough to even make Ironman a viable choice?

 

Why would it be hard for the game to delete your only save?

[Sacred_Path]

Gize,

 

will PE be bug free enough to even make Ironman a viable choice?

 

Why would it be hard for the game to delete your only save?

 

I'm thinking about things like savegame corruption, getting stuck in the environment (less of a problem in this game, moreso in i.e. Wiz8), or getting stuck due to some other random bug (I remember an issue with doors and stairs in ToEE). Which will not result in deletion of your save, ironically.

[Heresiarch]

I don't mind Ironmode, since that's how I play most of the time anyway. I am not sure ho well it works in cRPGs, since sometime you can screw up badly and have your whole party killed. If that would be the end of the game, I would be unlikely to ever try Ironmode.

[Umberlin]

There is an ironman mode.

 

Indeed. Not that such a fact has stopped multiple requests for said function, despite being confirmed as an option . . . nor has it stopped requests that all modes have aspects of ironman mode forced upon them.

[Monte Carlo]

God I hate the term 'save-scumming' it's meaningless.

 

Saving before something tough happens is, like, common sense.

[jethro]

Ironman mode, pffft. Real men play Mithrilman mode. But I guess that would be exclusive to AD&D, so please include Unobtainiumman mode.

 

Also we absolutely need a 15 level deep dungeon and staffs. You now, real men...

[Kore]

You don't relay need any iron mode, if your hero died etc., you can always can start a new game.

 

I barely use autosave (only before entering a new location are good ones) if something happens you have only 1 save and mostly it is too late to change something. Don't forget that this game will be big, and time is short, there will be game bugs, and all forces after the premiere will be set to do something new.

 

For me better will be no god mode in the game, if someone want to finish it - he should be able to do it on it's own.

 

People like me do not have enough self control. I will go into a game with the purest intentions, but if I have shadowkeeper installed then I will end up cheating. I need rules to be mechanically enforced for me when I attempt to do ironman modes and the like.

 

Gize,

 

will PE be bug free enough to even make Ironman a viable choice?

 

I think we're all just a bit skeptical because of the frequency that it would happen in IE games. It does happen in newer games though I admit.

 

 

One limitation of the proposed Trial of Iron mode is that if you die you die. That is it, gone forever. I'd like a "Trial of Bronze" mode or something similar that would be exactly the same, but if I died I would reload from the last autosave. This would be enough for me to not constantly reload if an encounter didn't go favourably, but it would save me from the inevitable immense frustration when I do die.

[rjshae]

Ironman mode, pffft. Real men play Mithrilman mode. But I guess that would be exclusive to AD&D, so please include Unobtainiumman mode.

 

Also we absolutely need a 15 level deep dungeon and staffs. You now, real men...

You poor, deluded gamer. Real men play in codpiece only mode.

[PsychoBlonde]

I want to have ironman mode in this game because it will help me to avoid reloading games when I should be paying the price for my decisions.

 

What's this "should"? According to whom? For what purpose?

 

If you actually LIKE to play the game by letting the chips fall where they may, then you don't have to RESIST doing so. So what you're asking for is the ability to select a mode that FORCES you to play in a way that, by your own admission, you DON'T enjoy?

 

Fine, whatever. It never ceases to amaze me how people invent reasons for themselves to feel guilt about things and then expect somebody else to come along and fix it.

[HangedMan]

Ironman mode, pffft. Real men play Mithrilman mode. But I guess that would be exclusive to AD&D, so please include Unobtainiumman mode.

 

Also we absolutely need a 15 level deep dungeon and staffs. You now, real men...

You poor, deluded gamer. Real men play in codpiece only mode.

Hah. You've never played in Loincloth Mode, have you? Get a load of this scrub, guys!

 

I want to have ironman mode in this game because it will help me to avoid reloading games when I should be paying the price for my decisions.

 

What's this "should"? According to whom? For what purpose?

 

If you actually LIKE to play the game by letting the chips fall where they may, then you don't have to RESIST doing so. So what you're asking for is the ability to select a mode that FORCES you to play in a way that, by your own admission, you DON'T enjoy?

 

Fine, whatever. It never ceases to amaze me how people invent reasons for themselves to feel guilt about things and then expect somebody else to come along and fix it.

This is a point I fully support and endorse. As for whether it's amazing or not that people do that... I actually just think it's kind of childish, which is unfortunately a major problem in nearly all of my damned generation. The part I do think is amazing, though, is where they don't realize this is just a form of hand-holding; which, I believe, most are not in favor of.

[Heresiarch]

I want to have ironman mode in this game because it will help me to avoid reloading games when I should be paying the price for my decisions.

 

What's this "should"? According to whom? For what purpose?

 

That's easy.

 

If you play any game that features Ironmode, you know the difference between the two. You know you can't just saveload, so every decision you take counts. It may be dead squad members, wasted resources or defeat in a crucial battle. It's a whole other experience and it actually forces you to master the gameplay if you don't like settling for a compromise each time. You get a lot more gratifying experience from it, naturally.

 

And no, it's not at all the same thing, as if you were simply to not save/load. Been there, done that.

[HangedMan]

I'm pretty sure you flubbed that, Heresiarch. As I'm reading it, we need to get one thing straight: the definition of the word "Should". "Should" implies that you have an obligation to do something. So I believe PsychoBlonde (and please, correct me if I am wrong) is asking "Who decides what is and is not an obligation, and why is it an obligation?" Or something to that effect.

[Heresiarch]

I'm pretty sure you flubbed that, Heresiarch. As I'm reading it, we need to get one thing straight: the definition of the word "Should". "Should" implies that you have an obligation to do something. So I believe PsychoBlonde (and please, correct me if I am wrong) is asking "Who decides what is and is not an obligation, and why is it an obligation?" Or something to that effect.

I am pretty sure that's one of them rhetorical questions.

Who decides who should pay for our mistakes? Well, if you mug someone, it would be common law, if you lie, it's your consciousness, if you mix acetaminophen with alcohol, it's biology. So it largely depends on the situation at hand.

 

I believe PsychoBlonde's question was more about why than about who. So I answered why would you want an obligation to pay for your mistakes in a game. It takes your gameplay to a whole new level. As simple as that. And no, it does not work the same way, if you just get the same effect as Ironman gives you through strength of will and determination.

[BetrayTheWorld]

I wouldn't be opposed to an ironman mode. I'm guilty of "save-scumming" as well. I typically play only on default difficulty, but this might be something I'd actually use, so long as ironman mode didn't also automatically crank the difficulty up to max.

[Uszi]

I'm not sure I understand the point of an Iron Man mode if, as people have said in this thread, they only want to do iron man run-throughs when they've played the game a few times and already know how to get the results they want.

 

Seems like a weird metagaming self challenge, which could easily by accomplished by using a standard save feature and choosing to not reload. Kind of like how Minecraft's new hard core mode doesn't actually add anything players couldn't have chosen for themselves.