Arachnophobia, "no spiders", what should be important in P:E?

[Quadrone]

If something goes against common ethics/morals or against the law, sure lets at least talk about removing it.

But like many said before, removing things from the game because of certain "dislikes/beliefs/fears" is a slippery slope.

 

So you have a phobia of spiders? There might be others who have a phobia of snakes, so they're out as well. Some people might be really superstitious, so better remove ghosts from the game so these people don't have to worry about getting cursed. What about strongly religious people? That's right, no more demons or devils in the game. They're servants of Satan after all. And let's not forget about animal rights activists! No more wolves, bears and other innocent wildlife.

 

Bit of hyperbole? Maybe, but as I see it, once that door has been opened and Obsidian start removing stuff from the game they'll have to justify themselves for not giving in to other groups demands.

Edited October 23, 2012 by Quadrone

[Tsuga C]

Hey, I remember you (that is, if you're the same Tsuga C)! This is reflir, from the bioware offtopic forum. Anyone else here from the old days? Thinking about it, it kind of makes sense that a game like this would bring us together again

 

Yes, indeed, Reflir--'tis I come to haunt a new forum now that BioWare has undeniably degenerated into EAWare. I don't know of anyone from the OffTopic II, III, or IV on these forums, but Sylvius the Mad, Tigranes, Volourn, and a couple of others I'm having trouble remembering at the moment are active here. It's good to see you still enjoying cRPGs.

[HansKrSG]

Hey, I remember you (that is, if you're the same Tsuga C)! This is reflir, from the bioware offtopic forum. Anyone else here from the old days? Thinking about it, it kind of makes sense that a game like this would bring us together again

 

Yes, indeed, Reflir--'tis I come to haunt a new forum now that BioWare has undeniably degenerated into EAWare. I don't know of anyone from the OffTopic II, III, or IV on these forums, but Sylvius the Mad, Tigranes, Volourn, and a couple of others I'm having trouble remembering at the moment are active here. It's good to see you still enjoying cRPGs.

 

I once was really active on the NWN2 forums, but that was under another name. I remember a few of the names you mentioned myself.

[Continuum]

Spiders are pretty much the only type of creature that irrationally scare me. It was ingrained on me by mother when I was a kid, it makes no logical sense to me, but that's why they call 'em phobias.

 

I'm not disturbed by them so much that virtual representations bother me, but my mom (who does play numberous RPGs) is to the extent that she simply can't play some games solely because of the spiders.

 

Spiders and snakes are incredibly common phobias, to the point you can find arachnophobia mods for many RPGs. It wouldn't be the worst thing in the world for developers to put options in to replace them with a different visual model. People who are scared of them know it's past the rational point, and are generally content to accept an out of place visual model knowing it is blocking what scares them.

 

Anything can be a phobia, but the number of people with IRRATIONAL fears of things like bears or dragons or lizards is pretty small compared to folks with phobias for spiders and snakes. It's perfectly rational to be afraid of a bear in the wild (or a dragon), that's not a phobia. (Different argument as to whether it's rational that every carnivore in RPGs attacks heavily armed humans on sight.)

 

Personally, I'd be quite happy with a spider-less P:E, although they bother me less than emo vampires would.

[AGX-17]

Spiders creep me out in real life, but I don't give two ****s about them in games. I find all the people who whine about giant spiders in video games part hilarious and part irritating. Every time a moddable game is released there are always people who come crawling out of dark corners (just like spiders!) requesting/demanding spider-removal mods.

 

Next time this goes down, I want to make a mod and label it a spider remover when it actually turns all NPCs into spiders. Bonus if arachnophobes read this post and start to get paranoid when searching for spider-removal mods.

Edited November 3, 2012 by AGX-17

[Solviulnir the Soulbinder]

Yeah, I'm f****** terrified of grass and leaves, I want PE to be a desert simulator. And don't even think of including clothes that are of green colour.

 

Dude seriously, are you going to shat your pants seeing an isometric spider? This is beyond me. I'd be quite scared to touch a big, hairy, venomous, real spider... but even my younger sister laughs at spiders in skyrim, maybe because she realises that they're *virtual* i.e. *not*real* i.e. *harmless*!

 

In fact, I've read somewhere that games actually helped many people get over their phobias. Including, inter alia, agoraphobia and arachnophobia. Grow up, man up.

[Ninjamestari]

I hate giant bugs, I really do. The absolute maximum size is a bloodfly type monster (like the ones in the games of the Gothic series). Any dog sized or larger spider or ant or scorpion or whatever is just utterly ridiculous.

[Archmage Silver]

There will probably be an unofficial mod or two that change the spiders to wolves or creatures of some sort. The balance issues can be addressed by giving the new stand-ins identical stats and similar abilities to the spiders. The loot lists / manual loot placement can be handled in the same way. This will require some tools though, so the timetable for these mods is still open. A lot depends on whether Obsidian will released modding tools of any kind.

[Archmage Silver]

Yeah, I'm f****** terrified of grass and leaves, I want PE to be a desert simulator. And don't even think of including clothes that are of green colour.

 

Dude seriously, are you going to shat your pants seeing an isometric spider? This is beyond me. I'd be quite scared to touch a big, hairy, venomous, real spider... but even my younger sister laughs at spiders in skyrim, maybe because she realises that they're *virtual* i.e. *not*real* i.e. *harmless*!

 

In fact, I've read somewhere that games actually helped many people get over their phobias. Including, inter alia, agoraphobia and arachnophobia. Grow up, man up.

People like you are detrimental to this entire conversation. Phobias can't just be "willed away" - they're rooted in the unconscious mind. The conscious, logical mind can't just forcibly remove them. Their scope is as varied as the people who suffer from them - some people have minor cases of phobia, which can be treated much more easily than severe, debilitating cases of phobia.

 

While I don't suffer from any phobia myself, I do have an interest in psychology, and seeing people like you post ignorant comments is just all too common. I can't reply in all instances where this happens, but I'm making the effort here, because saying things like "Grow up, man up" in order to help someone suffering from a phobia is just stupid. Without actual therapy or a self-help plan people suffering from phobias won't be able to gain control over their unconscious mind where the phobia in question is concerned.

[Hassat Hunter]

It reminds me of telling depressed people to "get over it. Think good and you'll feel better."

 

Well, good for you, ****, but it doesn't work that way.

And while, yeah, there will be mods, as mentioned tools might not be there right away, so why not allow an official option. It's not like it's that much work, as it just replaces the skin with that of another unit already in the game, fully animated, and with the same stats... :/

[Solviulnir the Soulbinder]

@Archmage Silver: people like you are clearly too uptight to comprehend what others are saying. I did mention that I would be afraid to touch a spider, I'm not a robot and I do feel for people with extreme cases of phobia. I know some people that are terrified of bees or hornets and I do not make fun of that, but they are afraid of *real* things. You do need to go out once in a while, to get some fresh air or food etc. and there is no way you can avoid contact with different insects and bugs irl, so everyday life can be very hard when you're terrified of them. I understand and respect that. But a game is just a game, you don't need to play it, nobody forces you to look at virtual spiders and be scared. So don't enforce that kind of thinking on other people and let your mentality limit their experience. I'm fine with a mod for all those who hate spiders, I might even make one, as it will not affect my or any others preferences. But initial post of the OP didn't even mention a mod, just getting rid of this kind of opponents all together "because fantasy doesn't need them". PCs suck so hard nowadays it's not even funny. I'm literally terrified of monsters in SCP games... so I just don't play these games. Even though I'd like to, were it not for the darkness. But I'm not asking developers to switch from ghosts and gloomy staircases to bunnies and chocolate castles. Imho this thread doesn't need self proclaimed moralisers like you, dude.

Edited November 4, 2012 by Solviulnir the Soulbinder

[Archmage Silver]

You're completely missing the point. And I'm not "moralising" anything - I'm stating the actual facts of the matter, which you are choosing to ignore. Do as you wish, but ignorance is not an excuse for anything.

[Bacon Pancakes]

I think there should be regular-sized spiders to fight. You don't see those often enough in RPG's.

[Solviulnir the Soulbinder]

@ Archmage Silver: Oh, yes, I'm sure I do miss the point. And I have no excuse for that indeed. But my oppinion is that if darkness scares you, you simply turn on the lights. And let's just say that I'm as ignorant as you are a moraliser.

 

I do hope that spiders, in some form or shape, will make it to the PE, they were one of my fave enemies in BG1.

And I'm sure that the community (if not the developers) will come up with a solution for all those affected by phobias.

[Starglider]

Half-Life 2 did this right with the antlions, which were more interesting than just 'oversized terrestial insect / arachnid'.

[HansKrSG]

Yeah, I'm f****** terrified of grass and leaves, I want PE to be a desert simulator. And don't even think of including clothes that are of green colour.

 

Dude seriously, are you going to shat your pants seeing an isometric spider? This is beyond me. I'd be quite scared to touch a big, hairy, venomous, real spider... but even my younger sister laughs at spiders in skyrim, maybe because she realises that they're *virtual* i.e. *not*real* i.e. *harmless*!

 

In fact, I've read somewhere that games actually helped many people get over their phobias. Including, inter alia, agoraphobia and arachnophobia. Grow up, man up.

 

Though I agree with you in that we can't change games to cater to everones phobias, that last part was just mean. Phobias are not logical, and he can not help it. Telling people to "grow up" out of their phobias? Don't be a douchebag.

[Crusader_bin]

I agree with many here, there are people who are afraid of technology, yet computers are still not banned. And although unrealistic, I really like the idea of spiders. Every hack and slash or good rpg in history had Spider Forest in them after all Call it lack of imagination. I'd say the same can be said about your car. It either runs on benzine or oil. Sooo mainstream Sure there are electric cars, but they are not too succesfull, you know Just look how awesome is bug crushing here (Revenant game) http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Zo6Snanp0Ik

[Juneau]

I'm terrified of spiders - Not to the point of an actual phobia but just to a sheer level of "holy f*** get that thing away from me!".

 

Normally I go get the cat or my wife to remove said species from the house. If I know its there i get itchy, scratchy, can't rest, fidget and so on. However in game/on TV it doesn't bother me. In fact, I normally go out of my way to kill the bloody things on TV.

 

Without "attacking" the OP - There is no way they should or could remove Spiders from the game to handle ONE phobia. What do they then do about the thousands upon thousands of phobias that exist. http://phobialist.com Fear of numbers - Sod it get rid of the stats system. Fear of fire - get rid of fireballs and so on and so on and so on.

 

You can't do it. Unfortunately OP there is no way a game can cater to people of certain phobias if they did it would open a door that resulted in the game never being made. You wouldn't even end up with a blank screen ( Fear of Black ).

[Sacred_Path]

Might as well leave out festering, brain-eating undead ancestors because it's a tad offensive XD

[Rink]

I agree that arachnophobia is one of the most common phobias around. But I don't know if there are many with that problem here, bg1 and bg2 had "big" (Well on the screen they are still tiny) spiders in them and I don't remember any mod that took them away. I know people that have phobias from snakes, rats, mice, dogs - very common too, flies and even frogs, mostly only one of those animals, so I guess if they make something hardcoded for one phobia, then other may want something against their phobia as well.

It is okay if there is an easy way to implement a mod to change the looks of some opponents (so for example you could change a number in an ini file and all spiders would look like bears instead of spiders).

 

By the way: one of the treatments against phobias is exposure therapy. Means: if you have fear of spiders, you will have to be around them until your brain accepts that they are not so scary after all. To avoid them altogether (what makes sense if you have such a fear) usually makes fear even bigger. Just a hint

[Brother Pain]

The only game I've seen so far that triggered my arachnophobia was actually Diablo 3. I don't know why, but the specific way the spiders there were animated was just too realistic or something.

I know that there are a lot of people that have the higher severity disadvantage are more sensible to this than me and can't play any game with realistic spiders, be it DA:O, Skyrim, or whatnot. Putting in a toggle (using a different model already in the game, eg. a bear or a cow) to not have spiders in the game would be a good idea.

 

And for the people who cannot fathom how someone can be afraid of spiders, and even to a degree that is crippling, understand that it's an irrational fear that can't be controlled and stop being a **** about it.

[TCJ]

I get a little tired of giant this, giant that as a monster, so if giant spiders go away, fine. However, creepy as they may be to some people (I don't particularly like them, though I have no fear of them) I don't see how it could be as much of a problem for someone with arachnophobia as in, say, Dragon Age... a game where you're up closer and everything will be larger on the screen and, thus, more detailed. P:E being an isometric view will not show the spiders as very large (unless Obsidian truly makes some whoppers), especially if you zoom out all the way.

[jivex5k]

I'm in agreeance an option to swap out the models would be a nice compromise.

If it's not too hard or takes up too much time of the Devs of course, but if the devs don't put it in a modder will figure it out.

What I'm against is the removal of an entire species due to phobia, i'm not against allowing them an option to swap models.