Badmojo Posted October 4, 2012 Share Posted October 4, 2012 It was in another topic and someone mentioned athiests. I had this vision of athiests trying to prove the gods do not exist to other characters like priests and godtouched. Then I thought, what if a secretive group did not want to prove they did not exist, but were activily TRYING to find ways to kill the gods and free the world from the tyrany (their world view anyway) of the gods meddling with the world. Perhaps they even killed a few gods to prove they are more than just a fringe group. They could be natural enemies to priests/religious groups and it would make sense in the setting. 9 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TrashMan Posted October 4, 2012 Share Posted October 4, 2012 Meh..personally, I'm not a fan of gods being such pushovers that they can be killed by a bunch of mortals. OR that mortals can ascend to godhood. * YOU ARE A WRONGULARITY FROM WHICH NO RIGHT CAN ESCAPE! *Chuck Norris was wrong once - He thought HE made a mistake! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Volourn Posted October 4, 2012 Share Posted October 4, 2012 What's this obsession with real life athiesm beingd ragged into a fantasy? 1 DWARVES IN PROJECT ETERNITY = VOLOURN HAS PLEDGED $250. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NerdBoner Posted October 4, 2012 Share Posted October 4, 2012 What's this obsession with real life athiesm beingd ragged into a fantasy? it goes hand in hand with the whole perceived sexism thing... it's pretty barf inducing to be honest. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Aedelric Posted October 4, 2012 Share Posted October 4, 2012 Deity's rarely ever help high fantasy and more often than no they are actually bad news. I am for a group out to murder them and release their soul energy, especially seems Eternity Gods can not be trusted! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
metiman Posted October 4, 2012 Share Posted October 4, 2012 How do you kill something you don't even believe exists? You could have a group of people that wanted to kill the (presumably immortal) gods, but they wouldn't be atheists. 1 JoshSawyer: Listening to feedback from the fans has helped us realize that people can be pretty polarized on what they want, even among a group of people ostensibly united by a love of the same games. For us, that means prioritizing options is important. If people don’t like a certain aspect of how skill checks are presented or how combat works, we should give them the ability to turn that off, resources permitting. . . Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Aedelric Posted October 4, 2012 Share Posted October 4, 2012 How do you kill something you don't even believe exists? You could have a group of people that wanted to kill the (presumably immortal) gods, but they wouldn't be atheists. You are mixing up what he meant, the killing gods was a secondary idea he had separate to the atheist idea. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lordgizka Posted October 4, 2012 Share Posted October 4, 2012 (edited) What's this obsession with real life athiesm beingd ragged into a fantasy? it goes hand in hand with the whole perceived sexism thing... it's pretty barf inducing to be honest. Video games are notorious for this in recent years (*obligatory BioWare reference!*). My biggest fear is that in Obsidian's writers' minds these things might be synonymous with the concept of "mature themes". Which is always most likely either a grimdark setting or a bunch of Evil People Who Fight for Good (or vice versa). Edited October 4, 2012 by lordgizka 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Badmojo Posted October 4, 2012 Author Share Posted October 4, 2012 No, I do NOT want atheists in the game, I was just pointing out that the thought popped in my head and it lead to another thought. I was just saying that, it makes sense that in a world of gods, there would be those who resent them and want to see them gone. Look at the historical religions, gods are always screwing with people for their own amusement and purpose. Turning them into monsters, raping them, sending them on quests against their will, killing them for petty reasons. Say you are married and are happy, one of the gods turns your bride into a hag because she looked more attractive than the goddess. Your bride dispairs and kills herself. Wouldn't you want revenge? Wouldn't you seek out others who feel the same? Doesn't it make since that a group would form that hate the gods and their goal is to get rid of them? Like I said, it was just a thought. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Luckmann Posted October 4, 2012 Share Posted October 4, 2012 What's this obsession with real life athiesm beingd ragged into a fantasy? it goes hand in hand with the whole perceived sexism thing... it's pretty barf inducing to be honest. Video games are notorious for this in recent years (*obligatory BioWare reference!*). My biggest fear is that in Obsidian's writers' minds these things might be synonymous with the concept of "mature themes". Which is always most likely either a grimdark setting or a bunch of Evil People Who Fight for Good (or vice versa). As much as I hate the whole "mature themes" schtick meaning "sexual progressiveness" or make-believe-fantasy-atheism (for the love of rage, they're there, we can see them, they talk to us, we heal people for crying out loud!) some other horse**** like that... I don't see how that relates to Grimdark. I do love myself some Grimdark. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Galdegir Posted October 4, 2012 Share Posted October 4, 2012 Gods should be like they were portraited in Xena they looked like humans, had their vices, you could kill them but it was quite difficult. I mean Ares played by Kevin Smith is one of my favorite characters of all time. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NerdBoner Posted October 4, 2012 Share Posted October 4, 2012 I do love myself some Grimdark. oh god, me too...hell, my cipher's name will probably be Grim snowflake Emoson. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
general_azure Posted October 4, 2012 Share Posted October 4, 2012 Somehow I don't think we'll reach the powerlevel where killing gods becomes feasible. But if we run into one, I'll be damn sure to try... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SewerCover Posted October 4, 2012 Share Posted October 4, 2012 Could be really neat, they kinda already played a lot with this idea in Mask of the Betrayer and it turned out really well. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sarog Posted October 4, 2012 Share Posted October 4, 2012 (edited) What's this obsession with real life athiesm beingd ragged into a fantasy? I had a scary BSN flashback when I wandered in here. Someone please hold me. I don't think modern notions of "atheism" have any place in a pre-modern setting, especially one where the gods are active, involved, meddlers who interact with the world. Hating gods, sure. Losing your faith in your god, and not identifying with any of them, also sure. But strong denial that any form of divinity exists whatsoever, when these divines are active in the world, has about as much place in such a setting as magical Facebook pages and pantomime Kardashians. As for if they should get killed for XPs, I'd say only as the potential end boss of the game, on the scale of the final battle in BG2:ToB. Edited October 4, 2012 by Sarog 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wirdjos Posted October 4, 2012 Share Posted October 4, 2012 Could be really neat, they kinda already played a lot with this idea in Mask of the Betrayer and it turned out really well. I'm glad they have some experience with the idea because it sounds great. More than that, it sounds like the sort of thing that comes about after thinking through the setting. If there are gods and they are known meddlers, it is reasonable to assume some people would resent them. In the name of actual content, I would point out that the fact that we've been told the gods have purposely confused the nature of the soul which means they have something to lose. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ravenshrike Posted October 4, 2012 Share Posted October 4, 2012 If they're going to go the Godslayer route as a faction they should look up the book Grand Central Arena and the Vengeance faction for ideas. In GCA interstellar travel is restricted by 'higher' beings with Plancktech and the only way to travel FTL means going through an Arena that effectively stops continuous interstellar war or Von Neumann style colonization. There are three factions that truly concern themselves with the beings that created the Arena. Of those three, the purpose of the Vengeance is to figure out how to destroy the Plancktech creators. "You know, there's more to being an evil despot than getting cake whenever you want it" "If that's what you think, you're DOING IT WRONG." Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TrashMan Posted October 4, 2012 Share Posted October 4, 2012 No. No god-killing pelase. the palyer achieving those levels of power is stupid. The gods being so easily killable by any drok with a magical sword is even dumber. Have the player being able to challange a god. And then be immediately sticken by an uncurable explosive diarehea. * YOU ARE A WRONGULARITY FROM WHICH NO RIGHT CAN ESCAPE! *Chuck Norris was wrong once - He thought HE made a mistake! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Retaliation Posted October 4, 2012 Share Posted October 4, 2012 What's this obsession with real life athiesm beingd ragged into a fantasy? I had a scary BSN flashback when I wandered in here. Someone please hold me. I don't think modern notions of "atheism" have any place in a pre-modern setting, especially one where the gods are active, involved, meddlers who interact with the world. Hating gods, sure. Losing your faith in your god, and not identifying with any of them, also sure. But strong denial that any form of divinity exists whatsoever, when these divines are active in the world, has about as much place in such a setting as magical Facebook pages and pantomime Kardashians. As for if they should get killed for XPs, I'd say only as the potential end boss of the game, on the scale of the final battle in BG2:ToB. Atheism can exist in a setting like this. It just requires a shift from "divine entity does not exist" to "entity is not actually divine". 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Orogun01 Posted October 4, 2012 Share Posted October 4, 2012 And divine magic is not divine. Well I think that if we can prove gravity to zealots by throwing them from a building we can smite the heretics into belief. Up next we try to convince those lunatics that don't believe the sky is blue. I'd say the answer to that question is kind of like the answer to "who's the sucker in this poker game?"* *If you can't tell, it's you. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
choasrepeated Posted October 4, 2012 Share Posted October 4, 2012 Given bg:2 flirted with the idea and there is a fanasty theme of murder the gods. It wouldn't be out of place. Just saying. Also this is anti-theist not atheist. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
choasrepeated Posted October 4, 2012 Share Posted October 4, 2012 What's this obsession with real life athiesm beingd ragged into a fantasy? it goes hand in hand with the whole perceived sexism thing... it's pretty barf inducing to be honest. Video games are notorious for this in recent years (*obligatory BioWare reference!*). My biggest fear is that in Obsidian's writers' minds these things might be synonymous with the concept of "mature themes". Which is always most likely either a grimdark setting or a bunch of Evil People Who Fight for Good (or vice versa). As much as I hate the whole "mature themes" schtick meaning "sexual progressiveness" or make-believe-fantasy-atheism (for the love of rage, they're there, we can see them, they talk to us, we heal people for crying out loud!) some other horse**** like that... I don't see how that relates to Grimdark. I do love myself some Grimdark. I'm confused, what do you consider mature themes if not things that raise questions of race, religion, gender politics or the human condition? These are fair game in fantasy and sci-fi novels in a way not available for more serious genres so why not in games? 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AW8 Posted October 4, 2012 Share Posted October 4, 2012 Atheism can exist in a setting like this. It just requires a shift from "divine entity does not exist" to "entity is not actually divine". That would actually be quite cool. But if the deities (or, plot twist!: the simply extremely powerful mortals masquerading as gods) wield god-level powers and are impossible to locate, the atheist movement would be a short-lived affair. And as I suspect that the deities of this world will have those powers, I doubt we'll see any crusading atheists in Project Eternity. Batman: [intimidate] "Let her go". Joker: [Failure] "Very poor choice of words." Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
diablo169 Posted October 4, 2012 Share Posted October 4, 2012 By the second or third game maybe, it's a bit earlier to be slaying divine powers. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
choasrepeated Posted October 5, 2012 Share Posted October 5, 2012 And divine magic is not divine. Well I think that if we can prove gravity to zealots by throwing them from a building we can smite the heretics into belief. Up next we try to convince those lunatics that don't believe the sky is blue. Well we know from the last update it isn't. It was very clear that the practitioner's faith sparked the power of their soul rather than the god in question granting the abilities. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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