Obsidain why you lie to us?

[oldmanpaco]

Well PS:T is probably he greatest RPG ever made. If the NPCs in this game are even half as good as PS:T's were I will apologize for my outburst.

 

 

Agreed. Look who made that game. Look who's making this one.

Lightning in a bottle. I'm not saying the devs are not good or that they are not trying. I just worry about what they are trying for.

[The Sharmat]

Well PS:T is probably he greatest RPG ever made. If the NPCs in this game are even half as good as PS:T's were I will apologize for my outburst.

Considering that a lot of the same people are involved, and are breaking from the standard model of game development just to make a game of this type...I doubt you'll be disappointed in that regard.

[oldmanpaco]

6) The magic system is going to be stupid. See number 5.

I assume you're coming to the conclusion that magic will be tied to our "souls", and thus you feel that such a mechanic is going to feel forced and contrived? I don't know about that. From what miniscule information we have, I'm getting the impression that mages in this game will be akin to Sorcerers in the old D&D games. if so, count me among the giddy. I LOVED playing sorcerers in the IE games.

As I have admitted #6 in the OP was a bit inflammatory. Sorcerers were great but they had a choice of something like 200 spells. If the magic system is that diversified I will be ecstatic.

 

Once again we need the info. They have it but do 't want to share.

[Stun]

I agree. I think they're going to need to unleash more information, and perhaps pretty soon. For their own good. I actually hang out on the bioware forums and I know about 10 posters there who have flat out said that they're willing to donate hundreds of dollars.... as soon as they know what the hell they're they're going to be throwing their money at.

 

Of course, we should probably cut Obsidian a little slack. It's only been 2 days since the reveal! Lets at least wait until we're out of the weekend and into the work week proper before we put on the restless native act.

[ComradeGoby]

I actually prefer less charcters. Even 5 is pushing it.

 

Mainly becasue games are limited to how much depth they can put in.

 

I hate when the party is silent for most of the game and never has anything to say.

 

Or when they all have the blinders on for the PC and never interact with each other.

[Elfwyn]

DA2 and ME3 are two of BIO's better games. Certainly better than overrated stuff like BG1 or KOTOR.

 

In my opinion BG1 is not overrated but rather still underrated, because it has "full" party size unlike

newer games (like the other above mentioned) and did many things the right way "first".

I still like Bioware pretty much even though they are getting corrupted by the dark side of the game industry.

DA2 was quite good, if a bit linear and short and ME3 is more of a Shooter than anything else (in my opinion) - wich doesn't make it a bad game.

 

I can't say much about KOTOR, but I think that it is one step backwards from the ingenious titles of BG1 and BG2 and of course Planescape Torment.

(Icewinddale had a good feel to it too, but the PCs were too lifeless for an imersive game)

[hips]

I think the discussion has a wrong focus to bring PS:T into comparison. The concern for only 5 companions is not whether their background stories or side quests will be rich or not, but whether this number can achieve the tactical flexibility and complexity of BG and IWD, which I think surpasses PS:T completely. If the players have no choice over party composition, then battle will just not be as rich as it stretches to be. This of course is built on the assumption that the party size is at least 5, which I think is also crucial in making the depth comparable to that of BG and IWD. The strongest point of PS:T is the deep story and dialog, never the combat system. Also, from what they announced there are only 5 classes, without any hint of whether there will be subclasses or not, which will also potentially make the party monotone.

 

Personally I will pay 30 or more gladly if they just use the IE to make an IWD3 instead of a game that only half way mimics the three great games. If budget is an issue, please focus on a few points and make them really strong.

[Elfwyn]

I have pleged to the campaign on a basis of trust, even though information is seeded pretty thin on the first day of kickstarter.

When Obsidian started this Project - I am sure - they knew what type of player they were asking for the money, and what type of game they would expect.

 

So I am really hopeful that it will be clarified soon that the game features meet our expectations.

 

My expectation is a mix of:

Full Party Size Tactic RPG (6+)

Party Interaction with 10+ playable characters

Epic Storyline (centered on the main Character)

Player choices(options) that matter!

Stronghold (like NWN2 or BG2)

Long playtime

Believable world with lots of background info

Possible continuation of storyline in a sequel.

 

I think all of this and more could be reached with the right stretch goals and our funding.

[alanschu]

If the players have no choice over party composition, then battle will just not be as rich as it stretches to be.

 

I actually disagree that party composition is as influential in whether or not you can have a rich combat system.

 

The abilities and encounter makeup are more important IMO.

 

 

Though frankly I am hoping this game is less combat centric.

Edited September 16, 2012 by alanschu

[Stun]

 

Personally I will pay 30 or more gladly if they just use the IE to make an IWD3 instead of a game that only half way mimics the three great games. If budget is an issue, please focus on a few points and make them really strong.

They could probably do a game that mimicks IWD, but they'll never be able to actually do another IWD proper because they'd have to get permission from WotC to use the Forgotten Realms setting, and then Hasbro for the D&D rules set. And whoever owns the rights to the Infinity engine. All three seem impossible for Obsidian at the moment, and absolutely impossible if they're going to be going via the Kickstarter route.

Edited September 16, 2012 by Stun

[smjones3]

3) They are not even man enough to call it a stronghold. They call it a house. Maybe we can have tea parties there.

 

 

Those bastards.

I hope they burn in hell. BRB calling my lawyers about getting my money back for false advertising.

See you get what I'm saying!

 

I had a house in Skyrim. I had a stronghold in BG2. Can you tell the difference?

 

I'm about 99 percent sure that was sarcasm, but I loved that you took it seriously. It made me smile.

[Shades]

The party size is an issue. The IE games had 6 members. The 6 member party was iconic in RPGs before the decline.

 

5 Companions + 1 PC= 6 man party.

 

BG1: 25 Companions

BG2: 17 Companions

PS:T: 7 Companions (but they were all awesome)

IWD2: 15 Companions

 

Wait, Icewind Dale 2 had 15 companions? Funny, last time I played it had none, you made your own companion characters in the Icewind Dale games. What version of IWD2 were you playing?

 

And as for BG1... Most of those companions while having great voice sets and potential, had very little dialogue through the game aside from a tiny bit of banter with each other. Certainly quite a bit less than what the BG2 companions provide. If anything your numbers show that the more detailed and dialogue-heavy a companion is, the less of them you're going to get in the game.

 

Also, five classes (to start, more if they reach the stretch goals) is more than the three you got to pick from in the Dragon Age games.

 

I'm happy to support the Kickstarter because I've enjoyed the Black Isle and Obsidian games I've played. When we're given more information it should be easier to start forming a clearer picture of this game, I bet even Obsidian didn't expect the Kickstarter to reach its goal as quickly as it did.

[EugenS]

Go home OP. Your bridge is warm, and your troll family misses you.

[generic.hybridity]

Hmm. I think its likely we'll have 8 companions at least. Given that it seems likely the game will reach those funding levels at its current rate. If they are well written, this is a sufficient number.

 

The number of base classes means little if we do not know how they play and i'm sure each will play differently depending on how you level up. Unlike in IE games where there was a set way each class levelled. For a proper comparison you'd need to identify distinct level up paths for the 5 base classes as compared to the static DnD classes of the IE games. We really don't have enough information to make that judgment yet but I doubt that the classes will be comparable to taking 5 classes out of the infinity engine. Which would be quite restrictive.

[marlomarlo]

3) They are not even man enough to call it a stronghold. They call it a house. Maybe we can have tea parties there.

 

For an extra $900k over Obsidian's base goal, we better get tea parties!

[generic.hybridity]

I

3) They are not even man enough to call it a stronghold. They call it a house. Maybe we can have tea parties there.

 

For an extra $900k over Obsidian's base goal, we better get tea parties!

 

I actually really want to have tea parties in our player houses now. I'm sure the devs would be able to pull off the requisite emotional depth and witty banter such a scenario would entail. Screw stronghold quests, I want to sweat it out trying to divine whether my part's fighter prefers Earl Grey or English Breakfast. More importantly Soy or Full Cream!?

[Volourn]

"PS:T: 7 Companions (but they were all awesome)"

 

L0L But no.

 

2 were awesome, 3 were good, and 2 were pure ****.

[dlux]

If this game does not have tea partys, then I am ****ing removing my pledge... I am so serious. ^^

 

Anyways:

 

I canceled my pledge after reading the stretch goals. I'm not normally a hater (as the kids say) but the stink of bioware is all over this project.

 

1) Only 5 companions. That means you need to take them all with you if you have a 6 person party. Worked in PS:T but that was a RPG unlike any other.

2) Only 5 classes. Unless there are 'kits' like BG this limits the diversity of the party and NPCs. Best option is like Diablo with skill paths to differentiate the players. Oh joy.

You are obviously not able to read.

1.1 million: three races, five classes, and five companions

2.2 million: five races, seven classes and eight companions (+ LOADS of other content)

 

Did you expect to have all of that at 1.1 Million? The more we pledge, the more we get! If you do not get it, then I would advise that you avoid Kickstarters in the future. Please, take your $20 and go and troll somewhere else.

Edited September 16, 2012 by dlux

[Tauron]

No reason to unpledge, it is still very blocky information we got. But I think it is good that OP voiced his opinion and worries. Devs DO want that, to hear what we expect, would like to see in game and what not. They said they made this project so they would be more involved with community and they would listen to community. I dont understand this hostility some of you have towards OP. Devs ego wont suddenly inflate and they will stop this project becouse someone feels his expectations for the game are being shattered.

 

OP is basically worried that only 5 companions means they will dumb this game down. If we can expect same from this game as some titles that were mentioned I want ability to kill some of my companions, annoying ones especially. Maybe the moment I see them, I might pay consequences later on. Why not give me that satisfaction, why limit it. Remeber encounters with yourcompanions in BG.

 

As for House, thats OK. But whn I heared about this project I hoped they will take from previous titles and build upon it. Maybe some characters are content with simple housing but what if you RP evil or good for that matter but "scheming" character and you want your own lair? Secret hideout? My english is not good. It can be stereotypical cave, wizards tower, maybe even you can make your own faction or secret society as those we encountered in BG and BG2. You had these in Fallout as well. Rogue class might have their own thieves guild, some sort of spynetwork or you can even use your companion to influence them to have that position if you play different class.

 

As for magic I am with OP in this one. I really dont know what to make out of soul magic? He said soul is tied to magic and empowering magic or something like that. What does it really means and will magic be dumbed down? As someone mentioned before DAO had about 40 spells and BG 300. So it is okej to ask these questions early on as devs go through this process of making the game. I hope devs will give us ability to make our own spells. Either ingame or some sort of editor.

 

So questioning this early is great and I think devs will apreciate feedback. They said they want to go back to roots and build on that. What OP is mentioning is something that was also voiced in BG and was made for BG2, strongholds for instance aka housing. Anyway I have feeling this is sort of prototype for what is to come :D

Edited September 16, 2012 by Tauron

[Posbi]

How about we all calm down, take a step back and wait until Obsidian actually gives us some solid info about the game itself. Once we've got something we can sink our teeth into the bitching may begin. Right now it's quite frankly an exercise in futility. WAIT TILL WE HAVE SOME INFO. The Kickstarter will run for another 30 DAYS. If at the end of this you're still disappointed you can cancel your pledge then. But for the love of God, give the guys at Obsidian some time to actually present their ideas.

[Wintersong]

I canceled my pledge after reading the stretch goals. I'm not normally a hater (as the kids say) but the stink of bioware is all over this project.

 

1) Only 5 companions. That means you need to take them all with you if you have a 6 person party. Worked in PS:T but that was a RPG unlike any other.

2) Only 5 classes. Unless there are 'kits' like BG this limits the diversity of the party and NPCs. Best option is like Diablo with skill paths to differentiate the players. Oh joy.

3) They are not even man enough to call it a stronghold. They call it a house. Maybe we can have tea parties there.

4) They say companions can stay relax at said house. This implies a crappy 'camp' mechanic, small party sizes and ****ty everyone gets XP even if they are not in the active party.

5) The whole soul crap is gong to be incredible forced. Without knowing anything about it besides it having something to do with the magic system I can tell it's going to be a construct shoved down our thoats.

6) The magic system is going to be stupid. See number 5.

 

Right now I'm afraid they think the IE games just means isometric perceptive. Jesus have they even confirmed it will have painted 2D background? I really hope I'm wrong but right now this is not the BG/IWD/PS:T we were promised.

 

 

And if anyone says that I am just guessing right now you are correct. I would loooooove for Obsidian to actually tell us what they are planning. Am I completely wrong? Am I right? It's not like it's some sort of state secret. The W2 Kickstarter was about 100% better at communicating what they were trying to build. Obsidian seems like they are playing those of us who want another IE experience.

Isn't Kickstarter about donating money for a project that you want to support? And that in exchange, and if you choose so, you can get some goodies for your donation? Because you know, you could donate $10,000 and ask nothing in return for that money.

 

So, not really knowing anything solid yet and with still 30 more days to go to get the real funding of the game (which will be sprinkled with more information about the game), you dare to judge the game as if it was already finished and we had hit April 2014. You sir...

 

1) Party of 6? Why? Maybe it's of only 3 including your character. I don't remember any party size being mentioned yet.

2) 5 classes is not enough? How do you know when you have no idea of the classes and how are they designed?

3) House? Well, not having started on really creating the game, I'd bet that they are calling it "house" just in case before deciding upon expanding the idea or not. It's not like we have the game funded (that won't really happen until the money is taken from the pledgers) and with that stretch goal met, right?

4)Companions relaxing in house supposes that they will earn XP without doing stuff? That is no fact. They may or they may not. If Obsidian thinks that gameplay wise is the best option, then it'll become fact. Otherwise, just speculation about afeature that you dislike.

5) Soul system forced... I see no facts in your hatred speech. You have no idea and just using wild speculation you pretend to talk about facts.

6) You run out of stuff to say, right?

 

Unless you can prove me that you have been able to time travel to the future (which is possible) and then back to the past (which is not possible), you are just out of context. Be glad that supporting a Kickstarter project is optional. Leave and come back in 2014. Maybe you will like the game. Or maybe not. Meanwhile, the rest of us still have 30 more days to get more precise information about what the game is going to have (and decide if we want to cancel, increase/decrease our pledge).

 

It's also quite tiresome how some people insist that Obsidian should be 24/7 telling us news about the game. Obsidian is Obsidian and not Brian Fargo. Also, even a weekend is a weekend for Brian Fargo. Obviously, Obsidian should be very interested in keeping alive as much as possible the interest of the people about the game during this month and try to minimize the mistakes as much as possible (all of them make mistakes, like Fargo back in the day). But all these "internet wisemen" telling Obsidian what to do, when to do it and how to do it, stopped being amusing long time ago.

Edited September 16, 2012 by Wintersong

[Moonlight Butterfly]

I think the best thing about this thread is that he spelled Obsidian wrong when it's in caps lock at the top of the page :3

[Frusciante]

How about we all calm down, take a step back and wait until Obsidian actually gives us some solid info about the game itself. Once we've got something we can sink our teeth into the bitching may begin. Right now it's quite frankly an exercise in futility. WAIT TILL WE HAVE SOME INFO. The Kickstarter will run for another 30 DAYS. If at the end of this you're still disappointed you can cancel your pledge then. But for the love of God, give the guys at Obsidian some time to actually present their ideas.

 

I think it should be first some info and then pledge. Not pledge first and maybe get info later.

[novander]

I think the best part is him complaining that only PS:T could do limited companions and thus this will fail, when the PS:T dev team are on this project

[Margaretha]

They lied to you, oldmanpaco, because... they hate you. They hate you so strong they whish you were desperate and miserable and dead and alone and they gave their poisonous gallbladders your name, oldmanpaco. This is why they lied.