Game Design Stuff You Hate

[Volourn]

"Just look at Mass Effect, most of the stats stuff is meaningless"

 

No, it isn't. In fact, stats are more meaningful in ME than they often are in BG2. Seriously, charisma, intelligence, and wisdom are near useless unless you have a class they're geared for. And, that says a lot considering ME is 'just' an Action RPG not a 'full fledge' RPG like Bg is supposed to be.

 

 

"Didn't Fallout 2 do this as well? One of your favorite games?"

 

Your point? You do realize that both ME, and BG are two of my favorite games as well, right? Yes, even games I relaly like have bad aspects. SHOCK! HORROR! OMGZ! GAMES AREN'T PERFECT!

 

And, oh, FO2 is nowhere near as bad in this aspect as the three games/series I mentioned hence why i didn't name it.

 

 

 

"Unkillable characters

Forced npcs into your party (Kotor 1, Kotor 2)"

 

Oh, n0es!!! We agreez!

[taks]

sloganizer.net... ahem.

 

taks

 

PS: i know, not part of game design, but i clicked on the damned thing, yet again, as if it has a magnet on it. grr gfted1!!!

[WILL THE ALMIGHTY]

DLC. I despise the concept for anything other than an MMO.

[Tale]

I despise encounter design that is either:

1) designed so that you have to play through it and die miserably several times before you can possibly come up with a strategy

2) so poorly playtested that only people who can beat it reliably are the people who've already played it a billion times

 

I don't mind an encounter sending me to my death every once in a while. Even on normal difficulty. I do mind when it happens repeatedly and through no mistake of my own except that I simply haven't played this level enough to figure out the trick.

[~Di]

...One thing I hate is what I call "gotchas". These are little traps that developers put into games that you can't possibly know about until you spring them and then you die. Horribly. And reload...

^

This.

 

Or like when a dozen hook horrors suddenly appear right behind your party when there is no way they could have been there.

^

This.

 

Non-skippable cutscenes (Bioware I'm looking at you), preferable with a tough fight and no way to save afterwards.

^

And definitely this!

[WILL THE ALMIGHTY]

Devs who put the auto-save point before ANY cutscene. Auto-save points go AFTER THE CUTSCENE. I don't want to hear the same damn dialogue twenty times, no matter how good it is.

[Gorth]

Boss Fights: Tedious, boring, game stoppers that reminds me that I am playing a video game (insert sound from Galaga or Invaders here).

 

Respawning enemies: Especially in completely impossible locations. I just cleared out room A, which has impenetrable concreate floor, roof and walls, just to be stabbed in the back by critters appearing out of thin air the moment I turn my back on it. It doesn't give the impression of vast numbers, it gives the impression of bad design/shortcuts

 

Forced companions: 'Nuff said.

 

Unkillable npcs: Just as bad as indestructable environment and 1 foot obstacles that you can't jump over. I don't care if it turns the entire world hostile and prevents me from completing the game. Powerword Reload is the lesser of two evils (immersion breakers).

 

Save points: Somebody once tried to convince me that it wasn't a limitation of the very first game consoles and their flash memory sizes. They didn't succeed.

 

The idea that first person perspective somehow equals immersion: No, artificial tunnelvision and lack of peripheral vision does not equal immersion.

 

The constant need for "streamlining" (politically correct term for dumbing down?): Ok, so the mainstream population might have a short attentionspan. Games designed for those who doesn't have that seems few and far between. Yeah, I know, it's all economics. Rogue Trader *was* more fun than the current GW drivel that they pass off as WH40K

 

Romances: Muahaahaa!... (see "streamlining", alternatively "shallow"). Nice dress, let's have sex.

 

Hybrid games: Action is fun, roleplaying is fun, adventuring is fun... lets do everything and achieve none of the above

 

 

...

Insert long continous rant here

[Kaftan Barlast]

The GRAW series games are a shining example of trial-and-error game design. The only way to discover a hidden sniper, is to get shot and killed by him. Im quite convinced that the designer behind that still hasnt grasped the concept of "the player is not the enemy"

 

 

Devs who put the auto-save point before ANY cutscene. Auto-save points go AFTER THE CUTSCENE. I don't want to hear the same damn dialogue twenty times, no matter how good it is.

 

 

This should be on a giant golden plaque in every studio that does game with cutscenes. And NO, its not ok to do it even if you can click to skip the cutscene.

[Tale]

The GRAW series games are a shining example of trial-and-error game design. The only way to discover a hidden sniper, is to get shot and killed by him. Im quite convinced that the designer behind that still hasnt grasped the concept of "the player is not the enemy"

I think design like that stems from two sources.

1) A lack of understanding that because you designed the level and played it a billion times you might know more than the average player will when they pick it up. So your experience is not the same they will have.

2) Nostalgia for Contra and Mega Man.

[Amentep]

One thing that really bugs me about game design - and I can't think of a recent example so maybe developers have moved away from it - opponents who have vastly better abilities or options than its ever possible for me or my group to have.

 

The best example I can think of this atm is Wizardry 8 where your party is forced to stick in a group (yet the villains aren't) and where enemy magic casters could regularly cast area spells at distances that I couldn't (meaning that they could tag my party all day long while I tried to move the distance to where they were at without ever being able to attack them).

[Gorth]

Good point. When the rules of the game universe only applies to the player

[Tale]

The rules of the game aren't generally meant to be the defining physics of that game's fictional world. But a conduit through which the player can experience that world. You can't have every option available to AI available to players because then you have a lot more work making sure those options don't break things. You can't limit AI to only the options you give players because then your encounter design options become incredibly limited.

Edited November 11, 2008 by Tale

[DemonKing]

For a start:

 

* Games where some keys can't be properly customised (usually console ports).

 

* Games with check point only saves that mean you have to repeat tedious sections over and over again.

 

* Mini-games.

 

* Games which use the IP of previous, fondly remembered games, but which have gameplay radically different to the original, beloved games and/or butcher the IP.

 

* NPC Romances.

 

* Expansion Packs/patches which dramatically alter the gameplay of a favourite title.

[Maria Caliban]

Other than unskipable cut-scenes, there's not much here that bothers me, and even then I rarely hate them.

 

I must just be easy that way.

[Hell Kitty]

I miss the days when the tutorial was separate from the main game.

[Walsingham]

I rarely hate things. I suppose my biggest dislikes would be, in order:

 

1. Levelling up enemies to auto match my character. Oblivion, I'm pointing at you and shrieking. (in fact this was a hate)

2. Excessive speed of play. I know I'm a frightened old man, but I should be able to play single player at my own speed. Dark Crusade is a prime offender here. I got tank rushed in the time it took me to lift my mug of tea. No exaggeration.

3. Problem solving restrictions. Commandos had far too few options for each mission (what kind of sniper only packs five rounds?). The ending of Fallout 3 is similar.

[Dark_Raven]

I rarely hate things. I suppose my biggest dislikes would be, in order:

 

1. Levelling up enemies to auto match my character. Oblivion, I'm pointing at you and shrieking. (in fact this was a hate)

Ah yes the height of stupidity. Another thing I can't tolerate.

 

Not being able to skip over dialogs. Yes I am playing this for the tenth time, it doesn't mean I want to hear some of the same old boring dialogs again.

[Hassat Hunter]

What comes to my mind:

 

* Infinitely Respawning enemies (especially nearby out of impossible locations). Re-seeding a forest map when you leave and reenter isn't bad.

* Enemies matching your level instead of the area (Oblivion).

* gigantic maps with barely anything on them to do (GTA:SA versus GTA:VC anyone? And that already had huge chuncks nothingness).

* Overabundant fed-ex that is back and forth.

* Universal Ammo (I look at you DX:IW).

[Amentep]

Good point. When the rules of the game universe only applies to the player

 

Yeah! That!

 

 

The rules of the game aren't generally meant to be the defining physics of that game's fictional world. But a conduit through which the player can experience that world. You can't have every option available to AI available to players because then you have a lot more work making sure those options don't break things. You can't limit AI to only the options you give players because then your encounter design options become incredibly limited.

 

The thing is that there is there is to me at least a limit to how far you can go to limit the players options but allowing the opponent to go on before it starts being a problem with the game. As in my example, when an opponent can target you from a distance with a weapon or spell and you can't attack back with the exact same weapon or spell then something isn't right. And when the game then additionally forces your party to stick in a bunch guaranteeing that every area attack spell sent over that great distance will hit your entire party...that's not fun, that's an exercise in constant reloading because your party keeps getting wiped out.

 

I understand the need to limit player options, but I think there's a reasonable side to it and a broken side.

 

I miss the days when the tutorial was separate from the main game.

 

Any game that has a really, really long prologue that isn't skipable whether its a tutorial, in game character creation or similar can be a pain. Particularly for inveterate game restarters like myself.

[Wrath of Dagon]

Checkpoints are bad enough, but what about checkpoints you can't even save? *cough* Ubisoft *cough*

[Killian Kalthorne]

Unkillable NPCs.

 

Everyone should be killable.

 

KILL KILL KILL!

[Monte Carlo]

I know some of these have already been mentioned, but I think they are worth reiterating. Then, perhaps, developers might stop doing them.

 

LENGTHY CUTSCENES - No, you don't work in the movies. I know you might like to, but until you do stop trying to impress me with your screenplay and directing skillz. I pine for the days of the brief "up the stairs to the brick wall in Spellhold" cutscene. MYSTARY!

 

ROMANCES - Just. Stop. It.

 

JOINABLE NPCs - Dear developer. You might think that you've created the best NPC ever. So good, in fact, that they MUST join my party. Trust me, they don't. And, whatever you do, don't compound this heinous crime by giving said NPC (a) a cutscene and (b) a romance.

 

CRAFTING - Why? Let me collect the bits, give it to the Scottish Dwarf, pay him ten grand and bingo! I can get back to the freaking game. Thanks.

 

GAMES WITH MULTIPLE CONTROLS - I love Fallout 3. I really do. I also hate Fallout 3. Why? I can't play and drink beer at the same time. Shame on you.

 

OVER-NERFED BOSSES - So the Orc has 600 hp and is resistant to the "Kill Orc" spell. Why? Because it's easier than developing a level / encounter that uses the rules? OK, we don't mind you taking liberties here and there (Rule Zero) but there has to be a limit.

 

GAMES THAT ARE DIFFICULT TO MOD - I know it's painful for some pros to accept that there are fans who can make the game more fun than they could. Unfortunately, it's a fact of life. Some real pros join in and win undying respect (Gaider springs to mind).

 

Cheers

MC

[aries101]

I do not like monsters respawning (why I even bothered to Finosh Diablo I + II, I don't know?) nor do like this new feature where you to have save and leave. I don't have time anymore to sit through 4-6 hours of gameplay - just so I can make progress in a game...

 

And the handholding levels in Oblivion were not a favorite of mine, too. I didn't like the quest arrows nor the pop up boxes that told the player what to do. However, I don't like that I only can use one or two tactis to defeat the enemies (yes, sendai in BG2; I'm looking at YOU!). Very annoying, I find.

[Jaesun]

...One thing I hate is what I call "gotchas". These are little traps that developers put into games that you can't possibly know about until you spring them and then you die. Horribly. And reload...

^

This.

 

Or like when a dozen hook horrors suddenly appear right behind your party when there is no way they could have been there.

^

This.

 

Non-skippable cutscenes (Bioware I'm looking at you), preferable with a tough fight and no way to save afterwards.

^

And definitely this!

 

Same here, I HATE those big 3 above. :does the I hate it! I hate it! I hate it! dance:

[Walsingham]

Monte Carlo: How can you hate crafting? Crafting is BRILLIANT. I just want MORE crafting. It's like a mini-game, but you have awesome death cannons when you've played it.

 

My only reluctance with crafting is that I'd prefer it if the 'rules' of crafting got re-jigged each time to played. So that you get some addditional excitement from testing the powers of each component. But then I am an engineering freak. I have a book of knots which I'm learning right now.