Are you disappointed with Obsidian?

[Zoma]

I want Avellone to make a Cthulhu based RPG, and I know he's got the right nuts in his twisted brain to make a good one. I feel a deep and unique RPG can be made from a Cthulhu based world that Obsidian could exploit it from.

Edited March 25, 2007 by Zoma

[Oerwinde]

Avellone should make a Power Rangers RPG. Then he can combine his High School RPG, with fighting space monsters in giant robots.

[Dark_Raven]

Pretty much very happy with them.

[SteveThaiBinh]

Not a disappointment at all. Despite its technical problems, Kotor 2 was a brave and interesting game. I don't know many other developers that are prepared to explore ideas in that way. I found NWN2 to be beautiful, aesthetically better than some technically superior games like Oblivion (pea soup, anyone?), though I'm glad I had a new PC to run it on.

[Azarkon]

Interesting topic. The short answer: no. The longer answer: no, but I might be in the future, if they simply remain where they are now.

 

The longest answer: I do not think KOTOR 2 or NWN 2 represent what Obsidian is, ultimately, capable of. In fact, if these sequels were the extent of Obsidian's abilities, then I would be disappointed, because not only are they riddled with technical issues/incompleteness, but they also seem a step back in terms of gameplay and player involvement. Forget PS:T - even Baldur's Gate II had better developed characters (including full-fledged romances), and while these first-gen Obsidian games beat the BG series in terms of choice & impact, they pale in that area when compared to the Fallouts and PS:T. All in all, not exactly what you'd expect from a company that was once the best evidence for why games should be considered art.

 

But then was then, and now is now - commercial realities have changed, and Obsidian, being a relatively new company (albeit led by industry veterans), is justifiably concerned foremost with paying the bills. It's for this reason that I don't judge current-gen Obsidian games as I'd judge something from, say, Bioware - because Obsidian has neither the budget nor the industry clout to do what Bioware can do. It's also why, taking into account these "birthing pains," what Obsidian has already achieved is actually quite remarkable.

 

So no, I'm not at all disappointed with Obsidian's games, given what they have had to work with. In fact, I am at the moment more optimistic about Obsidian's future than I had been about Black Isle's, since 1) Obsidian is not a part of Interplay, subject to Herve's every whim and 2) Obsidian seems more capable on the technical side, if we juxtapose Electron and TORN as each company's respective independently-developed engines. I only hope that as Obsidian becomes more successful, they do not lose that which made the company such an endearing underdog to cheer for. Gentlemen, the list of Western companies still doing CRPGs grows ever shorter - and there may come a time when we will need another one of those "roleplaying renaissances."

Edited March 26, 2007 by Azarkon

[mkreku]

Yes, I am a bit disappointed, to be totally honest. But I was kind of expecting to be disappointed, so it's not really big news to me. I never really liked any of the Infinity Engine drive games, but I absolutely loved Fallout (both of them). I was hoping we'd see more of the Fallout type of games coming from them and less IE type of games. Unfortunately, so far we've mostly seen what I'd clump into the IE genre from Obsidian: you call it story driven, I call it suffocating.

 

I'm hoping they'll make a Gothic 3/Stalker/Oblivion type of game next.. (Go Feargus, go!)

[aVENGER]

No, I'm not disappointed with Obsidian at all.

 

Instead, I'm disappointed with the current state of affairs in the gaming industry, especially the "mainstreaming" and "mass marketing" trends. IMO, Obsidian is doing the only reasnable thing in that situation and trying stay afloat. And while they certainly do have the capacity to make better and deeper RPGs, I'm fairly satisfied that they haven't decided to completely betray their ideals and that they are trying to work on some kind of a compromise instead of completely disappearing from the scene like Troika (sadly) did.

Edited March 26, 2007 by aVENGER

[Atreides]

No, I'm not disappointed with Obsidian at all.

 

Instead, I'm disappointed with the current state of affairs in the gaming industry, especially the "mainstreaming" and "mass marketing" trends. IMO, Obsidian is doing the only reasnable thing in that situation and trying stay afloat. And while they certainly do have the capacity to make better and deeper RPGs, I'm fairly satisfied that they haven't decided to completely betray their ideals and that they are trying to work on some kind of a compromise instead of completely disappearing from the scene like Troika (sadly) did.

Signed.

[Slowtrain]

Yes, I am a bit disappointed, to be totally honest. But I was kind of expecting to be disappointed, so it's not really big news to me. I never really liked any of the Infinity Engine drive games, but I absolutely loved Fallout (both of them). I was hoping we'd see more of the Fallout type of games coming from them and less IE type of games. Unfortunately, so far we've mostly seen what I'd clump into the IE genre from Obsidian: you call it story driven, I call it suffocating.

 

I'm hoping they'll make a Gothic 3/Stalker/Oblivion type of game next.. (Go Feargus, go!)

 

 

 

total agreement, except I didn't love Fallout 2. but that's just a minor detail!

 

Oh wait, I wasn't really expecting anything from obsidian so I'm not really disspopinted with them as developers.

 

But, Down with Suffocating Games! I'm so there.

[Sand]

As long it is character driven story line, I wouldn't mind a bit more open in exploration.

[Guard Dog]

I think Baldurs Gate was the last game to really give you both. Even BGII was lacking in open explorations. That was nice about Morrowind and even Oblivion, you did not really need to do the main story to enjoy the game.

 

BTW, has anyone ever tried going to Kvatch at the beginning of the game (in Oblivion)? What happens if you do?

[astr0creep]

The money is in console games, not PC.

 

Therefore, Obs are doing what they need to to survive and keep their employees working.

Period.

 

If we're lucky, they will spend some of that profit money on PC titles.

Although after playing NWN2, I wouldn't call it luck...

[Wistrik]

I voted slightly, though my feelings run toward developers in general. The almighty <monetary unit> ultimately determines what is in games these days. There also seems to be a gradual 'dumbing down' of game content, and too much adaptation of console mechanics. (When I want console mechanics, I'll buy a console system. )

 

That's my early morning, post-insomniac rant.

[Barzarel]

No, I'm not disappointed with Obsidian at all.

 

Instead, I'm disappointed with the current state of affairs in the gaming industry, especially the "mainstreaming" and "mass marketing" trends. IMO, Obsidian is doing the only reasnable thing in that situation and trying stay afloat. And while they certainly do have the capacity to make better and deeper RPGs, I'm fairly satisfied that they haven't decided to completely betray their ideals and that they are trying to work on some kind of a compromise instead of completely disappearing from the scene like Troika (sadly) did.

 

Well, said is about all i can say, most large companies now a day milk the marked of everything that has soul or visionary views, its honestly sad to see, i like obsidian for still making games with soul and rather than to liniar games like other large industries does, still think its possible to do it even better than obsidian currently does but i cant say it disappointing.

Edited March 26, 2007 by Barzarel

[Volourn]

Did you play NWN2? That was avery linear game... Hmmm...

[Maria Caliban]

Instead of making deep pc rpgs like bg2, torment and fallout, Obsidian has instead decided to go the console route. Even NWN2 played more like a console game than any of the aforementioned deep pc rpgs. While I am not disappointed because Obsidian is making console games, Obsidian doesnt seem to have any plans to make any deep rpgs in the future. Are you disappointed by this?

 

 

You have a truly amazing amount of stamina.

[Azarkon]

I actually have no problem with linear RPGs, so long as they're well-executed and somewhat original. What I dislike about today's game industry is that the bulk of what's produced demonstrate no attempt to escape the "blockbuster" mold of shallow storylines/characters and cliche thrills. But then that could just be an indictment of the PC gaming scene; perhaps I need to get into consoles?

[Dark_Raven]

I actually have no problem with linear RPGs, so long as they're well-executed and somewhat original. What I dislike about today's game industry is that the bulk of what's produced demonstrate no attempt to escape the "blockbuster" mold of shallow storylines/characters and cliche thrills. But then that could just be an indictment of the PC gaming scene; perhaps I need to get into consoles?

Yes, or they are rushed. They have these great ideas but timelines they have to follow and they end up cutting things out or rushing it to get it done.

[Girias_Solo]

I voted slightly, though I agree with people that state 'I didn't really expect anything else'.

 

The games they have made so far have some quite excellent writing, but are sadly rushed and are usually ripoffs of Bioware games. The Alien game might be something decent, though having console influence doesn't impress me, apart from the fact that it should run on older PCs by the time it gets here. And of course the guy in charge of the Alien game seems to know how a good RPG should be made, however....

 

I believe that any dev studio that relies on publisher money today is hamstrung from the get go. They are given orders: It will be real time combat. It will have graphics ahead of substance. It will appeal to as big an audience as can be found (Regardless of the genre's audience tastes)..... If you want some of the good old stuff, then the indy devs are the only place to look now, and thats where I am heading. There are several decent sounding RPG's on the horizon in this area. Can't wait.

 

Though I will still keep an eye on Obsidian games. They are the only 'edible' RPG's now on the market when it comes to major Developer titles to my knowledge.

[@\NightandtheShape/@]

People talk about games being rushed, and it's true they are rushed sometimes, but that's usually down to the time frame of development that's set at the start of a project.

 

It's always difficult to judge how long development will take, there are always problems which cannot be planned for, but that said, I'm not disappointed with obsidian, so far they hit deadlines and produce the goods. Someday we may all get lucky and see obsidian develop a game and engine without the pressure of publishers deadlines.

[roshan]

Instead of making deep pc rpgs like bg2, torment and fallout, Obsidian has instead decided to go the console route. Even NWN2 played more like a console game than any of the aforementioned deep pc rpgs. While I am not disappointed because Obsidian is making console games, Obsidian doesnt seem to have any plans to make any deep rpgs in the future. Are you disappointed by this?

 

 

You have a truly amazing amount of stamina.

 

What exactly do you mean by this?

[roshan]

****. I just looked at my join date and realized that Ive been waiting over three years for Obsidian to make a Fallout/Torment style RPG with none in sight. The situation is truly hopeless.....

[Meshugger]

****. I just looked at my join date and realized that Ive been waiting over three years for Obsidian to make a Fallout/Torment style RPG with none in sight. The situation is truly hopeless.....

 

...and here you are, still waiting for THE game

[Oerwinde]

****. I just looked at my join date and realized that Ive been waiting over three years for Obsidian to make a Fallout/Torment style RPG with none in sight. The situation is truly hopeless.....

 

It isn't likely that we'll ever see a game like those again. The age is gone where a team can make an epic engrossing story/character based RPG for the PC and be able to sell enough copies to make a profit. The economics of today just don't support it. The team required to make such a game is large, the time required would likely be a couple years, and selling 500k copies, which is probably being optimistic just doesn't justify the expense in many publishers eyes. And games don't get made without publisher support. I'm guessing probably every RPG dev house would love to make a game like that, but having it funded is the problem.

[Tigranes]

The age is gone where a team can make an epic engrossing story/character based RPG for the PC and be able to sell enough copies to make a profit.

 

The assumption that the change of industry trends is along any sort of progressive scale or even that the current trends will last for a significant amount of time is dangerous; we may well find that the current era is a sort of temporary 'bubble' that collapses back into a form of older styles, or that sometime in the future, perhaps not as far off to be irrelevant, we will see such styles come back into viability. Of course this is hopelessly speculative, but I don't think it's too ridiculous for a fan to dream of a 'rebirth' of an older style. For example, the continuing conglomeration and development (in terms of market/capital) in the industry may create stylistic fragmentations or simple niches, or even experience a general backlash against the extremisation of certain postmodern elements in the most popular of games today.

 

Anyway, for my part, I thoroughly enjoyed both K2 and NWN2. K2 was a flawed game, but for me the only flaw that was significant was the ending; perhaps because I'm used to buggy games, but the rest of it didn't bother me too much, and I really really liked the story. With NWN2 I think the game is beautiful - it suits my aesthetic tastes - and I'm also used to playing games with mediocre performance, i.e. 15fps. I loved the parts Obsidian concentrated on, which was the stronghold, character interaction and in general the creation of a long, BG-style adventure. They both lack that extra special bit to make them classics, of course, but I have great hopes for Obsidian.