Oblivion First Impressions

[Gfted1]

Im not sure I understand what TB means. Is TB what was used in the BG and IWD series?

[Llyranor]

I point you to Chess. Chess is TB.

[ShadowPaladin V1.0]

Im not sure I understand what TB means. Is TB what was used in the BG and IWD series?

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

 

A game where you have enforced waiting while the enemy moves. Although BG and IWD had turns ticking away in the background you could move whenever you liked and pause whenever you liked.

Edited March 24, 2006 by ShadowPaladin V1.0

[Musopticon?]

Turn based, simply.

[astr0creep]

You take a turn, and then the opponent takes a turn.

And so on and so forth for 40-60 hours.

 

Turn-based.

[Diogo Ribeiro]

You take a turn, and then the opponent takes a turn.

And so on and so forth for 40-60 hours.

 

Turn-based.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

 

Because speed sliders and mechanisms to solve time sinks obviously don't exist.

[Llyranor]

Screw TB, I like to click-click-click until my opponent dies. Then I feel big.

[astr0creep]

You take a turn, and then the opponent takes a turn.

And so on and so forth for 40-60 hours.

 

Turn-based.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

 

Because speed sliders and mechanisms to solve time sinks obviously don't exist.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

 

 

Of course they do.

[Diogo Ribeiro]

did tb work wonderfully in fo?

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

 

I think the whole problem with the turnbased model in Fallout was that it only applied, controlwise, to a single character. It was soul numbing because players had to sit back and watch party NPCs slug trough it without any kind of player input. In a game like Temple of Elemental Evil, it becomes much more attractive and interactive to issue orders to a group which you have full control over; you can analyze the battlefield and devise tactics that take NPC skills into consideration.

 

In Fallout there wasn't much you can do beyond controlling the PC, then wait for every other character in the current battle to make their move. To that degree I agree it wasn't a success. It worked as a means to an end, but that's pretty much all I can say about it.

 

The ToEE model was vastly superior for a number of reasons and ideally that would be where I would like to see Fallout's combat model go, with perhaps only a small number of improvements.

[Diogo Ribeiro]

Screw TB, I like to click-click-click until my opponent dies. Then I feel big.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

 

I thought that was when you touched-touched-touched yourself? :ph34r:

[Judge Hades]

ToEE style of Turn base would be good if we can control the whole party but if it is still just the player controlling the PC I think that NWN/KotOR Turn Base style would be satisfactory enough for me.

[Llyranor]

Urg. Actually, I am NOT a fan at all of FO's combat. A single avatar TB system, bah.

[Judge Hades]

That is amusing of you to say Hades. 

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

 

I'm trying to keep an open mind, dammit.

[Llyranor]

You're doing well, my Jedi friend. Keep it up

[Judge Hades]

Urg. Actually, I am NOT a fan at all of FO's combat. A single avatar TB system, bah.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

 

If they do it like NWN/KotOR but with smarter AIs then it should be fine but if they use the old FO 1/2 way I don't think that modern gamers would accept that.

[Llyranor]

did tb work wonderfully in fo?

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

 

I think the whole problem with the turnbased model in Fallout was that it only applied, controlwise, to a single character. It was soul numbing because players had to sit back and watch party NPCs slug trough it without any kind of player input. In a game like Temple of Elemental Evil, it becomes much more attractive and interactive to issue orders to a group which you have full control over; you can analyze the battlefield and devise tactics that take NPC skills into consideration.

 

In Fallout there wasn't much you can do beyond controlling the PC, then wait for every other character in the current battle to make their move. To that degree I agree it wasn't a success. It worked as a means to an end, but that's pretty much all I can say about it.

 

The ToEE model was vastly superior for a number of reasons and ideally that would be where I would like to see Fallout's combat model go, with perhaps only a small number of improvements.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

Do you know which body parts I would freaking sell for a game with TOEE's combat and NWN2's toolset????

[astr0creep]

did tb work wonderfully in fo?

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

 

I think the whole problem with the turnbased model in Fallout was that it only applied, controlwise, to a single character. It was soul numbing because players had to sit back and watch party NPCs slug trough it without any kind of player input. In a game like Temple of Elemental Evil, it becomes much more attractive and interactive to issue orders to a group which you have full control over; you can analyze the battlefield and devise tactics that take NPC skills into consideration.

 

In Fallout there wasn't much you can do beyond controlling the PC, then wait for every other character in the current battle to make their move. To that degree I agree it wasn't a success. It worked as a means to an end, but that's pretty much all I can say about it.

 

The ToEE model was vastly superior for a number of reasons and ideally that would be where I would like to see Fallout's combat model go, with perhaps only a small number of improvements.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

Do you know which body parts I would freaking sell for a game with TOEE's combat and NWN2's toolset????

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

 

Hum... I'll take a guess by choosing the obvious immature's body part of choice.

Your BLEEEPnis?

Edited March 24, 2006 by astr0creep

[Hurlshort]

BG and KotOR are not TB. You can pause, and there are turns being worked on behind the scenes, but you have no direct control over the turns. TB is also traditionally a non-frantic style of gameplay. You have as much time as you need to make your decisions, and the tactics are in the details. BG and KotOR were frantic, pause, frantic, pause...very different.

 

Civilization is an entirely different genre and so can't be compared to Fallout, Jagged Alliance, or ToEE. The TB functions on an entirely different level.

 

When you make combat real time, you are often giving up details like positioning, cover, and other tactics that can be interesting. But some people prefer the frenetic combat, so it's all about personal preferences.

[Kaftan Barlast]

A cheapshot argumet I used in a turnbased vs. realtime argument we had at Uni a while ago was

 

"If youre so adamant that realtime doesnt take away strategy/tactics, have you tried playing chess in realtime?"

 

 

And we tried that, it was very much like a typical RTS game where he who can spam the enemy with units the fastest wins. It didnt quite work IRL where you could move the pieces as fast as your hands could move but i think it could be done in a computer game.. it would suck, but it would be possible :D

[ShadowPaladin V1.0]

Chess dosnt have much relevance though. Yes it's TB but it's not like a game where statistics determine the outcome. The tactics in chess come from the restricted pathing. Thats something that dosnt apply to games.

 

If you can do it in real time, then you should. It's pointless trying to simulate a real time enviroment when you dont have to.

 

Full party control made TOEE less dull than FO (since in FO your waiting not only for the enemy, but also your own companions to act). Yet full party control is as unfallout as being real time.

Edited March 24, 2006 by ShadowPaladin V1.0

[alanschu]

I agree that that is a poor analogy.

 

Turn based games are hardly exempt from the "spam lots of units to overwhelm your opponent" game style.

 

Civ 4 shows this quite well.

[Llyranor]

Hello, geniuses, it all comes down to design. The modes in and of themselves can go screw a rock.

[alanschu]

Llyranor wins again.

[Diogo Ribeiro]

Do you know which body parts I would freaking sell for a game with TOEE's combat and NWN2's toolset????

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

 

I don't know about yours but I'd sell every body part of mine except for my meat canon and my eyes.

[Nick_i_am]

...I don't want to know how you play games.