Peragus/Taris preference

[GhostofAnakin]

btw for Mothman, the Star Forge's ability to create massive fleets and give Malak power was just as "ridiculous" as Kreia being able to hide her presence from the Jedi Masters. Neither have any previous examples in the Star Wars universe (unless you really want to stretch it) and thus both were introduced by a game developer because they felt it would make their game that much better.

 

But you won't admit that since you love K1 and hate K2. Therefore to you K1 ideas=great and plausible ideas, K2 ideas=crappy and ridiculous ideas.

[Dark Moth]

btw for Mothman, the Star Forge's ability to create massive fleets and give Malak power was just as "ridiculous" as Kreia being able to hide her presence from the Jedi Masters.  Neither have any previous examples in the Star Wars universe (unless you really want to stretch it) and thus both were introduced by a game developer because they felt it would make their game that much better.

 

But you won't admit that since you love K1 and hate K2.  Therefore to you K1 ideas=great and plausible ideas, K2 ideas=crappy and ridiculous ideas.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

 

Oh, get over youself. Kreia somehow being able to turn invisible right in front of a Jedi master was just absurd, just as Bastila was somehow able to avoid dectection by the Sith on Taris. If you can say the same for Kreia, why not for Bastila? In K2, you could have Kreia with you when talking to the Jedi Masters and they didn't even say a thing. But then, on Dantooine, they see her and they're like "OMG!!! It's you!!! You must be killed!!!" Besides, she couldn't even avoid being detected by Sion or Nihilus. If Kreia really had that power, why didn't she use it any other time?

Edited October 10, 2005 by Mothman

[GhostofAnakin]

Cool, you ignored my hypothetical question. I figured you would.

 

You also ignored my point about the "power of the Star Forge" being just as "ridiculous" as Kreia's, you ignored that too.

 

Like I said, you hate K2 and love K1 so everything in K2 either sucks or doesn't make sense, and everything in K1 is awesome and perfectly reasonable. You might as well quote this paragraph and paste it whenever you post, since this pretty much sums it up.

 

Also, don't attribute arguements others have made and respond to them towards me. I didn't mention Bastila, someone else did, so I have no clue how that has ANYTHING to do with what I said.

 

You constantly try to make it sound like I'm against K1 when in fact I was pointing out ONE thing and ONE thing only: the legitimacy of what Kreia did.

 

I brought up the Star Forge for ONE reason and ONE reason only: because you turn a blind eye to everything K1.

Edited October 10, 2005 by GhostofAnakin

[nightcleaver]

I think a core component of Star Wars is that it's fairly absurd... but, at least with the OC, I never had the feeling of "comic book" as much as I did with all the various fan fiction and star wars games floating around out there. Myself, I don't care for the star forge or the wound in the force, relating to kreia and the exile. Neither are really explained very well, although the wound in the force thingymabob is just... well, a thingymabob, instead of a cliche, deus ex machina, machine from the all-powerful forbearer race. Which one's really worse or less creative?

 

Both sound like ideas you might find in a comic book, and neither idea is truly inspiring to someone as great and intelligent as I am.

 

Seriously, folks! Think of something better!!

[dufflover]

The whole deal with Bastila walking around openly on Taris is just an oversight (or a comprise made to give more players the choice to take a Jedi into the Sith base, after all, Taris is a "beginner level").

 

It's like the oversight (or just ignoring it to keep the programming simple) walking around with huge vibro blades.

[Judge Hades]

Besides, she couldn't even avoid being detected by Sion or Nihilus.  If Kreia really had that power, why didn't she use it any other time?

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

 

She uses the Dark Side to befuddle the Light Side. That is its purpose. A Dark Sider is more attuned to the dark energies used therefore a Dark Sider could detect when she used those powers. Do you remember the Harbinger. Sion couldn't see her at first, but used the force to attack where she stood instead of seeing her with his eyes.

[Plano Skywalker]

both games depended on absurd, comic-bookish elements. but, then again, I would point out that GL's own OT had a space station that could *vaporize* entire planets....

 

the main reason we see such wacked out stories is because they help avoid the issue of a proper darkside path. We will not see more "conventional" stories until they decide to write 2 real paths for these games.

[FieryDove]

Really fair to compare a bustling three level city to an abandoned mining moon. Especially when other isn't even an intro level, but a real planet.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

 

Well you have to slog through both to get anywhere they are starter areas (not counting ender spire/t3 ebon hawk prologue. Someone said it correctly, peragus is repetitive. So much so I got a mod to get past that area. after you've seen 100 mining droids, there is no need to see a million more.

 

Taris was much more interesting and held alot more choices of tasks with ds/ls hits..imho perhaps but there you have it.

[vaxen83]

Some K1 concepts from planets were part of themes might have come from NWN ideas of Bioware. Hard to not see some common elements between both games.

[Musopticon?]

^That's because(vaxen) Bioware doesn't know how to make decent stories anymore. They just copy-paste the same skeleton story of good and evil and then cloth it in a different theme.

[dufflover]

^That's because(vaxen) Bioware doesn't know how to make decent stories anymore. They just copy-paste the same skeleton story of good and evil and then cloth it in a different theme.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

Well they did a pretty good job of it

 

I wouldn't say Obsidian's story is decent...unless you love "wtf" events like Half-Life 2 and Matrix.

[Nur Ab Sal]

This is fantasy, people.  Maybe Obsidian expanded on Palpatine's ability to make Kreia appear powerful.  How is that not "realistic" in a universe where laser swords and talking carpets are real?

 

Sometimes I think people just bitch about how "unrealistic" things are because they disliked TSL, rather than because it truly is unrealistic.

 

Hypothetical question: If GL had Sidious do this in the movie, would you still say "OMG that's so unrealistic" or would you accept it as a power that Sith Lords were capable of?

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

Yes this is fantasy but fantasy isn't excuse for a bunch of gibberish ideas, lame dialogs and pointless duels that TSL is.

 

I don't understand how guy who dares to criticize TOTJ - that was Darkhorse biggest hit of the 1990s and received warm welcome from most fans and nonfans,

as "terrible" and "primitive", can admire absolutely incongruous and cramped TSL

story that, in short, rests on instant repeating words "echo", "wound", "exile", "Revan", "hole" and unoriginal copying prequel ideas like Jedi Purge or death star interrogation droid remaked into GOTO.

 

Your hated TOTJ at least tried to give a feel of different, ancient times that still could easily be linked with classic movies without vulgar, obvious loans.

 

Avellone's philosophical blurb (which manifests through Kreia's mouth) is most idiotic and nonsensical in the entire EU. Even NJO heresies are something clever when compared to it. K1 story is simple and naive but fits into the simple star wars universe. TSL story is full of inconsequences but it actually aspires to be something ambitious and deep. Of course this makes all thing laughable.

[dufflover]

Maybe someone should make a new thread "Kreia's Invisibility Cloak" (okok, I hate harry potter but you get the point)

[Darth_Schmarth]

To me comparing Kreia's "invisibility" to Palpatine's clouding his alignment in the dark side of the Force is a bit like comparing a bicycle to a space shuttle. "They're both vehicles". While you can defend what Kreia does, simply because she does it, it doesn't mean it's good writing. You can argue what is plausible and what is not in both K1, K2, the movies and other fanfic, but it's not really the issue. It's about what feels balanced and trustworthy in both a story and a game. I definitely think Kreia's antics is further over the top than the Star Forge, just like I believe that Nihilus' destroying planets on a whim is plain silly too. There's extraordinary and there's extraordinary...

[Bulgarian Jedi]

As for you comments that some things in the game were absurd I say that first it is fiction and second in that fiction the Force is a reasonabe example for Everything impossibe and unlogical on the planet Earth.

[GhostofAnakin]

I don't understand how guy who dares to criticize TOTJ - that was Darkhorse biggest hit of the 1990s and received warm welcome from most fans and nonfans,

as "terrible" and "primitive", can admire absolutely incongruous and cramped TSL

story that, in short, rests on instant repeating words "echo", "wound", "exile", "Revan", "hole" and unoriginal copying prequel ideas like Jedi Purge or death star interrogation droid remaked into GOTO.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

 

I never said I admired the TSL story. I said that the Kreia thing is FEASIBLE when a)variations of that Sith power have been seen (perhaps not to that extent) by the likes of Palpatine and b)since the SW universe already has some powers that at first glance might be considered "out there".

 

I'm just arguing against people who say the power Kreia uses is "ridiculous" and "unbelievable".

[Judge Hades]

Same here. Its magic.

[BattleCookiee]

OE overreacts damn much with these powers.

 

Movies:

Battle-station can kill planet. First time ever, unique, very dangerous

Kotor 2:

A Push-over does it

 

Kotor1:

Powerfull Force Bonds, like the one from Master to apprentice

Kotor2:

Even more powerfull bond, lethal even, also giving benificial powers to both. HOW the heck do you even get a bond with that witch anyways?

Bastila had it because she pumped her energy in Revan to keep him alive... Kreia because, eh, eh, she was with you on a ship???

 

Movies:

The Force is everywhere, all living thing etc.

Kotor2:

KILL IT (A.K.A Kill everything existing)

 

Movies:

People can mask Alignment

Kotor2:

People can turn "invisible" at will...

[Bulgarian Jedi]

Somewhere in the cut content Master Vash(I think) tells you that this bond is a clever manipulation of Kreia. But this answer just raises more questions rather than explaining old ones.

[BattleCookiee]

Somewhere in the cut content Master Vash(I think) tells you that this bond is a clever manipulation of Kreia. But this answer just raises more questions rather than explaining old ones.

 

If it is somewhere, it is not in the Recorded Sound Files...

 

She wonders (like you) how you got that bond. It get's never answered though...

[Darth_Schmarth]

I think the general consent between people having played the game and read between the lines is that the bond is just another one of Kreia's schemes; it doesn't actually exist. But there you go, since that's just another one of those things I don't really like about Kreia and the way she is overpowered.

[thepixiesrock]

I like Peragus actually. I think it is one of my favorite parts of the second game. I am replaying it now.

[dufflover]

I like Peragus actually.  I think it is one of my favorite parts of the second game.  I am replaying it now.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

oh my ... your preferences are obviously different to most people...

 

I agree with Battlewookie on the Movie/KotOR comparison. Like I say in Kreia related threads, the bond was fake and a consequence of her being a ("secretly" powerful Sith Lord) witch.

This is probably more for a K1/K2 compare thread but the whole over doing the story elements like this is one of the sub-reasons of liking the K1 story better.

 

Anyway, I still think Peragus is stupid, especially when you solve what happened on the station but it means nothing, and at least in K1 when you solve puzzles it's to help people and be a goodie-goodie; Peragus is dead.

[Darth_Schmarth]

Peragus was okay on the first playthrough. It's replayability value is ten times lower than that of Taris, however, which makes Taris the superior place. Paradoxally I thought the Undercity was really cool and great fun on my first go, but on every subsequent playthrough I've found it tedious and boring. I guess it's the whole background thing with the Outcasts and the Promised Land; at first it is interesting, but after that it gets old.

[Nur Ab Sal]

There is one additional module for Taris that wasn't used actually. It is still remains in the game files, though. And it is pretty finished. We should ask Team Gizka if they could restore it, after they'll finish restoring rest of TSL crap.