Random Loot Generator

[Judge Hades]

Its better than the first two games. ALso the longer the battle takes the longer the bugger has to use his equipment up. It doesn't matter any way. They way that KotOR does random drops suck and its not going to change.

 

I just hope Obsidian does better with NWN 2.

[Volourn]

"Like I would find Dark Jedi robes off a dead Rhodian thug lying in the street."

 

Yet, some people claim that KOTOR2's random loot is an improvement over KOTOR.

 

 

"They way that KotOR does random drops suck and its not going to change."

 

Huh? First off, KOTOR1 didn't have random loot from what i seen, and enemies mostly dropped the weapon they used.

 

Quite frankly, loot system is something where without even playing KOTOR2; it is obvious that KOTOR1 was way better at. Of course, some things like more skill useage in dialogue seems to be one improvement that KOTOR2 got right. Good stuff.

 

 

"Secondly they only had a little over a year to develope this game while Bio had what two + years to work on KOTOR so I think this alone should grant them some degree slack as to the quality of game they did put out for all of us to enjoy."

 

Exuses, exuses.

 

BIO had to create the engine (almost), and game from scratch. Obsidian may have had less time; but a lot of the work was already done for them. On top of that, they pretty much knew how much time they had. People make a big deal about the x-box release date being "puseh up" for the Christmas holidays yet they forget that the release date for both version always varied between December 2004, and March 2005 so it wasn't that much of a surprise it was done then.

 

Tsk, tsk.

[Judge Hades]

I wasn't refering to KotOR 1, Volourn. Take the post in the context that it is written in, refering to KotOR 2. Its not that hard to do, for any grade schooler can figure it out.

[GarethCarrots]

master splinter, im not one to take hades side, but your last post about longer=better preserved was, idiotic and argument for arguments sake, as for the rlg i think it sounds awful, for munchkins and hardcore dudes alike. replace randomness with common sense...

[Volourn]

"I wasn't refering to KotOR 1, Volourn. Take the post in the context that it is written in, refering to KotOR 2. Its not that hard to do, for any grade schooler can figure it out."

 

You were referring to both games in the series. Nice try though.

[Sbri]

At the same time I think that some randomness is in order. I've played through KOTOR I more often then I would care to admit, and can tell you exactly what will be coming out of most of the containers and off a fair number of the bodies. While this makes planning my inventory easier, variety does equal better re-playability. Perhaps a middle ground should be reached...say certain types of enemies drop certain equipment, while other are completely random? And container inventory would also be, for the most part, randomly generated?

[Volourn]

"While this makes planning my inventory easier, variety does equal better re-playability."

 

True. Randomness to a certaind egree isn't bad; but when it's as silly as it seems to be KOTOR2 it goes to the other extreme of just nonsenical. ie. The example of a normal rodian having dark jedi robes.

[Epiphany]

Well like I said, I haven't played the game yet.  And I did mention that I have heard of some obvious flaws.  You apparently chose not to read my whole post and to reply negatively.  Good job! 

 

By the way, your example is pretty poor regardless.  Like in Kotor 1, you found the blade of Bacca's Ceremonial sword in the Terentatek on Kashyyk.  Don't you think it's possible the Sith battled these animals at one time and stuck their weapons in their hides?

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

 

1) I chose to ignore the rest of your post and respond "negatively" (cry), because of your "more realistic" comment

2) I never said the item loot in KOTOR was perfect, so why even bring it up

3) The sith war sword is a massive double bladed sword that I've found in tiny little cannocks before

 

But since you opted to bring up KOTOR, I'll be more than happy to compare the more logical item drops in the first game, than the idiotic drops in the second one. Just let me know.

[Drakron]

Random loot is not exactly bad but its something that must be done with care to avoid oddities like thugs dropping things they clearly cannot use.

 

Also enemies would always drop their equipted weapons for consistence sake, if weapons cannot be destroyed in combat they would not just "vanish".

[Master_Splinter]

master splinter, im not one to take hades side, but your last post about longer=better preserved was, idiotic and argument for arguments sake, as for the rlg i think it sounds awful, for munchkins and hardcore dudes alike. replace randomness with common sense...

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

 

Yes it was argumentative, and it was meant to sound stupid. That is why afterwards I said it wasn't significant and therefore was a poor choice to use for item drops.

 

Would you people please read entire posts before posting your opinions? This is the second time today...

 

And if you took the time to read my posts and understand them (you can understand proper English grammar yes?) then you would have read that I would prefer a random loot system based on common sense.

 

Your entire post agrees with what I said earlier, and yet you call what I said stupid and idiotic....

[NeverwinterKnight]

Random loot is not exactly bad but its something that must be done with care to avoid oddities like thugs dropping things they clearly cannot use.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

 

exactly.

 

my contention with the current system isnt that im pissed that i cant get all the uber loot in the same places everytime or that, in theory, its a bad system. but rather, it should have been tweaked or modified so that certain conditions apply. for example, dead bodies. you shouldnt be able to find uber weapons on lowly thugs, especially when theyre attacking you with one kind of weapon, and you loot their corpse to find a different kind.

 

if they wanted to use a random loot generator, they should have just done so for things like footlockers, metal bins, and backpacks. but corpses should have had only equipment that the person was carrying.

[Judge Hades]

I also agree with Drakon. If a enemy is using a weapon and its not destroy during combat, for some odd reason, it should be in the loot pile. As well as any armor that wasn't completely destroyed.

 

I think this how it should be done.

 

Have a random loot chart for all group types. Dark Jedi would be one group type, while Civilian Thug would be another type. You have each group type have its own set items. Dark Jedi would be Lightsaber and basic Dark Jedi robes, for a thug it might be a basic blaster and a light combat suit (at most a +3 Defense value). Sure these items wil be important at the lower levels but once you hit the mid range to upper mid range, 6th to 12th level, these items will not even be worth picking up. Beside set items do a random bit of items that one particular subgroup might have. There is an equal chance that they will not have anything.

 

In this way you have set items which the adversary obviously used while still keep the random lot done in a realistic fashion. Best of both worlds.

[sawyl]

the random drops concerning armor and weapons are unbearable enough, but when you add in that IT'S NEAR-IMPOSSIBLE to find the lightsabre crystals you want, it gets that much worse.

 

What would be realistic if the computer takes a look at the equipment being used by the adversary and take into account how quickly they died. Faster they died, the more salvagable their equipment is, ut longer the battle goes the less likely there will be anything of use left for it will either be used up, such as healthpacks, or destroyed and rendered unusable.

 

too much unnecessary scripting. The devs might consider it if they had time, but a lot of players wouldn't appreciate it.

 

In this way you have set items which the adversary obviously used while still keep the random lot done in a realistic fashion. Best of both worlds.

 

yes!

[Master_Splinter]

I also agree with Drakon.  If a enemy is using a weapon and its not destroy during combat, for some odd reason, it should be in the loot pile.  As well as any armor that wasn't completely destroyed.

 

I think this how it should be done.

 

Have a random loot chart for all group types.  Dark Jedi would be one group type, while Civilian Thug would be another type.  You have each group type have its own set items.    Dark Jedi would be Lightsaber and basic Dark Jedi robes, for a thug it might be a basic blaster and a light combat suit (at most a +3 Defense value).  Sure these items wil be important at the lower levels but once you hit the mid range to upper mid range, 6th to 12th level, these items will not even be worth picking up.  Beside set items do a random bit of items that one particular subgroup might have.  There is an equal chance that they will not have anything.

 

In this way you have set items which the adversary obviously used while still keep the random lot done in a realistic fashion.  Best of both worlds.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

 

Exactly. That just seems like the obvious way to do things. I don't know why we haven't seen it?

[anakins revenge]

yea the RLG thing was flawed, i mean i have like 4 pontite crystals that i dont need, also my robes are still those green ones i got by loading and talkin to a merchant about 50 times, so the merchants need to be upped in the next one so they sell better stuff than ur character can create without having to spend hundreds of credits.

[Judge Hades]

What you need to do is start off with a scripting master template. Once you have that working for general purposes You do a cut and paste for each subtype, which you then tailor make it for that one subtype.

 

Master Template you set primary weapon, primary armor and have random amount of money, a possible secondary weapon, random chance of 3 misc. items.

 

An example of subtype would be LowDarkJedi.

Low level Dark Jedi would have is primary weapon (Light saber), basic Dark Jedi armor, ramdom money, possible small blade, sith blaster, or nothing as secondary weapon. Of the misc. items it could be one or two low powered crystals, or a medpack, computer slicer, or whatnot.

 

Cut and paste and put in a midDarkJedi, then alter.

Mid level Dark Jedi might have 1, or 2 lightsabers, or even a double light saber as his primary weapon, basic Dark Jedi armor, ramdom money, a secondary weapon such as a sith blaster or nothing as secondary weapon. Of the misc. items it could be one or two mid powered crystals, or a medpack, computer slicer, or whatnot.

 

Cut and paste and put in a HighDarkJedi, then alter.

High level dark Jedi will have a double lightsaber or 2 lightsabers, moderately powerful Dark Jedi armor, ramdom money, no need for a secondary weapon. Of the misc. items it could be one or two high powered crystals, or a medpack, computer slicer, or whatnot.

[Obireel Y Doncha]

What you need to do is start off with a scripting master template.  Once you have that working for general purposes You do a cut and paste for each subtype, which you then tailor make it for that one subtype.

 

Master Template you set primary weapon, primary armor and  have random amount of money, a possible secondary weapon, random chance of 3 misc. items.

 

An example of subtype would be LowDarkJedi.

Low level Dark Jedi would have is primary weapon (Light saber), basic Dark Jedi armor, ramdom money, possible small blade, sith blaster, or nothing as secondary weapon.  Of the misc. items it could be one or two low powered crystals, or a medpack, computer slicer, or whatnot.

 

Cut and paste and put in a midDarkJedi, then alter.

Mid level Dark Jedi might have 1, or 2 lightsabers, or even a double light saber as his primary weapon,  basic Dark Jedi armor, ramdom money, a secondary weapon such as a sith blaster or nothing as secondary weapon.  Of the misc. items it could be one or two mid powered crystals, or a medpack, computer slicer, or whatnot.

 

Cut and paste and put in a HighDarkJedi, then alter.

High level dark Jedi will have a double lightsaber or 2 lightsabers, moderately powerful Dark Jedi armor, ramdom money, no need for a secondary weapon.  Of the misc. items it could be one or two high powered crystals, or a medpack, computer slicer, or whatnot.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

 

This is the idea that should be incorporated into KOTOR3.

 

I think there should be a good chance that the enemies primary and secondary weapons WON'T be available (just tell youself it was lost or damaged in the fight). Otherwise you'd end up with way too much stuff.

 

I'm sure you were thinking of this, but there should also be multiple subtypes for lockers, footlockers and other containers, based on location.

[Volourn]

"Otherwise you'd end up with way too much stuff."

 

Tough. If something is killed there should be a high chance their items exist. If the player lands up with "too much stuff"; I blame the devs for putting too much combat in.

[Obireel Y Doncha]

"Otherwise you'd end up with way too much stuff."

 

Tough. If something is killed there should be a high chance their items exist. If the player lands up with "too much stuff"; I blame the devs for putting too much combat in.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

 

"Tough"? What's this guy's problem? He's even "blaming the developers" for stuff that hasn't even happened yet (too much combat in KOTOR3).

 

The game's already incredibly balanced in favor of the player. The vast increase in stuff we're talking about would throw balance off even more. That's all I'm saying.

Volourn's probably the lone voice in the wilderness calling for less combat in a KOTOR game.

 

Volourn's argument doesn't really hold up anyway, if he meant "There should be a high chance their items exist IN WORKING CONDITION." Melee weapons, blaster fire, and lightsabers would do a great deal of damage (it's why they're used to bash stuff open and kill things). The loser of a fight isn't just going to have a broken body, a lot of his/her/its equipment is going to get busted up as well.)

Add in stuff like plasma grenades and Force Storm and it's downright unlikely you'd find useable equipment on a fallen enemy.

[Epiphany]

You're trying to justify something that doesn't apply to this game. Equipment doesn't degrade over time, nor during combat. Just because you "win" a fight, wouldn't mean your stuff would be in perfect condition. Since the game doesn't factor in equipment degradation, you should just simply find what the enemy was using on their body.

 

Fight a jedi? Get their robes and saber.

Fight a merc? Get their armor and blaster/sword.

[Sbri]

As to the "too much stuff" agruement, they could alway institute the NWN solution. Have your ability to carry inventory limited by your strength. I know that in that game I am skipping low level items entirly, as I don't want to be loaded down and not have room for items that I want.

 

BTW - I hate this plan. I enjoy carrying everything and anything I want. It's simply a suggestion to remedy a particular complaint. If anyone has a better one, I'm all ears.

[213374U]

You're trying to justify something that doesn't apply to this game.  Equipment doesn't degrade over time, nor during combat.  Just because you "win" a fight, wouldn't mean your stuff would be in perfect condition.  Since the game doesn't factor in equipment degradation, you should just simply find what the enemy was using on their body.

 

Fight a jedi?  Get their robes and saber.

Fight a merc?  Get their armor and blaster/sword.

Unfortunately, that doesn't work from a game balance standpoint. CRPGs are not PnP RPGs, hence you can't have the same rules, period.

 

I'm all for realism in that sort of things, but then again, how do you justify carrying around 25 armors and 500 lightsabers?

[Drakron]

Simple, limited inventory space and weight limits.

 

Those rules are pretty standart on RPGs, unlimited inventory space tends to be standart of adventure games.

[Ludozee]

I haven't experienced the RLG myself, but I didn't like the system KotOR used. It just wasn't realistic (and don't give me some "yeah, but SW is unrealistic" crap). If I kill a sith soldier I at least expect to find his gun on his corpse, because I saw him use the damn thing on me. I prefer the Fallout and and BG system, where you could actually find the dead guy's complete equipment on his corpse.

[NeverwinterKnight]

Unfortunately, that doesn't work from a game balance standpoint. CRPGs are not PnP RPGs, hence you can't have the same rules, period.

 

I'm all for realism in that sort of things, but then again, how do you justify carrying around 25 armors and 500 lightsabers?

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

 

this is where id like them to make better use of the ebon hawk storage compartments.

 

have a limit on what you and your npc party can carry, then youd be forced to either sell the rest or leave the rest aboard the ebon hawk.