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The Political Thread - Hobbes Edition


Amentep

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Yet people will continue to argue that certain countries aren't actuyally ****holes and are actually 'better' than the US. LMAO

 

 

As for SA, they are what they are. Murderous dictatorship.  And, Trump is gonna do what basically every other president has done - continue to let them slide.

 

 

btw, That excuse they came up with is the most believable defense I have ever heard for murder/assassination. Yeah.

No the Saudi and USA  relationship is much more nuanced, historical and significant than just this incident 

 

The best way to see this is to not focus on these terrible mistakes but rather the important role that Saudi Arabia needs to play in the broader ME and future stability for the region. 

"Abashed the devil stood and felt how awful goodness is and saw Virtue in her shape how lovely: and pined his loss”

John Milton 

"We don't stop playing because we grow old; we grow old because we stop playing.” -  George Bernard Shaw

"What counts in life is not the mere fact that we have lived. It is what difference we have made to the lives of others that will determine the significance of the life we lead" - Nelson Mandela

 

 

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What's nuanced about it?

Excellent question but before I respond how do you see the  Saudi\USA relationship?

 

Please include as much details as possible because there are different views people have on Saudi Arabia

"Abashed the devil stood and felt how awful goodness is and saw Virtue in her shape how lovely: and pined his loss”

John Milton 

"We don't stop playing because we grow old; we grow old because we stop playing.” -  George Bernard Shaw

"What counts in life is not the mere fact that we have lived. It is what difference we have made to the lives of others that will determine the significance of the life we lead" - Nelson Mandela

 

 

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Theory of the day:

 

Bruce and SonicMage are the same person.

:biggrin:

 

I remember when I use to be compared to Oby....that was hilarious 

"Abashed the devil stood and felt how awful goodness is and saw Virtue in her shape how lovely: and pined his loss”

John Milton 

"We don't stop playing because we grow old; we grow old because we stop playing.” -  George Bernard Shaw

"What counts in life is not the mere fact that we have lived. It is what difference we have made to the lives of others that will determine the significance of the life we lead" - Nelson Mandela

 

 

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There's nothing nuanced about it.  THE US uses SA to combat Iran. That is why they 'put up' witH SA's evil.

 

Yeah it is old but still very working strategy of fighting evil by supporting bigger evil

 

 

Elerond what do you think of the whole Saudi\USA relationship ?

"Abashed the devil stood and felt how awful goodness is and saw Virtue in her shape how lovely: and pined his loss”

John Milton 

"We don't stop playing because we grow old; we grow old because we stop playing.” -  George Bernard Shaw

"What counts in life is not the mere fact that we have lived. It is what difference we have made to the lives of others that will determine the significance of the life we lead" - Nelson Mandela

 

 

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There's nothing nuanced about it.  THE US uses SA to combat Iran. That is why they 'put up' witH SA's evil.

 

Yeah it is old but still very working strategy of fighting evil by supporting bigger evil

 

 

Elerond what do you think of the whole Saudi\USA relationship ?

 

 

It is mutually benefitical relationship where both parties turn blindeye towards things that another does that goes against their ideological values, because they see that economical, geopolitical and militaristic benefits that relationship brings are more important than their ideological values that they just can shutup otherwise.

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Why has elegance found so little following? Elegance has the disadvantage that hard work is needed to achieve it and a good education to appreciate it. - Edsger Wybe Dijkstra

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The argument that INF tied the United States' hand vis a vis China (curiously the reasoning Putin tried to use when he attempted to take Russia out of it before) makes absolutely zero sense; the treaty only forbids _ground-launched_ cruise missiles, and its arsenal of both air and sea-launched missiles (be it from Mk. 41 destroyers and cruisers or submarines, though this would require refitting nuclear warheads onto Tomahawks, as the nuclear-armed missiles were taken out of service in the early 2000s) are more than sufficient for the deterrence role. Most likely scenario is that no new platform that would have violated INF will be deployed by the US in Europe (as the DoD previously didn't see the need) where Russia's programs will go into overdrive.

 

Words by James Acton: https://twitter.com/james_acton32/status/1053793374090731520

Edited by Agiel
Quote
"All of life’s lessons come with a price…
We may learn a lesson, and things may get better in the end…
So that’s the trade off…life experience for exhaustion… wisdom for innocence.
There may be a happy ending to our stories…
but we paid for that with little pieces of our souls and we will never get those back."

-Austin Lunn

 

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Paul Krugman (living proof that a nobel prize is about as valuable as a participation trophy) says if the Dems win Congress in two weeks Trump won't "accept" the results. This again? What does he think Trump can do? I remember some folks saying Obama would not leave office when his term was up. I don't think anyone in the US was happier to see January 20th 2017 than Barak Obama was. It is ironic, the very people bemoaning the toxic political atmosphere in this country are the ones fomenting the very thing they complain about. It's like they want to create a "situation" just so that can be right that a "situation" was brewing. The wort part of all is it's all just a show. A farce. The winner of the Giants - Falcons game tonight will have a greater impact on the world  than the winners of the 2018 midterms.

"Be on the lookout for thieves, trespassers, aaaand COMMUNISTS!"

The Director FO4

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I haven't heard anything about Trump not 'accepting' the results (he has been throwing around 'warnings' of 'voter fraud' though), just that he won't accept the blame if the Republicans lose the House. Looks like the Senate could end up being either status quo or the Republicans win a seat or two, it's a tough one for Democrats.

 

Didn't hear any people saying that Obama would refuse to step down either if Trump won.

 

The winner of the Giants - Falcons game tonight will have a greater impact on the world  than the winners of the 2018 midterms.

 

I wouldn't bet on it.

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I haven't heard anything about Trump not 'accepting' the results (he has been throwing around 'warnings' of 'voter fraud' though), just that he won't accept the blame if the Republicans lose the House. Looks like the Senate could end up being either status quo or the Republicans win a seat or two, it's a tough one for Democrats.

 

Didn't hear any people saying that Obama would refuse to step down either if Trump won.

 

The winner of the Giants - Falcons game tonight will have a greater impact on the world  than the winners of the 2018 midterms.

 

I wouldn't bet on it.

Paul Krugman said it yesterday. As far as Obama not leaving office it was not thrown around by serious political or media, just the fringes. And of course "people you know". From what I've read the only President in recent memory who wasn't happy when his term ended was Clinton. Free cigars and interns? That guy wanted to stay! But this is a thing that comes up around here every two years and has very little merit. Another nugget of propaganda thrown around to convince people to vote by telling them the people of opposite political inclination are their literal enemies waiting for the chance to take over everything and bring about 1000 years of darkness, etc.

 

Suppose Clinton won in 2016. Aside from Goresuch what would be different? Assuming Kennedy did not want to retire with Clinton in office?

 

Spending has gone up? Check

Still fighting in Afghanistan, Syria, 180 other places around the world? Check.

ACA still a thing? Check

Immigration status quo? Check

Tax Cut? Well, that would not have happened. Clinton thinks that's HER money not YOUR money.

 

Otherwise.... can't think of much.

 

If the Dems take over the House which they are likely to do, then they will control what gets funded and what does not. So they will be in a position to STOP things but not DO things. So you are likely looking at two years of status quo until 2020 when we put all the dice back in the cup and shake them up again. But status quo appeared to be just fine to the Republicans in the House after the initial flurry last year. So again... not much will change.

 

Personally I hope they do take the House. I always sleep better when the government is divided.

"Be on the lookout for thieves, trespassers, aaaand COMMUNISTS!"

The Director FO4

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"says if the Dems win Congress in two weeks Trump won't "accept" the results."

 

That's funny considering the Dems still haven't accepted the results from last eyar. To the point that they have tried, and have continued to try to kick  him out and will use any trick - legal or otherwise - to  accomplish their mission.  That is their prerogative but be honest about your hypocrisy.

 

Let's not forget pre presidential election, Trump said he would only accept the results if he felt they were above board and legit. Dems were livid and people like Obama sated that it wa sundemcoratic and unAmerikan to not accept the results because the election is always above board and cannot be hacked. The moment he won,  it's been nothing but spam about how the US election was hacked... by Russian spamming on the internet. Seriously, that is the HUGE hacking scandal. A bunch of spammers and trolls. LMAO

DWARVES IN PROJECT ETERNITY = VOLOURN HAS PLEDGED $250.

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I still fail to see how anyone figures the election was "hacked". So a bunch of russian bots and trolls were spreading disinformation on social media and other parts of the internet. Seriously who believes anything they read on the internet? Suppose I told all of you my entire back story was fake and I'm really a FBI agent working with INTERPOL in a joint investigation to ensnare Malcador & Volo (who are both the same person BTW) for criminal sarcasm and trolling for dwarves to be added into ALL rpgs ever made (including ones not in a fantasy setting)  and of course mail fraud and money laundering? And you know it MUST be true. Someone you don't know just wrote it on the internet! But then again people still fall for the Nigerian Prince and catfish scams. You can't fix stupid.

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"Be on the lookout for thieves, trespassers, aaaand COMMUNISTS!"

The Director FO4

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 Seriously who believes anything they read on the internet?

 

I think you may be overestimating your countrymen (like every country I guess) a tad. :p

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Why has elegance found so little following? Elegance has the disadvantage that hard work is needed to achieve it and a good education to appreciate it. - Edsger Wybe Dijkstra

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L0L EU is evil and full of Nazis. And, theya re gonna punished Italians because they don't like what a gov't wants to do. I thought EU existed to help. Not. EVIL TO THE CORE. Let the Italian people decide who governs them.

Edited by Volourn

DWARVES IN PROJECT ETERNITY = VOLOURN HAS PLEDGED $250.

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"L0L EU is evil and full of Nazis. And, theya re gonna punished Italians because they don't like what a gov't wants to do. I thought EU existed to help. Not. EVIL TO THE CORE. Let the Italian people decide who governs them."

 

DizzyWindingDunnart-max-1mb.gif

The ending of the words is ALMSIVI.

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