Sensuki

bumping a few "priority" bugs that haven't been answered (well I assume persistence issues are a priority)

I would try it. Hormalakh gets better performance than I do and my PC is better than his. I think Unity games don't like the 1156 chipset very much, but seem to run fine on AM2/AM3, 1155 and 1150.

Yeah sec/msec calculation of Attack Speed/Recovery time is really needed, especially for new players and I'm not sure why it hasn't been included yet.

The encounter design in that temple could stand to be improved IMO Maybe also some more traps too.

Yeah currently War Bows are now the best ranged weapon, if you can crit with them anyway. You'll do no damage if all your hits are grazes, but if you are accurate, they're currently better than Arbalests and guns. It's more of a problem on Hard because of the increased number of enemies. On normal, there's less enemies so if your Shield-using Fighter is holding off 2-3 enemies, then that might be good enough. This isn't good enough however when you're up against lots of enemies. You need that character to actually help take them down, so you can reduce the incoming DPS. Like I said in the OP, it mostly just seems to be the combination of two small balance issues and a possible (yet to be confirmed) bug. I think fixing those will allow a more fair comparison of the fighting styles and builds than the currently skewed mechanics.

This is not true: https://forums.obsidian.net/topic/69964-the-pe-ie-mod-thread-draggable-ui-now-available/ However there are more things they could do to support modding.

I have never really found Shields that great in Pillars of Eternity. I've tried them every build, and shield using characters to me are virtually useless. I only play on Hard difficulty, so experiences may vary if you're playing on easy and normal. To win encounters on Hard, you need to take stuff down as fast as possible. I find that offense is a better defense than defense is in Pillars of Eternity (at least, so far). To me, it seems that the increased Deflection gained from wearing a shield is far outweighed by the downsides of wearing one, and building a character to be good at defense and using shields is even worse. The best shield user I have been able to create is a Moon Godlike Fighter. You can get 20 Intellect with the right culture choice (eg. Old Vailia). I tried both maximum Constitution and maximum Perception to accompany my 20 Intellect, and I found that max CON was completely useless, but max Perception was okay. For a Level 1 Ability, you want Vigorous Defense, it's an awesome defensive spell and gives you a big edge at the start of combat. After that you want: Sword and Shield Style, Defender Ability and Wary Defender Talent. You steal the BB Priest's off-hand Large Fine Shield, and her Boots of Evasion. As long as you equip the Boots of Evasion AFTER you activate Defender (doing it the other way is bugged), you can attain 116 Deflection at the start of the Backer Beta. That's pretty big right ? The high deflection absolutely makes a difference. There is a huge increase in survivability. Matt516 charted in our attribute paper that Deflection contributed more to survivability in combat if your Deflection was already 6+ points higher than enemy accuracy than Constitution did, at a rate of +1 Deflection vs +2% Endurance on CON. Endurance gain has not been buffed since the Attribute number tweaks, so Intellect far outweighs it in survivability most of the time now. On Hard though, this build is trash. I've tested it against a few fights multiple times, and the MAX INT Fighter with the Shield absolutely can last longer in combat. The problem is that they have virtually no offensive output whatsoever. To offset this a little bit, you can try wearing no armor, since it doesn't have anything to do with defenses and it decreases your DPS. I found this to be a little bit more effective than wearing it in some fights but not by much, and worse against really high damage units - like Elder Lions. The problem is that this character will still be attacking the same target they started attacking by the end of combat. Their slower recovery, 1H weapon hits and reduced accuracy (from shield use) has an abysmal damage output. Against armored enemies, most of the damage is soaked up by DR and you are often dealing single digit and minimum damage. Other characters that are built more offensively (such as all of the BB characters) will have already killed multiple enemies, while your Fighter has killed none, and dealt little damage. On Hard there are more enemies in most encounters than party members and this requires you to often spread your aggro around. Now that some enemies actually have smarter targeting, they might go for some of your squishier characters and due to engagement, your Fighter can't really deal with it. Each extra enemy is another engagement that the party will have to deal with, and they add up. The more enemies, the less you want to (or can) move. Because the shield-wearing Fighter has virtually no DPS output, enemies live longer through encounters and thus deal more damage to your party. This can often mean that you take more damage than you would have if you had another offensive character with 2-3 times the DPS output. Building the same level 1 character with different non-shield based talents and equipping them with a two-handed weapon illustrates the difference. The character can actually down enemies in good time, and assist in other kills. You take less damage from weapon attacks due to the high intellect and you score lots of hits and crits and deal good damage with a two-hander. There are a few problems attributing to the fact that building for Shield Use doesn't appear to be very viable, the first is that the accuracy penalty for shields is too large. Recently, many things in the game that gave +10 accuracy were nerfed to +6 accuracy. 1H weapon style was nerfed from +15 accuracy to +10 Accuracy. Shield use however was not changed. A Medium shield gives you -5 Accuracy, and a Large Shield gives you -10 Accuracy. I think this is too much, and I would suggest that values of -3 (Medium) and -6 (Large) be trialed internally instead. The second problem I believe is because one-handed weapon damage ranges aren't "doing" what they are supposed to. Consider this recent quote from Josh Sawyer on Something Awful Currently I do not believe that light and normal 1H weapons are meeting this goal, I am finding that against any DR at all, 2H weapons deal more damage for all characters except Rogues and sometimes Barbarians. Rogues can stack multipliers, the calculation of which currently I believe is not working as intended either, and apply DoTs at 5th level - so dual-wielding is often best for them for highest DPS. Barbarians also deal more Carnage damage from dual-wielding. I think the weapon values have been balanced for 0 DR, which is the problem there. The third problem is the (likely) bugged damage calculation. 2Hers deal more per-hit damage, and thus benefit more from multipliers (Might + Fine Weapon bonus + Crits + others). I believe that addressing these three problems might make using shields a bit better. Currently I just avoid them, unless testing specifically for them. However, I am only one tester and not everyone may have had the same experience as me, so what are everyone else's thoughts?

Confirmed: The bottom menu also moves with it.

I agree with that notion. The system would be MUCH more interesting if it worked like that.

Is it possible to get the Known Bugs list with the actual fixed v392 things? I know a couple of the fixes that didn't work but most of the others seem to have been. If you've fixed the others you can just chuck fixed internally next to it like I do in my self-managed thread

Yeah people with 32-bit systems have struggled to run this game and Wasteland 2. I'm not sure why though. If you upgrade to 64-bit you likely won't see any crashes. Not sure how much the devs are going to do to support 32-bit operating systems properly.

Oh okay, that makes sense. Thanks for clearing that up.

When I actually get a chance to sit down and hunt for them, always end up finding a few. Really need to get around to looking into some of the gameplay issues though, like with the damage thing.

Back when it was delayed, I guessed March 2015. I'm not sure whether it will be early march or late March. I still hope it's something more like APril - even just an extra week just to get some more bugfixes in, would be good IMO. But yes, the announcement will probably come at PAX.

I've never skipped Irenicus' Dungeon lol. I always fully complete it every time And yeah, casters (Wizards specifically) are going to suck in PE. They are so easy to take down in the beta, it's hilariously disappointing.

It isn't. The engine for some reason requires you to state one higher than the maximum integer as the range . 100 is the maximum in the game.

Contrary to popular belief this is absolutely not true. I never did it and neither did any of my RL friends, who are all worse at the IE games than me. My friend Andrew got it first, and he taught me how to play it, and introduced me to D&D. One example is the Ogre right at the start of the game. On my first try, I sent my PC Fighter in to melee the Ogre, and he killed me in a single hit. I repeated that tactic and died again. On my third go, for some reason I thought okay, I'll use Imoen to take the hit, while I attack from the side. The Ogre hit Imoen, didn't kill her, and I got the hits in to take it down. I do not know how this works, because Imoen has like 8 HP, and my PC has 14. I have *never* seen the Ogre kill Imoen on the first hit, ever, in any BG1 vanilla game, almost if she has some kind of script protecting her from this encounter. So that's how I beat that one. To this day, I have never kited an enemy in an IE game with ranged weapons. I have killed plenty of enemies with ranged before they got to me, but I always just send my melee guys charging headlong in to meet them. Kiting is not necessary.

Final Seal Guardians.

That's just how unity handles their .random function for integers. For floats it's the starting and ending number

This is how it's supposed to work though and I don't think it does work like that at the moment (but I can't be sure until the devs confirm it)

Druid is the easiest class at the moment. I actually think they might have nerfed the Cipher too much, but that might be just me.

Over time I've basically lost any bit of LARP in me and I won't do any unless the game gives you a pretty even choice about it - such as The Witcher series. I usually do things based on what the rewards are going to be. Sometimes it will be what content I want to experience. Stun's approach is good, and he knows more about the game than me. I am better at handling multiple melee characters and positioning, moving them and using them in conjunction with usually a couple of spells or item uses to beat most encounters. I can't really remove the metagame knowledge from my mind, but even if I 'forget' something, I can always work out a way to deal with a problem. On my last playthrough I had a Kensai with low intelligence. This was fine, until I came up against Mind Flayers who drain your intelligence. If your INT hits 0 - you die. Game over. So I had to play knowing that I could only take x amount of hits from a Mind Flayer before I died. My other main tank was Minsc who .. yeah only has 6 Intelligence. Luckily for me I had a few Potions of Genius lying around that allowed for a few more hits, and I switched aggro between characters until I could beat the various groups. These groups were fairly large because I was using a mod, and there was more of them than normal. But I did it. It took careful playing and I did stuff up a few times, but I did it. BG2 to me is an experience. It is probably my favourite game, but until this year I had not actually played it for about 7-8 years because it is a pretty serious commitment and I had been playing competitive Call of Duty - which took up a lot of time, so I'd been replaying BG1 and IWD1 each year instead, and not BG2. I am at the point where I do not care about any of the dialogue because I've heard it so many times before. I just play it because I love the gameplay. Using mods also adds a lot of new enjoyment. Playing Unfinished Business for the first time. Playing with TobEx for the first time. Playing with 1PP for the first time. This is an easy one - what they have done is make easy and normal difficulty relatively easy, and the general gameplay is also much simpler than any IE game, except for maybe BG1. There however, are still a lot of rules to learn and they are not going to be able to clearly explain how stuff works via the UI before release, so they may run into some problems. It shouldn't be, I don't think. Personally I don't really care too much, but Obsidian are usually pretty good about this stuff. I wouldn't be worried about that. I don't use auto-pause, and I don't have a single problem with those encounters. I always seem to manage. Just press pause straight away and think about your actions. Sometimes some save or die effect will kill a character though, and you'll be like oh, well I'll just Death Ward next time. That's just how it is.

Okay so, I got an answer, and here is my bug report http://forums.obsidian.net/topic/70016-possible-bugs-with-damage-calculation-weapon-damage/ If some other people could use my testing methodology and try and produce the same results, that would be appreciated.

After the discussion on the forums about critical hit damage being too high, and after seeing some questionable results from various things in the game I decided to ask Josh Sawyer about how total damage was calculated in Pillars of Eternity. His reply was Now much of the time, I'm not seeing results in this range on weapons. So I decided to look at the source code to see how damage is actually calculated in the game. The method which I think is most relevant is below. This is the AdjustDamageDealt method from the class CharacterStats, which is called in the AttackBase.calcDamage() method public void AdjustDamageDealt(GameObject enemy, ref DamageInfo damage) { damage.DamageAmount *= this.StatDamageHealMultiplier; if (this.OnPreDamageDealt != null) this.OnPreDamageDealt(((Component) this).get_gameObject(), new CombatEventArgs(damage, ((Component) this).get_gameObject(), enemy)); if (this.OnAddDamage != null) this.OnAddDamage(((Component) this).get_gameObject(), new CombatEventArgs(damage, ((Component) this).get_gameObject(), enemy)); int roll = Random.Range(1, 101); CharacterStats enemyStats = (CharacterStats) enemy.GetComponent<CharacterStats>(); if (Object.op_Equality((Object) enemyStats, (Object) null)) return; int toHitRollOverride = enemyStats.GetAttackerToHitRollOverride(roll); if (this.OnAttackRollCalculated != null) this.OnAttackRollCalculated(((Component) this).get_gameObject(), new CombatEventArgs(damage, ((Component) this).get_gameObject(), enemy)); int num1 = this.CalculateAccuracy(damage.Attack, enemy); int num2 = enemyStats.CalculateDefense(damage.DefendedBy, damage.Attack, ((Component) this).get_gameObject()); if (damage.DefendedBy != CharacterStats.DefenseType.None) { this.ComputeHitAdjustment(toHitRollOverride + num1 - num2, enemyStats, ref damage); if (damage.IsCriticalHit) damage.DamageAmount *= this.CriticalHitMultiplier; else if (damage.IsGraze) damage.DamageAmount *= CharacterStats.GrazeMultiplier; else if (damage.IsMiss) damage.DamageAmount = 0.0f; } damage.AccuracyRating = num1; damage.DefenseRating = num2; damage.RawRoll = toHitRollOverride; if (this.OnAdjustCritGrazeMiss != null) this.OnAdjustCritGrazeMiss(((Component) this).get_gameObject(), new CombatEventArgs(damage, ((Component) this).get_gameObject(), enemy)); if (!damage.IsMiss) { if (damage.Attack.IsDisengagementAttack) damage.DamageAmount += this.DisengagementDamageBonus; if (damage.Attack is AttackMelee) { damage.DamageAmount += this.BonusMeleeDamage; if ((damage.Attack as AttackMelee).Unarmed) damage.DamageAmount += this.BonusUnarmedDamage; } for (int index = 0; index < this.BonusDamage.Length; ++index) { if ((double) this.BonusDamage[index] != 0.0) { DamagePacket.DamageProcType damageProcType = new DamagePacket.DamageProcType((DamagePacket.DamageType) index, this.BonusDamage[index]); damage.Damage.DamageProc.Add(damageProcType); } } this.AddBonusDamagePerType(damage); this.AddBonusDamagePerRace(damage, enemyStats); if (Object.op_Inequality((Object) damage.Attack, (Object) null)) { Equippable equippable = (Equippable) ((Component) damage.Attack).GetComponent<Equippable>(); if (Object.op_Inequality((Object) equippable, (Object) null)) { if (equippable is Weapon) { if (damage.Attack is AttackMelee) { damage.DamageAmount *= this.BonusMeleeWeaponDamageMult; } else { damage.DamageAmount *= this.BonusRangedWeaponDamageMult; if (Object.op_Inequality((Object) enemy, (Object) null) && !this.IsEnemyDistant(enemy)) damage.DamageAmount *= this.BonusRangedWeaponCloseEnemyDamageMult; } } equippable.ApplyItemModDamageProcs(ref damage); } } } this.ComputeInterrupt(enemyStats, ref damage); if (this.m_isPartyMember) { if (Object.op_Implicit((Object) enemyStats)) { enemyStats.RevealDefense(damage.DefendedBy); enemyStats.RevealDT(damage.Damage.Type); using (List<DamagePacket.DamageProcType>.Enumerator enumerator = damage.Damage.DamageProc.GetEnumerator()) { while (enumerator.MoveNext()) { DamagePacket.DamageProcType current = enumerator.Current; enemyStats.RevealDT(current.Type); } } } if (damage.DefenseRating >= damage.AccuracyRating + 50) { GameState.AutoPause(AutoPauseOptions.PauseEvent.ExtraordinaryDefence, ((Component) this).get_gameObject(), enemy); TutorialManager.STriggerTutorialsOfTypeFast(TutorialManager.ExclusiveTriggerType.PARTYMEM_GETS_DEFENSE_TOO_HIGH); } if ((double) damage.MaxDamage - (double) damage.DTRating < (double) damage.MinDamage && Object.op_Inequality((Object) ((Component) damage.Attack).GetComponent<Weapon>(), (Object) null)) GameState.AutoPause(AutoPauseOptions.PauseEvent.WeaponIneffective, ((Component) this).get_gameObject(), enemy); } if (this.OnPostDamageDealt == null) return; this.OnPostDamageDealt(((Component) this).get_gameObject(), new CombatEventArgs(damage, ((Component) this).get_gameObject(), enemy)); } private void AddBonusDamagePerRace(DamageInfo damage, CharacterStats enemyStats) { if (enemyStats.CharacterRace >= (CharacterStats.Race) this.BonusDamagePerRace.Length || (double) this.BonusDamagePerRace[(int) enemyStats.CharacterRace] == 0.0) return; damage.DamageAmount += this.GetBonusDamagePerRace(enemyStats.CharacterRace, damage.DamageAmount); } Now I do not have perfect understanding of the code, and there could be connected methods that I don't know about, but what I think I'm seeing here is that damage multipliers are individually multiplying the base damage, instead of being added together in a formula like Josh presented on tumblr. I have shown this code to four other people and they agree that this looks like how it's working. To test damage multiplier stacking, I am using The Rogue Class Human or Aumaua to achieve High Might Living Lands Culture 18-20 Might score Blinding Strike ability Weapon Focus talent (whichever weapon I'm testing) Dirty Fighting and Vicious Fighting talents to score easier critical hits Have mostly been testing with 1H Normal style weapons, usually dual wielding Here are some screenshots of the strange results I've been getting. I know for a fact that there is something definitely off about spears. They seem to be doing the most damage of any of the weapons currently, and it could be a separate issue. You can create a character from scratch, equip two fine spears and use Blinding Strike on a party member or any other unit and regularly score 70 damage critical hits (before DR). Here is a Fine Sword crit for 70.7 damage (20 Might Aumaua Rogue). There is something strange about this one because it says Medreth only has 21 Deflection :/ I'm not sure why, it should be 40-something, unless the Bliding affliction was applied before the damage hit or something. Fine Spear crit hit for 70.8 damage (max should be 38.24) 45.3 damage with a Fine Sabre crit with Crippling Strike (18 Might Orlan Rogue) 47.9 damage sword HIT with Blinding Strike (Aumaua Rogue 20 Might) 44.8 damage sword HIT on the BB Fighter with Blinding Strike 41.9 damage War Hammer crit on Crippling Strike (Human 18 Might, max should be 38.24) Another instance - same character of 42.4 Fine Sabre crit of 49.3 on a Crippling Strike (18 Might Human, max should be 38.24) You get the picture. I am not 100% sure what the problem is, I suspect some of it might be related to the way in which damage is calculated in the source code, but it's possible that some of these are separate bugs and not the same bug. For instance, the spear screenshot is from a freshly launched game with a fresh character, no save/load or anything. Some of the others are from saved games. As I learn new information, I will post it.

In this video, I demonstrate the use of a Rogue weapon-based attack with single weapon style, then reload the game and demonstrate two-weapon style. When using two-weapon style, the ability attack does not trigger recovery and the off-hand attack is instant after the animation. Expected Result: Weapon-based ability attack should trigger recovery when used in two-weapon fighting style.