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#281
Guard Dog

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I was specifically thinking about the "working tremendous hours" bit.

 

I'm of the opinion that both W. and Obama were well meaning. This is iffier if considering their entire administrations, of course.

 

Stating that the cause of rising health care costs was the ACA is misleading to say the least. Healthcare costs in the US were already ridiculous and increasing long before the ACA. The ACA was an underwhelming solution because the US, as a whole, is ridiculously and irrationally dysfunctional regarding anything that attempts to tackle the unmitigated catastrophe that is healthcare in America.

The thing I was specifically referring to was a tax on medical devices that was included in the ACA. It's only a 2.3% tax but it is applies to just about everything. For example, if I take my dog to the vet for a check up, blood test and X-Ray. The tax applies to the syringe, the vial the blood goes in, the X-Ray machine, the stethoscope, the otoscope, the lab that analyzes the blood has it applies to all of their equipment.  So all of this costs more for the Vet & lab to provide and the added costs are passed on to me. So because we have the ACA, which has nothing to do at all with Veterinary care, my dogs annual exam and senior dog wellness test which used to cost $98, now costs $166 for the exact same service. And it is only because all taxes, fees, and costs mandated by the government are ultimately paid by the consumer.   



#282
Wrath of Dagon

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I'm not sure how a 2% tax on everything causes your cost to double. Sounds to me like your vet is making a killing.
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#283
Guard Dog

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I don't believe the MDT was 100% responsible. The price of everything escalates over time because the cost of everything goes up. But in 2005 that service cost $85 give or take (going from memory here). In 2010 it was $98 so about a 15% change over five years give or take. So if it follows that rate of increase it should cost between $115-$120 ballpark. So the actual difference cause by the tax (which kicked in in 2011) is $46, and increase of thirty something percent.


Edited by Guard Dog, 20 April 2017 - 12:57 PM.


#284
Hurlshot

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 Edit: Btw, my healthcare is fine, and so is most people's.

 

 

Edit: You know, probably just a waste of breath. Living in a different world, I suppose.  :-

 

Edit 2, where I decide to waste breathe. :p

 

I'm not fine with this: http://www.npr.org/s...care-per-person

 

No one in the US should be "fine" with the costs of healthcare. We are all one emergency away from catastrophic medical bills that can bankrupt all but the richest of us.


Edited by Hurlshot, 20 April 2017 - 08:31 PM.

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#285
Elerond

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Funny how foreigners keep coming over here to partake in the "unmitigated catastrophe".

 
Clearly, if people prefer to live in a country where they can earn five times as much as they could in their homeland, it's a sign that literally no problems could possibly exist in that country.

 

I meant they're coming over here to get medical treatment, I wasn't talking about immigration. Edit: Btw, my healthcare is fine, and so is most people's.

 

 

Healthcare system and being able to get good medical treatment aren't same thing even though they are connected.

 

As healthcare system is usually used when people are talking about people's ability access medical treatment they need.

 

So country may have world best medical treatment facilities, but if only handful people are actually able to use them country's healthcare system maybe bad for most of the citizens of that country. Meaning that if rich foreigners come and buy those treatments that most people in country can't access it really don't tell anything about country's healthcare system.



#286
Wrath of Dagon

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Edit: Btw, my healthcare is fine, and so is most people's.

 
Edit: You know, probably just a waste of breath. Living in a different world, I suppose.  :-
 
Edit 2, where I decide to waste breathe. :p
 
I'm not fine with this: http://www.npr.org/s...care-per-person
 
No one in the US should be "fine" with the costs of healthcare. We are all one emergency away from catastrophic medical bills that can bankrupt all but the richest of us.

We're not all one emergency away, because most of us have health insurance. You're exaggerating same as most people on this topic. Our system is far from perfect, but one reason the costs are high is that Americans are demanding and spoiled. We won't accept long waiting times or rationing.

Edit: From your chart, the closest in spending to us are Norway, Luxembourg and Switzerland. What's the common denominator? These are all very rich countries.

Edited by Wrath of Dagon, 21 April 2017 - 06:18 AM.


#287
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We're not all one emergency away, because most of us have health insurance. 

 

 

This is completely false. The vast majority of health insurance covers a percentage, and it has a yearly cap. If you end up in the hospital for a month you will literally be drowning in debt.



#288
Guard Dog

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We're not all one emergency away, because most of us have health insurance. 

 

 

This is completely false. The vast majority of health insurance covers a percentage, and it has a yearly cap. If you end up in the hospital for a month you will literally be drowning in debt.

 

Hmmm... unless your health insurance is drastically different than mine that cap is your out of pocket maximum. For example, my insurance has an out of pocket maximum of $10k. Although I do get some discounts and benefits for using doctors and labs "in network" I'm responsible for all of my healthcare up to $10k. After that I'm fully covered. That's the way most of them work in my experience. It's unusual for someone to hit the "big number" so it's a pretty good deal for the insurance companies even if 30-40% of policies go over.



#289
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Ah, looks like the ACA ended yearly and lifetime limits on coverage, that is good news.

 

Still, that 10K is nothing to shake a stick at, and that does not include deductibles, which continue to rise.

 

My cap is actually much lower, at 1k a year. But that is for each individual in the family, so we've met to cap for my wife but we could still hit it for other family members. Of course that is on top of the monthly $700 I pay and the few thousand my employer kicks in. Also prescriptions and dental seem to be on different plans.

 

Here is some data that Kaiser put together: http://kff.org/healt...l-bills-survey/



#290
Guard Dog

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Ah, looks like the ACA ended yearly and lifetime limits on coverage, that is good news.

 

Still, that 10K is nothing to shake a stick at, and that does not include deductibles, which continue to rise.

 

My cap is actually much lower, at 1k a year. But that is for each individual in the family, so we've met to cap for my wife but we could still hit it for other family members. Of course that is on top of the monthly $700 I pay and the few thousand my employer kicks in. Also prescriptions and dental seem to be on different plans.

 

Here is some data that Kaiser put together: http://kff.org/healt...l-bills-survey/

Actually there was a bill before the ACA that did that too. It was signed around 2003 IIRC. The ACA nullified some of it's provisions which is why it was added in. I forget the name of it. They offer better plans but I took this one with the additional carrot of a one time $1k in my HSA. Plus since it's a high deductible plan I can use my HSA with no tax penalty without going over the "big number". Dental insurance now.... they all suck. Some more than others. They actually do have coverage caps and they are pretty low. It's enough to make you want to brush your teeth right now.


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#291
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This is probably a better link for the Kaiser study, gets into the details of people who struggle with medical bills: http://kff.org/repor...buting-factors/

 

I'm part of this group, by the way. Every year someone in our family has had something unexpected that has cost us a few thousand dollars in medical bills. It's always a strain. It doesn't bankrupt us, but makes it difficult to set anything aside.


Edited by Hurlshot, 21 April 2017 - 07:27 AM.

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#292
Wrath of Dagon

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I think that's why they tell you to have a "rainy day" fund.

#293
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I think that's why they tell you to have a "rainy day" fund.

 

Thanks for the advice. 


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#294
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http://www.msn.com/e...ocid=spartandhp

 

the recent trump twitter rant 'bout judge shopping were amusing as well.  'cause san francisco has options other than the 9th circuit to address sanctuary city concerns?  'course this is one o' those gut-level appeals for which trump is becoming (in)famous.  

 

am actual understanding why trump supporters is current enraged by the fed judges.  liberals were in a similar position a few years ago when judges were stomping 'pon obama actions.  seems wrong to many folks that a single judge could block an executive order or act of Congress, or fed rule.  the thing is, the Court does not make advisory opinions, so the only functional way to test Constitutionality o' government action is through actual cases brought before the courts, and with almost few exceptions, one starts at district level. according to the Constitution, a person or entity need an actual case or controversy to gets benefits o' judicial attention. hypothetical people with potential problems do not get their day in court. good. can one imagine how busted would be the court system if every claim o' federal excess were needing be reviewed by the Supreme Court of the United States of America?  

 

HA! Good Fun!


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#295
Guard Dog

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Apparently, Trump is under the impression that if Andrew Jackson had been elected President in 1860 (rather than being dead for nearly 17 years) the Civil War would have been avoided. That Jackson (a southern slave owner) would have negotiated a peace. Well, let's see. In Jackson's 8 years neither Kansas or Missouri were organized territories so the big issue of slavery in non-state territories which was a big deal in the 1850's and a factor in the war would have been a non-issue. And the Abolitionists didn't wield a lot of political clout nationally in the 1830's so it's not like he had to do much to appease them. And there was the incident where he allowed the regional post masters to destroy mailings from abolitionist groups. So, nothing I know about Andrew Jackson leads me to believe he would have been interested in negotiating any kind of peace other than the fact that as a Democrat, southerner, and slave owner himself the southern states would not have felt threatened enough by him to secede. Which means two things: The slaves would still be slaves and the can would just be kicked down the road a bit.

 

Do you ever get the feeling every time Trump says something there is a staffer off screen mentally willing him to shut up? This would have been one of those times.

 

http://www.oann.com/...-had-to-happen/


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#296
Ben No.3

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Oh come on, he is a populist indeed who most probably lies in bed with the very people he promised to fight; why would anyone take him seriously?

Edited by Ben No.3, 01 May 2017 - 10:25 AM.


#297
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Apparently, Trump is under the impression that if Andrew Jackson had been elected President in 1860 (rather than being dead for nearly 17 years) the Civil War would have been avoided. That Jackson (a southern slave owner) would have negotiated a peace. Well, let's see. In Jackson's 8 years neither Kansas or Missouri were organized territories so the big issue of slavery in non-state territories which was a big deal in the 1850's and a factor in the war would have been a non-issue. And the Abolitionists didn't wield a lot of political clout nationally in the 1830's so it's not like he had to do much to appease them. And there was the incident where he allowed the regional post masters to destroy mailings from abolitionist groups. So, nothing I know about Andrew Jackson leads me to believe he would have been interested in negotiating any kind of peace other than the fact that as a Democrat, southerner, and slave owner himself the southern states would not have felt threatened enough by him to secede. Which means two things: The slaves would still be slaves and the can would just be kicked down the road a bit.

Do you ever get the feeling every time Trump says something there is a staffer off screen mentally willing him to shut up? This would have been one of those times.

http://www.oann.com/...-had-to-happen/


His predictions of what would happen are as valid as yours. Both are lala land fantasies.
And don't get me wrong it's healthy and stimulating to do so, but arguing whose fantasies are wrong or right is not.

#298
Malcador

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Do you ever get the feeling every time Trump says something there is a staffer off screen mentally willing him to shut up? This would have been one of those times.

http://www.oann.com/...-had-to-happen/


Yup. Also Spicer opens that bottle of JD again at his desk.
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#299
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What is in the minds of men? :lol:

 

Jimmy Carter saw a UFO.

 

Goddamn I'd like to encounter an alien. Not a scary tentacle alien, a Grey or maybe even a Reptoid. :yes:


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#300
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The slave owner with the big heart.






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