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DSIII is CGRs third best game of 2011


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#1
C2B

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Before watching: Its a completly opinionated list and weird one (He also includes a pinball machine and a 90's game rerelease). Of course that also makes it honest.

Edited by C2B, 21 December 2011 - 02:33 AM.


#2
Nathaniel Chapman

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Before watching: Its a completly opinionated list and weird one (He also includes a pinball machine and a 90's game rerelease). Of course that also makes it honest.


I've seen this guy's stuff before, that's really nice! Thanks for posting.

#3
Pidesco

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Dungeon Siege 3 is my favourite game of 2011, by the way.* Do I get some love too?



*I haven't played Arkham City or Deus Ex: HR, yet. Dungeon Siege 3 is totally more awesome than the Witcher 2, though.

#4
Nathaniel Chapman

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Dungeon Siege 3 is my favourite game of 2011, by the way.* Do I get some love too?



*I haven't played Arkham City or Deus Ex: HR, yet. Dungeon Siege 3 is totally more awesome than the Witcher 2, though.

<3<3<3

now go make a youtube about it!

#5
Oner

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DS 3 is totally in my top 2.
Spoiler


#6
C2B

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10th on Platformnations list

http://www.platformn...es-of-the-year/

#7
C2B

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Dungeon Siege 3 is my favourite game of 2011, by the way.* Do I get some love too?


Its close to my favourite too. (Though I probably prefered a few games more) Was just loads of fun. Its not my favourite Obsidian game but its a fun one.


Also, you are probably aware of that yourself but its kinda sad how much the games plot and writing get labelled as "generic" and "bland" without people even picking up on the slightest of its nuances. Seriously, after carefully reanalyzing it, the game displays by far the most "realistic" charachter motivations of any Obsidian game and in turn has also the plot with the most "morally grey" shades attached to it.

Seriously, before the end of the spire there was not one moment in the main plot where I seriously thought. "Well yeah, I HAVE to do that because its the "right" thing to do"

Aside from some minor nitpicks there is also two major design and writing issues. The main charachters/companions could have been handled a LOT better. Especially limiting the major part of original writing for them to side comments was not that great an idea. Maybe give them 1-2 unique quests. A few more NPC's that recognize each indivudally. These are just a few things that previously (even before release) were stated in this forum too.

Thats also kinda connected to the second major issue. The storytelling. I know the initial idea here was probably "It's a dungeon crawler. So let's not shove the narrative in the player's face" Problem here is. You did too good a job at that. Yes, it has a great pacing to it but on the other hand most people won't actually bother to pick up on it or get involved when that part is locked away in side content.

I think Anthony Davis even mentioned this in that RPG-Codex thread where he said that he probably has a different perspective because he read George Ziets sourcebook. Which I fully believe to be the case.

Both of these are more design issues than problems with the quality of the writing.



Anyway. Again, big probs to the team and especially to George Ziets.

Edited by C2B, 27 December 2011 - 07:21 AM.


#8
George Ziets

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Thanks for the props, C2B!

Originally, we had planned to give the companions larger roles (and quests of their own), but these were cut pretty early due to schedule constraints. Based on what was in the game, you probably caught hints of what those quests would have been. I also wanted to give more "screen time" to the Katarina-Lucas sibling relationship, but that suffered the same fate.

Story vs. action was a difficult balancing act for DS3 - possibly the toughest challenge I've faced so far in my career. Some action gamers have told me that we got the balance just right, others actually feel that there is still too much dialogue / story. Meanwhile, most traditional RPG gamers would have preferred more of a story focus. I think this is a case where we probably couldn't please everyone, but we tried our best, and I'm glad you still enjoyed the final product. I'm also glad you appreciated the realistic character motivations, which are always important to me in games. :down:

#9
WorstUsernameEver

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Actually, something that disappointed me of the plot is that very few explanations are given about the Radiant Youth. I don't mind a little mystery on what exactly he (or it?) is, but there were points were it felt like an unexplained Deus Ex Machina, going into people's dreams to move the plot. Might be just me though.

#10
HoonDing

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Originally, we had planned to give the companions larger roles (and quests of their own), but these were cut pretty early due to schedule constraints. Based on what was in the game, you probably caught hints of what those quests would have been. I also wanted to give more "screen time" to the Katarina-Lucas sibling relationship, but that suffered the same fate.

That's pretty disappointing considering Dungeon Siege 2 had full party banter and all (eight) companions had a sidequest. Even the expansion (which I surmize is probably as long as the entire Dungeon Siege 3) had three new companions with each a new sidequest.

#11
Wrath of Dagon

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For an ARPG the story/action balance was just right IMO. I was actually happy that for once I didn't have to babysit my moron companions or solve their mommy/daddy issues, and what was there established their personalities well enough. Sometimes less is more. I think the only big opportunity missed (and I understand there were budget constraints) was to begin with a really nice cut scene of Jane murdering the Legion, and thus establish her character from the beginning. She's attractive and charismatic enough so that the game would've benefitted greatly from meeting her at the start instead of half way through the game, so you'd know who you're up against.

Edited by Wrath of Dagon, 02 January 2012 - 05:36 PM.


#12
GhostofAnakin

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Originally, we had planned to give the companions larger roles (and quests of their own), but these were cut pretty early due to schedule constraints. Based on what was in the game, you probably caught hints of what those quests would have been. I also wanted to give more "screen time" to the Katarina-Lucas sibling relationship, but that suffered the same fate.


That sucks. That was probably my biggest (only?) major complaint about DS3. At the beginning you learn a bit when first meeting them, but then they just sort of become silent muscle for hire afterward. You don't really learn all that much more about them as you travel with them. And the lack of NPC-specific sidequests just added to the disappointment when it comes to your companions.

#13
Starwars

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I don't mind the lack of "banter" or direct companion interactions ala NWN2 or what-have-you. I think it works pretty well as is and keeps the action going.

That said, a specific quest for each companion would've been nice and a good way to flesh them out without engaging in hours of just sitting around exploring the next dialogue option. Loved it in a game like Torment or MotB, don't think it'd fit in here.

#14
Tale

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The Katarina-Lucas relationship being seemingly glossed over did end up surprising me. I doubted if the characters even knew, or if it was just supposed to be us knowing something behind the scenes.

#15
C2B

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Thanks for the props, C2B!

Originally, we had planned to give the companions larger roles (and quests of their own), but these were cut pretty early due to schedule constraints. Based on what was in the game, you probably caught hints of what those quests would have been. I also wanted to give more "screen time" to the Katarina-Lucas sibling relationship, but that suffered the same fate.

Story vs. action was a difficult balancing act for DS3 - possibly the toughest challenge I've faced so far in my career. Some action gamers have told me that we got the balance just right, others actually feel that there is still too much dialogue / story. Meanwhile, most traditional RPG gamers would have preferred more of a story focus. I think this is a case where we probably couldn't please everyone, but we tried our best, and I'm glad you still enjoyed the final product. I'm also glad you appreciated the realistic character motivations, which are always important to me in games. :(


By the way. Will we ever get to see your sourcebook?

#16
George Ziets

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I'd guess probably not, since I'm not even sure who owns the rights. But I'll mention it to the Powers That Be.

#17
Nathaniel Chapman

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Actually, something that disappointed me of the plot is that very few explanations are given about the Radiant Youth. I don't mind a little mystery on what exactly he (or it?) is, but there were points were it felt like an unexplained Deus Ex Machina, going into people's dreams to move the plot. Might be just me though.


We would have liked to include this as well.

#18
WorstUsernameEver

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Actually, something that disappointed me of the plot is that very few explanations are given about the Radiant Youth. I don't mind a little mystery on what exactly he (or it?) is, but there were points were it felt like an unexplained Deus Ex Machina, going into people's dreams to move the plot. Might be just me though.


We would have liked to include this as well.


I guess that explains it. Thanks for the reply!

#19
Oner

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The Katarina-Lucas relationship being seemingly glossed over did end up surprising me. I doubted if the characters even knew, or if it was just supposed to be us knowing something behind the scenes.

I expected more from that angle too, but there was a small sentence when you recruit Katarina as Lucas, that I thought was sweet. Can't quote it though.

#20
Sannom

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I think it went something like "Even if you weren't of the Legion, you're still family". Rather sweet indeed, and a far cry from the scene you get when you meet Katarina with Lucas as your companion, which is actually rather funny :) Particularly Lucas' "You really think so?" when Katarina tells him he has prettier hair than her o:) .

Just finished Treasures of the Sun, it was weird having the "end-slide" BEFORE making the choice leading to it, but it actually resolves one of my problems with Obsidian's choices and consequences in that game (basically some of the benefits granted from the choices are not clearly explained beforehand, I'm notably thinking of the cyclops' situation in Stonebridge). Story was nice, expansion on the lore was good (strangely good to know where the Vyodanoï come from) and the characters were interesting. The 'greatest treasure of the faith' was a surprise and it's funny how off-marks we were in our speculations :p .




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