Completed the game as pure rogue (assassin) for science - it's actually great

[Faytte]

Just so people know: rogues have an essentially free PL8 skill that does 160% crit damage, +10 acc, +80(so far) crit chance, full attack as long as you dual wield and spam it while you have high resource points. It's called Gambit

How does this compare vs single monk? Also doesn't this cut you off from using your powers for the most part?

[Nefarious7]

Can you post your full assassin build mate? Thanks

[Aramintai]

So the difference between multi class and single class rogue is only 15% sneak attack? If so that's nothing. Cipher for soul whip gives you 20% that's active all the time.

Not only. As with all multiclasses you lose 8-9 level abilities, which are quite good for the rogue.

[Leafar]

I'm using a bleakwalker/assassin and found that it's a very good multiclass for a rogue. Opening up with a black flames of devotion from sneak that also puts status effects so you can immediately capitalize with any rogue skill for more status effects for Deathblows. The only passive I don't quite understand yet is the Deep Wounds skill, can someone explain what the purpose of that skill is and why you should pick it?

[jomoroon]

does ass/soulblade do more burst than ass/monk?

[ppscurry]

I'm using a bleakwalker/assassin and found that it's a very good multiclass for a rogue. Opening up with a black flames of devotion from sneak that also puts status effects so you can immediately capitalize with any rogue skill for more status effects for Deathblows. The only passive I don't quite understand yet is the Deep Wounds skill, can someone explain what the purpose of that skill is and why you should pick it?

For boss killing to be honest, some things just won't die in one opening backstab. Unless of course you out level the dude a lot. Only time I found it useful in a solo run was against nemnok. I was level 14 then so I still didn't have Gambit to spam on him.

[Maxzero]

Nature godlike rogue/monk is probably the highest sustained single target dps.

 

But tbh that doesn't count for much with current balance when you have broken abilities that oneshot the whole screen.

Empower spam is the new rest spam.

[Dongom]

One question, when you invis as a Rogue can you reset combat?

 

So kill 1 enemy, invis and run away, and keep doing this to easy solo?

[ppscurry]

Yes. You need to ensure there's sufficient distance between the spot you are running away to and the spot they reset to. Rogues have a teleporting spell with inbuilt invis so it's really easy to cheese like that. 

 

Pure assassin/rogue is just so cheesy lol. Wait till you hit PL 8 and 9, ultimate cheese fest.

Edited May 13, 2018 by ppscurry

[dunehunter]

Am asking, is it really good? PoTD is kinda easy now so you gonna feel pretty good with any builds. Btw any of your ability including backstab will do lower damage than Monk autoattacks once he get Turning Wheels.

[ppscurry]

One Gambit does around 200-300 dmg (before raw damage dot kicks in), assuming normal circumstances. 

 

With 12 resources points, gambit deducts it to 8, so you are looking at 80% crit and 160% crit bonus damage. With dual wield, you go back up to 12 resource points after that attack. In the middle of that gambit attack, you can interrupt the second proc of the full attack and just run away. I'm not saying it is Inner Death levels of damage, I'm saying you can spam it and it is versatile as heck because you can run away mid hit. 

 

Don't forget rogues have a persistent flanked/distracted aura, with that you basically have death blows on everything you hit.

 

Essentially, with zero points spent, I can delete one target and then I can either run away with invis or continue to another target. The only thing lacking from single assassin solo is AOE damage. If this sounds cheesy, it is. It is strong though. 

Edited May 13, 2018 by ppscurry

[Aramintai]

Essentially, with zero points spent, I can delete one target and then I can either run away with invis or continue to another target. The only thing lacking from single assassin solo is AOE damage. If this sounds cheesy, it is. It is strong though. 

Well, there is that one big radius grenade ability that does corrode damage as a bonus. But in general I don't think AOE abilities is something rogues should have - they're single target eliminators.

Btw, dot damage is still not fixed from the beta times - it still breaks invisibility:

https://forums.obsidian.net/topic/97738-invisibility-pestilance-cloud-bugged/?hl=%2Bdamage+%2Binvisibility

Edited May 13, 2018 by Aramintai

[Takkik]

I tested the smoke grenade with corrode dmg with console commands, the dot don't work, you only see the initial tick of dmg and then nothing.

[Aramintai]

I tested the smoke grenade with corrode dmg with console commands, the dot don't work, you only see the initial tick of dmg and then nothing.

It's in that bug thread as well. But there are other abilities and weapons in the that game do work.

Edited May 13, 2018 by Aramintai

[Takkik]

Lol didn't noticed you linked my bug report.

 

Anyone think that the rogue have some overpriced ability past tier 1?

 

- Ring the bell, for ranged you get 5pen +20% dmg for 2guile and spending 2 ability point. Fighter get an attack that do +4pen, +25% dmg for 1 discipline and 1 ability point. the One-handed dot feel less potent than an upgraded cripplestrike. I think at some point the selling ability of the ability was to interrupt, but now all abilities do it?

 

-smoke cloud : 2pts for 1 infliction? 2pts for the upgrades ok, but 2 for the base ability? Don't know how it was during the beta, but the tree let me think it was supposed to be a smoke veil upgrade?

 

- shadowstep : same price as shadow beyond for a single target paralyse vs 10 sec of invisibility.

 

- whittered strike at 3pts. I find 2pts for the base skill better.

 

I get the feeling that you pay the price of the upgrade (in guile cost) even if you don't upgrade the skill.

[dunehunter]

Lol didn't noticed you linked my bug report.

 

Anyone think that the rogue have some overpriced ability past tier 1?

 

- Ring the bell, for ranged you get 5pen +20% dmg for 2guile and spending 2 ability point. Fighter get an attack that do +4pen, +25% dmg for 1 discipline and 1 ability point. the One-handed dot feel less potent than an upgraded cripplestrike. I think at some point the selling ability of the ability was to interrupt, but now all abilities do it?

 

-smoke cloud : 2pts for 1 infliction? 2pts for the upgrades ok, but 2 for the base ability? Don't know how it was during the beta, but the tree let me think it was supposed to be a smoke veil upgrade?

 

- shadowstep : same price as shadow beyond for a single target paralyse vs 10 sec of invisibility.

 

- whittered strike at 3pts. I find 2pts for the base skill better.

 

I get the feeling that you pay the price of the upgrade (in guile cost) even if you don't upgrade the skill.

 

I never pick any high level rogue abilities, the ones I use is cripple strike, escape, sometime blind strike and that's all. All other abilities are just a waste of points, quite poor design honestly.

[Aramintai]

I never pick any high level rogue abilities, the ones I use is cripple strike, escape, sometime blind strike and that's all. All other abilities are just a waste of points, quite poor design honestly.

You should try them out. Gambit is good and invisibility ones are a must for assassin.

[dunehunter]

 

I never pick any high level rogue abilities, the ones I use is cripple strike, escape, sometime blind strike and that's all. All other abilities are just a waste of points, quite poor design honestly.

You should try them out. Gambit is good and invisibility ones are a must for assassin.

 

 

I mean low to mid games, and I tested that ability it is OK, not that impressive as you said.

[Aramintai]

 

 

I never pick any high level rogue abilities, the ones I use is cripple strike, escape, sometime blind strike and that's all. All other abilities are just a waste of points, quite poor design honestly.

You should try them out. Gambit is good and invisibility ones are a must for assassin.

 

 

I mean low to mid games, and I tested that ability it is OK, not that impressive as you said.

 

Well, if you did it only for testing in some starting areas it may feel less worthy. But if you play it seriously, collecting gear that synergizes with rogue's abilities then you'd get much greater damage output. I'm not saying rogue is better than any other class because I haven't tested any yet besides companions, but it's damn well impressive. And it's fun to play  - and that's all that matters to me, personally, not searching for the most broken op class that steamrolls POTD or busts. Btw, in my playthrough rogue did most everything - crits, hits, kills, you name it.

 

In any case, the whole point of this thread was to say that rouge is very far from trash people assumed he'd be during the beta and, imho, is even better and more fun to play than his POE1 version.

Edited May 13, 2018 by Aramintai

[Dongom]

One Gambit does around 200-300 dmg (before raw damage dot kicks in), assuming normal circumstances. 

 

With 12 resources points, gambit deducts it to 8, so you are looking at 80% crit and 160% crit bonus damage. With dual wield, you go back up to 12 resource points after that attack. In the middle of that gambit attack, you can interrupt the second proc of the full attack and just run away. I'm not saying it is Inner Death levels of damage, I'm saying you can spam it and it is versatile as heck because you can run away mid hit. 

 

Don't forget rogues have a persistent flanked/distracted aura, with that you basically have death blows on everything you hit.

 

Essentially, with zero points spent, I can delete one target and then I can either run away with invis or continue to another target. The only thing lacking from single assassin solo is AOE damage. If this sounds cheesy, it is. It is strong though. 

 

Man Gambit seems very fun, i"ll probably try a solo POTD Assassin next play through.

 

What are the best weapons for a such a build? Would it still be OP if I used dual pistols? Which skills give you the death blow afflictions? And for skills, max out stealth?

Edited May 13, 2018 by Dongom

[Aramintai]

What are the best weapons for a such a build? Would it still be OP if I used dual pistols?

I went full on dual wielding melee assassin, because for me style trumps meta (inconceivable for some, I'm sure ). So I wasn't looking for anything specifically optimized for max damage, but nevertheless collected some good gear that rocked:

 

 

 

Edited May 13, 2018 by Aramintai

[GamerSerg]

Should backstab bonus show up in the combat log? I know I have to use shift to see sneak attack bonus but I never see any mention of backstab bonus even after using smoke veil.

[Faytte]

Think the issue with gambit is 1) it comes too late in the game 2) it encourages you to not use your other abilities to ensure you get your refunds. 3) still seems weaker then monk.

[Clerith]

@Aramintai, thanks alot of the pictures, some sweet gear there indeed. Especially that sword Duskfall, any idea where you got it? I need it now. And I wonder how that Fair Favor (again, where did you get this? :D) crit chance works - is it just 15% hit to crit conversion or something else? Like I wonder how Gambit works - is it just Hit to Crit conversion or mmorpg-esque "crit chance"? If you could somehow stack the two and get 95% crit chance before anything else, you could just spam Gambit over and over pretty much infinitely? Well, you probably still can...

Edited May 13, 2018 by Clerith

[Takkik]

Think the issue with gambit is 1) it comes too late in the game 2) it encourages you to not use your other abilities to ensure you get your refunds. 3) still seems weaker then monk.

+1

 

past tier 1 most ability don't worth it, but when you reach t8 feel like the game say you don't use anything else. Give me the feeling devs never played rogues in their playthrough or only as a solo assassin. The class didn't get the same attention than some of other classes, mechanics & balance wise.