[POTD Difficulty] Launch NOT tuned discussion thread

[Lobotechx]

Hey guys, i just finish the game with 1 character only. Solo POTD Expert all Scaling with background #6 most difficult path.

 

Nothing to say but easy. Put a shield early on and after a few lvl u crush everything since u out lvl everything and nothing scale.

 

I don't understand how easy but be the regular difficulty....  make no sence to me. I will remake a new character again ill try to put bad stats and put a white weapon and see if i got challenge. Since the game is not for veteran... Just a bit upset guys sorry. Big fan of those game since Baldur's gate but jizz the game so Easy wtf is wrong..... I'll keep u update with my white weapon solo POTD expert fake scaling on.

[Camonge]

Did you try beta patch branch? I believe level scaling is working there.

[gruelest]

I purchased PoE 2 and I'm excited to start the campaign but I've come across some topics stating Path of the Damned is too easy, even easier than PoE 1.

 

This is a huge concern for me, and has unfortunately quelled my desire to play. I'm writing this because I want to hear from other players, to see if this desire for a better challenge resonates with anyone else. Maybe one of you lucky souls will rekindle my desire to play--- or maybe... even more...

 

(Side note: I understand there is a difficulty spike coming soon--- That is GREAT news--- I look forward to the release, whenever that may be, and I hope it does well. Most likely, I will bite the bullet and wait for the spike before I start PoE 2)

 

For some time, I feel like there has been a tendency to make games more lenient--- to make players more overpowered. Intoxicating them with power to get them hooked early, even "dumbing it down" for newcomers to the genre.

 

The game should be punishing in a smart way (not made to be impossible, obviously, but done in a way where resources, planning, and pure luck and roll of the die are paramount to success).

 

This is what I believe will happen if I start playing now (outside of just experiencing the story)

- Early game will possibly be challenging --- a good balance of trial and error

- Mid game - The steam roll begins. + an occasional surprise (maybe some mass confusion, fampyr or viseryk stun lock

- Late game - the optional "deep-roads-instakill-dragon" will be your only challenge

 

I really hope there's a better focus on path of the damned in the future, and more challenging difficulties in general, not just in this franchise, but in all tactical games.

 

*Just a background on myself as a gamer. I have over 400 hours in XCOM 2, a Commander Ironman Vet. I have over 100 failed campaigns to beat it on Legendary with Ironman to no success. I love hearing myself talk. It feels amazing. And I'm very proud to live in my mom's basement. No shame. No I don't really live in my mom's basement. Okay, yes I do. Someone please hold me.

Edited May 18, 2018 by gruelest

[The Sharmat]

Deadfire is far, far easier than Pillars 1. Not even a comparison. The only challenge to be found on PotD is by deliberately going to areas intended for characters 4 or more levels higher than you.

[DragonWiz]

Sorry dude, but the game is way easier than it should be. I suggest waiting a couple of months or something. 

[cokane]

I also played a decent chunk of XCOM 2.

 

Without any Deadfire story spoilers, but perhaps giving away a gameplay element I can tell you, that early game is a breeze but you could easily make your mid-game hard for a stretch by using the visible quest difficulty markers to tackle harder areas first. Thus maybe skipping the low level sidequests entirely in your first playthrough?

Edited May 18, 2018 by cokane

[PatrioticChief]

I do think PoE2 is too easy. I surprise myself by saying that because I usually don't play RPG's for the combat. But even on veteran with no Berath's blessing I was absolutely wrecking face, including missions that were supposedly significantly above my level. 

 

I honestly expect a lot of this stuff to improve. Obsidian has proven to be very dedicated post launch when it came to PoE, I expect the same here. 

[Tigranes]

POE1 was pretty linear, but they still made errors with pacing XP reward. Now that it's more open-ended, it's very difficult to keep difficulty balanced.

 

It's honestly not good enough, and hopefully they can mitigate it somewhat through belated patching.

[NZV]

PotD in this game is easier than PoE1 on normal. Your expectations of difficulty are actually higher than the reality.

[Ninjamestari]

There are plenty of reasons to be hesitant about playing this game. My advice would be to get a refund and buy the game at some point when its on a sale if obsidian has addressed the countless issues the game has by then instead of trying to force down pointless unfinished DLC down our throats. I've enjoyed the game so far, but in hindsight, had I known the kind of mess the game is, I wouldn't have bought it yet, I would've waited to see if they'll actually fix the game.

[wih]

There are plenty of reasons to be hesitant about playing this game. My advice would be to get a refund and buy the game at some point when its on a sale if obsidian has addressed the countless issues the game has by then instead of trying to force down pointless unfinished DLC down our throats. I've enjoyed the game so far, but in hindsight, had I known the kind of mess the game is, I wouldn't have bought it yet, I would've waited to see if they'll actually fix the game.

 

To each their own. I am happy with current situation. I am playing the game while Obsidian is bugfixing. Perfect. I much prefer this than having to wait for months until the bugs are cleared.

The low difficulty is not a problem for me either - I am playing on normal but I leave most sidequests for future playthroughs, so I am constantly underleveled. Nice experience so far. The game is great.

[whiskiz]

You know, for supposedly only very few wanting to play the hardest difficulty or be challenged in general and it being a very minor thing, there sure is alot of discussion and problems with it :D

 

I'm right with you, i'm not getting the game until it's actually finished. When the balance and especially PotD has been done properly.

 

I can't wait, but i can.

 

I'm willing to wait months, if it means playing an awesome Pillars game with an even more awesome combat system this time around which is much less restrictive - per encounter abilities - as long as it's actually challenging and you need to use everything every fight just to get by.

 

As awesome as auto-attacking and using a low level spell here or there for 80% of combat was, before facerolling bosses and any other semblance of challenge using the rest of your stuff. (per rest)

 

Hopefully multiclass/subclass balance get's done at the same time, or the problem of mid-game+ faceroll/power creep will still be there and it'll have been a waste of time and resources.

 

Take your time Obsidian, get it right.

 

P.S Makes thing even worse when apparently level scaling is/was not working properly, either....

 

P.P.S Releasing a Pillars game as nothing more than an interactive novel is almost an insult to the world of Pillars and half of its fan base. Reducing the depth and fun of Pillars combat and the awesome new multiclass and subclass features, to nothing more than just side systems that are just there for the sake of it, is just sad.

Edited May 18, 2018 by whiskiz

[Wormerine]

Deadfire encourages regular use of active skills from all classes and didn’t seem to balance enemies for it. The whole thing could use a serious difficulty spike. The most enjoyable fight I had were ones I would tackle enemies way way above my level. Veteran poses no threat, and I don’t feel it’s xp float, but that your level encounters just aren’t good enough. Super crazy weapons might contribute to it.

 

If what engaging, tough combat is what you are looking for than wait until they rebalance difficulty.

[tela2k]

-snip-

For some time, I feel like there has been a tendency to make games more lenient--- to make players more overpowered. Intoxicating them with power to get them hooked early, even "dumbing it down" for newcomers to the genre.

-snip-

 

Since others already answered the difficulty question, I'll just say I don't believe Deadfire being easy is part of this trend. I think they honestly just messed up and didn't have the time to test and fix before release. Waiting for the patch   

[Slotharingia]

 

PotD in this game is easier than PoE1 on normal. Your expectations of difficulty are actually higher than the reality.

 

No it's not. I can easily play 1 on normal even with that annoying setting that makes the aoe's invisible that I accidentally picked my last pt, but I tried 2 on PotD with some Berath's blessings and it really is a lot harder lmao. Aloth, Xoti and the character I made at the inn dropped inatantly, and mobs kept going after my main instead of Eder, I also found myself using tons of items, and downright gave up on some fights. None of that applied to my P1 playthroughs on normal.

 

Also people forget that P1 was kind of unbalanced after the addon content. It's challenging until after you did Whitemarch 1&2, then the endgame is ridiculously easy in comparison even if you scale it up.

[Judicator]

This is what I believe will happen if I start playing now (outside of just experiencing the story)

- Early game will possibly be challenging --- a good balance of trial and error

- Mid game - The steam roll begins. + an occasional surprise (maybe some mass confusion, fampyr or viseryk stun lock

- Late game - the optional "deep-roads-instakill-dragon" will be your only challenge

 

So just like BG, IWD, the first PoE, etc. Granted, Deadfire is much easier to abuse.

[Nanomachin]

 

 

So just like BG, IWD, the first PoE, etc. Granted, Deadfire is much easier to abuse.

 

 

Yeah, this. To be perfectly honest, I'm not sure why people are singling out POE 2 for being too easy. I wouldn't be able to name a crpg that's harder than POE 1 & 2.

[The Sharmat]

 

 

PotD in this game is easier than PoE1 on normal. Your expectations of difficulty are actually higher than the reality.

 

No it's not. I can easily play 1 on normal even with that annoying setting that makes the aoe's invisible that I accidentally picked my last pt, but I tried 2 on PotD with some Berath's blessings and it really is a lot harder lmao. Aloth, Xoti and the character I made at the inn dropped inatantly, and mobs kept going after my main instead of Eder, I also found myself using tons of items, and downright gave up on some fights. None of that applied to my P1 playthroughs on normal.

 

Also people forget that P1 was kind of unbalanced after the addon content. It's challenging until after you did Whitemarch 1&2, then the endgame is ridiculously easy in comparison even if you scale it up.

 

Perhaps you're just very bad the game.

[tela2k]

 

 

 

So just like BG, IWD, the first PoE, etc. Granted, Deadfire is much easier to abuse.

 

 

Yeah, this. To be perfectly honest, I'm not sure why people are singling out POE 2 for being too easy. I wouldn't be able to name a crpg that's harder than POE 1 & 2.

 

Maybe you had a different experience, but mine was fast mode auto combat. PoE1 is much more difficult, not even comparable at the moment. BG-trilogy is more difficult even without mods. D:OS is definitely much more difficult, although it did suffer from crazy power creep. The Witcher games are way more difficult, even the 3rd game and even in the end since you still, no matter how OP you are, have to dodge those instagibs and spam that fast attack till your fingers bleed. I was literally away from keyboard fast moding boss fights in Deadfire on the hardest difficulty. There is no doubt it's badly borked at the moment, hence all these threads about it.

[Slotharingia]

 

 

 

PotD in this game is easier than PoE1 on normal. Your expectations of difficulty are actually higher than the reality.

 

No it's not. I can easily play 1 on normal even with that annoying setting that makes the aoe's invisible that I accidentally picked my last pt, but I tried 2 on PotD with some Berath's blessings and it really is a lot harder lmao. Aloth, Xoti and the character I made at the inn dropped inatantly, and mobs kept going after my main instead of Eder, I also found myself using tons of items, and downright gave up on some fights. None of that applied to my P1 playthroughs on normal.

 

Also people forget that P1 was kind of unbalanced after the addon content. It's challenging until after you did Whitemarch 1&2, then the endgame is ridiculously easy in comparison even if you scale it up.

 

Perhaps you're just very bad the game.

 

Yep I'm bad at it compared to people who play on PotD. However, by your logic - i.e. that I suck at PotD in Deadifre cos I suck full stop - I'd suck MORE playing normal in P1, which I have no problems with. *shrug*

[Oasx]

I found Classic to be a good difficulty level, and when I play the game again I don't intend on setting the difficulty higher, there were plenty of hard fights even towards the end. I understand that they need to make PotD harder, but also remember that not everyone wants a super hard game, and that there are difficulty options for a reason.

[Witness41920]

To be honest, the game could use some revisiting in terms of the difficulty adjustments. I have no reason to doubt that Obsidian will address the issue(s) with the game as they have a good track record in that regard.

 

I think the Classic difficulty is perhaps slightly easier than it should be for the casual player looking to enjoy the story as it was meant to be played but I wouldn't be surprised if it doesn't get touched, largely because difficulty isn't the focus of Story and Classic.

 

I do think Veteran and Path of the Damned will see major revisions. Both are settings intended to focus on combat difficulty for the player seeking that and both unfortunately fail to deliver.

 

I'd like to see Obsidian leave Story and Classic alone so players more interested in story can experience it without setback and tweak Veteran and Path of the Damned to be more punishing for players seeking the thrill of challenging combat.

 

Also, for the record, I'd prefer difficulty to come in the form of the AI using more tactics, attempting to disable and debuff you more, targeting weaker party members where possible and so on rather than simply a health and damage spike.

[Zeitzbach]

 

 

 

So just like BG, IWD, the first PoE, etc. Granted, Deadfire is much easier to abuse.

 

 

Yeah, this. To be perfectly honest, I'm not sure why people are singling out POE 2 for being too easy. I wouldn't be able to name a crpg that's harder than POE 1 & 2.

 

 

Because it's new and people keep increasing expectation as they play new games.

 

cRPG hasn't really been well known for its difficulty because this kind of playstyle only gets you once because you lack information. It's like how Darkest Dungeon is hard because you have to be either extremely unlucky or have bad comp. The moment you know what you're getting into and always stick to the same playstyle, it becomes derps easy.

 

PoE is no different, 1 or 2. PoE 2 just give the player more freedom and the hardcore player hates that. Majority of the changes demanded are more of a "I want PoE 2 to be PoE 1 again, just with flashier graphic".

Edited May 18, 2018 by Zeitzbach

[Judicator]

 

 

 

 

So just like BG, IWD, the first PoE, etc. Granted, Deadfire is much easier to abuse.

 

 

Yeah, this. To be perfectly honest, I'm not sure why people are singling out POE 2 for being too easy. I wouldn't be able to name a crpg that's harder than POE 1 & 2.

 

Maybe you had a different experience, but mine was fast mode auto combat. PoE1 is much more difficult, not even comparable at the moment. BG-trilogy is more difficult even without mods. D:OS is definitely much more difficult, although it did suffer from crazy power creep. The Witcher games are way more difficult, even the 3rd game and even in the end since you still, no matter how OP you are, have to dodge those instagibs and spam that fast attack till your fingers bleed. I was literally away from keyboard fast moding boss fights in Deadfire on the hardest difficulty. There is no doubt it's badly borked at the moment, hence all these threads about it.

 

Give me a break, I beat PoE 1 on Hard a couple of weeks ago with a straight fighter doing nothing but auto attack and letting the AI handle the companions. The combat was slower and less flashy, but it wasn't hard at all, just more tedious.

 

BG is only hard the first time you play it due to the clusterf*ck that the AD&D rules are. After that it's a cake walk without mods like SCS.

[tela2k]

-snip-

Also, for the record, I'd prefer difficulty to come in the form of the AI using more tactics, attempting to disable and debuff you more, targeting weaker party members where possible and so on rather than simply a health and damage spike.

 

They said in the latest Q&A stream, that fixing PotD is going to take time, because they have to look at every encounter separately. I would take that as a sign that they're really looking into what enemies do and how the fights play out. As in upgraded scripts, more abilities, more interesting mix of enemies maybe. I mean if they were going the Bethesda way of difficulty increase, that shouldn't take longer than 5 minutes, right? Down 500 iron arrows and it's only half hp