My big hope for thiis game is that the soundtrack won't...put me to sleep

[algroth]

 

Transistor did something really neat with this where while exploring, the percussion track is muted, and fades in when combat starts. Then when you enter the pause mode, the instrumentals become muted and distant, while the main character's humming comes in.

Darren Korb and Ashley Barret is so ahead of the curve when it comes to rpg ost that I don't even think of their material as video game soundtrack but as actual artist soundtrack. There's nothing in the industry that's on that level, maybe that's because rpg's are mainly orcestra and Supergiant's stuff is written, composed and sang all by the artists themselves.

 

 

Darren Korb is only "ahead of the curve" in whatever fantasy 2004 he still inhabits where post-rock is still the bee's knees. By the time Transistor came out his approach was so old-hat and ham-fisted it had me merely sighing in exasperation at its own pretentions of artistry, driven further by the August Rush syndrome running throughout the game where this complete personality void of a singer warbles across these generic, hook-less post-rock tracks and we the players are supposed to accept that as proof of her "genius". Ugh. His work on Bastion is better, but yeah, "ahead of the curve" he ain't. I don't even know what "actual artist soundtrack" is meant to mean.

Edited March 27, 2018 by algroth

[The Sharmat]

Today I learned that basically every AAA game uses Polish folk metal for inspiration for its soundtrack.

[algroth]

Today I learned that basically every AAA game uses Polish folk metal for inspiration for its soundtrack.

Maybe they do. Far as I'm concerned, the Witcher 3 soundtrack feels the same as any other, regardless of "inspiration" (which can mean very little when it comes to defining the end product).

[The Sharmat]

Well in some cases it's less inspiration and more them outright paying the band for the rights to put a version of the song in the game. In any case we clearly hear totally different things in both soundtracks. One of us is going to be disappointed.

[Jayngo]

I couldn't disagree more. The music in PoE is brilliant. I went through a stint where I would listen to the whole OST on my way to and from work for a few months in a row. It has such an old school, Baldur's Gate feel to it. I simply love it. Much of it is relaxing, but that's the type of music I like listening too for the most part.

[algroth]

In any case we clearly hear totally different things in both soundtracks. One of us is going to be disappointed.

 

I don't mind that, that's what opinions are for. And I don't think it's really a binary option at all, a sort of either/or where we won't see eye to eye no matter what. As far as I'm concerned the approach to the first game worked really well for that game, and for that setting, or at least for parts of it. I wouldn't mind a change in approach to the battle music for one, or even for the rest of the music to best reflect on a colonist setting opposite to a classic European one as it was in the first game. To that effect I think there are some really interesting artists like Toru Takemitsu, Steve Roach, Geinoh Yamashirogumi and so on who have worked a fair bit with blending styles such as taiko and gamelan with modern classical, ambient and so on and they could be interesting sources from which to get ideas for Pillars' soundtrack, even if I also feel that their particular tone and aesthetic isn't a complete match with the game's own (on the subject of Steve Roach and Geinoh Yamashirogumi I do feel both of them are some manner of root for the score to Mask of the Betrayer, and whilst it worked really well in that specific context you can see how such music would be very at odds with the feel Pillars is going for). I would like the game to follow a similar aesthetic principle as the first when it comes to music, but I don't mind change either and can see how it would better serve the setting and certain parts of the music that I felt really suffered in the first game (again, see the combat music for example). I only oppose to using The Witcher 3 as some gold standard to which Pillars should aim for, as I think it neither aligns itself with what the aesthetic intentions behind Pillars are, nor do I find it particularly good or worth discussing in such light. But again, opinions.

Edited March 27, 2018 by algroth

[SonicMage117]

 

 

Transistor did something really neat with this where while exploring, the percussion track is muted, and fades in when combat starts. Then when you enter the pause mode, the instrumentals become muted and distant, while the main character's humming comes in.

 

Darren Korb and Ashley Barret is so ahead of the curve when it comes to rpg ost that I don't even think of their material as video game soundtrack but as actual artist soundtrack. There's nothing in the industry that's on that level, maybe that's because rpg's are mainly orcestra and Supergiant's stuff is written, composed and sang all by the artists themselves.

 

Darren Korb is only "ahead of the curve" in whatever fantasy 2004 he still inhabits where post-rock is still the bee's knees. By the time Transistor came out his approach was so old-hat and ham-fisted it had me merely sighing in exasperation at its own pretentions of artistry, driven further by the August Rush syndrome running throughout the game where this complete personality void of a singer warbles across these generic, hook-less post-rock tracks and we the players are supposed to accept that as proof of her "genius". Ugh. His work on Bastion is better, but yeah, "ahead of the curve" he ain't. I don't even know what "actual artist soundtrack" is meant to mean.

No, Darren Korb's genre is actually acoustic folk-rock. Darren reads the game's novel, writes the music and then they record the music in a bedroom closet. This is said in the concert video. It's explained in a another video that Supergiant then adds the effects or has them re-record it with effects to suit their games.

 

When I see another artist in the industry with another kind of superior writing which can translate to any type of genre on developer's command I will have to admit that he's not ahead of the curve. As a musician myself, it's nice to see someone who's written compositions can be so versatile to adapt to blues, chillpop, rock, etc.

 

By the way, if you're wondering what tuning August Rush was, it's open D on guitar. Darren Korb plays in stardard E and when he tunes down, it's standard D align. Adaptability is key to genius even moreso than perfect writing, sometimes even skill.

[SonicMage117]

Darren Korb is most definitely ahead of the anyone else in the industry, even if you could name me an artist which has the type of versatility of writing, the fact is that nobody else has experimented with story-telling in/through the game's ost.

 

If you haven't played Transistor or Pyre than you probably have no idea of what I'm talking about but Supergiant's games are the only ones to have relative lore of the gam in their ost. The closest thing we could say is Skyrim's Dragonborn song but that's not what I'm talking about.

 

You probably wouldn't know or accept that their are seven variations of a few of Transistors and Pyre's songs and the version you get is based on your choices. So that's what I'm getting at here. Nobody else has done that in the industry.

[algroth]

Edit: Meh, I'm not getting into this. As I said on the other thread.

Edited March 27, 2018 by algroth

[rjshae]

I enjoyed the music track in PoE. It wasn't the least bit jarring and often set a suitable mood for the environment. If the game music is putting somebody to sleep, I suspect it's just not to their particular taste. Musical preferences are a very personal choice, after all.

[SonicMage117]

 

 

 

 

Transistor did something really neat with this where while exploring, the percussion track is muted, and fades in when combat starts. Then when you enter the pause mode, the instrumentals become muted and distant, while the main character's humming comes in.

 

Darren Korb and Ashley Barret is so ahead of the curve when it comes to rpg ost that I don't even think of their material as video game soundtrack but as actual artist soundtrack. There's nothing in the industry that's on that level, maybe that's because rpg's are mainly orcestra and Supergiant's stuff is written, composed and sang all by the artists themselves.

 

Darren Korb is only "ahead of the curve" in whatever fantasy 2004 he still inhabits where post-rock is still the bee's knees. By the time Transistor came out his approach was so old-hat and ham-fisted it had me merely sighing in exasperation at its own pretentions of artistry, driven further by the August Rush syndrome running throughout the game where this complete personality void of a singer warbles across these generic, hook-less post-rock tracks and we the players are supposed to accept that as proof of her "genius". Ugh. His work on Bastion is better, but yeah, "ahead of the curve" he ain't. I don't even know what "actual artist soundtrack" is meant to mean.

No, Darren Korb's genre is actually acoustic folk-rock. Darren reads the game's novel, writes the music and then they record the music in a bedroom closet. This is said in the concert video. It's explained in a another video that Supergiant then adds the effects or has them re-record it with effects to suit their games.

When I see another artist in the industry with another kind of superior writing which can translate to any type of genre on developer's command I will have to admit that he's not ahead of the curve. As a musician myself, it's nice to see someone who's written compositions can be so versatile to adapt to blues, chillpop, rock, etc.

By the way, if you're wondering what tuning August Rush was, it's open D on guitar. Darren Korb plays in stardard E and when he tunes down, it's standard D align. Adaptability is key to genius even moreso than perfect writing, sometimes even skill.

So he's an "acoustic folk-rock" artist who can play his guitar on different tunings and can adapt to different genres. And does some research on his videogames. He's so ahead of his time.

 

Far as I'm concerned this means very little to the point I highlighted. Maybe I'm missing the mark here but when someone tells me an artist is "ahead of his time" (beyond the fact that using this in a present-day context in which future musical currents are uncertain is absolutely ridiculous), you usually refer to an artist's innovation, ability to set trends or prescience for future musical currents. Being a diverse artist, while a positive trait in and of itself, is not something I necessarily associate with the term "ahead of its time" - Silver Apples, a band I'd very well deem "ahead of their time" basically worked with a single, very focused style of music and only barely strayed from that 'shtick' through their two albums, yet in that style they were massive pioneers and influencers for electronic music to come (as well as krautrock and so on). Darren Korb's work, while nice and capable at times, doesn't seem to show to me any such quality that would deem him an artist "ahead of its time". That he's able to work on a bunch of styles and adapt to what the developer wants him to do only tells me that he works well as part of a team or by commission, but it hardly tells me how he performs within each style (of which I have my doubts about, as I expressed before) or what he's doing to achieve some "actual artist soundtrack" status over anyone else, however one may define that.

 

Anyhow, dunno why I even waste my time. I guess I have too much of it or something. Gah.

With respect, not sure if you read my whole comment but it's not that he plays guitar and writes songs that makes him ahead of his time.

 

The reason why Darren Korb and Supergiant is ahead of their time within the industry of video game soundtrack is because they're the only one who have taken the extra effort and care to give players something which nobody else with.... which is offering different versions of lore songs based on what story choices you make. It has nothing to do with content, tuning or genre.

 

 

In other words, he's ahead of his time because he game music is doing something that nobody else has ever done or still not even doing. If you can prove me wrong, I'd be delighted to admit a fault in my saying so. Your ending song is different from someone else's song, maybe this isn't important to you but it's still something that should be praised and thought highly on especially when AAA titles haven't even thought to do such a thing.

[The Sharmat]

More games should have dynamic music like Nier or Witcher 3 or Banner Saga or the several games I can't remember that did it before then. It's always neat when it actually changes to fit the situation. Music becoming more tense as the battle becomes more desperate, etc. Also prevents weird mood whiplash since it's reacting directly to your gameplay.

[Drowsy Emperor]

I think one important thing to implement is easygoing combat music, or track rotation during combat. It becomes very oppressive to listen to the same dramatic combat music all the time, particularly as the combat sounds can be very dissonant and somewhat annoying to begin with. 

 

An RPG is not like an action-adventure game (e.g. Shadow of the Colossus) where the number of battles is low and they're all carefully designed set-pieces that justify a sweeping score. There are hundreds of battles and the music should be used sparingly. 

 

The Myth RTS games had no music at all in combat and were no less epic for it. In fact they had 2-3 instantly recognizably tracks used only sparingly in the main menu and briefing. I'm not suggesting PoE do the same, but there is a lesson to be learnt here. 

[The Sharmat]

A reactive soundtrack would help with that too. Pillars 1 didn't even really have anything like "boss" music.

 

Could also go the Dark Souls route I guess, where no music is the default and music is only for hubs and very important fights. But that'd be a big departure.

[Beyond The Sea]

I did not enjoy Transistor but it's music was quite good. From what I have played the innovation and strangeness of the original Fallout has probably not been surpassed. Desert Winds still creeps me out 20 years later. Strange Flesh has an excellent soundtrack.

 

https://soundcloud.com/greatest-bear-studios/01-bartenders-lure

 

I don't mind the PoE title theme for the first minutes or so when it's just woodwind and strings relatively quiet but then it's goes into a generic Lord of the Hobbit whatever fantasy. Similarly the intro of the newest trailer is fine, not amazing, but perfectly fine only to spin into something rather dull. Oh well, I can always turn the music off. It's not really something that makes or breaks a game I find.

[Progressive_Stupidity]

I was really not a fan of the POE soundtrack on the whole (it felt very derivative and the combat music was really dated) but it's simple to swap out with tracks of your own choice (I particularly enjoyed having 'Needle' from the GOT soundtrack playing in Defiance Bay). I'm assuming Deadfire will be just as simple, but I'm expecting a more interesting soundtrack based on the more exotic setting anyway so I'll give it a go first. And as already stated, dynamic combat music that builds or changes depending on enemy type would help.

[The Sharmat]

I'd also like it if important locations like Neketaka have their own theme music but maybe that would be too expensive for a project like this.

[Archaven]

I really liked the music in PoE. I remember the first village gave off a really strong Arcanum vibe, for me, another game whose soundtrack I really like, much because of the music.

 

not only that i like more of the music is poe but i love poe dearly due to it's settings. i like some high fantasy stuff.. and deadfire moving towards a more piratey and a little modern settings? and i dont like that so much.

[Drowsy Emperor]

For me the setting was okay. It felt like a mix between Forgotten Realms and some aspects of Arcanum, but nothing distinctive enough to make me want to revisit it. PoE aimed to hit the same target reached by Baldur's Gate and it succeeded, but there is only so far you can go on generic high fantasy. The pirate theme would not be my first choice for a sequel, but I'll give it a fair chance.

 

PoE's music was likewise reminescent of Baldur's Gate 1, but not particularly memorable. The combat music had the same issues BG1 had.

 

All in all, as glad as I was to be swept back to childhood with some nostalgia, I'll be happy to move on to something else.

Edited March 31, 2018 by Drowsy Emperor

[Wormerine]

not only that i like more of the music is poe but i love poe dearly due to it's settings. i like some high fantasy stuff.. and deadfire moving towards a more piratey and a little modern settings? and i dont like that so much.

Deadfire isn’t really more modern. In a way it is an “older” setting than Dyrwood was. Dyrwood was already colonised with the conflict being for the most part resolved. Deadfire is in active colonisation.

[Aramintai]

Not sure what people didn't like about POE soundtrack, I found it quite lovely and fitting to set the right atmosphere. There were quite a few good tracks there but my favorite was this:

Set the somber and mysterious tone for the story right off the bat.

 

But I'm sure since we're going to tropical pirate infested islands in POE2 the soundtrack will be more lively. I've even seen shanties available when you're sailing your ship in the beta .

[injurai]

I have it on good record that people who didn't like PoE1's soundtrack suffer from nostrils for ears. Terrible terrible affliction.

[SonicMage117]

It was okay, it wasn't amazing especially when pitting it against other ost's. It did it's job for creating a daunting atmosphere for Pillars 1. That's what counts I guess. It didn't make me get the feels like other game ost's - and there are so many out there.

 

Now, I keep listening to this video, which is some ost from Deadfire's beta and I'm reminded of early 2000's Jrpg for reason of timing, the beat, the instruments, etc...

https://youtu.be/0EHwOgHlub4

 

Ignore the comments on the video though. They went a bit overboard (maybe?)

[Aramintai]

Ignore the comments on the video though. They went a bit overboard (maybe?)

They're not wrong though, this is bad. All 3 of the tracks. But I guess those people who complained that POE1 combat music was borderline plagiarism of BG combat music will be pleased, new tracks are sure...different.

[Drowsy Emperor]

I will immediately have to lower the music volume bar in-game. There's nothing wrong with the track in an of itself but listening to those 'tense' sounds for hours on end, and for every Xaurip barfight, would drive me crazy.