HoonDing Posted August 11, 2017 Share Posted August 11, 2017 They can't even take out a remote tiny al Qaeda outpost in Yemen without losing a SEAL and killing women and children. What are they going to do in NK The ending of the words is ALMSIVI. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gfted1 Posted August 11, 2017 Share Posted August 11, 2017 Well, theres a lot more innocents to kill there. Duh. "I'm your biggest fan, Ill follow you until you love me, Papa" Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
smjjames Posted August 11, 2017 Share Posted August 11, 2017 (edited) They can't even take out a remote tiny al Qaeda outpost in Yemen without losing a SEAL and killing women and children. What are they going to do in NK Your point being?.... Anyhoo.... In response to a question on the "locked and loaded" thing, he said "it's pretty obvious.""We are looking at that pretty carefully. I hope they are gonna fully understand the gravity of what I said. And what I said is what I mean," Yay ambiguousity! /s Edited August 11, 2017 by smjjames Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Malcador Posted August 11, 2017 Share Posted August 11, 2017 Yep, bull**** artist at work there Why has elegance found so little following? Elegance has the disadvantage that hard work is needed to achieve it and a good education to appreciate it. - Edsger Wybe Dijkstra Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BruceVC Posted August 11, 2017 Share Posted August 11, 2017 (edited) Well, theres a lot more innocents to kill there. Duh. The whole NK issue is complex and to be fair to Trump he has inherited a problem that no US president in the last 30 years has been able to resolve The Kim dynasty and there rulership of NK is truly an anomaly, they should have ended their interpretation of Communism like every other country at the end of the Cold War. China allowed NK to survive in its truly anachronistic and cruel system of government And now we have this relic from the Cold War that has developed Nuclear technology and thinks its acceptable to constantly threaten the world Whatever happens I want to be unequivocal about who is to blame, its the Kim regime and there intransigence ....this is on them Edited August 11, 2017 by BruceVC "Abashed the devil stood and felt how awful goodness is and saw Virtue in her shape how lovely: and pined his loss” John Milton "We don't stop playing because we grow old; we grow old because we stop playing.” - George Bernard Shaw "What counts in life is not the mere fact that we have lived. It is what difference we have made to the lives of others that will determine the significance of the life we lead" - Nelson Mandela Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
smjjames Posted August 11, 2017 Share Posted August 11, 2017 (edited) The Kim dynasty and there rulership of NK is truly an anomaly, they should have ended their interpretation of Communism like every other country at the end of the Cold War. China allowed NK to survive in its truly anachronistic and cruel system of government *ahem* Cuba? China is still politically a communist country, though economically they've changed a bit. Vietnam and Laos (link goes to Vietnam) are also still politically communist. Though NK is more like a monarchy with communist gears. Edited August 11, 2017 by smjjames Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BruceVC Posted August 11, 2017 Share Posted August 11, 2017 The Kim dynasty and there rulership of NK is truly an anomaly, they should have ended their interpretation of Communism like every other country at the end of the Cold War. China allowed NK to survive in its truly anachronistic and cruel system of government *ahem* Cuba? China is still politically a communist country, though economically they've changed a bit. Vietnam and Laos (link goes to Vietnam) are also still politically communist. Though NK is more like a monarchy with communist gears. Come on China isnt Communist .....not in the historical sense at least. Its a one party state, doesnt really care about human rights, controls the media but it has embraced and benefited from a global world and how countries trade with each other. You could argue it has been able to gain all the benefits of Capitalism but has none of the responsibilities that other Western countries have in regards to the principles of a Democracy...like free press and a government beholden to a Constitution But I dont believe the Chinese economic and political model is sustainable so structural changes to how they run there economy are necessary "Abashed the devil stood and felt how awful goodness is and saw Virtue in her shape how lovely: and pined his loss” John Milton "We don't stop playing because we grow old; we grow old because we stop playing.” - George Bernard Shaw "What counts in life is not the mere fact that we have lived. It is what difference we have made to the lives of others that will determine the significance of the life we lead" - Nelson Mandela Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
smjjames Posted August 11, 2017 Share Posted August 11, 2017 Watching 1.3 billion people argue and vote on a constitution would be interesting, to say the least. Yeah, China isn't quite the same 'communist' as they were historically, but for all intents and purposes, their politics is still socialist/communist. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gfted1 Posted August 11, 2017 Share Posted August 11, 2017 The whole NK issue is complex and to be fair to Trump he has inherited a problem that no US president in the last 30 years has been able to resolve The Kim dynasty and there rulership of NK is truly an anomaly, they should have ended their interpretation of Communism like every other country at the end of the Cold War. China allowed NK to survive in its truly anachronistic and cruel system of government And now we have this relic from the Cold War that has developed Nuclear technology and thinks its acceptable to constantly threaten the world Whatever happens I want to be unequivocal about who is to blame, its the Kim regime and there intransigence ....this is on them Eh, I have war fatigue. Unless they actually fire something at someone, just let them make noise. 1 "I'm your biggest fan, Ill follow you until you love me, Papa" Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BruceVC Posted August 11, 2017 Share Posted August 11, 2017 The whole NK issue is complex and to be fair to Trump he has inherited a problem that no US president in the last 30 years has been able to resolve The Kim dynasty and there rulership of NK is truly an anomaly, they should have ended their interpretation of Communism like every other country at the end of the Cold War. China allowed NK to survive in its truly anachronistic and cruel system of government And now we have this relic from the Cold War that has developed Nuclear technology and thinks its acceptable to constantly threaten the world Whatever happens I want to be unequivocal about who is to blame, its the Kim regime and there intransigence ....this is on them Eh, I have war fatigue. Unless they actually fire something at someone, just let them make noise. Dont get me wrong, I absolutely dont want a military intervention around NK, its the last thing most reasonable people want hence the last 30 years of failed attempts to negotiate with NK But Gfted1 I wish there was another option but if you look at the history of NK and how they have constantly ignored attempts to become part of the global community what is the USA suppose to do when there territories are directly threatened ? Yes China should be dealing with NK or at least allowing the Koreas to reunite. Thats what worries them the most IMO, they fear NK and SK uniting once Kim is removed. A united Korea they feel could threaten there hegemony in the region but China must stop being so insecure about there economic dominance "Abashed the devil stood and felt how awful goodness is and saw Virtue in her shape how lovely: and pined his loss” John Milton "We don't stop playing because we grow old; we grow old because we stop playing.” - George Bernard Shaw "What counts in life is not the mere fact that we have lived. It is what difference we have made to the lives of others that will determine the significance of the life we lead" - Nelson Mandela Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
smjjames Posted August 11, 2017 Share Posted August 11, 2017 They're also obsessed with stability, not just because the ruling party wants to stay in power, but as their very long history shows, every time things become unstable (for various reasons), the ruling dynasty loses power. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zoraptor Posted August 12, 2017 Share Posted August 12, 2017 Yeah, China isn't quite the same 'communist' as they were historically, but for all intents and purposes, their politics is still socialist/communist. They are basically 'State Capitalist', which is hybrid economic system with elements of western style capitalism but also an extremely strong interventionist streak and many state run companies along with the private ones; and with the private companies being wholly subservient to the state. By many arguments that is what later 'communist' economies actually were anyway, even when they claimed to be 'communist' planned economies (of which DPRK is probably the only current example). They're also obsessed with stability, not just because the ruling party wants to stay in power, but as their very long history shows, every time things become unstable (for various reasons), the ruling dynasty loses power. Sorry, that sentence doesn't make much sense. They certainly want stability so as to stay in power, but also because every time China goes unstable bits break off and literally millions of people die as well as the ruling clique losing power? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Malcador Posted August 12, 2017 Share Posted August 12, 2017 http://thehill.com/policy/international/346278-pentagon-weve-received-no-new-orders-on-venezuela-after-trump-remarks He's on a roll Why has elegance found so little following? Elegance has the disadvantage that hard work is needed to achieve it and a good education to appreciate it. - Edsger Wybe Dijkstra Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
smjjames Posted August 12, 2017 Share Posted August 12, 2017 (edited) They're also obsessed with stability, not just because the ruling party wants to stay in power, but as their very long history shows, every time things become unstable (for various reasons), the ruling dynasty loses power. Sorry, that sentence doesn't make much sense. They certainly want stability so as to stay in power, but also because every time China goes unstable bits break off and literally millions of people die as well as the ruling clique losing power? They're just... more acutely aware of it or something? It's supposedly a cultural thing and it's a narrative given by those in the West. Having to keep 1.3 billion people from revolting is certainly a factor. http://thehill.com/policy/international/346278-pentagon-weve-received-no-new-orders-on-venezuela-after-trump-remarks He's on a roll I treated that as him having no clue what he's even talking about. http://thehill.com/homenews/administration/346282-trump-refused-phone-call-from-venezuelan-president Probably Maduro demanding an explaination. Edited August 12, 2017 by smjjames Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HoonDing Posted August 12, 2017 Share Posted August 12, 2017 hes butthurt Maduro mocked him for winning the presidency with 3,000,000 less votes The ending of the words is ALMSIVI. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Agiel Posted August 12, 2017 Share Posted August 12, 2017 (edited) Pretty much in line with Howard Stern's comments on the matter, who for my money is about the one person who knows Trump best outside of his family circle. Edited August 12, 2017 by Agiel Quote “Political philosophers have often pointed out that in wartime, the citizen, the male citizen at least, loses one of his most basic rights, his right to life; and this has been true ever since the French Revolution and the invention of conscription, now an almost universally accepted principle. But these same philosophers have rarely noted that the citizen in question simultaneously loses another right, one just as basic and perhaps even more vital for his conception of himself as a civilized human being: the right not to kill.” -Jonathan Littell <<Les Bienveillantes>> Quote "The chancellor, the late chancellor, was only partly correct. He was obsolete. But so is the State, the entity he worshipped. Any state, entity, or ideology becomes obsolete when it stockpiles the wrong weapons: when it captures territories, but not minds; when it enslaves millions, but convinces nobody. When it is naked, yet puts on armor and calls it faith, while in the Eyes of God it has no faith at all. Any state, any entity, any ideology that fails to recognize the worth, the dignity, the rights of Man...that state is obsolete." -Rod Serling Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BruceVC Posted August 12, 2017 Share Posted August 12, 2017 http://www.npr.org/sections/thetwo-way/2017/08/12/542982015/home-to-university-of-virginia-prepares-for-violence-at-white-nationalist-rally Oh my hat...white nationalists, white supremacists ....neo-nazis !!! Its all happening in Virginia and over a statue of Robert E Lee ? "Abashed the devil stood and felt how awful goodness is and saw Virtue in her shape how lovely: and pined his loss” John Milton "We don't stop playing because we grow old; we grow old because we stop playing.” - George Bernard Shaw "What counts in life is not the mere fact that we have lived. It is what difference we have made to the lives of others that will determine the significance of the life we lead" - Nelson Mandela Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
smjjames Posted August 12, 2017 Share Posted August 12, 2017 http://www.npr.org/sections/thetwo-way/2017/08/12/542982015/home-to-university-of-virginia-prepares-for-violence-at-white-nationalist-rally Oh my hat...white nationalists, white supremacists ....neo-nazis !!! Its all happening in Virginia and over a statue of Robert E Lee ? And you're surprised? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Agiel Posted August 12, 2017 Share Posted August 12, 2017 Looking at photos of all these white supremacist rallies, I can't help but mirror Jesse Custer's sentiments: 1 Quote “Political philosophers have often pointed out that in wartime, the citizen, the male citizen at least, loses one of his most basic rights, his right to life; and this has been true ever since the French Revolution and the invention of conscription, now an almost universally accepted principle. But these same philosophers have rarely noted that the citizen in question simultaneously loses another right, one just as basic and perhaps even more vital for his conception of himself as a civilized human being: the right not to kill.” -Jonathan Littell <<Les Bienveillantes>> Quote "The chancellor, the late chancellor, was only partly correct. He was obsolete. But so is the State, the entity he worshipped. Any state, entity, or ideology becomes obsolete when it stockpiles the wrong weapons: when it captures territories, but not minds; when it enslaves millions, but convinces nobody. When it is naked, yet puts on armor and calls it faith, while in the Eyes of God it has no faith at all. Any state, any entity, any ideology that fails to recognize the worth, the dignity, the rights of Man...that state is obsolete." -Rod Serling Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BruceVC Posted August 12, 2017 Share Posted August 12, 2017 http://www.npr.org/sections/thetwo-way/2017/08/12/542982015/home-to-university-of-virginia-prepares-for-violence-at-white-nationalist-rally Oh my hat...white nationalists, white supremacists ....neo-nazis !!! Its all happening in Virginia and over a statue of Robert E Lee ? And you're surprised? Whats your opinion on taking down of this type of statue? In South Africa there are these irritating movements called " Rhodes must fall " that want to remove all statues and or references to Colonialism or the history of the country. It makes no difference to me in the context of SA but Lee represents part of the history of the South, I can see how some people will see this as an attempt to erase history of white people and get upset And Im not in anyway supporting any kind of white supremacist ideology. I am just saying Lee is not seen by everyone as a symbol of racism or white superiority "Abashed the devil stood and felt how awful goodness is and saw Virtue in her shape how lovely: and pined his loss” John Milton "We don't stop playing because we grow old; we grow old because we stop playing.” - George Bernard Shaw "What counts in life is not the mere fact that we have lived. It is what difference we have made to the lives of others that will determine the significance of the life we lead" - Nelson Mandela Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Blarghagh Posted August 12, 2017 Share Posted August 12, 2017 They can't even take out a remote tiny al Qaeda outpost in Yemen without losing a SEAL and killing women and children. What are they going to do in NK They don't even have to go out of their own country to fail. https://www.cato.org/blog/gao-weighs-countering-violent-extremism?utm_content=buffer111c5&utm_medium=social&utm_source=twitter.com&utm_campaign=buffer Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
smjjames Posted August 12, 2017 Share Posted August 12, 2017 (edited) http://www.npr.org/sections/thetwo-way/2017/08/12/542982015/home-to-university-of-virginia-prepares-for-violence-at-white-nationalist-rally Oh my hat...white nationalists, white supremacists ....neo-nazis !!! Its all happening in Virginia and over a statue of Robert E Lee ? And you're surprised? Whats your opinion on taking down of this type of statue? In South Africa there are these irritating movements called " Rhodes must fall " that want to remove all statues and or references to Colonialism or the history of the country. It makes no difference to me in the context of SA but Lee represents part of the history of the South, I can see how some people will see this as an attempt to erase history of white people and get upset And Im not in anyway supporting any kind of white supremacist ideology. I am just saying Lee is not seen by everyone as a symbol of racism or white superiority Given that you aren't familiar with US history, I get where you're coming from. However, the problem is that it's not just about history and Colonialism is the wrong equivalent here. Not sure if you have any similar white nationalist groups in South Africa, but, say, if you have a statue of a well known Apartheid supporter/leader that people wanted removed, would your white nationalist groups go and protest it's removal? To understand this, you have to go deep into US history. To try and summarize it, up to the civil war, African Americans were slaves (which AFAIK, didn't happen in South Africa, but Africans did get treated as second class citizens). This led to an ideological divide between northern states which didn't allow slavery (though still had issues with racism) and the southern states which did allow slavery. Enter the Civil War in 1861, which was a fight over slavery. General Lee was the General of Generals in the Confederate south. While you guys in South Africa had reconcillation stuff after apartheid ended, nothing like this happened after the Civil War, which is part of why things are like this today. However, racism did NOT end with the end of the Civil War, white supremacist groups, who resented what happened with the Civil War sprung up quickly afterwards and there are still stuff like that today who want a return to a 'white nation' and they view Confederate monuments as part of their history. It's history, yes, but it's something that we never really had a tough reconcillation over or got it dealt with. Germany did, South Africa did, we didn't. As for my personal opinion, yes, it should be removed as those racist white supremacist groups aren't good. Edited August 12, 2017 by smjjames 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
injurai Posted August 12, 2017 Share Posted August 12, 2017 Lee's views on slavery were not even progressive for his time. So it's not like he was an abolitionist that was merely defending southern sovereignty. The noble aspects of southern culture can always be reborn under new symbols of leadership; to mark a clean separation from the collective sin. Instead people want to hide under the "glory" of the form slave states. Which is shameful. The people taking to the streets to act out righteous southern indignation are shameful. Even if some see Lee in a good light, does not mean he is worthy of being a bastion of pride. I see efforts to enshrine him as either being out of ignorance or out of political spite seeking justification for socio-political obstruction. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
smjjames Posted August 12, 2017 Share Posted August 12, 2017 Lee's views on slavery were not even progressive for his time. So it's not like he was an abolitionist that was merely defending southern sovereignty. The noble aspects of southern culture can always be reborn under new symbols of leadership; to mark a clean separation from the collective sin. Instead people want to hide under the "glory" of the form slave states. Which is shameful. The people taking to the streets to act out righteous southern indignation are shameful. Even if some see Lee in a good light, does not mean he is worthy of being a bastion of pride. I see efforts to enshrine him as either being out of ignorance or out of political spite seeking justification for socio-political obstruction. Except that they want those southern symbols of leadership to be symbols of white supremacy that match their beliefs. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
injurai Posted August 12, 2017 Share Posted August 12, 2017 Lee's views on slavery were not even progressive for his time. So it's not like he was an abolitionist that was merely defending southern sovereignty. The noble aspects of southern culture can always be reborn under new symbols of leadership; to mark a clean separation from the collective sin. Instead people want to hide under the "glory" of the form slave states. Which is shameful. The people taking to the streets to act out righteous southern indignation are shameful. Even if some see Lee in a good light, does not mean he is worthy of being a bastion of pride. I see efforts to enshrine him as either being out of ignorance or out of political spite seeking justification for socio-political obstruction. Except that they want those southern symbols of leadership to be symbols of white supremacy that match their beliefs. Exactly. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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