Please bring back salvaging.

[jumpthegun]

Poll

 

Actually, I'll change my vote to a no. After more information given by MrBishop, I'm inclined to agree that the new system is better.

 

https://forums.obsidian.net/topic/92894-no-more-salvage/?p=1919316

Edited June 21, 2017 by jumpthegun

[Hannibal_PJV]

I think that the lack of salvage option is a bug... but we don't have confirmation to it yet.

 

Edit: Not a bug, so Yep definitely needs some tinkering.

 

There was idea of hard or soft capping the cards. So that there would be maybe max 3 of any treasure card when making locations deck. So if you have 250567 rusty hankerchief and 34 Holy hand granades, They both have a same change of getting to the location decks.

The smaller the cap, the better!

Or allowing the Salvaging, but then most people would have 1 rusty hankefchief and 2-4 Holy handgranades in their decks. And if the hankerchief is common and Holy handcranade is rare or epic it would be against the cards normal rarity. Not sure why the dev team desided to go not allowing the salvaging, but that may be one reasons...

 

The best option (IMHO) would be automatic salvaging. I don't enjoy manually salvaging all those millions treasure cards. It is not fun. Automatic salvaging would give two thumbs upp! But I really would like to know how automatic salvaging would work. So maybe allowing to set the upper limit to individual cards would sort this out. Some people would put the cap to 4 and some people like me to 1 (so that I would see different treasures in each game)

 

Edit2:

There is a automatic salvaging system allready. So far so good. But it really would be nice to info players the changes...

https://forums.obsidian.net/topic/92894-no-more-salvage/?p=1919316

Edited June 21, 2017 by Hannibal_PJV

[Irgy]

Ugh. I hadn't noticed it was gone yet. Why did it go?

 

There's no way I'm buying another chest without salvaging available, I'm reluctant to even open the free one. I don't even want the gold, or a perfectly optimised card pool, I just don't want 14 copies of the same card.

[jumpthegun]

Irgy you should check out this post by MrBishop https://forums.obsidian.net/topic/92894-no-more-salvage/?p=1919316

 

He drops some info about the current system.

[wakasm]

Definitely not - the new system of just capping the cards is better IMO since we'll never get anything like the original "box" system to manually dilute cards through play anyway, at least this new system it limits everything without any extra work.

 

The only argument I can see is for min-maxers who might want to just salvage away completely useless cards and only keep a pool of overpowered cards, but at that point, why have the Treasure Chest Card System at all? 

[Ripe]

Definitely not - the new system of just capping the cards is better IMO since we'll never get anything like the original "box" system to manually dilute cards through play anyway, at least this new system it limits everything without any extra work.

 

The only argument I can see is for min-maxers who might want to just salvage away completely useless cards and only keep a pool of overpowered cards, but at that point, why have the Treasure Chest Card System at all? 

New system is NOT better... not even close. And stealing our cards is certainly not a way to go forward.

[Irgy]

Irgy you should check out this post by MrBishop https://forums.obsidian.net/topic/92894-no-more-salvage/?p=1919316

 

He drops some info about the current system.

Ah ok thanks

 

I prefer the old system, but the new one seems fine. The change doesn't seem in any way necessary to me, but on the other hand I always found it kind of a pain in the neck going through and salvaging cards before (indeed that's effectively why I hadn't noticed yet) at least I don't have to bother now.

[Borissimo]

I like the new capping system, and in fact I wish there was a way to set caps on mobile. But my vote is still a "yes" because MrBishop's post does not address the following:

 

1) When something is "just salvaged on the back end," do you get gold for it? If not, then you just paid gold to get nothing.

 

2) A great deal of uncommon cards are junk, and 4 copies is a pretty damn big cap for a card that's junk. Without a way to change the caps yourself or salvage individual cards, your game will become significantly diluted by uncommon cards.

Edited June 21, 2017 by Borissimo

[stbassy]

Voting yes.

I like and share Borissimo's points

 

But.. if they bring it back, I can see some ppl will be reeeeaallly pissed. (The app ate away some of their cards in this version. Next version, cap is lifted. End result: they lost cards for no apparent reason or benefit)

[thelee]

Poll

 

Actually, I'll change my vote to a no. After more information given by MrBishop, I'm inclined to agree that the new system is better.

 

https://forums.obsidian.net/topic/92894-no-more-salvage/?p=1919316

 

I also changed my vote to a no. Less RNG-exploitation, and the hard cap prevents flooding your collection with junk.

[wakasm]

 

 

New system is NOT better... not even close. And stealing our cards is certainly not a way to go forward.

 

I respectfully disagree and think that the new Salvage system is better.   I do however think their choice of how many cards per type was wrong and where the problem lies.    

 

The cap for 1 Legendary is a wrong choice.  You should have the same probability of finding one just like any other card.  

 

The fact it's legendary was from it's probability of dropping from a Treasure Chest, but it shouldn't be it's probability from dropping inside the Campaign... since the Campaign is still a fixed number of scenarios.  That's the whole point of Pathfinder the card game.  The Adventure Decks already give you your probability of finding things - stronger stuff shows up later in the game...  so the probability to realistically find things late in the game unless you farm for them is lower.  IE - finding something you want in AD6 should be harder than AD1, which is how the original game is designed.  (I personally never farm - because I play as it was intended to be played). 

 

However, if even a single person spent real world money or time to farm 20x of a single card... (which again, is ridiculous to me personally), then yes - you probably have a case to be angry, but that still doesn't mean that the new system isn't better.   The new system at least is in line with how the rest of the game works.  

 

A player should never have been able to mess with the probabilities of a card showing up in a box at all via the treasure system. 

 

 

2) A great deal of uncommon cards are junk, and 4 copies is a pretty damn big cap for a card that's junk. Without a way to change the caps yourself or salvage individual cards, your game will become significantly diluted by uncommon cards.

 

IMO, the entire Treasure System already dilutes the game, which was always my issue with the Treasure System to begin with.  It was never needed from a gameplay point of view.   New cards should always have been introduced either through Adventure Decks or Character Classes.  They could have introduced "Treasure Decks" with all these cards to purchase an toggle on/off when you start an adventure, which is closer to what this new system is like, but that is not a real thing in the physical game.   They could have created optional side scenarios for these treasure cards, or created unique loot cards - but their original intention was not from a gameplay perspective, but from a finanicial one - hence why we got them. 

 

That said...I do think the new auto salvage system is better, but their values for how many cards to limit are where I think there is a problem, so I will say that I don't think salvage needs to come back.  The real problem is the arbitrary numbers they chose.  I don't think a player for instance should be able to Salvage ALL the treasure cards they don't want and keep only the useful overpowered cards so they have a higher probability to drop.  

 

A player should be able to find multiple copies of any card however.  I forget how many copies of every other Adventure Deck 1-6 card their are, but I think at least a minimum of 2 of any card should be allowed and the Rarity shouldn't matter in it's ability to be found - only limited by it's Adventure Deck number.  A single character may need two of the same card to fully enjoy it, etc. 

 

That said... it's all a moot point anyway since you can already create new characters, farm the same card by starting a new party, transfer characters, transfer cards, rinse, repeat, anyway... which is something that (IMO) never should have happened as well.  Every instance of "the box" should have been it's own without cards being able to be transferred, and they unlocked Pandora's box by allowing that work around to get any number of cards.  The new Stash just makes this worse.   Their excuse of "multiplayer" for that is also a silly one, you know, especially since a year later and that doesn't exist either.  

 

The whole point of the game is to progress with the items you find and not to spec out exact builds. That's where the actual challenge lies.  They could have just implemented a sandbox mode for people who really wanted to build crazy decks.  

Edited June 21, 2017 by wakasm

[BAdler]

I am looking at suggestions for improving auto-salvaging. A couple of things I have discussed with the team:

• Increasing the cap for Legendary and Epic cards by one. I still want those to be rarer that other "lesser" rarity cards in terms of location deck construction, but the current limits may be too harsh. I am still discussing and taking feedback on this.
• Allow for a way for users to "tag" treasure cards as hidden (do not use). This would mean that a user could tag various treasure cards with this status and the game would ignore those cards when building location decks. If you really hated specific cards, this would mean you could exclude them permanently. You could also toggle this hidden status between scenarios.

 

We won't be removing the cap or auto-salvaging, though. I fell that this is a more user friendly (if not power gamer friendly) way for the digital game to work. That said, I do want to work with the community to make the feature something that works better for you guys, so keep the suggestions coming.

[Snarfblat]

If the cap is increased will I be able to get my cards that were already salvaged for being over the current one restored?

[BAdler]

If the cap is increased will I be able to get my cards that were already salvaged for being over the current one restored?

 

It wouldn't happen automatically (I don't think), but we could probably do something about it if you contacted support.

[Longshot11]

• Increasing the cap for Legendary and Epic cards by one. I still want those to be rarer that other "lesser" rarity cards in terms of location deck construction,

With the risk of sounding confrontational - how does what *you* want help players who prefer salvaging all their Commons so they only get the Rare/Legendary treasures? I mean, I don't have many R/L and I haven't personally paid for chest (well, one 1-month Gold sub, but I'll let it slide), so I don't particularly care if you go that road, but to me it sounds like a way to further annoy an already irritated core player base.You are basically punishing players who were opening chests with the idea that they have a control over their Treasure pool - and now you just pull the rug from under their feet. I won't even get into players who have paid for chests and hunted down 5 Swords of Slaying (for example), but I can only imagine in their shoes I'd be igniting torches and sharpening pitchforks right about now... To dictate your personal preferences on a paying player-base (let's say you don't owe anything to FTP-er's but that's still bad word of mouth..) doesn't strike me as the smartest decision, is all I'm saying.

 

The second option, with "off-tagging" actually sounds OK - it still mostly doubles what manual salvaging of 'bad' cards was doing, but combined with auto-culling will probably save some time. You're still wrestling out control from players, so old users are probably not going to be particularly happy, but new ones probably won't bat an eye... as long as you actually explain WITHIN the game what's happening with all their cards.

 

And, of course, if you're still charging Gold for Chests on mobile - I don't know how any one player would' feel it's anything but rip-off, considering you're sort of 'stealing' their cards, and they have an ever-diminishing chance (as they gradually fill their Collection caps) of actually getting *anything* from a Chest. God forbid that they're actually payng real money for it...

 

 

I have currently pulled away from mobile, and I wait to see how you'll turn things around with the GOG version, so all of the above doesn't directly concern me, but I really think your approach with regards to  your existing player base hasn't been very... popular. The lack of proper and timely communication is a main culprit, but by this point this seems to become the rule rather than exception with the app, so color me surprised no lessons seems to have been learned through the development cycle about how to keep your players in the loop.

[thelee]

I am looking at suggestions for improving auto-salvaging. A couple of things I have discussed with the team:

• Increasing the cap for Legendary and Epic cards by one. I still want those to be rarer that other "lesser" rarity cards in terms of location deck construction, but the current limits may be too harsh. I am still discussing and taking feedback on this.
• Allow for a way for users to "tag" treasure cards as hidden (do not use). This would mean that a user could tag various treasure cards with this status and the game would ignore those cards when building location decks. If you really hated specific cards, this would mean you could exclude them permanently. You could also toggle this hidden status between scenarios.

 

We won't be removing the cap or auto-salvaging, though. I fell that this is a more user friendly (if not power gamer friendly) way for the digital game to work. That said, I do want to work with the community to make the feature something that works better for you guys, so keep the suggestions coming.

 

Personally, I like the idea that a legendary item is essentially "unique." Once you get it, you can't get another copy for your current party (that is, if I understand adventure deck construction correctly). (Though you can still get more copies in your "unclaimed" by judiciously buying chests.)

 

If I were to spit-ball a suggestion, it would be to select all treasure cards independent of how many copies you have in your collection. They don't have to be equal weight, but you could be more flexible (fractional) with your weights. Like maybe an uncommon is only twice as likely as a legendary to be picked, instead of potentially 4x, regardless of how many copies of the uncommon you have (even if you have a 1-1 ratio). You still leave the caps in place (4/3/2/1) to limit the number of potential copies that can float in a given party+adventure, which basically acts as a second level to dictate card rarity.

 

This leaves open the possibility that someone with an incomplete collection but good RNG luck at chests may have a better overall treasure card power level than someone with a complete 4/3/2/1 collection. The only way around that I think would be to make it possible to "select" non-existent cards - e.g. if an uncommon is chosen that you don't have a copy of, then the game replaces it with a common of the same type instead (or doesn't include a treasure card at all). But honestly I think this is an edge case that doesn't deserve any attention to fix.

 

If people are worried about their inability to spend lots of treasure chests to get lots of legendaries, that might be an orthogonal problem. Maybe the drop rates of legendaries should be increased, and people can just rely on farming them into their unclaimed?

Edited June 22, 2017 by thelee

[Archangelrey]

I really confuse by the whole matter. No one mention this change was happen outside the forum and I about to lose a huge collection of my cards if it happen. I have already culling my collection to my liking: 3 to 6 of the items, 6 of each blessing and spell if able, 3 of each armor, and such.

[GrimTalles]

I am looking at suggestions for improving auto-salvaging. A couple of things I have discussed with the team:

• Increasing the cap for Legendary and Epic cards by one. I still want those to be rarer that other "lesser" rarity cards in terms of location deck construction, but the current limits may be too harsh. I am still discussing and taking feedback on this.
• Allow for a way for users to "tag" treasure cards as hidden (do not use). This would mean that a user could tag various treasure cards with this status and the game would ignore those cards when building location decks. If you really hated specific cards, this would mean you could exclude them permanently. You could also toggle this hidden status between scenarios.

 

We won't be removing the cap or auto-salvaging, though. I fell that this is a more user friendly (if not power gamer friendly) way for the digital game to work. That said, I do want to work with the community to make the feature something that works better for you guys, so keep the suggestions coming.

 

And to all the players that have spent real cash on there treasure card, how are you going to compensate there losses, hope its not gold to by one use items or more treasure chest for more card's that they cant keep any way, did your team think of that and just desided to shank them in the back. I Really need an explanation to why it's a good feature to have when it more or less steals people's cash!!!

[Valaria]

 

I am looking at suggestions for improving auto-salvaging. A couple of things I have discussed with the team:

• Increasing the cap for Legendary and Epic cards by one. I still want those to be rarer that other "lesser" rarity cards in terms of location deck construction, but the current limits may be too harsh. I am still discussing and taking feedback on this.
• Allow for a way for users to "tag" treasure cards as hidden (do not use). This would mean that a user could tag various treasure cards with this status and the game would ignore those cards when building location decks. If you really hated specific cards, this would mean you could exclude them permanently. You could also toggle this hidden status between scenarios.

 

We won't be removing the cap or auto-salvaging, though. I fell that this is a more user friendly (if not power gamer friendly) way for the digital game to work. That said, I do want to work with the community to make the feature something that works better for you guys, so keep the suggestions coming.

 

And to all the players that have spent real cash on there treasure card, how are you going to compensate there losses, hope its not gold to by one use items or more treasure chest for more card's that they cant keep any way, did your team think of that and just desided to shank them in the back. I Really need an explanation to why it's a good feature to have when it more or less steals people's cash!!!

 

If you contact support you should be able to get all your stuff back if and when they decide to rollback this change/modify it to allow more cards. That shouldn't be that big of an issue.

The biggest issue is rolling such a massive change to the game without informing anyone. Moreover because some users are losing real life cash here because of the multiple bundles they offered this past year with the mobile version. 

The entire explanation for this boils down to "the game needs to be more user friendly". I see what they're trying to do, as the entire concept of chests and collection back in the iOS version was confusing as heck for me, and I understand not every user will be invested enough to actually come to the forums and use the search function to figure out what the hell do chests even do and what the collection is for.

[haegar72]

Hi, normally I am the lurking type, but now I have to speak up, to express my anger about this change.

 

I will try a real life "comparison" to make myself clear:

Imagine I bought a car with manual transmission, and apart from some annoying break downs I still like it and even invest in some upgrades. Then one day I come to my garage and find a note "In case you didn't notice, we exchanged your transmission to automatic. We want to simplify things, and some people can't drive with manual transmission."

But I like manual. And I bought my car with it, this was one of the reasons in the first place, also for my upgrades, which now are useless/removed/salvaged.

What do you think I would do?

 

So you just changed things without telling, cards get salvaged without my consent and you try to sell it as an improvement?????