US stronk?

[obyknven]

US president say:

https://medium.com/@WhiteHouse/president-obama-s-2016-state-of-the-union-address-7c06300f9726#.fx5ga6lgs

 

Well, so is all the rhetoric you hear about our enemies getting stronger and America getting weaker. The United States of America is the most powerful nation on Earth. Period. It’s not even close. We spend more on our military than the next eight nations combined. Our troops are the finest fighting force in the history of the world. No nation dares to attack us or our allies because they know that’s the path to ruin. 

But later...

Two US military ships surrender to Iranian navy.

http://www.foxnews.com/politics/2016/01/12/us-sailors-boats-held-by-iran-in-persian-gulf.html

 

Do US really so stronk?

[BruceVC]

Yes of course the USA is by far the strongest military force in the world

 

But some people who don't like Obama think he has made them weak .....he hasn't. He just doesn't feel the need to prove constantly the USA can bomb anyone into oblivion

 

Also Obama has correctly realized that the USA doesn't need to resort to force in places like the Middle East to achieve relative peace 

[Guard Dog]

Don't confuse strength of arms with strength of will. Lacking the latter does not preclude the former. 

[BruceVC]

Don't confuse strength of arms with strength of will. Lacking the latter does not preclude the former. 

Yes my friend and using  a euphemism to still imply Obama has made the USA weak still doesnt really make the USA weak  

 

GD as an ex-military man do you think the USA is weaker militarily....and if you think this what do you mean by it ? So for example is this something that has negatively impacted your important relationship with good friends like ...Syrian rebels ....or the Saudis?

[Gorgon]

A US navy boat has engine trouble and drifts into Iranian warters, rather than invade Iranian territory they decide to let it play out diplomatically. This is not the 70s, there is no reason to suspect the sailors would become hostages.

 

Is there any indication that it was a covert raid of some sort. Not that we would know either way. 

[Amentep]

Do US really so stronk?

Yes, the US really so stronk. You may argue that Russia is stronkier, but no one can deny the stronk of the US.

 

It does raise the question of whatever other countries are stronk, of course, but I'll leave that as an exercise for the group.

[Guard Dog]

 

Don't confuse strength of arms with strength of will. Lacking the latter does not preclude the former. 

Yes my friend and using  a euphemism to still imply Obama has made the USA weak still doesnt really make the USA weak

 

GD as an ex-military man do you think the USA is weaker militarily....and if you think this what do you mean by it ? So for example is this something that has negatively impacted your important relationship with good friends like ...Syrian rebels ....or the Saudis?

 

Like all comparisons this one is relative. Are we weaker than we were 8 years ago? Sure. Have we fallen out of frst place in the "strongest military in the world" pagent? No. Has our ability to project power been lessened? No. I wouldn't say Obama has made the US weaker. I WILL say Obama is a weak man. His mealy mouthed responses to ISIS, Russia in Ukraine, Benghazi, the Bergdal mess, etc. play that out. Last night he patted hiself on the back over Osama Bin Laden but let's not forget he nearly screwed that one up by waffeling on it for 24 hours. But the truth of being the leader of a nation is this: If you are not going to DO something about it, STFU about it. Talking without backing it up is what makes you look weak.

 

No I've made my opinions on the US role in the world abundantly clear before but to highlight it here the US has no interest and should not be intervening in Syria. No matter who wins that "civil war" that country will still be an enemy that supports terrorisim and is a threat to Turkey & Israel (both allies in case we forgot). I would not shed on drop of American blood or on cent of American treasure on that. If Russia wants to take a side, let them. I hope they choke on it. As for our "friends" in the House of Saud if we had the courage to exploit our own oil resources we could tell them to go f--k themselves once and for all. As far as military intervention and humanitarian aid IMO US interests start at the eastern shore of the US Virgin Islands and ends at Pochnoi Point in Alaska. The exception being support of allied nations should they ever be threatened.

 

I am reminded of George Washington's farewell address: "The great rule of conduct for us in regard to foreign nations is in extending our commercial relations, to have with them as little political connection as possible. So far as we have already formed engagements, let them be fulfilled with perfect good faith. Here let us stop."

Edited January 13, 2016 by Guard Dog

[Gorgon]

So Obama should have pretended that the US would have intervened in Ukraine and Syria. What would have happened when the world called his bluff. I'm sure you agree it would never have happened. 

[Guard Dog]

So Obama should have pretended that the US would have intervened in Ukraine and Syria. What would have happened when the world called his bluff. I'm sure you agree it would never have happened. 

No he should have stayed out of it altogether. And he DID make noise suggesting we would intervene. He did give military aid to Ukraine.

 

I don't think you read what I wrote. Or if you did I did a poor job conveying my point.

[obyknven]

 If Russia wants to take a side, let them. I hope they choke on it. 

Why you so butthurrt hate of Russia? We actually do nothing hostile against Murica yet - what reason for such anti-Russian talking do you have?

[BruceVC]

 

So Obama should have pretended that the US would have intervened in Ukraine and Syria. What would have happened when the world called his bluff. I'm sure you agree it would never have happened. 

No he should have stayed out of it altogether. And he DID make noise suggesting we would intervene. He did give military aid to Ukraine.

 

I don't think you read what I wrote. Or if you did I did a poor job conveying my point.

 

No your point is clear, I just think Gorgon misunderstood it?

 

Yes I understand your view on intervention in the ME, I also don't get why a single USA soldier should ever die in the ME unless really necessary but end of the day why bleed and spend resources in an area where the average person despises your country anyway? Its not worth the sacrifice ....the USA is involved in certain African countries but the difference is black Africans in these countries appreciates what the USA is doing 

 

 

 If Russia wants to take a side, let them. I hope they choke on it. 

Why you so butthurrt hate of Russia? We actually do nothing hostile against Murica yet - what reason for such anti-Russian talking do you have?

 

Oby I really tried to warn you, I was the only one on these forums who said " Oby....you need to find more reasonable Russians who represent the Russian view in a way that isn't paranoid or militant " ...but Oby no ....you didn't listen to me

 

You agreed with people like Zora, 2133 and Sarex who supported the Russian unacceptable intervention in Ukraine. Oby the reality is Putin seemed to think he could just seize any country he wanted as a justification for " NATO aggression " ....

 

NATO is your friend Oby...NATO likes Russia

 

Now look at the Russian economy, I'm sorry about that as I don't like the idea of any country suffering

 

But there is one advantage to this mess. In South Africa I am able to negotiate very good prices with the Russian strippers who normally dont ever drop prices and dont like small talk....yes I pretend to be on the side of Putin and say " he is a victim of Western aggression "  and they really are impressed that I seem to know so much about there country ( I don't really see this as lying as sometimes the truth can be more hurtful than constructive ) 

[BruceVC]

 

 If Russia wants to take a side, let them. I hope they choke on it. 

Why you so butthurrt hate of Russia? We actually do nothing hostile against Murica yet - what reason for such anti-Russian talking do you have?

 

Oh no Putin has been very critical of the West and has used basically every opportunity he can to undermine the USA

 

But its easy to pass judgement when you aren't actually fighting any wars. I'm glad Russia is involved in Syria ....as GD said let them have it and let people think Putin found a solution if he can. The West really doesn't care and would love just to get out  

[Woldan]

I would not say the US is the strongest nation in the world, militarily. Like any other military organization they have their strengths and weaknesses, their strength being technology, their weakness not being able to take casualties too well, a certain amount of arrogance and a susceptibility in dealing with asymmetric warfare.

Lets not forget in the past 30 years the US had a lot of trouble dealing with opponents with vastly inferior equipment and training.

Edited January 13, 2016 by Woldan

[BruceVC]

I would not say the US is the strongest nation in the world, militarily. Like any other military organization they have their strengths and weaknesses, their strength being technology, their weakness not being able to take casualties too well, a certain amount of arrogance and a susceptibility in dealing with asymmetric warfare.

But Woldan no one likes casualties especially if the war is not absolutely justified   

[obyknven]

Iranians release pics of stronk US warriors.

 

 

 

They force US military girl to wear proper Muslim clothes also.

 

   

[Zoraptor]

Is there any indication that it was a covert raid of some sort. Not that we would know either way. 

 

The circumstances are rather weird on the face of it, but neither party wants to make an issue of it and it's difficult to imagine what kind of covert action they might have been doing anyway.

[bigcrazewolf]

 

 

Don't confuse strength of arms with strength of will. Lacking the latter does not preclude the former. 

Yes my friend and using  a euphemism to still imply Obama has made the USA weak still doesnt really make the USA weak

 

GD as an ex-military man do you think the USA is weaker militarily....and if you think this what do you mean by it ? So for example is this something that has negatively impacted your important relationship with good friends like ...Syrian rebels ....or the Saudis?

 

Like all comparisons this one is relative. Are we weaker than we were 8 years ago? Sure. Have we fallen out of frst place in the "strongest military in the world" pagent? No. Has our ability to project power been lessened? No. I wouldn't say Obama has made the US weaker. I WILL say Obama is a weak man. His mealy mouthed responses to ISIS, Russia in Ukraine, Benghazi, the Bergdal mess, etc. play that out. Last night he patted hiself on the back over Osama Bin Laden but let's not forget he nearly screwed that one up by waffeling on it for 24 hours. But the truth of being the leader of a nation is this: If you are not going to DO something about it, STFU about it. Talking without backing it up is what makes you look weak.

 

No I've made my opinions on the US role in the world abundantly clear before but to highlight it here the US has no interest and should not be intervening in Syria. No matter who wins that "civil war" that country will still be an enemy that supports terrorisim and is a threat to Turkey & Israel (both allies in case we forgot). I would not shed on drop of American blood or on cent of American treasure on that. If Russia wants to take a side, let them. I hope they choke on it. As for our "friends" in the House of Saud if we had the courage to exploit our own oil resources we could tell them to go f--k themselves once and for all. As far as military intervention and humanitarian aid IMO US interests start at the eastern shore of the US Virgin Islands and ends at Pochnoi Point in Alaska. The exception being support of allied nations should they ever be threatened.

 

I am reminded of George Washington's farewell address: "The great rule of conduct for us in regard to foreign nations is in extending our commercial relations, to have with them as little political connection as possible. So far as we have already formed engagements, let them be fulfilled with perfect good faith. Here let us stop."

 

Where do you get your stuff? I want some!

[Tigranes]

There's one thing where I'll agree with Obama's critics - making the 'red line' statement on Syria wasn't 'strong' or 'weak' (because those words are usually used to describe an ill-defined set of mostly pointless postures), but it certainly was stupid. Once he said it there was only going to be one outcome: embarrassing backtracking. 

 

That said, if he declared "Syria sort your own mess out, we are hands off" from the start, he would have gotten at least the same amount, possibly more, amount of "Obama is weak" flak over the years. Obama is weak he is letting Middle East destabilise he is losing the peacemaking work done in the Bush era he is showing America is powerless to save civilians etc etc etc. Even today, with the benefit of hindsight (well considered predictions about Syria were almost nonexistent, at least in publicly available debate, during 2011/2012), I"m not sure what would have been the best course of action.

[Zoraptor]

Obama is hamstrung on Syria because nearly all his regional allies are militantly anti Assad and they fund a lot of media and think tanks plus provide a lot of their regional intelligence capabilities, a situation he inherited and cannot change significantly even if he wanted to. I rather think he has let himself be convinced into a lot of international adventurism somewhat against his better judgement- Hillary plus Nick the Hungarian plus Gulf States were the main cheerleaders for Libya and the latter were so for Syria as well.

 

Personally, I couldn't care less if a leader is 'weak' if being strong also means being a moron. Given the strength of the various rebel factions we'd probably have ISIS with a capital in Damascus now if he'd followed the 'strong' line espoused by sock puppet buffoons like post 2000 McCain whose answer to a blocked toilet would be advocating for it to be bombed back to the stone age (but at least that makes him look 'strong').

[bigcrazewolf]

I would not say the US is the strongest nation in the world, militarily. Like any other military organization they have their strengths and weaknesses, their strength being technology, their weakness not being able to take casualties too well, a certain amount of arrogance and a susceptibility in dealing with asymmetric warfare.

Lets not forget in the past 30 years the US had a lot of trouble dealing with opponents with vastly inferior equipment and training.

I'm not a U.S. war monger, but you are far from being correct on this statement. We can take casualties when we have too, but I felt Iraq was a rouse, but don't forget when we invaded Iraq S.H. had one of the largest most feared armies in that area of the world. Please, don't get me wrong the U.S. should have never went there, but if the R.O.E. were non-existent the U.S. would have demolished the whole area.

[obyknven]

Iran continue deliver lulz for us.

http://youtu.be/Qr7LbW9iibc

Don't find this video in major Western media. Freedom of speech

 

Also story about US fail probably is more epic than we can imagine before.

http://www.americanthinker.com/blog/2016/01/10_us_sailors_held_by_iran_confirmed_freed_comments.html

 

 

MattBracken FactsWillOut • 10 hours ago

I rarely pull out my dusty old trident, but in this case, here goes. I was a Navy SEAL officer in the 1980s, and this kind of operation (transiting small boats in foreign waters) was our bread and butter. Today, these boats both not only had radar, but multiple GPS devices, including chart plotters that place your boat's icon right on the chart. The claim by Iran that the USN boats "strayed into Iranian waters" is complete bull$#it.
For an open-water transit between nations, the course is studied and planned in advance by the leaders of the Riverine Squadron, with specific attention given to staying wide and clear of any hostile nation's claimed territorial waters. The boats are given a complete mechanical check before departure, and they have sufficient fuel to accomplish their mission plus extra. If, for some unexplainable and rare circumstance one boat broke down, the other would tow it, that's why two boats go on these trips and not one! It's called "self-rescue" and it's SOP.
This entire situation is in my area of expertise. I can state with complete confidence that both Iran and our own State Department are lying. The boats did not enter Iranian waters. They were overtaken in international waters by Iranian patrol boats that were so superior in both speed and firepower that it became a "hands up!" situation, with automatic cannons in the 40mm to 76mm range pointed at them point-blank. Surrender, hands up, or be blown out of the water. I assume that the Iranians had an English speaker on a loudspeaker to make the demand. This takedown was no accident or coincidence, it was a planned slap across America's face.
Just watch. The released sailors will be ordered not to say a word about the incident, and the Iranians will have taken every GPS device, chart-plotter etc off the boats, so that we will not be able to prove where our boats were taken.
The "strayed into Iranian waters" story being put out by Iran and our groveling and appeasing State Dept. is utter and complete BS from one end to the other.

 

P.S. Obama is not weak

[Rostere]

No I've made my opinions on the US role in the world abundantly clear before but to highlight it here the US has no interest and should not be intervening in Syria. No matter who wins that "civil war" that country will still be an enemy that supports terrorisim and is a threat to Turkey & Israel (both allies in case we forgot). I would not shed on drop of American blood or on cent of American treasure on that. If Russia wants to take a side, let them. I hope they choke on it. As for our "friends" in the House of Saud if we had the courage to exploit our own oil resources we could tell them to go f--k themselves once and for all. As far as military intervention and humanitarian aid IMO US interests start at the eastern shore of the US Virgin Islands and ends at Pochnoi Point in Alaska. The exception being support of allied nations should they ever be threatened.

 

But Turkey supports ISIS if not actively, then passively. And Israel's ethnic cleansing of Palestinians is one of the main reasons why the Muslim nations have developed an anti-Western attitude to begin with, the last colonial project forever poisoning the well of Middle Eastern politics. IMO the US should tell both Turkey, Israel and Saudi Arabia to go f--k themselves (OK, that sounds too harsh, but you get the point...). Turkey and Israel are allies of convenience at best, I strongly doubt any Turks or Israelis would sacrifice their lives if the US needed assistance. This stands in contrast to countries such as the UK which can be regarded as genuine allies of the US.

[HoonDing]

"P.S. Obama is not weak"

 

He does not bow nearly enough.

 

[ShadySands]

You know the emperor and I have the same birthday...

 

Odd that I've never seen us both at the same place at the same time

 

[obyknven]

But there is one advantage to this mess. In South Africa I am able to negotiate very good prices with the Russian strippers who normally dont ever drop prices and dont like small talk....yes I pretend to be on the side of Putin and say " he is a victim of Western aggression "  and they really are impressed that I seem to know so much about there country ( I don't really see this as lying as sometimes the truth can be more hurtful than constructive  ) 

 

Bruce - your constant mania about strippers looks... non-normal. How old you are? Maybe you must find a love and marry to this woman. Family, Bruce, it's much better than any your purchased "love" of cheap migrants. You so similar to Murika, you crying about how stronk  you are, but IRL your behavior looks just pathetic.