I'm new to this whole "Wizard wearing armor" thing, can someone explain?

[Baron_Bathory]

Hey all!
 

So I'm a huge fan of the IE games where a clothie wearing plate is ludicrous. That's obviously not the way it works in this game and it's totally thrown me off who should be wearing what.

 

Obviously melee tanks should have the heaviest and strongest armor regardless. What about the other classes? What type of armor should they be wearing? Priest healer? Wizard DPS? etc.

 

Thanks guys!

 

 

Pic Related....

 

[dirigible]

I don't put heavy armor on anyone unless I plan for that person to be tanking.

My ranger, priest, and wizard are all wearing robes or plain clothing, because I have them sit behind my warrior and monk.

 

You could make a wizard-tank, and in that situation, full plate might be a good idea.

[Horrorscope]

What I've found is sure you can wear it, but you want to and not just on wizards but every character, to wear the lightest amount of armor in which you can still manage to survive, the speed penalty is large, perhaps too large. So with a proper defense (fighter/pet) in front of the wizard, I run them with 0 Armor for 0 speed penalty.

[Baron_Bathory]

Good stuff, thanks guys! So should I be looking for magical robes for my whole party sans le tank?

[Sedrefilos]

Heavyer armor gives better protection but (all) your actions become slower. Is as simple as that. You can always echant your armor.

[Stargazer86]

I'd be careful about sticking everyone in robes. There are some enemies that are difficult to maintain control of. Spirits like to teleport in behind your lines. Beetles like to dig their way past your tanks. If one of your character gets mind-controlled and starts wailing on your other squishy party members you could be in for a rough time.

 

The damage reduction of heavier armor helps, but without a good deflection/reflex score they're still going to be squishy. So I like to pick somewhere in the middle, giving my mage/ranger/chanter medium-ish armor that doesn't detract from their attack speed all too much but still has enough DR reduction to help them not be one-shot in case something goes wrong.

[Horrorscope]

^Those are true for sure, since you have a bottomless inventory, keep some extra armor around, some light, med, heavy. I keep all my back line at zero armor, zero delay, however if something pops up that I can't get past, one of my reloads I can pop on heavier armor and try that tactic.

[Horrorscope]

Good stuff, thanks guys! So should I be looking for magical robes for my whole party sans le tank?

 

Well if you can find magical one's, sure! Just plain old wares works to keeping you quick at the trigger.

[Arctic]

Good stuff, thanks guys! So should I be looking for magical robes for my whole party sans le tank?

robes gives you 15 % speed penalty .. so just normal clothing for the wizard  , unless you find one with a really good enchant xD

Edited March 30, 2015 by Arctic

[Xavori]

I'd actually argue the opposite.

 

The speed penalty is nothing compared to having a party that simply cannot be killed.

 

If you're into cheese...

 

3 Moon Godlike Chanters - plate armor, shields, heaviest one handed weapon you can find main slot, hardest hitting ranged weapon in secondary.

1 Moon Godlike mage - stealth + fan of flames is loltastic ambush alpha strike

1 Moon Godlike Rogue - plate armor, faster ranged weapon because rogue's abilities will get past damage reduction.

1 Moon Godlike Priest - again plate armor.  Provides circles of protection, sets up rogue by inflicting negatives on enemy, etc.

 

The chanters will easily keep everyone alive.  And since you can give each one a different single phrase chant, you can pick up some serious boots to your entire party.

 

Fights go mage sneaks up and flames much of the uther side, then runs behind the tank chanters.  The rogue starts ploinking enemies.  The tank chanters start gobbling up all the engages (give them the defense traid for extras).  The priest then starts using his spells to inflict conditions that allow the rogue to get sneak attacks in.  Mage continues nuking.

 

Personally, I made it about 5 fights like that until I went back to a 'real' party since the game got silly pointless when you no longer ever see red on your portraits.

[Viperswhip]

It must be a class skill, but warriors get a talent that reduces the armor penalty by 16 (so -25% becomes -9).

 

There are plenty of different armors though, and I'd be most concerned with picking the appropriate armor for the engagement, even if it ups my reaction time a bit.

[Horrorscope]

^Right. So when you went back to normal what is your suggestion? I'm not saying total tanking isn't bad either, it isn't like I have a whole bunch of time with the game and hopefully there are many ways to play it. But from my early observations, speed with more of a balanced team for the back row seemed better. They shouldn't be touched to often.

[Viperswhip]

^Right. So when you went back to normal what is your suggestion? I'm not saying total tanking isn't bad either, it isn't like I have a whole bunch of time with the game and hopefully there are many ways to play it. But from my early observations, speed with more of a balanced team for the back row seemed better. They shouldn't be touched to often.

Well, it depends, I don't have anyone in robes in my party I think, because I've not found any great wizard robes. Even Aloth starts with his own medium (?) armor.

 

I would think that if the person has an escape skill, like a knockdown, or paralyze...etc, then you can put them in a ligher/no armor, but there are plenty of mobs that will one shot them or come close to it.

[bobthe]

Armor in this game is a bit weird, but once you realize that the only restriction is the combat action speed penalty then you are open to evaluate which armor works best for each build. Personally, my fighter has the highest DR armor I can find. My barbarian has armor somewhere in the middle. He's my primary damage dealer so I don't want to compromise his attack speed much. My priest has plate also because his speed is mostly irrelevant. He barely does anything because priest spells suck in this game. He heals my barbarian from time to time. Ranger, wizard, and chanter all have light armor, but not robes. Somewhere between -15% and -25% speed armor. They rarely get attacked but sometimes stuff gets around the front lines (e.g. incorporreal undead etc that can teleport or tunnel mostly)

[Lightzy]

Front line - highest armor

back line - naked

 

Win!

 

All of the in-between armors are completely useless. If you play right your back liners are never hit anyway. Just run in with the armored melees and gobble up those 'engagements'

 

 

And haha!

I also tried an all-moongod party like that, it was very silly and broke the game. It was quite literally impossible to go under a certain HP threshold, because of everyone healing each other all the time, including priest just for kicks.

[Bhazor]

I stick my priest and mage in heavy armour because I don't care about their autoattacks. So let them rock some full plate shrug off arrows and bullets and hold them back until you need them to cast a spell. Who cares about my wizard missing out on a couple of pissy little rod attacks if it lets them survive long enough to walk up and fire fan the whole mob from behind.

Edited March 30, 2015 by Bhazor

[Hogfather]

Front line - highest armor

back line - naked

 

Win!

 

All of the in-between armors are completely useless. If you play right your back liners are never hit anyway. Just run in with the armored melees and gobble up those 'engagements'

 

How do you stop Spirits laughing at Rules of Engagement? Its not always possible to plonk your fighters in a choke point (though it often is). 

 

I'm currently rolling with 2 tanks and a chantie in plate and everyone else bathrobes, but man it really hurts if something manages to sneak into the back line o.O

Edited March 30, 2015 by Hogfather

[Lephys]

I kind of wish armor granted Deflection as well. I don't mean "take the game, currently, and just add on Deflection." But, maybe the Fighter, for example, could get far less natural Deflection (but still more than other classes), and roughly half of people's Deflection could come from armor. 'Cause, the biggest problem is that, on anyone with horrible Deflection (like Wizards), the heavier the armor, the more negative you're getting for every bit of positive you're getting. Yeah, that -50% action speed armor BETTER give your Wizard 9 DR, 'cause everything's statistically going to be hitting or critting (for extra damage, pretty much offsetting the DR you just got) him the whole time, and he's still operating at half speed.

 

The pros don't match the cons, mainly because of base values being so different (CON's effect on Wizard Health, DR's effect on Wizards, etc.)

 

So, with a Wizard, you're:

 

- Going to be downed/die in fewer hits because of piddly Health/Endurance.

- Going to be hit more often for full damage or 150% damage from Hits and Crits, and rarely Grazed and VERY rarely Missed.

- Receiving half action speed, on top of casting times that already slow down your actions compared to, say, a Fighter's attacks, AND on top of low-Accuracy standard attacks that are already going to miss and Graze more often than they're going to do regular damage or crit.

 

Armor is actually far less useful for Wizards, for example, than it is for others. That's the kind of thing I hope they tweak a bit. I think the base values for different classes need to have less variance in them. Just have a Fighter gain +4 Deflection per level instead of +3, etc., and let stats and armor do the rest. Especially with all the %-based modifiers in the game.

[Viperswhip]

 

Front line - highest armor

back line - naked

 

Win!

 

All of the in-between armors are completely useless. If you play right your back liners are never hit anyway. Just run in with the armored melees and gobble up those 'engagements'

 

How do you stop Spirits laughing at Rules of Engagement? Its not always possible to plonk your fighters in a choke point (though it often is). 

 

I'm currently rolling with 2 tanks and a chantie in plate and everyone else bathrobes, but man it really hurts if something manages to sneak into the back line o.O

 

Just like MMOs any decent tank should be able to peel, or you can try to kite. I use two tanks and 4 behind, but my Rogue can peel to a degree, and then escape while I micro manage kiting and my 4 guys plink the mob to death.

 

Depending on the engagement I will send one tank forward and keep the other one back to get any that come around. That strategy heavily reduces the usability of aoe attacks though.

[Horrorscope]

 

Front line - highest armor

back line - naked

 

Win!

 

All of the in-between armors are completely useless. If you play right your back liners are never hit anyway. Just run in with the armored melees and gobble up those 'engagements'

 

How do you stop Spirits laughing at Rules of Engagement? Its not always possible to plonk your fighters in a choke point (though it often is). 

 

I'm currently rolling with 2 tanks and a chantie in plate and everyone else bathrobes, but man it really hurts if something manages to sneak into the back line o.O

 

 

Well that is where it is a good thing that many early Wiz spells are short range AOE. Do that and a perfect time for Fan of Flames. But yes, that can cause some issues, but nothing I haven't overcome yet. It is a time where you do get to unload.

[Lohi]

It's about how you want to play.  There's no inherent anti-caster field surrounding armor like some games like to do.  Instead armor just slows you down when using spells (or swords for that matter).  So if you feel too squishy, use a little light armor, if still squishy use some more, if still squishy maybe try another tactic...  There's a bit of balancing, find out what sort of armor is best for you.

 

Or just ignore the mechanic and wear whatever you want that looks nice.  That will work too.

[Baron_Bathory]

Excellent tips guys thank you so much!

 

I'd actually argue the opposite.

 

The speed penalty is nothing compared to having a party that simply cannot be killed.

 

If you're into cheese...

 

3 Moon Godlike Chanters - plate armor, shields, heaviest one handed weapon you can find main slot, hardest hitting ranged weapon in secondary.

1 Moon Godlike mage - stealth + fan of flames is loltastic ambush alpha strike

1 Moon Godlike Rogue - plate armor, faster ranged weapon because rogue's abilities will get past damage reduction.

1 Moon Godlike Priest - again plate armor.  Provides circles of protection, sets up rogue by inflicting negatives on enemy, etc.

 

The chanters will easily keep everyone alive.  And since you can give each one a different single phrase chant, you can pick up some serious boots to your entire party.

 

Fights go mage sneaks up and flames much of the uther side, then runs behind the tank chanters.  The rogue starts ploinking enemies.  The tank chanters start gobbling up all the engages (give them the defense traid for extras).  The priest then starts using his spells to inflict conditions that allow the rogue to get sneak attacks in.  Mage continues nuking.

 

Personally, I made it about 5 fights like that until I went back to a 'real' party since the game got silly pointless when you no longer ever see red on your portraits.

 

Cheese is soooo fun :D Waiting for a nice powergaming guide to come out, and a solo one :D Seems like Godlike are the race to go for most classes. Pity, I don't find them incredibly role-playable. I wonder if their advantages are negligible for power gaming.

[zephiris]

I don't play any 'Godlike' race. First of all I find them extremely ugly, and secondly I find them a bit too 'OP'.

I rather have a 'normal' party, and play a game that is constantly challenging me each fight.

[dirigible]

Personally, I don't like heavy armor on anyone. The speed penalty means that your characters spend a lot of time on cooldown.

 

The boss just hit your party with a big AOE and you need to heal right now? Too bad, your priest is wearing full plate and won't be able to do anything for the next 4 seconds.

 

The enemy just dodged past your warrior and is running towards your mage? Well you could use Into The Fray to pull him back, but your Warrior is wearing full plate and won't be able to do anything for the next 4 seconds.

[CarpalTony]

Wow, this entire thread has made me realize that I need to kick it up a notch on the strategy front.  My wizard, ranger and priest take such a beating in every single fight. Especially the priest, he currently holds the "most times KO'd" record.

 

I also didn't understand how armor worked at all. Now I'm really wishing I wasn't at work, so I could put this new found knowledge to use.

 

Thanks guys!