USA : State of the Union Address

[Zoraptor]

Any reasons why the economy and employment gotten better? Cheap oil prices? Market growth in certain sectors? Banks starting to invest again?

Six years of free money helps a lot, shows why they spend so much time trying to make sure the USD remains the world's reserve currency, with the amount of cash being printed they'd be half way to Zimbabwe if most of the world's lenders didn't have a stake in the USD holding its value. And a lot of people have simply given up looking for work so aren't officially counted as unemployed any more. It's ironic in a 'Yes, Minister' kind of way, but unemployed people going off welfare even if they are not employed is a good statistical result for governments as the unemployment rate goes down when those (still in any sensible definition) unemployed are off books as unemployed.

 

Most of the fundamental problems are still there, Too Big To Fail Banks have just got bigger, income and wealth imbalances, massive indebtedness, lack of genuine competitiveness. The US economy looks better than that in Europe, but it's mostly because the buboes have got a good layer of makeup put over them, they're still suppurating and oozing underneath.

 

Still, Obama is better than McCain or Romney by a country mile, faint praise as that may be, he's just not as good as he should or could have been and a massive disappointment when measured against that yard stick. Far too much vacillation, far too much dreaming of bipartisanship when his opponents had not interest in it etc.

 

Still, the Repubs will probably be judged worse by history, not least for their utter lack of class about losing to a black guy.

[Valsuelm]

It's interesting yet not surprising that nearly every, if not every one who lives outside of the U.S. on this forum thinks Obama is better than the Republican alternatives...

[Tigranes]

It depends. It's relatively difficult for me to find people making concrete arguments for why Romney would have done better, outside, say, Republican bloggers - but then, 'living in America' doesn't mean you know what American people think, I spend 90% of my day in a private university campus, one where it has its own security force every corner chasing away the homeless and others besides.

[Hurlshort]

It's interesting yet not surprising that nearly every, if not every one who lives outside of the U.S. on this forum thinks Obama is better than the Republican alternatives...

 

It's basically how the second term was won.  Mitt Romney was simply the mormon John Kerry, neither really had the charisma to upset an incumbent, even one rocking super low approval ratings. 

[ShadySands]

It's interesting yet not surprising that nearly every, if not every one who lives outside of the U.S. on this forum thinks Obama is better than the Republican alternatives...

That's why my wife begged me to vote for him (him being Obama). Of course my wife isn't American so I guess it makes sense

[Blarghagh]

 

It's interesting yet not surprising that nearly every, if not every one who lives outside of the U.S. on this forum thinks Obama is better than the Republican alternatives...

 

It's basically how the second term was won.  Mitt Romney was simply the mormon John Kerry, neither really had the charisma to upset an incumbent, even one rocking super low approval ratings. 

 

 

I think that in this day and age, every president from history would face low approval ratings. People have become more cynical and more entitled at the same time and anything that isn't giving them exactly what they want is the end of the world. It's not the president, it's the people.

[Orogun01]

 

 

It's interesting yet not surprising that nearly every, if not every one who lives outside of the U.S. on this forum thinks Obama is better than the Republican alternatives...

 

It's basically how the second term was won.  Mitt Romney was simply the mormon John Kerry, neither really had the charisma to upset an incumbent, even one rocking super low approval ratings. 

 

 

I think that in this day and age, every president from history would face low approval ratings. People have become more cynical and more entitled at the same time and anything that isn't giving them exactly what they want is the end of the world. It's not the president, it's the people.

 

And that's why the president spies on them and sends drones to get them.

[Zoraptor]

It's interesting yet not surprising that nearly every, if not every one who lives outside of the U.S. on this forum thinks Obama is better than the Republican alternatives...

 

In most places in the rest of the world the Democrats would be a right wing party with the Repubs being even further right, that explains most of it. The rest is Bush jr hangover, almost everyone outside the US loathed him, so anyone associated with him gets automatically disliked. I didn't actually mind Romney particularly, he gave the impression of being a moderate guy saying immoderate stuff because he needed to fire up the core support.

 

I suspect you'd get significantly different results if you asked "has Obama done a good job?" vs "has Obama done a good job compared to how McCain or Romney would have performed" from non US people.

[BruceVC]

Well I give up, I'm going to stick to people who agree with me when I say  " Obama has done a good job as president for the USA "...you guys obviously need another 8 years of George Bush to remind you of what a bad president really is    

 

But on a serious notes as TN said the lack of recognition for Obama is something as an outsider I clearly don't understand. Despite some of the reasons given he should be given credit for the recovery of your economy, if the USA unemployment rate was same as when he came to power and the country was in the same economic malaise people would be saying 
" he has been a terrible president...he couldn't even get the economy working....what good is he "

 

So all Im going to say is the actions and decisions of any president of any country have a direct correlation to the state of the economy. And when Obama came to power the USA economy was facing certain serious and severe challenges yet now the USA is really recovering economically. Maybe some food for thought ?

[Bartimaeus]

So all Im going to say is the actions and decisions of any president of any country have a direct correlation to the state of the economy. And when Obama came to power the USA economy was facing certain serious and severe challenges yet now the USA is really recovering economically. Maybe some food for thought ?

Alright, I'll bite: what did he do that positively affected the economy?

[BruceVC]

 

So all Im going to say is the actions and decisions of any president of any country have a direct correlation to the state of the economy. And when Obama came to power the USA economy was facing certain serious and severe challenges yet now the USA is really recovering economically. Maybe some food for thought ?

Alright, I'll bite: what did he do that positively affected the economy?

 

 

Barti, to be honest thats very long and complicated, here are some of the things he has done that are shown in a more joking way

 

http://whatthe****hasobamadonesofar.com/

http://www.bspcn.com/2010/10/18/things-obama-has-done/

 

http://www.forbes.com/sites/realspin/2012/11/03/what-obama-has-done-not-what-he-says-matters/

 

Read the last article from Forbes, it was written in 2012. Read the first two paragraphs where the writer says " Having steered the U.S. economy into a ditch that he created given his unfortunate reprise of big government spending and big regulation liberalism last in vogue in the 1930s, President Obama—remarkably—is asking voters for another term. Unfortunately, the problems created and worsened by our 44th President are far bigger than he is" and " After four years in office, the President of the United States is offering us nothing more than slogans about binders, Romnesia, and taxing the rich. How sad and small. After four years of persistently high unemployment, Obama’s campaign pleas of new plans to address joblessness ring flat and hollow" 

 

And ask yourself if that reflects the reality of the USA now? In other words he was judged directly on the unemployment rate and state of the economy yet  now when things are good " "its not because of Obama and we refuse to give him credit" 

 

So its lose lose for him ?

[Bartimaeus]

I'm not concerned with what the Forbes writer is talking about - like an earlier poster said, I believe far too much responsibility for our economic conditions - whether good or bad - goes to the credit of the President...undeservedly. So I was curious as to what you thought *he* specifically did that helped our economy. The first link you posted...seems to have a huge list of things not really attributable to him - a whole lot of legislation jointly passed by both parts of Congress, and then signed off by him. Is not being a hindrance for these bills enough to be credited with mild to moderate renewed success of arguably the world's most complex economy? I don't think so.

 

So...your link kind of illustrates the point I was making.

Edited January 22, 2015 by Bartimaeus

[BruceVC]

I'm not concerned with what the Forbes writer is talking about - like an earlier poster said, I believe far too much responsibility for our economic conditions - whether good or bad - goes to the credit of the President...undeservedly. So I was curious as to what you thought *he* specifically did that helped our economy. The first link you posted...seems to have a huge list of things not really attributable to him - a whole lot of legislation jointly passed by both parts of Congress, and then signed off by him. Is not being a hindrance for these bills enough to be credited with mild to moderate renewed success of arguably the world's most complex economy? I don't think so.

 

So...your link kind of illustrates the point I was making.

 

Okay, well I guess we will never fundamentally agree on this one

 

I absolutely believe that under any president or prime minister the state of the economy is one of the real benchmarks to measure if that person did a good job overall

 

Its appears most people here don't see this connection and believe that the president or prime minister makes no difference to the overall state of economic transformation

 

I can cite dozens of examples where, for example, African leaders have come to power and by the end of their leadership the economy of there countries have effectively collapsed or are in a worst state 

 

But its fine, no one has to give Obama credit for the state of the USA economy. I'll continue to do it

[Bartimaeus]

Shall I start personally blaming Hoover for the Great Depression, then?

[Barothmuk]

But its fine, no one has to give Obama credit for the state of the USA economy. I'll continue to do it

Bruce: Always willing to stand up for the oppressed and unheard.

[kgambit]

 

• America is less dependent on foreign oil than its ever been in 30 years

 

 

LOL  Obama has done jack **** to bring that about.  In fact, his policies have been counter productive:  To name just a few:

 

- Under the Obama administration, the time required for a permit [for drilling on federal onshore lands and the Outer Continental Shelf (OCS)] has doubled to 307 days, while in North Dakota, where booming oil shale fracking has effectively wiped out unemployment, permitting currently takes only 10 days.

 

- He tightened regulations against drilling [2012]

 

- During his first term in office, the Obama administration cut by more than half the number of new permits and new leases for offshore oil and gas drilling.

 

- In 2011, the Obama administration approved a grand total of 12 new leases. 

 

- In 2010 he instituted a moratorium on drilling in the Eastern GOM until 2022, the Pacific OCS and Northern Atlantic OCS indefinitely, the Southern Atlantic and Northern Alaskan OCS until 2012.   The areas closed were estimated to contain over 13 billion barrels of oil and 41 Tcf of natural gas.

 

Obama might be able to claim credit for a number of things but the boost in oil and gas production is NOT one of them. 

Edited January 22, 2015 by kgambit

[BruceVC]

 

 

• America is less dependent on foreign oil than its ever been in 30 years

 

 

LOL  Obama has done jack **** to bring that about.  In fact, his policies have been counter productive:  To name just a few:

 

- Under the Obama administration, the time required for a permit [for drilling on federal onshore lands and the Outer Continental Shelf (OCS)] has doubled to 307 days, while in North Dakota, where booming oil shale fracking has effectively wiped out unemployment, permitting currently takes only 10 days.

 

- He tightened regulations against drilling [2012]

 

- During his first term in office, the Obama administration cut by more than half the number of new permits and new leases for offshore oil and gas drilling.

 

- In 2011, the Obama administration approved a grand total of 12 new leases. 

 

- In 2010 he instituted a moratorium on drilling in the Eastern GOM until 2022, the Pacific OCS and Northern Atlantic OCS indefinitely, the Southern Atlantic and Northern Alaskan OCS until 2012.   The areas closed were estimated to contain over 13 billion barrels of oil and 41 Tcf of natural gas.

 

Obama might be able to claim credit for a number of things but the boost in oil and gas production is NOT one of them. 

 

 

Look you know your stuff Kgambit, I can't argue with you when it comes to the facts about these types of developments

 

So I'll rephrase what I said  " during Obamas presidency American became less dependent on foreign oil than it has been in 30 years " 

[Wrath of Dagon]

Obola is the worst president in history because he completely disregards the rule of law, civilization's greatest achievement. The economy might look good compared to the rest of the commie world, but if labor participation rate was the same as pre-recession, unemployment now would be over 9%, and wages have stagnated. Not that it's all necessarily his fault, but by the same token the good things only happened because most of his program was blocked.

Edited January 23, 2015 by Wrath of Dagon

[Hurlshort]

Obola is the worst president in history because he completely disregards the rule of law, civilization's greatest achievement. The economy might look good compared to the rest of the commie world, but if labor participation rate was the same as pre-recession, unemployment now would be over 9%, and wages have stagnated. Not that it's all necessarily his fault, but by the same token the good things only happened because most of his program was blocked.

 

You need to read up on Lincoln if you think Obama is bad about the law.  

 

Here is what a lot of the sites you read today would look like if Lincoln were in power:  http://www.libertyforlife.com/constitution/politicians/dishonest_abe.htm

 

 

Here is a less inflammatory version:

 

http://www.politifact.com/truth-o-meter/statements/2014/mar/10/ted-cruz/ted-cruz-says-barack-obama-first-president-who-thi/

Edited January 23, 2015 by Hurlshot

[Valsuelm]

Obama did get one thing right, things were generally better in 1999.

 

[Wrath of Dagon]

 

Obola is the worst president in history because he completely disregards the rule of law, civilization's greatest achievement. The economy might look good compared to the rest of the commie world, but if labor participation rate was the same as pre-recession, unemployment now would be over 9%, and wages have stagnated. Not that it's all necessarily his fault, but by the same token the good things only happened because most of his program was blocked.

 

You need to read up on Lincoln if you think Obama is bad about the law.  

 

Here is what a lot of the sites you read today would look like if Lincoln were in power:  http://www.libertyforlife.com/constitution/politicians/dishonest_abe.htm

 

 

Here is a less inflammatory version:

 

http://www.politifact.com/truth-o-meter/statements/2014/mar/10/ted-cruz/ted-cruz-says-barack-obama-first-president-who-thi/

 

Lincoln was President during a civil war, what's Obola's excuse? The first link you posted is completely ridiculous, in the second link read Cruz's response, it explains it very well.

[Valsuelm]

 

 

Obola is the worst president in history because he completely disregards the rule of law, civilization's greatest achievement. The economy might look good compared to the rest of the commie world, but if labor participation rate was the same as pre-recession, unemployment now would be over 9%, and wages have stagnated. Not that it's all necessarily his fault, but by the same token the good things only happened because most of his program was blocked.

 

You need to read up on Lincoln if you think Obama is bad about the law.  

 

Here is what a lot of the sites you read today would look like if Lincoln were in power:  http://www.libertyforlife.com/constitution/politicians/dishonest_abe.htm

 

 

Here is a less inflammatory version:

 

http://www.politifact.com/truth-o-meter/statements/2014/mar/10/ted-cruz/ted-cruz-says-barack-obama-first-president-who-thi/

 

Lincoln was President during a civil war, what's Obola's excuse? The first link you posted is completely ridiculous, in the second link read Cruz's response, it explains it very well.

 

 

I'm no fan of Obama, but you repeatedly calling him a childish name like 'Obola' detracts from any argument you make. It's no different than the bitter democrat/socialist who refers to Republicans as 'Repugnacans' or people who identify with the Tea Party as 'Teabaggers'.

 

Ted Cruz is wrong.

 

I've little doubt there are other examples, but somewhat famously in recent times one can look to Obama's immediate predecessor if one wants an example of a President who is guilty of exactly what Ted Cruz claims Obama is guilty of (he's right in that he's guilty, but he's very wrong in that he's the first).

 

Here's one article on it (there are many others out there):

http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/article/2006/07/23/AR2006072300511.html

 

One could start reading through the various Executive orders through the years to no doubt find more examples of Presidents doing exactly what Cruz says Obama has done. There are other places to look as well.

 

I'm not defending what Obama has done. Much of it is solid ground for impeachment. But we past the point before Obama came to office where Congress, the Supreme Court, the mainstream media, and even a majority of the American people would pursue that route. So, the inevitable has been and is happening: The President and the government at large are going to just do whatever they want, Constitution be damned, more and more.

Edited January 24, 2015 by Valsuelm

[Hurlshort]

We really need a legitimate third party to challenge the current trends.  Bull Moose Party Redux!

 

Actually I think even another Ross Perot type might be enough to get some actual reform in the two parties.  There just isn't enough pressure on either group to move from the status quo.

[Namutree]

We really need a legitimate third party to challenge the current trends.  Bull Moose Party Redux!

 

Actually I think even another Ross Perot type might be enough to get some actual reform in the two parties.  There just isn't enough pressure on either group to move from the status quo.

I think Rand Paul is the best chance we have to seeing a reformed republican party. If he isn't the 2016 national candidate; I'll just give up on them. As for the democrats; they're a lost cause already. 

[Barothmuk]

Obola? That barely works at all.

 

Trust conservatives to throw away the one clever (albeit still incredibly stupid) pun of "Obamao".