Police arrest, attack reporters; order reporters NOT to cover protest. IN UNITED STATES.

[BruceVC]

 

 

The fat lady scream "police killed a black boy" well how often white kids run ariund with guns (real or not) pointing them at cops?

 

Just off the top of my head, around this time last year

 

 That's not the answer to my question.

 

 

well how often white kids run ariund with guns (real or not) pointing them at cops?

 

He didn't point it at the cops....

 

He reached for the gun. Not a huge difference.

 

 

I agree with Sharp on this one, over the last few years there have been numerous examples  in the USA of young people being involved in shooting incidents. The police couldn't have known if the gun was real or not, this teenager was really silly to act the way he did considering the history of gun violence. Its a tragedy but I can completely understand why the police reacted the way they did

[BruceVC]

 

Could have used a taser or w/e. I thought american policel oves it so much to tase people.

 

 

Honestly, with all the reports coming up (and probably because I've read all the stuff about the pennsylvania police stuff like this), it makes me feel as if american police isn't there to secure the people, but to oppress them.

 

A taser would have been overkill too...

 

And yes, in general the police are here to oppress and steal... errrr raise revenue.

 

 

Now, now Vals. No need to bring up the whole " this is a another example of glaring police brutality " conspiracy theory

 

The police acted because of the behaviour of the kid, that's the reason he is dead. Its not because the USA police are  " here to oppress and steal"

[Valsuelm]

 

He reached for the gun. Not a huge difference.

 

 

There is a gargantuan world of difference. While one's imagination should serve, yours is failing you. If you've ever had a loaded gun pointed at you, you'd appreciate that super big difference between that, and someone displaying or reaching for a gun. I've been around the latter more times than I can count, the former just once, and the difference between the two cannot be overstated.

 

Nevertheless, the policeman interviewed stated that there were no threats nor any confrontational manner about the boy (an unusual thing for a police department to say, as usually they cover things up as best they can).

Edited November 24, 2014 by Valsuelm

[ShadySands]

 

 

The fat lady scream "police killed a black boy" well how often white kids run ariund with guns (real or not) pointing them at cops?

Just off the top of my head, around this time last year

That's not the answer to my question.

 

 

well how often white kids run ariund with guns (real or not) pointing them at cops?

He didn't point it at the cops....

He reached for the gun. Not a huge difference.

I don't think white kids running around pointing guns (real or fake) at cops is a real statistic

 

Buuuut as I mentioned a very similar incident to this was in the news about a year ago only the kid was white.

 

I'm sure if you took 2 minutes to do a web search you would post less ignorant things.

[Volourn]

"this teenager"

 

12 year olds are teenagers now? Man, the world changes.

 

People defending the cops are shameful. This idea that cops can get away with cold blooded murder is sickening. Why is the first choice always murder? There is no reason why the cops couldn't have handled this better so the kid could live.

 

Sorry, but murdering someone because they had a fake gun is sick and twisted.

 

He wasn't even committing a stupid crime. He was friggin' playing around.

 

Evil to the core nazis. Every time someone defends a bad cop it makes it harder to praise the good ones who make the right decisions.

[BruceVC]

"this teenager"

 

12 year olds are teenagers now? Man, the world changes.

 

People defending the cops are shameful. This idea that cops can get away with cold blooded murder is sickening. Why is the first choice always murder? There is no reason why the cops couldn't have handled this better so the kid could live.

 

Sorry, but murdering someone because they had a fake gun is sick and twisted.

 

He wasn't even committing a stupid crime. He was friggin' playing around.

 

Evil to the core nazis. Every time someone defends a bad cop it makes it harder to praise the good ones who make the right decisions.

 

And if the gun was real and he was waving it around, would the police have been justified in shooting him then? Because he ignored there instructions and it appears they did follow proper training.

 

Also its easy for you to say  " the Police are heavy handed " because you live in one of the safest countries in the world and you probably haven't experienced much gun violence

[Volourn]

"Also its easy for you to say  " the Police are heavy handed " because you live in one of the safest countries in the world and you probably haven't experienced much gun violence"

 

LMAO

 

Then police can be pretty heavy handed here too.  perhaps, instead of ASSuming, pick up a Kanadian paper once and awhile and you'd see we have our over the top pyschos in the police industry.

 

Thankfully, my "city" is small so we don't have Big City Problems tm but that doesn't excuse poor decision makinmg skills by the police.

 

Ultimately it comes down to training. Some people simply shouldn't be police officers - either ebcause theya re incompetent or they are evil.

 

I'll give these coppers the benefit of the douibt - they're simply incompetent.

 

They are supposed to SERVE and PROTECT not ENSLAVE and MURDER.

[Walsingham]

I agree that police culture in the US needs special scrutiny, and that cops should not get a free pass. But remember that they put their lives on the line, and I think that ought to buy them 60 seconds of your careful consideration before you condemn them.

 

The reality is that police have a duty to protect the public. I don't think any of us would argue that point.

 

The reality is that we live in a world where kids and teenagers think it's life-affirming to kill other kids, and teachers. In the US they use guns, in the UK they use knives. Therefore the threat from a kid in possession of a weapon in a public place is very high.

 

The reality is that hundreds of people are killed or injured each year in confrontation with armed individuals.

 

In these circumstances a kid waving what appears to be a weapon around is a threat to both the public and officers. It is NOT acceptable threaten people as 'playing around'. You can't threaten to rob them, blown them up, rape them, or - as in this case - shoot them.

 

The officers warned the kid, and when he ignored the warning they shot him. You cannot taser an individual wit ha firearm because tasers do not always work, and they also produce spasms which might lead to the firearm discharging.

 

That's is doing precisely what we expect them to do: protect people.

[Namutree]

Cops are heroes and should be obeyed and taken at face value no matter what: http://countercurrentnews.com/2014/11/woman-sues-lapd/

Holy crap.

[Drowsy Emperor]

I agree that police culture in the US needs special scrutiny, and that cops should not get a free pass. But remember that they put their lives on the line, and I think that ought to buy them 60 seconds of your careful consideration before you condemn them.

 

The reality is that police have a duty to protect the public. I don't think any of us would argue that point.

 

The reality is that we live in a world where kids and teenagers think it's life-affirming to kill other kids, and teachers. In the US they use guns, in the UK they use knives. Therefore the threat from a kid in possession of a weapon in a public place is very high.

 

The reality is that hundreds of people are killed or injured each year in confrontation with armed individuals.

 

In these circumstances a kid waving what appears to be a weapon around is a threat to both the public and officers. It is NOT acceptable threaten people as 'playing around'. You can't threaten to rob them, blown them up, rape them, or - as in this case - shoot them.

 

The officers warned the kid, and when he ignored the warning they shot him. You cannot taser an individual wit ha firearm because tasers do not always work, and they also produce spasms which might lead to the firearm discharging.

 

That's is doing precisely what we expect them to do: protect people.

 

It was a 12 year old kid doing the sort of stupid things 12 year old kids do. He did not even point the gun at the police or threaten them.

 

Get a grip man. 

Edited November 24, 2014 by Drowsy Emperor

[Drowsy Emperor]

The reporter said he didn't point the gun at the officers. 

 

There was a man with a gun in front of the Serbian government the other day, he was pissed about his military pension and was waving the thing about in a very busy street. The police defused the situation and he gave up the gun. That is proper handling. That is what European cops usually do, which is why there are very few such videos from anywhere other than the US. The consequences for cops for shooting anyone in Europe are usually quite harsh and there is little of the ridiculous departmental protection seen in the US. 

 

This kid wasn't given the benefit of the doubt. He did not threaten, there was no verbal confrontation and... he is a kid. Kids play games without thinking about the consequences. The imperative is to talk him down and defuse the situation not to fire away like its the wild west. 

Edited November 24, 2014 by Drowsy Emperor

[BruceVC]

The reporter said he didn't point the gun at the officers. 

 

There was a man with a gun in front of the Serbian government the other day, he was pissed about his military pension and was waving the thing about in a very busy street. The police defused the situation and he gave up the gun. That is proper handling. That is what European cops usually do, which is why there are very few such videos from anywhere other than the US. The consequences for cops for shooting anyone in Europe are usually quite harsh and there is little of the ridiculous departmental protection seen in the US. 

 

This kid wasn't given the benefit of the doubt. He did not threaten, there was no verbal confrontation and... he is a kid. Kids play games without thinking about the consequences. The imperative is to talk him down and defuse the situation not to fire away like its the wild west. 

 

That is an interesting story and relatively pertinent but Europe also hasn't  the degree of mass shootings, or easy access to firearms, that the USA has had. So the USA police are understandably under different pressures and will react differently

[Malcador]

http://www.ctvnews.ca/canada/no-charges-against-speeding-officer-involved-in-crash-that-killed-5-year-old-1.2109509

 

http://www.theglobeandmail.com/news/national/minister-raps-quebec-prosecutors-handling-of-police-crash-that-killed-child/article21651689/

 

Ah, good old Canadian cops. Shame the cop didn't die in the accident though, I guess he wore a seatbelt (another hero here died last year while speeding on a wet road and no belt on). Rather surprising the way police investigate themselves in Quebec, not even a token agency like the SIU we have in Ontario.

Edited November 24, 2014 by Malcador

[Drowsy Emperor]

What the hell is that. Not prosecuting him in such a clear cut case is insane

[HoonDing]

america greattst countrey

[Volourn]

"That's is doing precisely what we expect them to do: protect people. "

 

They weren't protectin anyone. Nobody was in danger until they decided to cold blooded murder some 12 year old boy with a toy.

[kgambit]

How many of you could really tell whether this is real or a toy?  And remember you're seeing this up close and not at a distance.

 

 

The police told the kid to raise his hands and the kid's reaction was to pull a fairly realistic replica gun from his waistband.     

 

 

 

It was a 12 year old kid doing the sort of stupid things 12 year old kids do. He did not even point the gun at the police or threaten them.

 

 

Oh but he was only 12 years old?  Tell that to Michael Landsberry ......

 

http://www.nydailynews.com/news/national/cops-id-12-year-old-gunman-sparks-middle-school-shooting-nevada-article-1.1496283

Edited November 24, 2014 by kgambit

[Malcador]

Weird that the cop said he didn't threaten the officers, though (rather surprising the lack of BS in that statement - is there video around of it ?). Ah well, I'm sure the cop will be upset or something

[kgambit]

Weird that the cop said he didn't threaten the officers, though (rather surprising the lack of BS in that statement - is there video around of it ?). Ah well, I'm sure the cop will be upset or something

 

Guess that kind of depends on how you interpret the kid pulling the gun from his waistband.  Was that threatening or not?

 

Yes (video).  The family of the boy has apparently seen it but I don't think it has been released to the press. 

 

The cop who shot the kid is apparently a rookie; he was accompanied by a 10-15 year veteran. 

Edited November 24, 2014 by kgambit

[Gorgon]

I don't understand why you should recieve any special consideration because you are a cop. If anything they should be held to a higher standard. Lots of temptation and opportunity to misuse the power you are given. 

[Malcador]

Guess that kind of depends on how you interpret the kid pulling the gun from his waistband.  Was that threatening or not?

 

Yes (video).  The family of the boy has apparently seen it but I don't think it has been released to the press. 

 

The cop who shot the kid is apparently a rookie; he was accompanied by a 10-15 year veteran.

Well, the deputy chief said the kid did not threaten officers, so I figure he'd the best source.

[Valsuelm]

 

The reporter said he didn't point the gun at the officers. 

 

There was a man with a gun in front of the Serbian government the other day, he was pissed about his military pension and was waving the thing about in a very busy street. The police defused the situation and he gave up the gun. That is proper handling. That is what European cops usually do, which is why there are very few such videos from anywhere other than the US. The consequences for cops for shooting anyone in Europe are usually quite harsh and there is little of the ridiculous departmental protection seen in the US. 

 

This kid wasn't given the benefit of the doubt. He did not threaten, there was no verbal confrontation and... he is a kid. Kids play games without thinking about the consequences. The imperative is to talk him down and defuse the situation not to fire away like its the wild west. 

 

That is an interesting story and relatively pertinent but Europe also hasn't  the degree of mass shootings, or easy access to firearms, that the USA has had. So the USA police are understandably under different pressures and will react differently

 

 

No.

 

You're an unwitting victim of a great deal of propaganda. So is the idiot who called 911 in the first place, and likely the police officer as well.

 

There are many police officers that would have handled the situation correctly. A manner that would never have made the news, and would have seen the kid home for dinner rather than in a morgue. There are many people who wouldn't have called the police at all and taken care of the situation themselves. Such are the people who should be police officers, if we are to have them. People who would shoot the kid (or adult if he was an adult) in a situation like this, or someone who would justify it are exactly the kind of people a rational intelligent free person does not want on the police.

[Valsuelm]

I don't understand why you should recieve any special consideration because you are a cop. If anything they should be held to a higher standard. Lots of temptation and opportunity to misuse the power you are given. 

 

For well over the first 100 years of the history of the U.S., they did not receive special treatment. By and large though they are above the law now, as the result of near 100 years of propaganda in the media (especially the last 50 years), and corruption.

[Drowsy Emperor]

How many of you could really tell whether this is real or a toy?  And remember you're seeing this up close and not at a distance.

 

 

The police told the kid to raise his hands and the kid's reaction was to pull a fairly realistic replica gun from his waistband.     

 

 

 

It was a 12 year old kid doing the sort of stupid things 12 year old kids do. He did not even point the gun at the police or threaten them.

 

 

Oh but he was only 12 years old?  Tell that to Michael Landsberry ......

 

http://www.nydailynews.com/news/national/cops-id-12-year-old-gunman-sparks-middle-school-shooting-nevada-article-1.1496283

 

Common sense dictates that you can't follow the same protocol for a child as you would for a gangbanger if you want to have a sane society in the future. Else everyone ends up living in fear or everyone else and their children.

 

The first mistake was to order him to put his hands up as if they're dealing with a responsible adult instead of approaching the situation in a more casual, diplomatic manner.

 

A case of a kid shooting up someone, intentionally or unintentionally, happens once in a while. As do a ton of other freak accidents. The greatest majority of children, far more so than adults, will never do such a thing. But they will do irresponsible things like what happened here and it is the responsibility of the adults to sort that mess out, not to add to it.

Edited November 24, 2014 by Drowsy Emperor

[Valsuelm]

 

Common sense dictates that you can't follow the same protocol for a child as you would for a gangbanger if you want to have a sane society in the future. Else everyone ends up living in fear or everyone else and their children.

 

The first mistake was to order him to put his hands up as if they're dealing with a responsible adult instead of approaching the situation in a more casual, diplomatic manner.

 

A case of a kid shooting up someone, intentionally or unintentionally, happens once in a while. As do a ton of other freak accidents. The greatest majority of children, far more so than adults, will never do such a thing. But they will do irresponsible things like what happened here and it is the responsibility of the adults to sort that mess out, not to add to it.

 

 

There's nothing common about 'common sense'.

 

That said, I generally agree with your sentiment. However, I'd say that the insane society is already here, and a great many people already do live in fear of everyone else.

 

For a little evidence to this in just this matter reference all the people who would justify shooting the kid, the guy who called 911 in the first place, or the cop who immediately escalated the situation by telling the kid to put his hands in the air (the police department themselves said the kid was not confrontational, but they themselves were), the fact that one of the cops shot and killed the kid, and last but not least the yet to be determined for certain but very likely lack of charges against the cop who killed the kid as that's par for the course in situations such as these (and Cleveland has a history of police corruption and a lack of prosecuting murder and other crimes committed by the police).

Edited November 24, 2014 by Valsuelm