Ingame Reactions to Death Godlike

[Fluffle]

Hey everybody,

 

pondering over what PC I'd like to play as I rediscovered the Godlike.

At the moment I favor the Death Godlike.

 

However I fear they might be unplayable for me for rpg-reasons.

 

As in update #72 many people pointed out that they look so different

in a bizarre way, that they wonder how people in Eora react and treat them.

 

On the PoE wiki it says:

"Death Godlike are commonly killed at birth because many cultures consider them harbingers of doom."

 

So if I play Death Godlike, should I not be shunned by almost every NPC I come across?

Wouldn't the game be unplayble actually?

 

I fear that this might turn out as in Dragon Age - especially Dragon Age 2 when you play as a Blood Mage and you openly

practice blood magic and run around Kirkwall and almost nobody seems to notice or react as you would expect.

 

[Nonek]

I assume you'll be treated like a Witcher, spat upon and reviled but made use of when needed. I'd fully expect to be reviled and not considered suitable for polite society, but used when the unnatural rears its ugly head. A monster to kill a monster?

[gamerdude130]

I think it would be cool if some NPC out in the wilds would just attack you for being a death godlike.

[eimatshya]

Hopefully it will be more like being a half orc in Arcanum. That is, many people will react negatively to meeting you, but you can convince them to give you a chance. This makes the game playable, while still showing that your choice of character type matters to the game.

Edited August 2, 2014 by eimatshya

[Orogun01]

Hopefully it will be more like being a half orc in Arcanum. That is, many people will react negatively to meeting you, but you can convince them to give you a chance. This makes the game playable, while still showing that your choice of character type matters to the game.

Nah, too complicated. Better just wear a hood

[ManifestedISO]

Death godlike paladin will be my first play-through. I expect NPC resistance, but more because of his master plan to obliterate and supplant the Aedyr Empire. And cat-druids.  

[Ztirual]

On the PoE wiki it says:

"Death Godlike are commonly killed at birth because many cultures consider them harbingers of doom."

 

So if I play Death Godlike, should I not be shunned by almost every NPC I come across?

Wouldn't the game be unplayble actually?

Well, that does seem to be a matter of definition and self-expectation. A common belief is a popular thought that is, not necessarily factual or false, being created, passed on, or adhered to by individuals that form groups or collectives based on similar ideas for similar or various purposes. Now, if the common belief in Eora is that Death Godlikes should be killed at birth, does that also mean that nearly every NPC is going to have or act upon that specific belief, even if the culture is common to them? No. Because some NPCs are not many NPCs, and many NPCs are not all NPCs, and all NPCs are not some or many, but the whole, regardless of culture or belief; so, some or many might have that belief within their particular culture, but that doesn't mean that all act upon it, or even have it, whereas some or many who might not have that belief - or even know about it at all - could still act in the same manner as the culture or the belief demand, without having it. So, is it not to say then that the game is actually going to be heavily unpredictable, and therefore, not really unplayable - as how you respond with the action or reaction of others means that you are going to find out whether they shun you or not, whether they openly express it or not? I could be wrong, but to me, that doesn't seem as something unplayable, but rather as something that adds tremendous playability.

[Fluffle]

I admit that the statement "Death Godlike are commonly killed at birth because many cultures consider them harbingers of doom."

and the looks of the Death Godlike made me expect a certain behaviour of NPCs towards them.

 

My first example was that how people of Thedas in Dragon Age react to Blood Mages.

My second example would be that if it was possible to play let's say Baldur's Gate as a Drow.

 

I guess people in Eora do not necessarily *have to* act towards Death Godlike like people in the other

worlds react to Drow or Blood Mages respectively.

 

But that statement above made me expect that actually.

Edited August 2, 2014 by Fluffle

[Sensuki]

I'm sure followers of Berath will love you.

[Death Machine Miyagi]

I admit that the statement "Death Godlike are commonly killed at birth because many cultures consider them harbingers of doom."

and the looks of the Death Godlike made me expect a certain behaviour of NPCs towards them.

 

My first example was that how people of Thedas in Dragon Age react to Blood Mages.

My second example would be that if it was possible to play let's say Baldur's Gate as a Drow.

 

I guess people in Eora do not necessarily *have to* act towards Death Godlike like people in the other

worlds react to Drow or Blood Mages respectively.

 

But that statement above made me expect that actually.

 

You couldn't really play a Drow in BG2. You could play an Elf with Drow skin color, but no one would ever react to it.

 

You could play a Drow in Obsidian's own Neverwinter Nights 2, though. I didn't get very far playing one, but on the whole, from what I saw the impact this had on the game was minimal. A few dialogues were changed, but in order to properly convey the response most Forgotten Realms surface worlders would have to running into a Drow they'd have had to write special dialogue and behavior for just about everyone in the game. Same would go for playing a Duergar or a Tiefling or any other notoriously exotic and/or malevolent race. I applaud them for the dialogue they did change, as it would have been all too easy to simply ignore it.

 

I can't say I'm extremely optimistic about reactions changing dramatically if you play a Death Godlike, but one of the things I like about Obsidian is they've shown on several occasion a love for putting in exactly that kind of reactivity when they have the time. I doubt it will come up in every conversation, but I'm certain it won't be completely ignored like the Dragon Age Blood Mage example you cite.

[Zallgrin]

I expect the Death Godlike to be hated by many, but also feared. If you are a farmer and a group of armed mercenaries walks in with a Death Godlike as a leader... nobody is going to threaten the protagonist. Complain, maybe. Curse you behind his breath. But open hostility will be fairly rare. (Besides, if you are possibly useful, people won't give a **** what you look like.)

 

I did have a question of my own though:

 

If I have a Death Godlike priest, will my companions comment on the choice of my deity? Nothing elaborate, but I would think a Death Godlike that worships Beran, god of death and cycles, or Eothas, the dead god of compassion, would invite a discussion why you chose this specific deity as your patron.

[Sonntam]

To be honest, if I came across an abomination of nature like Death Godlike, I would politely smile and act as if nothing unusual is happening. Especially if that Death Godlike is backed by five armed to teeth companions. 

 

I think people of Eora are superstitious, not suicidal. It's one thing to kill a baby and other thing to try to pull the same number with a full grown Death Godlike. 

[Ztirual]

All in all, this has alot to do with the unpredictability of knowing how people are going to respond to the PC. We can predict - and by that I mean approximate - to a certain extent how we think people are going to react, but we can never pinpoint the exact nature of their reaction before it has acted - can you tell by looking at someones face if they think you are a wonderful or an ugly person? -, till then it is only an assumption, a speculation, but even so, it is not a certainty that our approximation or assertation of that person will be correct or true according to whatever it is we expect to find.

So, some people in Eora can and most presumably are going to dislike or even hate Godlikes, be they Death or the other, and on the other hand, some people can and are also most presumably to have developed a fetish, a like, or a strong attachment to them. But the thing is, there are so many ways and variables that affect how an encounter could or will turn out, that we cannot really predict its end result before it takes place; you could during a certain encounter act in what is supposedly judged as 'good' ways or be talking, as a Death Godlike, in this instance, to someone who absolutely loathes that kind, but with the effect of your 'good' actions and then during the conversation, it could show that the Godlike is actually of quite a benevolent or sane nature - Death isn't something evil, just something that is prone to bring fear when not understood - and, therefore, change the view and thus the expected outcome - if there was an expectation, that is - and, therefore, change the common belief. Though, the outcome could also not be changed at all, and certainly, it could in fact turn out completely the other way and end very fatally, even if you acted with benevolence or kindness.

My point is that interactions between mentalities cannot be predicted to such an extent that it is going to follow our expectations, as there is an infinite number of factors and variables between the here now and the future, and trying to make something that is unpredictable within something that only works on predictions is really hard to do - impossible, in fact - that being the computer and the game mechanics itself. Which, I stated earlier, means that if you play as a Death Godlike, you can expect there to be challenges in how people react, but, simulationally, there is on the other an 'infinite' variable that you cannot expect, you can only really find out about it in the moment it happens. So, I guess it also comes down to how the player also plays the game - if there is the prediction making of "metagaming" or the expectation making of "roleplaying", which is really only for the player who plays the game to decide upon.

[Blarghagh]

Here's a thought - you guys think these reactions might be fairly accurately done by giving Death Godlikes starting points in whatever "evil" reputations?

[bronzepoem]

I admit that the statement "Death Godlike are commonly killed at birth because many cultures consider them harbingers of doom."

and the looks of the Death Godlike made me expect a certain behaviour of NPCs towards them.

 

My first example was that how people of Thedas in Dragon Age react to Blood Mages.

My second example would be that if it was possible to play let's say Baldur's Gate as a Drow.

 

I guess people in Eora do not necessarily *have to* act towards Death Godlike like people in the other

worlds react to Drow or Blood Mages respectively.

 

But that statement above made me expect that actually.

The reaction to Blood Mages in DA was crap. Even Wayne could become blood mage.

[Sensuki]

Here's a thought - you guys think these reactions might be fairly accurately done by giving Death Godlikes starting points in whatever "evil" reputations?

Nope. There are no evil reputations either.

[Ztirual]

 

Here's a thought - you guys think these reactions might be fairly accurately done by giving Death Godlikes starting points in whatever "evil" reputations?

That's presuming death is evil in the first place? And if it is, why? What exactly is evil? If you ask me, I don't consider things as good or evil at all, but then again, others might not reason as I, so... In my view, it is not accurate to give Death either evil or good points since life doesn't fit into such ideas.

[Blarghagh]

 

Here's a thought - you guys think these reactions might be fairly accurately done by giving Death Godlikes starting points in whatever "evil" reputations?

Nope. There are no evil reputations either.

 

 

Yes, that's why "evil" is in quotes, obviously. Those were not random keystrokes, if I had wanted to say simply evil I would have done so.

 

I meant reputation factors that people generally associate with the concept of evil. The cruel and deceptive dispositions come to mind, except instead of earning them people just assume they exist and they respond to you as if you were cruel and deceptive. Starting points in those dispositions could make a death godlike feel more in character without having to add a large amount of custom dialogue for this race, and would also simulate how hard it is to get out of prejudice by making it much harder to get a better reputation.

 

I'm not advocating this idea be implemented as I have no idea in what way responses to the cruel and deceptive dispositions come to fruition in the game or exactly how death godlikes are treated, but I felt the idea was interesting and I was hoping for something of a more in depth response than the utterly lame out of hand dismissal of "nope".

 

 

 

 

Here's a thought - you guys think these reactions might be fairly accurately done by giving Death Godlikes starting points in whatever "evil" reputations?

That's presuming death is evil in the first place? And if it is, why? What exactly is evil? If you ask me, I don't consider things as good or evil at all, but then again, others might not reason as I, so... In my view, it is not accurate to give Death either evil or good points since life doesn't fit into such ideas.

 

 

I'm not saying death is evil in the first place. It was said that death godlikes were prejudiced against as being evil or harbingers of doom, not that they were evil by default. They're not getting evil points as there is no binary good and evil system in Pillars of Eternity. They would be getting points in reputations (reputation being how others perceive you) that are associated with the concept evil because of how prejudiced people are against them. The starting points would indicate that they, being death godlikes, are automatically seen by the populace as being cruel and deceptive even though they're not. Essentially a form of racism.

 

This would counteract the problem given earlier in the thread such as how in Neverwinter Nights 2 you could play a drow or a tiefling and it had zero bearing on how people responded to you beyond the occassional dialogue blurb.

Edited August 2, 2014 by TrueNeutral
slight changes

[Fluffle]

 

I admit that the statement "Death Godlike are commonly killed at birth because many cultures consider them harbingers of doom."

and the looks of the Death Godlike made me expect a certain behaviour of NPCs towards them.

 

My first example was that how people of Thedas in Dragon Age react to Blood Mages.

My second example would be that if it was possible to play let's say Baldur's Gate as a Drow.

 

I guess people in Eora do not necessarily *have to* act towards Death Godlike like people in the other

worlds react to Drow or Blood Mages respectively.

 

But that statement above made me expect that actually.

The reaction to Blood Mages in DA was crap. Even Wayne could become blood mage.

 

 

Heh that's my fear.

 

The Dragon Age setting defines that people are scared by Blood Mages and would really freak out if they encountered one.

Yet do you really experience that when you play as a Blood Mage?

Maybe sometimes you do but not as much and as strong as you were let to believe.

 

And the same applies to playing as a Drow in Neverwinter Nights 2.

The Forgotten Realms setting defines how people of Faerun usually react to Drow.

You may see a few lines about you being Drow in Nwn2 but not as much as you would expect.

 

So my fear is that the same happens to the Death Godlike.

[Nonek]

Torment with a minimum charisma Nameless One played quite well in terms of emphasising ones shocking appearance, it really is a shame that most players max charisma and the other mental stats rather than going for a balanced build. The conversations with passers by on the streets were piceless, and usually ended with you slaughtering them or their backing away watchfully with a knife drawn.

 

Then again I expect that certain folk might well treat one as an almost angelic presence amongst them, depending on their faith or personal bias.

[Fluffle]

Torment is a good example of how it can be done properly.

 

Yes I am one of those who max charisma, but even though I encountered people who were taken aback by TNO's appearance.

[Nonek]

The problem is there are so many variations of characters to design for (it would be impossible if voice acted I imagine,) perhaps one could fudge it somewhat by always picking the aggressive or intimidating dialogue options, and thus get a reputation as a dour, dangerous individual to be wary of. Perhaps the Death Godlike gets a bonus to these mannerisms initially? It's an interesting question.

[Karkarov]

I don't know about you guys but my first playthough is going to be a death godlike in big head mode.  The lulz train can't be stopped.

[Fluffle]

I'd actually like to play a Death Godlike who is kind and benevolent.

 

You may call it the typical good Drow syndrome.

(That was a syndrome on some persistent NWN2 worlds where a lot of people wanted to play a good Drow because they wanted to be as unique as Drizzt which ended up

with A LOT of good Drow and everyone emphasizing how exceptional and rare they were. Lol that was fun.)

 

So I'd like almost everyone to be freaked out by my Death Godlike PC but time after time they learn that he's good and kind.

 

It's a cliché of a misunderstood underdog I know, can't help it ^^

[Nonek]

Crunchy on the outside, fluffy in the middle?

 

Sorry.