Fear of women body in modern videogames

[Drowsy Emperor]

The only result of the whole anti-objectification campaign can be observed on the new Tomb raider. They made her boobs smaller but her ass is still porn-star perfect. The moisture effects on her thighs would make Jenna Jameson green with envy.

 

Talk about winning a battle only to lose the war.

 

They also made her strong because strength of character now means killing people who want to do bad things to you in a gruesome fashion.

 

To quote the good Volo: R00fles

Edited June 7, 2013 by Drowsy Emperor

[Drowsy Emperor]

 

Surely it would be far more pertinent to observe that in almost every mainstream game I can think of women are PRECISELY equal to men in terms of game stats. That's a pretty positive thing, I'd have thought.

 

 

Is it? Or is it just enforced political correctness? In a typical scenario, without drugs, strength and muscle gains are much slower in women - and the realistic strength maximum is lower. That's one typical stat that should never be equal. but is because the alternative would make for a PR disaster. 

 

There's a reason females don't compete in full contact martial sports with men and while some are culture related the fact is that they simply can't be competitive in the same weight categories.

 

Of course, I'm all for willfully ignoring this facet of reality in a computer game- but the very notion that the games industry is sexist and mysogynistc is a myth. 

Edited June 7, 2013 by Drowsy Emperor

[obyknven]

It's best Vampire from videogames. Look so strong, creepy and sexy at the same time.  How someone can don't like such beauty? 

 

[Keyrock]

The fact that this thread has been allowed to go on for SEVEN WHOLE PAGES

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

without a picture of Morrigan from Darkstalkers is a TRAVESTY!  I cannot allow this to continue.

 

[Drowsy Emperor]

Is this also Vannilaware's work?

 

Its not as if their art style changed over the years anyway. Where were these idiot journalists when Grim Grimoire and Odin's Sphere were made years ago? 

 

Another fun fact. The leading characters in both their games are non-exaggerated female characters.

 

I finished both of those games. Of course I couldn't enjoy them because I couldn't play a male.

 

I WANT A REFUND 

Edited June 7, 2013 by Drowsy Emperor

[Malcador]

I suppose the slide into NSFW will at least slay this beast.

[Keyrock]

I suppose the slide into NSFW will at least slay this beast.

Slide into NSFW?  We've been bordering on that territory since the OP.

[Hurlshort]

That vampire harpy barely looks human, let alone female.  

[DeathQuaker]

I like boobies. I enjoy them immensely. I got a whole huge book of pulp art 'cause of that. But I also like the nice warrior ladies looking like they can actually take a hit because they're dressed appropriately.

 

Every female character everywhere should not have to look like a very specific kind of masturbation fantasy fetish. NOR SHOULD every female character everywhere have to be dressed in muu muus. I think it would be nice to get away from extremes.

 

Generally, I trust game designers to choose the art style that is best for their project. That's it.

 

And frankly, I think of all the pictures the OP posted, the only one that looked attractive or sexy to me was the Project Eternity picture. All the other example art looked like monstrously ugly caricatures. I think the human female figure is gloriously beautiful, but none of his example images looked very natural or human at all, in my personal opinion. I feel very sad if that's what the OP thinks women really look like, or should, when there's so many beautiful women in the world (and they don't have to prance around in a thong all the time to prove it)--but they definitely don't look like the freaky alien examples.

 

(And yes, I know I have an Annah avatar. But while I adore the character because of how she was written, I've actually always hated her character design. She looks like she's got water balloons stapled to her chest in lieu of real, properly proportioned, soft, beautiful breasts; and everything comes off at weird angles; and how the hell does she pee when she's wearing that outfit?)

 

But yes, I know because I'm suggesting there might be room in the world for more modest designs AS WELL AS more risque ones, yes, I am a terrible evil puritan who is oppressing you horribly and torturing you and beating you and destroying the world and the world is ending because you just don't have enough boobs to look at. Poor, poor, pitiful you and the hardships you must endure. Honey, you're on the Internet. If you want to look at boobs, you have ample opportunity that will not go away ANY time soon.

Edited June 7, 2013 by DeathQuaker

[Keyrock]

DeathQuaker, you're making sense.  I'm not sure that's allowed in this thread.

[Chilloutman]

wait.. you want to tell me that these monstrously overgrown anime mamalities arent real?

[BruceVC]

That vampire harpy barely looks human, let alone female.  

 

I often admire your ability to make a succinct, sobering and accurate point

 

I haven't quite acquired that skill yet

[Katphood]

You should all play Lollipop Chainsaw: 

 

[Chaz]

I am for equal rights for everyone

 

BUT

 

if 90% of backers are man (my guess) , I dont see why 50% of game should be focused around what womens (and White Knights) want.

But I am ok if there will be no boobs around, we still have internets for porn right?

 

 

 

Bingo, but then again many people in gaming have been chastised and now think that if you like boobs you'r immature, including some developers. I prefer to trust the developers, if they want to go with a completely sexless, sterile art style, that's their prerogative. But don't you people start bitching when another dragon crown comes along, don't start with that misogyny bs argument, or sexism nonsense, nobody becomes sexist because they played video games, wake up!

[Keyrock]

 

You should all play Lollipop Chainsaw: 

 

 

 

No, not really.  It's a mediocre game that happens to have a sex kitten with a chainsaw as the main character.

[DungeonKeeps]

Awesome thread.

 

We'll have one hand grabbing our _ _ _ _ while the other hand reaches the tissue for the final ooOOooohhhh!

 

 

[LadyCrimson]

Back on topic, LadyCrimson, what's your attitude toward assless chaps? That one is sort of unisex, works on both genders.

I like real cowboy chaps with no pants/leggings underneath - stuff that simply looks like tight pants with the butt area removed, not so much. The former are da awesome tho!

[alanschu]

 

 

Can't wait for alanschu to take a crack at his post though

 

I'm not sure what to think of this... hahahaha.

 

 

 

 

To find a post like this from the only poster on this forum to have been absolutely infatuated with a game character, to the point of it becoming slightly creepy for the rest of us, is a bit funny. There are obviously female fantasies in games already, the difference is that different things get our respective juices flowing. We like boobs, you like.. berets.

 

The only poster to express it.  For myself, I don't see the big deal (nor did I find it creepy - I thought she was just having fun), nor do I have any issue with her talking up Boone a lot, yet still have an opinion on the matter.

 

 

 

 

And I love how women are always going "they need to make [insert current object of political correctness here] because they did blah blah". No. No, they don't have to make anything. When 50% of developers are female, you can do whatever fantasies you want. Until then, male fantasies will be dominant, of the simple rteason that men are dominant in the industry. It always amazes me, the amount of entitlement females feel in every aspect of life.

 

I don't think the 50% split is as necessary as a fixed line, although I agree that some level of demand is necessary.  However, the depiction of women in video games is not an issue that is solely put forth by women (or even "White Knights").

 

 

 

 

It's like in Sweden, one of the most gender equal societies in the world, where women for some reason believe they automatically have the right to 50% of everything. An example: we (a bunch of bored guys) started a football club a lot of years ago, out of interest for the sport. We built a football field, we arranged for people to come to practice, we built an organization, we even managed to build an indoor hall for the winter season after many years. We never excluded women, but noone was intertested in joining us. A decade ago, women suddenly realized they can play football too. What do they do? Do they make the same journey as us, building everything from the ground up? No. They demand to have 50% of the practice time slots on the field we built. They want 50% of the economy we've accrued. They want 50% of everything we worked for for 30+ years. Because they're women. The best part? They got it because of Swedish equality laws.

 

You have a few posts discussing this, including one where you admit that the project received government funding.

 

 

 

 

Granted, in Sweden you get aid from the government for projects like this (so technically both men and women paid for it), but the work was done by us.

 

This reminds me of a time when I, someone that loved basketball, grabbed a snow shovel for a few lunch breaks at school to clear off the outdoor basketball courts.  I, in my foolishness, felt that this would give me some alone time with the hoop.  Unsurprisingly, when people saw me shooting around, suddenly more people wanted to take part.  I was pissed.  With some maturity and hindsight, I also realize that I was wrong.  I had no entitlement to exclusive access to the court, reflected in my protestations falling on deaf ears (between teachers and peers).

 

Looking back, I realize I was naive.  I didn't actually understand the consequences for my actions.  Doubly so as it was a public school.  To my point, your facility has received public funds, and by the sounds of it is even a somewhat public facility in general (the government funded hall).  That you guys built it 30+ years ago leads me to, quite frankly, simply say "So?"

 

You state that you didn't deny women access.  Did you deny other people from making their own clubs?  Because for myself, that'd be the issue.  If it's in large part a public facility built with public dollars, and I do feel that anyone should be able to create their own club and apply for membership.  Now, Sweden saying "50% of it must be for this women's club is probably a bit off."  Assuming it was partitioned based on sizes of the clubs, I'd be less averse to Sweden saying "Each club should get proportional access."

 

 

 

 

Anyhow, the entire point of this example of Swedish insanity was: instead of demanding boobs to be removed and every game having equal parts male and female fantasies, do something yourself. Don't just demand things from others, contribute yourselves. Make the games you enjoy instead of demanding they change the games others may enjoy.

 

My point in illustrating my basketball story is that you need to understand the context by which you are making your decisions.  First, what you did 30+ years ago, in an initiative that you give the impression of being some sort of "good for the community" type of feel, your position mostly just comes across as selfish.  "We built this 30+ years ago, and therefore our club should maintain exclusive access for this facility, even though we didn't exclusively finance this initiative."

 

 

Looking back at my basketball experience, I would still shovel off the court if I could go back today.  I'd just understand that I shouldn't do it if I'm only interested in my own benefit.  I can look back now and go "What I did was probably a net positive for the school in general."  Or, I could continue to get pissy about it and feel that people took advantage of me, when in reality, I put myself in a position to be taken advantage of by being naive.  Granted, your naivety was probably more justified, as the idea that competing clubs may, 20+ years down the line, also want to have access to the facility.  But I am not getting the impression that your club *should* be legally entitled to exclusive access, based on public funding.  I suppose it would come down to "what level of public funding?"

 

 

As for the "go make it yourself," this is a pointless endeavour.  All people saying is "I will find games more appealing if you change some decisions."  From a purely utilitarian perspective, they're just saying "we're a market for your games, should you decide to pursue it more."  And it's not a position held exclusively by women (or "white knights") either.  It's more a reflection of games pushing for economies of scale, and the fact that there's been HUGE pushes to break down gender barriers for typically more masculine jobs in a lot of places (BioWare does a lot of initiatives for getting women in Math/Engineering/Sciences as well, and never mind "geek girls" are becoming more and more common IMO - or at least more public).

 

As for "go make it yourself," I suppose I could counter that your football club could consider going and making their own new pitch, exclusive of any government funding, if you truly wanted exclusive access.  But then, I don't know enough about Sweden's laws to know if it'd even be possible to do such a thing.  I don't think "go make it yourself" is a truly beneficial perspective, but at the same time, I suppose I can at least say "I am."

[Walsingham]

If it's possible to derive some real value from this thread, is anyone up for extracting/analysing the predominant themes in the viewpoints made so far?

[Malcador]

If it's possible to derive some real value from this thread, is anyone up for extracting/analysing the predominant themes in the viewpoints made so far?

Gaming needs women, so the games should be more welcoming to them.

 

Or something like that.

[alanschu]

If it's possible to derive some real value from this thread, is anyone up for extracting/analysing the predominant themes in the viewpoints made so far?

 

Are you saying you'd like to discuss them (I am), or are you asking for an explanation?

[PK htiw klaw eriF]

If it's possible to derive some real value from this thread, is anyone up for extracting/analysing the predominant themes in the viewpoints made so far?

Relevant Information in this thread:

1)Oby wants more tittays in vidya gaem, he also bitches about Westerners

2)alanshu doesn't want vidya gaem wimminz to look like they're about to shoot a porn

3)mkreku want dem wimminz off the football field the local village boys built(while being bankrolled by the government)

4)LadyCrimson and Keyrock want to institute a new dress code

[Zoraptor]

 

To find a post like this from the only poster on this forum to have been absolutely infatuated with a game character, to the point of it becoming slightly creepy for the rest of us, is a bit funny. There are obviously female fantasies in games already, the difference is that different things get our respective juices flowing. We like boobs, you like.. berets.

 

The only poster to express it.  For myself, I don't see the big deal (nor did I find it creepy - I thought she was just having fun), nor do I have any issue with her talking up Boone a lot, yet still have an opinion on the matter.

Yeah, the express it part is the big thing.

 

I've always had a bit of a thing for Shodan* personally, and could probably write a dissertation on her to make any Talimancer blush.

 

*I like my pathetic creature of meat and bone to run panting and sweating through her corridors and I'm not afraid to say it, though I will use little letters.

[Walsingham]

 

If it's possible to derive some real value from this thread, is anyone up for extracting/analysing the predominant themes in the viewpoints made so far?

Relevant Information in this thread:

1)Oby wants more tittays in vidya gaem, he also bitches about Westerners

2)alanshu doesn't want vidya gaem wimminz to look like they're about to shoot a porn

3)mkreku want dem wimminz off the football field the local village boys built(while being bankrolled by the government)

4)LadyCrimson and Keyrock want to institute a new dress code

 

 

That's kinda what I'm talking about. I mean this can't really drag on much longer. Hopefully something must be distillable from the smush.

[PK htiw klaw eriF]

That's kinda what I'm talking about. I mean this can't really drag on much longer. Hopefully something must be distillable from the smush.

Well, I found out about a B-movie featuring Sean Connery that I intend to watch so it wasn't a complete waste.