What's going on in Boston?

[Drowsy Emperor]

Drowsy, what connection are you making exactly?  These two men would have been children at the time of that event.  Apparently the older brother actually attended School Number One, but they left the country a year before that happened.

 

The uncle has been interviewed, and it was refreshing to hear him call his nephews losers that have disgraced the family.  Usually the family is pretty quiet about this stuff.

 

I agree this seems less political or religious and more a horrific act committed by two boys who felt like outsiders.

 

Malcador explained it.

 

And if you think there is no religious component in this you're mad. Chechens are among the most fanatical muslims in the world. 

[Malcador]

Lovely, their aunt is in my city.  Claiming they're innocent and this all a sham.  Maybe so, for the bombing. But for the robbery, murder of the officer and throwing bombs around..not so much. 

 

Oh and the obligatory conspiracy stuff if one is interested - https://images.4chan.org/b/src/1366284427802.jpg

[BruceVC]

Ah so the same people that the US financed and helped train to kill Russian soldiers and civilians are now killing US civilians.

 

History indeed, has a sense of irony.

 

 

Drowsy I am concerned that your understanding of the conflict in Chechnya, Beslan and the USA involvement is incorrect

 

Can you explain why you think the USA funded the Checknyan extremists in any respect?

[Drowsy Emperor]

 

Ah so the same people that the US financed and helped train to kill Russian soldiers and civilians are now killing US civilians.

 

History indeed, has a sense of irony.

 

 

Drowsy I am concerned that your understanding of the conflict in Chechnya, Beslan and the USA involvement is incorrect

 

Can you explain why you think the USA funded the Checknyan extremists in any respect?

 

The emergence of Islamic groups in adjacent regions of North Caucasus based on the Chechen model and their support from Chechnya to break from Russia led to the indirect involvement of the US and its allies. The latter’s involvement was covert but US was directly involved. In 1998 the US was exerting pressure on Geidar Aliyev who usurped power in Azerbaijan to accept the US proposed oil pipeline from the Caspian Sea to Turkey, bypassing Russia. At the time Aliyev was still dependent on Moscow and was reluctant to give in to US demands. There is evidence to suggest that Aliyev, backed by the US, actively aided Chechen militias to battle Russian forces in Dagestan. The motive was to eliminate the existing oil route through Russia which was severely damaged in the 1999 military activities in Dagestan. The American project succeeded; today the Baku-Ceyhan pipeline pumps oil out of the Caspian bypassing Russia, but economically drains the Azerbaijan Republic.

 

And more:

 

 

Although President Vladimir Putin and top Russian security officials provided evidence of links between Chechen fighters and Al-Qaeda, European politicians and mainstream Western journalists focused instead upon the Russian army's brutality and dismissed Putin's claims as an attempt to gain sympathy in the West and deflect criticism of Russia's handling of a nationalist insurgency.

Putin may have been opportunistic, but he was also correct. A close examination of the evolution of the Chechen movement indicates that Islamists and followers of Al-Qaeda have increasingly sought to co-opt the Chechen movement as their own.

 

Not to mention open propaganda support (TIME magazine covers and all).

[Calax]

Source?

 

 

Because I can too, put random things into quotations

[alanschu]

Lovely, their aunt is in my city.  Claiming they're innocent and this all a sham.  Maybe so, for the bombing. But for the robbery, murder of the officer and throwing bombs around..not so much. 

 

Oh and the obligatory conspiracy stuff if one is interested - https://images.4chan.org/b/src/1366284427802.jpg

 

 

I haven't been following too closely, but is the shooting of the MIT security officer related then?

 

 

EDIT:  After reading this thread (which includes clicking on posts from people that I have ignored), it should be noted that there are posters in this thread that have, on this board historically, pretty much demonstrated that they are anti-Islam and willing to make excuses and exceptions for any circumstances that undermines their hateful dogma.

 

At this point, I'm just going to provide a link to my previous rant since I'm already pretty certain that there's no point discussing this topic further without making me wish that I continued on my research instead.

 

I'm out of this thread.

 

P.S. Though my rant provides a quote from an individual, Mr. Bruce, I just want to make it clear that I have no issues with Bruce and feel that, in general, he's perhaps an overly cheerful chap by which much of the world would probably benefit from by emulating.  Just wanted to make that clear.

Edited April 19, 2013 by alanschu

[BruceVC]

 

Source?

 

 

Because I can too, put random things into quotations

 

I agree, I have never ever heard of that before so Drowsy please post some credible links discussing the USA supporting Chechen rebels in there war agaisnt Russia

[Malcador]

Not that unbelievable though, Afghanistan, Libya, soon to be Syria.  Also, emulating overly cheerful people is a dreadful idea.

 

As for this guy, I get the sense he's given them the slip.  Feel sorry for the people in Watertown and Boston, they're kind of locked down in their homes for the next couple of days potentially.

Edited April 19, 2013 by Malcador

[Amentep]

 

 

 

Ah so the same people that the US financed and helped train to kill Russian soldiers and civilians are now killing US civilians.
 
History indeed, has a sense of irony.

 
 
Drowsy I am concerned that your understanding of the conflict in Chechnya, Beslan and the USA involvement is incorrect
 
Can you explain why you think the USA funded the Checknyan extremists in any respect?

 

The emergence of Islamic groups in adjacent regions of North Caucasus based on the Chechen model and their support from Chechnya to break from Russia led to the indirect involvement of the US and its allies. The latter’s involvement was covert but US was directly involved. In 1998 the US was exerting pressure on Geidar Aliyev who usurped power in Azerbaijan to accept the US proposed oil pipeline from the Caspian Sea to Turkey, bypassing Russia. At the time Aliyev was still dependent on Moscow and was reluctant to give in to US demands. There is evidence to suggest that Aliyev, backed by the US, actively aided Chechen militias to battle Russian forces in Dagestan. The motive was to eliminate the existing oil route through Russia which was severely damaged in the 1999 military activities in Dagestan. The American project succeeded; today the Baku-Ceyhan pipeline pumps oil out of the Caspian bypassing Russia, but economically drains the Azerbaijan Republic.

 
And more:
 

 
Although President Vladimir Putin and top Russian security officials provided evidence of links between Chechen fighters and Al-Qaeda, European politicians and mainstream Western journalists focused instead upon the Russian army's brutality and dismissed Putin's claims as an attempt to gain sympathy in the West and deflect criticism of Russia's handling of a nationalist insurgency.
Putin may have been opportunistic, but he was also correct. A close examination of the evolution of the Chechen movement indicates that Islamists and followers of Al-Qaeda have increasingly sought to co-opt the Chechen movement as their own.

 
Not to mention open propaganda support (TIME magazine covers and all).
 

 

 
Source?
 
 

Because I can too, put random things into quotations

 

The first one is, I believe, from The Crescent International Magazine, the second appears to be from The Middle East Quarterly.

 

I'm not terribly familiar with either, so can't say what kind of sources they (or, the authors articles) are / have

Edited April 19, 2013 by Amentep

[obyknven]

Russian member of spetznas wondering how unprofessional SWAT are.

 

http://hardingush.livejournal.com/73169.html

Amazingly, the FBI SWAT acts as if they are at all involved in the raid for the first time. Nobody covers, no one controls the sector.  Oops, closed! Wander around, looked around the corner. They don't knows what to do here ... It is clear that they do not expect that from the next house will be opened firing on them. Of course they are not thinking about trying to deblocking the house.  We do not know what to do. We are a crowd of armed men dressed in beautiful shape and bulletproof vests.

 

http://youtu.be/dhUQ5ONxYFc

[LadyCrimson]

I haven't been following too closely, but is the shooting of the MIT security officer related then?

Just to answer your question .... yes, it is.

 

The timeline supposedly goes something like this:

 

--assumption that suspects went into a panic after FBI released photos of them

--they rob a 7-11 near MIT

--they encounter MIT police officer and during encounter shoot him

--they carjack a Mercedes SUV and later released the driver (or driver managed to escape)

--Police search for/follow SUV to Watertown

--gunfight in Watertown with 1 suspect wounded, other manages to flee.

[Malcador]

Robbery of the 7-11 wasn't them apparently https://twitter.com/karenreports/status/325340619667034112

[HoonDing]

This manhunt is even more exorbitant than the one in LA with the rogue cop.

 

Good thing the people are staying inside to prevent collateral from trigger happy 'law' enforcement.

[LadyCrimson]

Robbery of the 7-11 wasn't them apparently https://twitter.com/karenreports/status/325340619667034112

Ah, ok. Guess the "comedians" on Twitter will have to stop making those Slurpee jokes.

 

I've only been checking in now and then, but I'm probably still paying more attention than I might normally. A lot of Red Sox twitter peeps from Boston area in my timeline, freaking out. Just wish it was over.

[rjshae]

Watching the news yesterday was a bit like seeing fog of war in action. They couldn't wait to contradict their own announcements from five minutes previously. It's just sad to watch them mindlessly at work.

[Hurlshort]

What is wrong with some of you? This isnt a movie, there are law enforcement people putting their lives in jeopardy to stop those two violent psychopaths. If you think you can do a better job, go join the police academy and stop looking like a total a-hole.

 

These two brothers blew up an 8 year old boy and crippled over a hundred innocent people. Get a clue.

[Malcador]

What is wrong with some of you? This isnt a movie, there are law enforcement people putting their lives in jeopardy to stop those two violent psychopaths. If you think you can do a better job, go join the police academy and stop looking like a total a-hole.

 

These two brothers blew up an 8 year old boy and crippled over a hundred innocent people. Get a clue.

And this is in regard to what ? Nothing like the 'Criticize me ? well you do better' approach to things. Police are doing a decent job, sure they have places in some weird martial like state but they've not managed to kill anyone or shoot at people like their brothers out West.

 

Looks like he gave them the slip, the last I heard.

Edited April 19, 2013 by Malcador

[Gorgon]

I considered watching news coverage but then remembered that the media are being idiots about this. The social media angle is encouraged and misinformation doesn't matter, as long as you are the first to report it. I miss the days when you had to have two confirmed sources to report something. Nowadays 'this or that person tweeted' willl do.

[Malcador]

I considered watching news coverage but then remembered that the media are being idiots about this. The social media angle is encouraged and misinformation doesn't matter, as long as you are the first to report it. I miss the days when you had to have two confirmed sources to report something. Nowadays 'this or that person tweeted' willl do.

Yep, see CNN and New York Post about this.

[LadyCrimson]

I considered watching news coverage but then remembered that the media are being idiots about this. The social media angle is encouraged and misinformation doesn't matter, as long as you are the first to report it. I miss the days when you had to have two confirmed sources to report something. Nowadays 'this or that person tweeted' willl do.

Yeah, this whole incident has me thinking about those kinds of things a lot. On the one hand, social media/connectivity can be used/be useful, on the other hand, more often than not, it just gets in the way and spreads misinformation/panic/hate etc. Not to mention, in some ways, it starts to feel a bit like the world is now a single, mass lynchmob that moves from one sensational thing to another.

 

It was bad enough before social media ... makes me a bit uncomfy. But such is life.

[Malcador]

Well, looks like endgame now. Have him pinned in a boat in a backyard.

[HoonDing]

 

Social media is a blight on humanity.

 

[Malcador]

Well they are from Czechnyha.

[Hurlshort]

The suspect was captured alive, so that will lead to an interesting trial.

[LadyCrimson]

The suspect was captured alive, so that will lead to an interesting trial.

Assuming he survives his injuries. But yeah....and good luck finding an "impartial" jury.

More importantly, hopefully they'll be able to get more info, if there is any - eg did they act alone or what was going on. Anyway, glad it's over and no more loss of life occurred capturing him.