[merged] Do you think the Kickstarter could have been better

[Metabot]

http://www.kickstart...steland-2/posts

 

Here's the updates page for Wasteland 2. Tell me, what was so exciting about those updates in comparison to this?

 

http://www.kickstart...-2/posts?page=3

 

Look at update #8 (count it EIGHT) on April 4, 2012 (that's with 13 days to go). They announced a bigger game, more artwork for weapons, more portraits, a mod kit, and some extra designers. Not all that exciting and not much more than is already expected from the Project: Eternity stretch goals except the mod kit.

Edited October 1, 2012 by Metabot

[Grimlorn]

More mugs, t-shirts, and swag could've been done with minor increase in pledges. Obsidian could've offered to digitally reproduce the purchased character(s) sitting in an abode or the tavern one buys or the item one makes, and send the digital reproduction as a high quality picture both to the computer of the pledger and the actual abode of the purchaser. Specially designed marshmallows and other treats might have been ideal, but they had no idea that so many people would be interested so quickly and that the interest would flag suddenly.

 

I seem to think that they could've lowered pledge amount for "creating ones own character or item" and had city districts created by high pledges for special cities designed specifically by pledgers -- and they could've used tile sets for those areas, making it easier to design and cheaper to design too. Otherwise, I think they did an okay job except they should've had more swag! And comic books. A certain level of pledge should permit them to hire a manga artist.

They're game developers. Where are they going to set that kind of stuff up where people gets mugs and tshirts? They don't even know whether this thing is going to take off or not and there are only about 50k donors. Not all of them want mugs and tshirts, so how are they going to set up what the demand will be and how much everything will cost. You have to know someone in the fashion business and mug business to help you with those kinds of things.

 

Seriously people, think before you post.

[Metabot]

More mugs, t-shirts, and swag could've been done with minor increase in pledges. Obsidian could've offered to digitally reproduce the purchased character(s) sitting in an abode or the tavern one buys or the item one makes, and send the digital reproduction as a high quality picture both to the computer of the pledger and the actual abode of the purchaser. Specially designed marshmallows and other treats might have been ideal, but they had no idea that so many people would be interested so quickly and that the interest would flag suddenly.

 

I seem to think that they could've lowered pledge amount for "creating ones own character or item" and had city districts created by high pledges for special cities designed specifically by pledgers -- and they could've used tile sets for those areas, making it easier to design and cheaper to design too. Otherwise, I think they did an okay job except they should've had more swag! And comic books. A certain level of pledge should permit them to hire a manga artist.

 

Christ, I hope you're trolling. This is ridiculous.

[Grimlorn]

http://www.kickstart...steland-2/posts

 

Here's the updates page for Wasteland 2. Tell me, what was so exciting about those updates in comparison to this?

 

http://www.kickstart...-2/posts?page=3

 

Look at update #8 (count it EIGHT) on April 4, 2012 (that's with 13 days to go). They announced a bigger game, more artwork for weapons, more portraits, a mod kit, and some extra designers. Not all that exciting and not much more than is already expected from the Project: Eternity stretch goals except the mod kit.

It's 5 months old and people are nostalgic about it. It's crazy. Edited October 1, 2012 by Grimlorn

[bronzepoem]

http://www.kickstart...steland-2/posts

 

Here's the updates page for Wasteland 2. Tell me, what was so exciting about those updates in comparison to this?

The most exciting thing is: they could invite Chris

So when we saw the holy three name at first, 1.1 million was funded by 27 hours. Now we need a new stretch goals like that.

[Grimlorn]

http://www.kickstart...steland-2/posts

 

Here's the updates page for Wasteland 2. Tell me, what was so exciting about those updates in comparison to this?

The most exciting thing is: they could invite Chris

So when we saw the holy three name at first, 1.1 million was funded by 27 hours. Now we need a new stretch goals like that.

Yeah but they already have Chris for this, so it should automatically get that bump anyways.

I mean who else are they suppose to get? David Gaider? Excuse me while I go throw up.

[Shades]

http://www.kickstart...steland-2/posts

 

Here's the updates page for Wasteland 2. Tell me, what was so exciting about those updates in comparison to this?

The most exciting thing is: they could invite Chris

So when we saw the holy three name at first, 1.1 million was funded by 27 hours. Now we need a new stretch goals like that.

 

So there is already one on this project, how about... Two Chris Avellones!

 

Edit: We just need a cloning machine

Edited October 1, 2012 by Shades

[Metabot]

For me, a more exciting stretch goal would be something like 3 million-new region, 1 or 2 new factions, and mod kit. Maybe that's realisitic, maybe not, but more "swag" like mugs and crap don't really arouse my interest as much as an overall better game does.

[Ieo]

The thread What do you want to see as stretch goals? is far better for discussion than this silly thread....

[Superdeluxe]

http://www.kickstart...steland-2/posts

 

 

George Ziets

Here's the updates page for Wasteland 2. Tell me, what was so exciting about those updates in comparison to this?

The most exciting thing is: they could invite Chris

So when we saw the holy three name at first, 1.1 million was funded by 27 hours. Now we need a new stretch goals like that.

Yeah but they already have Chris for this, so it should automatically get that bump anyways.

I mean who else are they suppose to get? David Gaider? Excuse me while I go throw up.

[nikolokolus]

It's funny, I pop over to the kickstarter page maybe once or twice a day, just to see what people are posting in the comments section and I get the feeling that many people are camped out watching the money counter obsessively and when it's not ticking over as rapidly as they think it should/could be, comments about bigger and more grandiose stretch goals and more demands for more updates start to pour in.

 

From what little I know, it seems like most kickstarters have this kind of lull in the action, and as the last few days approach there seems to be a rush to pledge or up an initial pledge.

 

Why don't we wait until the campaign is over until we write the post-mortem?

[Grimlorn]

The kickstarter is doing better than Wasteland 2's so far and it's doing slightly better than Double Fine's adventure game. Someone was creating a graph and comparing the money they raised over their kickstarters.

 

People were just really excited when the news was first announced and now it's dying down a bit. It's perfectly natural.

[Gatt9]

I feel the lack of defined stretch goals is really hurting the kickstarter. I think they could have a lot more money. Stretch goals incentivize upgrading pledges, and new pledges at higher levels. At this point, we already know all of the stretch goals that are present will be hit, so why pledge more than the minimum?

 

Strong stretch goals also tend to cause wealthy people to kick in late in the run at high tiers. Dead State had people kick in 2 of the highest tiers in the last few minutes just to reach an extremely close stretch goal. Wasteland 2 overcame the mid-kickstart slump by announcing Avellone. Planetary Annihilation was consistent because of it's roadmap of compelling stretch goals.

 

IMO, Obsidian is limiting their own success right now. IMO, they should have goals mapped out to 3 million at least.

 

Because Obsidian is already successful. Your last bit makes no sense at all. Some people are misunderstanding the Kickstarter goal; "get as much money as possible no matter what" is not the purpose, nor is the juvenile "we need to beat X project and look at how much Y project made."

 

"Get enough money to make a business proposal happen" is the purpose. Obsidian may actually feel that the current funding covers all their intended content and then some, so any subsequent bonuses must be weighed carefully to avoid introducing burdensome and unnecessary feature creep or painting themselves into a corner with a promise that may not work out in development.

 

A good example are mod tools. Obsidian is aware of the desire for such tools and would rather wait a year into development (U12) before committing to that or not; this has to do with a lot of behind-the-scenes balancing against content and funds and other variables the players simply do not know. Because the folks at Obsidian has way more game development experience than, well, everyone here, I must trust their judgment on that matter.

 

I have no doubt that Obsidian will advertise more stretch goals soon, but thinking that the Kickstarter's current state is somehow a failure is rather silly.

 

If you're going to quote me, at least read what I wrote. I think you'll find that the word "Failure" doesn't appear anywhere in my post. I think you'll find that the message in my post is that they could be "More successful", which is completely different from "Failure".

 

I also suspect you're overestimating how much can be achieved with 1.1 million.

Edited October 1, 2012 by Gatt9

[GhostofAnakin]

The kickstarter (and stretch goals) were fine, IMO. In fact, I'm more than happy with a lot of the stretch goals, and am glad we've reached pretty much all of them.

[Metabot]

The kickstarter is doing better than Wasteland 2's so far and it's doing slightly better than Double Fine's adventure game. Someone was creating a graph and comparing the money they raised over their kickstarters.

 

People were just really excited when the news was first announced and now it's dying down a bit. It's perfectly natural.

 

Exactly. I made the same mistake once, admittedly.

[bronzepoem]

For me, a more exciting stretch goal would be something like 3 million-new region, 1 or 2 new factions, and mod kit. Maybe that's realisitic, maybe not, but more "swag" like mugs and crap don't really arouse my interest as much as an overall better game does.

The problem is I don't know how many regions or facions we already have now. So when they say new regions,new factions, I have no feeling.

[Gorth]

I think they underestimated the speed with which they reached their bare bones minimum target (which would allow them to create a game, showcasing their ideas and setting), I'm not sure they had banked on several millions either, which means the stretch goals have mostly been about expanding the "glorified proof of concept" into a full scale game. I for one is happy to see them not over committing themselves with hard/impossible to fulfill promises. I would rather see a complete product this time around than a showcase of unfulfilled potential.

[bronzepoem]

The kickstarter is doing better than Wasteland 2's so far and it's doing slightly better than Double Fine's adventure game. Someone was creating a graph and comparing the money they raised over their kickstarters.

 

People were just really excited when the news was first announced and now it's dying down a bit. It's perfectly natural.

Exactly agreed.

[Ieo]

I have no doubt that Obsidian will advertise more stretch goals soon, but thinking that the Kickstarter's current state is somehow a failure is rather silly.

 

If you're going to quote me, at least read what I wrote. I think you'll find that the word "Failure" doesn't appear anywhere in my post. I think you'll find that the message in my post is that they could be "More successful", which is completely different from "Failure".

 

I also suspect you're overestimating how much can be achieved with 1.1 million.

 

Fine, then adjust my response as--"but thinking that the Kickstarter's current state is somehow 'really hurting' (your exact words) is rather silly." My point still stands, and you still missed the point of the KS in its entirety.

 

You do not have the wherewithal to question Obsidian's own calculations of their work product. I don't either. So between the three of us, who do you think is really in the best position to properly estimate what can be achieved with $1.1m?

Edited October 1, 2012 by Ieo

[bronzepoem]

http://www.kickstart...steland-2/posts

 

Here's the updates page for Wasteland 2. Tell me, what was so exciting about those updates in comparison to this?

The most exciting thing is: they could invite Chris

So when we saw the holy three name at first, 1.1 million was funded by 27 hours. Now we need a new stretch goals like that.

Yeah but they already have Chris for this, so it should automatically get that bump anyways.

I mean who else are they suppose to get? David Gaider? Excuse me while I go throw up.

Hei David Gaider is a good guy...

Ok, maybe no a special person. Could it be a team as the Graphic Artists from BIOWARE? Or as we know there are some genius in the team of Baldur’s Gate: Enhanced Edition.

[AwesomeOcelot]

I don't think Wasteland 2 had any better stretch goals, I think it had better reward tiers from the start, also the improved digital reward tiers (which PE already has) and the Obsidian collaboration announcement made the difference in the second half.

 

If you guys could invite Leonard Boyarsky or some big guys from BIOWARE to join the project, I will glad to pay another 1000 dollar.

 

Boyarsky would be great, but who wants anyone from Bioware?

[chisled2bone]

I have noticed that the kickstarter has slowed down drastically, relatively speaking of course. It has slowed to probably about $25k a day now, compared to when it was making $100k and then $50k a day. With the kickstarter being half way done how much more do you think the kickstarter will garner? What can be done to either get new backers or to get people to up their donations? Personally , as a linux user, i think there needs to be more publicity in the linux crowd. More interviews maybe done on some linux gaming websites, or omgubuntu should do some kind of article on PE, or even some linux youtube channels putting out the news about PE. The humble indie bundle proves that linux users are willing to pay and back projects that are willing to be native on linux. Heck even kickstarter is a proven fact of that. I am putting so much emphasis on the linux people because i believe that is the biggest potential currently that PE has to up their donations. Do you guys think there are any announcements that could get more backers and interest?

[ButchinMelancholy]

This is a normal pace, and an excellent one actually. I think they'll end up around 3,2 - 3,5M$ eventually, but they do need to offer some quite exciting news in the last weeks to help revive the campaign and boost the last days boom.

Edited October 1, 2012 by ButchinMelancholy

[Ieo]

Keep this in mind: The Kickstarter is already successful.

 

To repeat the gist of my other post:

 

Some people are misunderstanding the Kickstarter goal; "get as much money as possible no matter what" is not the purpose, nor is the juvenile "we need to beat X project and look at how much Y project made."

 

"Get enough money to make a business proposal happen" is the purpose. Obsidian may actually feel that the current funding covers all their intended content and then some, so any subsequent bonuses must be weighed carefully to avoid introducing burdensome and unnecessary feature creep or painting themselves into a corner with a promise that may not work out in development.

 

Edit: Coming off way cranky late at night, maaaan.

Edited October 1, 2012 by Ieo

[chisled2bone]

Man, why do these early doom threads pop up? (Like this useless thread Do you think the Kickstarter could have been better) It's normal for the excitement to peak at the earliest stages and then pick up towards the end.

 

Keep this in mind: The Kickstarter is already successful.

 

To repeat the gist of my other post:

 

Some people are misunderstanding the Kickstarter goal; "get as much money as possible no matter what" is not the purpose, nor is the juvenile "we need to beat X project and look at how much Y project made."

 

"Get enough money to make a business proposal happen" is the purpose. Obsidian may actually feel that the current funding covers all their intended content and then some, so any subsequent bonuses must be weighed carefully to avoid introducing burdensome and unnecessary feature creep or painting themselves into a corner with a promise that may not work out in development.

 

Actually I never said that the kickstarter was unsuccessful, i think it is very successful by the simple fact that they are going to double their initial goal, while there are other projects that never even reach their goal. I also havent compared it to any other projects. I thought forums are where people can converse and invoke conversation. Some of my key questions are what do you think Obsidian can do to pick up more backers. My personal opinion is that i think they havent completely tapped into the linux potential. I know they are supporting linux, the only reason that i decided to back the project with my money, as those are the only projects i will back.

Edited October 1, 2012 by chisled2bone