Bioware's New Game

[Nepenthe]

"Guy in a coat!"

"Guess it was nothing."

"Put him in a bag, I want no-one to see this!".

 

Looks like we have our share of the "konsole kiddies" who found the DX mechanic too complicated...

 

DX clumsy and awkward? Lies!

[WILL THE ALMIGHTY]

No offense but DX had some pretty glaring combat issues. Mostly how enemy soldiers would run around. Their AI in general wasn't too sharp, either.

 

I mean, I liked it, but nearly every other shooter I've played has had better combat mechanics.

[GreasyDogMeat]

Looks like we have our share of the "konsole kiddies" who found the DX mechanic too complicated...

 

DX clumsy and awkward? Lies!

Are you kidding or wearing those rose tinted nostalgia glasses? DX was a fantastic game, probably still is (like I said haven't played it lately & don't know how well it would hold up), but it had issues, even for it's time. Clumsy and awkward is fair to describe it when it came to the shooting and action. Just about every RPG/shooter hybrid is clumsy and awkward from Deus Ex, Vampire the Masquerade: Bloodlines, Mass Effect, Fallout 3/New Vegas to Alpha Protocol. It doesn't mean these are BAD games, in fact they are one of my favorite genres in gaming.

 

If you were to strip out the RPG mechanics from any of the above mentioned games, the inventory screens, the leveling, the dialogue choices and more open level design and turn them into corridor shooters they would be considered horrible games compared to any other shooter game on the market.

 

As for being a 'konsole kiddy' I've only become one recently, before I was a fellow PC elitist snob.

Edited December 22, 2010 by GreasyDogMeat

[Bos_hybrid]

Alpha Protocol. open level design

 

Does not compute.

[Purkake]

"Guy in a coat!"

"Guess it was nothing."

*drop crate of TNT 10m away from guy*

"Must have been the wind."

[Nepenthe]

In case you haven't noticed, I kind of like to poke holes at what I perceive as black-and-white "groupthink" (or the elitist snobism, but that would be like trying to stop a train by jumping in front of it). Some people have referred to it as trolling, I like to think it's more like a Socratic method for improving you as people.

 

So yeah, I was kidding (but honestly, even the AI had a lot of stuff that was really cool and new to me at the time, even if the combat behaviour was kind of... lame). It's just one of those games were I consider the good to outstrip the bad by such a wide margin that I honestly think anyone complaining about things (especially considering the age) just needs a smack on the head.

 

And just in case my stand isn't on record, I use a PC, and x360 and a PS3 for gaming, but have a slight preference for the PS3 (mostly because it DOES do nearly everything:P)

[Malcador]

DX "AI"wasn't that bad for the time it came out. I still want to meet these people that found Liberty Island too hard, so I may laugh at them

[Hassat Hunter]

In DX even with the lowest skill you could make headshots, it just took longer for the reticle to close. But it would close as much as it would do on higher levels, just took a bit longer. So saying that you had to level up to hit means your an inpatient **** apparently. Or tried spraying with an assault rifle on lvl 1 from miles away instead of aiming first.

In DX every weapon can be modified to be a deadly sniper rifle of death. From the starter pistol to even an assault rifle.

 

And if you think DX combat was bad, you probably didn't get the point that you weren't SUPPOSED to be shooting like a CoD player. You had to use stealth, cover, and carefully aim your shots before the kill. The AI was also made to make this stealth possible. Hey, that sounds like Alpha Protocol?

And true, they both use the exact same design (the assault rifle of AP is precisely how DX reticle works). So how can people one is better than the other? Ignorance...

 

And how can people say the combat sucks in either games? Because they are too inept to notice that combat is punished in those games. Unlike CoD. Stealth is more powerful. And if you do want a firefight, you damn well be careful before starting one...

[GreasyDogMeat]

In DX even with the lowest skill you could make headshots, it just took longer for the reticle to close. But it would close as much as it would do on higher levels, just took a bit longer. So saying that you had to level up to hit means your an inpatient **** apparently. Or tried spraying with an assault rifle on lvl 1 from miles away instead of aiming first.

In DX every weapon can be modified to be a deadly sniper rifle of death. From the starter pistol to even an assault rifle.

 

And if you think DX combat was bad, you probably didn't get the point that you weren't SUPPOSED to be shooting like a CoD player. You had to use stealth, cover, and carefully aim your shots before the kill. The AI was also made to make this stealth possible. Hey, that sounds like Alpha Protocol?

And true, they both use the exact same design (the assault rifle of AP is precisely how DX reticle works). So how can people one is better than the other? Ignorance...

 

And how can people say the combat sucks in either games? Because they are too inept to notice that combat is punished in those games. Unlike CoD. Stealth is more powerful. And if you do want a firefight, you damn well be careful before starting one...

Or I'm not remembering things ****. From my memory the lowest level accuracy the aiming reticle never closed completely and your shot always had a chance of missing unless you were about 5 feet away. Possible I may be thinking of Bloodlines...

 

Either way it was very easy for me to jump into AP and I enjoyed it's combat system.

[Thorton_AP]

No, you're right.

 

If you could get your gun's accuracy up to 95%+ then the crosshairs would fully intersect giving you a precise shot. The start of the game does not have this. 5 feet is probably a bit closer than you needed to be, but yeah you weren't precisely accurate. I usually made up for it with gun mods than more skill though

 

 

 

As for DX (probably my fav game of all time), there's gems like this:

 

[sorophx]

there's gems like this:

 

oh. my. goodness.

[Thorton_AP]

I love the game, but it's not without its faults haha.

[Morgoth]

Someone really needs to make a decent total conversion with Source/Unreal engine, a'la Black Mesa.

[Orogun01]

Someone really needs to make a decent total conversion with Source/Unreal engine, a'la Black Mesa.

I'd love that!. :runs to see if anyone has made one:

 

edit:Jackpot!

Edited December 22, 2010 by Orogun01

[entrerix]

much earlier some of us were theorizing a potential hd update to the game and how awesome that would be.

 

deus ex is king of the shooter/rpg hybrid. the only games that come close are system shock 2 and now new vegas, but new vegas feels very different as its more focused on open world exploration.

 

i'm going to play deus ex for the millionth time the week before the new game comes out, so i can judge the new game fairly without too much nostalgia-goggle effect.

[Bos_hybrid]

As for DX (probably my fav game of all time), there's gems like this:

 

[Thorton_AP]

What a shame!

[Raithe]

Augmented Shame.

[Malcador]

A bomb.

[HoonDing]

That vid reminds me of sniping Papa Khan at his dinner table with the Ratslayer.

[Niten_Ryu]

And how can people say the combat sucks in either games? Because they are too inept to notice that combat is punished in those games. Unlike CoD. Stealth is more powerful. And if you do want a firefight, you damn well be careful before starting one...

 

That is a lot of crap. I've complited DeusEx 10+ times and Alpha Protocol 6 times. Guess what, CoD4 is more difficult (on highest difficulty) then either of 'em. Both in DeusEx and Alpha Protocol, you can start firefight and survive it easily. From my sig you'll find Alpha Procol run, no gear upgrades, veteran / hard difficulty settings. Reason for easiness is simple. Both DeusEx and Alpha Protocol assume that certain amount of shots fired will be missed. Thus enemies react slower, while in CoD4 enemies can drop you really fast if you missed flash granade or moved into room looking wrong direction.

 

But quality of the combat / shooting mechanics is NOT the same as the overall difficulty of the game.

[Thorton_AP]

Nevermind the fact that according to Mr. Spector, guns-a-blazing is a valid playstyle for Deus Ex.

[Hassat Hunter]

If you could get your gun's accuracy up to 95%+ then the crosshairs would fully intersect giving you a precise shot.

Actually, the only way the crosshairs don't intersect was if your arms where blown off. Maybe you should take care to heal them?

 

Also, even with 10% acc (not that any unmodded weapon has as low), a laser dot gave the exact spot you aimed at, making even lvl 1 pistol super powerful, without aiming. You can find a laserdot on Liberty Island too.

 

EDIT: @ Niten_Ryu. Played DX on Realistic? Cause even a pistol wielder can 1 shot you to death by making a headshot (snipers love this). I wouldn't call that savely making a firefight...

Edited December 22, 2010 by Hassat Hunter

[entrerix]

also guns blazing IS a totally valid playstyle if you are liberal with the gep gun and grenades.

[Thorton_AP]

Actually, the only way the crosshairs don't intersect was if your arms where blown off. Maybe you should take care to heal them?

 

You are wrong. When I am talking about intersection, I mean a full on cross with no hole whatsoever between them. By default the tightest they get still has a small hole in the dead center of the reticle. Your shot is not precisely accurate at this point. They are VERY close to intersecting, but not entirely.

 

 

@enterix

Guns blazing is a very valid playstyle, but it is harder at the start of the game when playing on Realistic.

 

 

Played DX on Realistic? Cause even a pistol wielder can 1 shot you to death by making a headshot (snipers love this). I wouldn't call that savely making a firefight...

 

All headshots are lethal with any weapon in CoD 4 on the highest difficulty as well.

Edited December 22, 2010 by Thorton_AP