Dragon Age 2

[Volourn]

Inability to choose race, no 'powering up time' for spells, the fact that warriors can't use two weapons at once (or is it missles), the inability of rogues to use shields, the fact that many mage powers are being cut so all classes can have equal amount of powers, and I'm sure there's a host more of things too.

 

This doesn't mean I'll hate the game.

 

I am quite capable of dislking certain aspects of a game and still enjoying it for what it is. Just read up my comments about ME2 where I got attacked HERE of all palces for calling it dumbed down. Even my 'beloved' NWN, i ciriticized a lot. i really wish i could find my original review of NWN. iF people didn't conviently forget or ignore that they wouldn't be such silly liars. L0LZ

[Thorton_AP]

What is important: he's an experienced game designer, thus his opinion should carry some weight. I personally agree with him. If I was a boss in Bioware I'd value an experienced employees opinion.

More importantly: all that crap about "streamlining gameplay", "innovation" and a thousand other excuses for Bioware's failure to truly innovate on their original formula gains weight when its subtly pointed out by the very people working on their project - or refusing to do so.

 

What about the experienced game designers that embraced the change?

 

They need the money.

 

Jokes aside, designers don't decide what's popular or what can make money, which is the one and only point of this change - someone thought this way DA would be a better cash cow. Nothing to do with creativity. Also this way its more easily adaptable to consoles, which is again the same thing - more moneyz.

 

You're talking about it as though it was a creative issue.

 

You're talking as though we should only listen to the designer that didn't want to do this game, and ignoring the other ones. You're selectively picking what you want because you feel as though BioWare not making games specifically for you is somehow a sleight against yourself.

 

Face it bub, you don't have a clue what went on behind closed doors. Grow a pair and stop being such a baby.

 

Clearly the ones that stayed with the project did it purely because "they need the money."

[alanschu]

you're right, DA sure wasn't big, at least in my book. hell, none of my friends played it, they couldn't even be bothered to try a cracked version, that's how bad DA is. they bought ME2 though, and enjoyed it, which is very strange...

 

 

Dragon Age is BioWare's best selling game in its history. Take that for what you will.

[WorstUsernameEver]

Dragon Age is BioWare's best selling game in its history. Take that for what you will.

 

Sorry if I'm bold and ask, I'm not sure if you can even tell that, but is it internal data you've got at BioWare or the usual 'I've read that on a website'?

[sorophx]

it deosn't matter, it may be their best-selling game ever. in my eyes that only proves one point: people forgot how good video games can be. I'm tired of replaying old titles, which had it all. but there's no alternative. get through DA in 2 days then go back to my Valkyrie Profile for a month, rinse and repeat.

 

but of course you're right, I'm probably blind or stupid, how can I not see, that DA is a masterpiece, outshining them all?! second only to NWN

[WorstUsernameEver]

it deosn't matter, it may be their best-selling game ever. in my eyes that only proves one point: people forgot how good video games can be. I'm tired of replaying old titles, which had it all. but there's no alternative. get through DA in 2 days then go back to my Valkyrie Profile for a month, rinse and repeat.

 

And these were the words that started another pointless argument about whether a game can or cannot be considered good objectively.

[alanschu]

it deosn't matter, it may be their best-selling game ever. in my eyes that only proves one point: people forgot how good video games can be. I'm tired of replaying old titles, which had it all. but there's no alternative. get through DA in 2 days then go back to my Valkyrie Profile for a month, rinse and repeat.

 

but of course you're right, I'm probably blind or stupid, how can I not see, that DA is a masterpiece, outshining them all?! second only to NWN

 

Your original statement was referring to "how big" Dragon Age was. I do not think Titanic is a very good movie, but there is no disputing that it was a big movie.

 

 

Sorry if I'm bold and ask, I'm not sure if you can even tell that, but is it internal data you've got at BioWare or the usual 'I've read that on a website'?

 

Unless things have changed, it was mentioned a couple months ago at work. ME2 did well too (zomgbbq fantastic to start), but DAO has sold through more units. A large part of this, I believe, is that it also had a PS3 SKU. ME2's numbers will benefit from a PS3 release as well. I believe both games are appreciably close.

[sorophx]

Your original statement was referring to "how big" Dragon Age was. I do not think Titanic is a very good movie, but there is no disputing that it was a big movie.

yeah, I remember I wasn't answering to you exclusively just trying to point out, that this whole discussion has lost any sense, like WUE said.

[Volourn]

"Sorry if I'm bold and ask, I'm not sure if you can even tell that, but is it internal data you've got at BioWare or the usual 'I've read that on a website'?"

 

DA and ME2 are easily BIO's highest selling games ever. DA got a head start it was released first but both have sold 3mil+ despite being released a year or less ago.

 

 

"it deosn't matter, it may be their best-selling game ever. in my eyes that only proves one point: people forgot how good video games can be. I'm tired of replaying old titles, which had it all. but there's no alternative. get through DA in 2 days then go back to my Valkyrie Profile for a month, rinse and repeat.

 

but of course you're right, I'm probably blind or stupid, how can I not see, that DA is a masterpiece, outshining them all?! second only to NWN"

 

Your agrument here is sad and silly. Youa re making the pathetic case that popular = bad. That's silly talk. NEWSFLASH: Your personal opinion (and mine) is (are) irrelevant in the big picture.

 

I guarantee you a game specifically made for Volourn would NOT sell a lot and would not be consiered 'good' by more than a handful of people. Same with a game made specifically for Sorophx. True story.

[sorophx]

Youa re making the pathetic case that popular = bad.

no I'm not. you 're not reading carefully

[meomao]

Inability to choose race, no 'powering up time' for spells, the fact that warriors can't use two weapons at once (or is it missles), the inability of rogues to use shields, the fact that many mage powers are being cut so all classes can have equal amount of powers, and I'm sure there's a host more of things too.

 

This doesn't mean I'll hate the game.

 

 

Thanks. Sorry for the question but you are one of the few who does not seem to be allways against what Bioware does around here so I was curios . About your critics: I don't mind the loss of races (was it for me, Elves and Dwarves would not be part of the setting from the beginning... so bored with tolkeniesque fantasy) and I don't mind more balance between classes. But I do agree aboout the rogue/warriors thing... even here, I don't understand the need of the rogue class in fantasy gaming anymore. They should merge those classes and leave open to anyone the ability to customize their Fighter. I do agree even about the powering up time thing, but I want to play some of the game before I made my mind about that.

[RPGmasterBoo]

What is important: he's an experienced game designer, thus his opinion should carry some weight. I personally agree with him. If I was a boss in Bioware I'd value an experienced employees opinion.

More importantly: all that crap about "streamlining gameplay", "innovation" and a thousand other excuses for Bioware's failure to truly innovate on their original formula gains weight when its subtly pointed out by the very people working on their project - or refusing to do so.

 

What about the experienced game designers that embraced the change?

 

They need the money.

 

Jokes aside, designers don't decide what's popular or what can make money, which is the one and only point of this change - someone thought this way DA would be a better cash cow. Nothing to do with creativity. Also this way its more easily adaptable to consoles, which is again the same thing - more moneyz.

 

You're talking about it as though it was a creative issue.

 

You're talking as though we should only listen to the designer that didn't want to do this game, and ignoring the other ones. You're selectively picking what you want because you feel as though BioWare not making games specifically for you is somehow a sleight against yourself.

 

Face it bub, you don't have a clue what went on behind closed doors. Grow a pair and stop being such a baby.

 

Clearly the ones that stayed with the project did it purely because "they need the money."

 

I was criticising Bioware for what I percieve their faults are. I also noticed their own designer felt the same way. I voiced the opinion that this change in DA2 is nothing but sucking up to console kids and trying to make more money.

I dont give a rats ass about DA2, for me Bioware ended with ToB. All I was doing was expressing delight at a former Bioware employee feeling the same way as I do, because for me that confirms my thoughts on the matter.

 

The only issue I have with them is the degeneracy of the genre they, as a big, influential company are creating, and that's beyond fixing at this point.

 

If you actually bothered to read my previous posts you would know all this, and wouldn't need to post such garbage.

[Volourn]

"for me Bioware ended with ToB."

 

yet, you keep buying and playing their games letting them know where it counts that they amde the right choices.

[sorophx]

yet, you keep buying and playing their games letting them know where it counts that they amde the right choices.

even if it's true, the only reason would be that Bio promised a lot and failed to deliver. or maybe they intended to do it this way all along. promise a spiritual successor to BG and make a completely different game to appeal to younger gamers. which means we were fooled. and you know what they say in Texas, 'fool me once...'

[Volourn]

"even if it's true, the only reason would be that Bio promised a lot and failed to deliver. or maybe they intended to do it this way all along. promise a spiritual successor to BG and make a completely different game to appeal to younger gamers."

 

Spiritual successor doesn't mean exactly the same. And, DA was the spiritual successor to BG, NWN, KOTOR, JE, MDK2, SS, Medcial Software, and everything else BIO touched. L0L

 

DA had LOTS in common with BG series. So, they kept their 'promise' even though their promise in that case was meaningless because 'spirtiual succesor' is an useless phrase since it can mean quite a bit depending on the person and their mood.

 

As for DA2, BIO to my knowledge, has not promised it to be a 'spiritual successor' to Bg so 8shrug*

 

As for Boo and others who continually buy and play BIo games while whining about BIO being 'sell outs'.. they should look in the mirror.

[sorophx]

Spiritual successor doesn't mean exactly the same. And, DA was the spiritual successor to BG, NWN, KOTOR, JE, MDK2, SS, Medcial Software, and everything else BIO touched. L0L

I'm crying

[RPGmasterBoo]

As for Boo and others who continually buy and play BIo games while whining about BIO being 'sell outs'.. they should look in the mirror.

 

My good and wonderful friend Volo, these are the Bioware games that I own:

 

BG

BGII

ToB

 

NWN

SOU

HOTU

 

The latter bunch is in my collection because they came in a compilationthat included Icewind Dale. They don't even work because something is screwed up with their copy protection

 

Jade Empire - Because it came in a nice metal box and cost 5$

 

Everything else I played by the mercy of my other good and wonderful friends, since I wouldn't spend a dime of my own on those games.

Edited October 10, 2010 by RPGmasterBoo

[Volourn]

"Everything else I played by the mercy of my other good and wonderful friends, since I wouldn't spend a dime of my own on those games."

 

Convienent excuse. Try again, but make it a better than the 'ol 'my friend bought it'. It's as poorly thought out as the 'ol 'the dog ate my homework' one that kiddies use.

[Tigranes]

Except that's how I played Jade Empire, Friend Volo.

 

Yes, I know, it's shocking but it happens.

[alanschu]

Although Boo admitted on this forum that he pirates games.

[Oner]

Poor Vol, either he has no friends and/or they never lend him anything. :c

[Meshugger]

So, no interesting news lately i presume?

[Volourn]

"Except that's how I played Jade Empire, Friend Volo. "

 

Dogs eating homework happens too. Just sayin'.

[RPGmasterBoo]

Poor Vol, either he has no friends and/or they never lend him anything. :c

 

I was going to say that but I guess there's no need to now.

[Gromnir]

What is important: he's an experienced game designer, thus his opinion should carry some weight. I personally agree with him. If I was a boss in Bioware I'd value an experienced employees opinion.

More importantly: all that crap about "streamlining gameplay", "innovation" and a thousand other excuses for Bioware's failure to truly innovate on their original formula gains weight when its subtly pointed out by the very people working on their project - or refusing to do so.

 

What about the experienced game designers that embraced the change?

 

 

 

Jokes aside, designers don't decide what's popular or what can make money, which is the one and only point of this change - someone thought this way DA would be a better cash cow. Nothing to do with creativity. Also this way its more easily adaptable to consoles, which is again the same thing - more moneyz.

 

 

 

am suggesting an alternative reason for the consolized changes we sees in da2: time. da2 development is relative short, and many o' the streamlining efforts is intended more to save resources than they is motivated by creativity or a genuine belief that such changes will create more revenue. bio is trying to cut fat from da so they can get the game released Q1 2011, and if some stuff many o' us view as pc staples can be cut, then so be it.

 

HA! Good Fun!