Not Related to AP per say; Why does everyone hate DRM?

[Orogun01]

Me too, I think it's a brilliant scheme, which I heartily approve of.

 

I also approve of the current BioWare way.

I would had agreed with you before I played DA:O and ME2. The DLC is not worth it's price, is basically the "crust" of the game all that got left out of the final cut with new makeup.

The game by itself does well but there is no motivation to actually buy them.

 

I do think that their approach is the right one, to reward honesty instead of hurting your customers because of the wrongdoers. But the quality of the content leaves much to be desired, E.G: Awakenings, an expansion that only last 12 hours

[Mamoulian War]

The first Drakensang had the following DRM: a missing quest NPC if the game was pirated, making it impossible to continue. The sequel, River of Time, uses something similar (making it possible to revive characters that fell in battle). It also caused pirates to flood the forum and whine about a buggy game, which was hilarious.

Wasn't so funny when Iron Lore did it with Titan Quest...

 

Iron Lore did a big mistake of not making this a public information... i never played Titan Quest, but 1st time i've heard that the game was intentionaly bugged for pirates, was about 2 years after they got bankrupt...

[Spider]

Me too, I think it's a brilliant scheme, which I heartily approve of.

 

I also approve of the current BioWare way.

I would had agreed with you before I played DA:O and ME2. The DLC is not worth it's price, is basically the "crust" of the game all that got left out of the final cut with new makeup.

The game by itself does well but there is no motivation to actually buy them.

 

I do think that their approach is the right one, to reward honesty instead of hurting your customers because of the wrongdoers. But the quality of the content leaves much to be desired, E.G: Awakenings, an expansion that only last 12 hours

 

Yes, but here we are talking about the DLC that you get for free with the game. Like Shale in DA:O. It's not about getting you to pay for more stuff, it's about rewarding customers instead of punishing them.

 

So I also like this scheme very much.

[Orogun01]

Me too, I think it's a brilliant scheme, which I heartily approve of.

 

I also approve of the current BioWare way.

I would had agreed with you before I played DA:O and ME2. The DLC is not worth it's price, is basically the "crust" of the game all that got left out of the final cut with new makeup.

The game by itself does well but there is no motivation to actually buy them.

 

I do think that their approach is the right one, to reward honesty instead of hurting your customers because of the wrongdoers. But the quality of the content leaves much to be desired, E.G: Awakenings, an expansion that only last 12 hours

 

Yes, but here we are talking about the DLC that you get for free with the game. Like Shale in DA:O. It's not about getting you to pay for more stuff, it's about rewarding customers instead of punishing them.

 

So I also like this scheme very much.

Shale was a punishment onto me

[Thorton_AP]

E.G: Awakenings, an expansion that only last 12 hours

 

Is 12 hours that bad?

 

I've never understood the fixation with "time played" as the prime metric for determining quality. Unless you're just playing a game to pass the time and not to enjoy it or anything like that. Sure, 2 minutes in heaven is better than 1 minute, but I've played some games with 60-100 hours of gameplay that frankly were just time sinks when I step back and look at it. Sure, I played a lot of Oblivion, but I'd much rather play a significantly shorter game that is of actual quality.

[Tigranes]

Well, maybe he thought it wasn't so amazingly good that it's worth it at 12 hours.

 

I mean, if your game is amazing and feels very tight, nobody will be criticising its length...I've come across sections of games that felt like they should have been longer and more fleshed out.

[Spider]

Shale was a punishment onto me

 

I thought Shale was the best NPC. Most entertaining and most interesting, as well as the best tank. My party wept whenever I went with Alistair instead of Shale. At least in Origins. The Awakening NPCs were generally better, and I liked the expansion a lot overall. I just wished it hadn't been quite so easy.

[Purkake]

The first Drakensang had the following DRM: a missing quest NPC if the game was pirated, making it impossible to continue. The sequel, River of Time, uses something similar (making it possible to revive characters that fell in battle). It also caused pirates to flood the forum and whine about a buggy game, which was hilarious.

Wasn't so funny when Iron Lore did it with Titan Quest...

 

Iron Lore did a big mistake of not making this a public information... i never played Titan Quest, but 1st time i've heard that the game was intentionaly bugged for pirates, was about 2 years after they got bankrupt...

Instead of some random bugs, they should just have a sign pop up saying that you have a pirated copy(and if not, send an email to this address).

[Busomjack]

They don't hate it that much. Its a little annoying sure but they deliberately exaggerate their frustration with it as an excuse to justify their addiction to piracy.

[Thorton_AP]

Well, maybe he thought it wasn't so amazingly good that it's worth it at 12 hours.

 

I mean, if your game is amazing and feels very tight, nobody will be criticising its length...I've come across sections of games that felt like they should have been longer and more fleshed out.

 

 

I've seen my share of people criticize games that they enjoy simple because they feel the game must adhere to some never actually established rule that the game should be 60 hours long in order to be a good game.

[Thorton_AP]

The first Drakensang had the following DRM: a missing quest NPC if the game was pirated, making it impossible to continue. The sequel, River of Time, uses something similar (making it possible to revive characters that fell in battle). It also caused pirates to flood the forum and whine about a buggy game, which was hilarious.

Wasn't so funny when Iron Lore did it with Titan Quest...

 

Iron Lore did a big mistake of not making this a public information... i never played Titan Quest, but 1st time i've heard that the game was intentionaly bugged for pirates, was about 2 years after they got bankrupt...

Instead of some random bugs, they should just have a sign pop up saying that you have a pirated copy(and if not, send an email to this address).

 

WOuldn't that be as effective as saying "The game is not yet cracked properly. Go back and try again!"

[Hurlshort]

I prefer games that take less time. If a game is over 40 hours, the odds are very slim that I will ever finish it. 20 hours is just about perfect for my money.

[Purkake]

The first Drakensang had the following DRM: a missing quest NPC if the game was pirated, making it impossible to continue. The sequel, River of Time, uses something similar (making it possible to revive characters that fell in battle). It also caused pirates to flood the forum and whine about a buggy game, which was hilarious.

Wasn't so funny when Iron Lore did it with Titan Quest...

 

Iron Lore did a big mistake of not making this a public information... i never played Titan Quest, but 1st time i've heard that the game was intentionaly bugged for pirates, was about 2 years after they got bankrupt...

Instead of some random bugs, they should just have a sign pop up saying that you have a pirated copy(and if not, send an email to this address).

WOuldn't that be as effective as saying "The game is not yet cracked properly. Go back and try again!"

Having some secret stealth DRM that screws up the pirated games just leads to really bad PR and possibly bancrupcy, as with Iron Lore. Also, there are usually cases where the DRM gets activated on a legal copy, this causes extra confusion and doesn't help anyone. This isn't some secret war between the developers and the pirates, companies should just focus on the paying customers, like Ironclad and Bioware seem to be doing.

[kirottu]

I prefer games that take less time. If a game is over 40 hours, the odds are very slim that I will ever finish it. 20 hours is just about perfect for my money.

 

That

[Amentep]

I prefer games that take less time. If a game is over 40 hours, the odds are very slim that I will ever finish it. 20 hours is just about perfect for my money.

 

That

[Morgoth]

These days I feel that everything that is longer than 12 hours already feels tedious.

[Nepenthe]

E.G: Awakenings, an expansion that only last 12 hours

 

Is 12 hours that bad?

 

I've never understood the fixation with "time played" as the prime metric for determining quality. Unless you're just playing a game to pass the time and not to enjoy it or anything like that. Sure, 2 minutes in heaven is better than 1 minute, but I've played some games with 60-100 hours of gameplay that frankly were just time sinks when I step back and look at it. Sure, I played a lot of Oblivion, but I'd much rather play a significantly shorter game that is of actual quality.

 

And let's not forget that the 12 hour expansion is roughly 1,5-2 times as long as the average AAA title, these days. Kind of a ludicrous thing to call out the game for.

[Nemo0071]

This isn't some secret war between the developers and the pirates, companies should just focus on the paying customers, like Ironclad and Bioware seem to be doing.

This.

[Orogun01]

E.G: Awakenings, an expansion that only last 12 hours

 

Is 12 hours that bad?

 

I've never understood the fixation with "time played" as the prime metric for determining quality. Unless you're just playing a game to pass the time and not to enjoy it or anything like that. Sure, 2 minutes in heaven is better than 1 minute, but I've played some games with 60-100 hours of gameplay that frankly were just time sinks when I step back and look at it. Sure, I played a lot of Oblivion, but I'd much rather play a significantly shorter game that is of actual quality.

 

And let's not forget that the 12 hour expansion is roughly 1,5-2 times as long as the average AAA title, these days. Kind of a ludicrous thing to call out the game for.

Those AAA games are not an RPG in which I want to become immersed. They had such an interesting setting and a great opportunity to mix mechanics with and economic simulation; wasted it. Most of these DLC are overshadowed by some mods out there and these are free. I expect a higher level of quality from game developers, something that will have some bearing on the game's universe not a free potato knife.

 

Regular DRM with a great with me, these cheap gifts DLCs are hurting their own cause. When you go watch a movie or listen to music you get a whole song/movie, if a new version is made it's built upon the original and serves to enhance it. BW's DLC make the game look fragmented, they are so small that is hard to measure any contribution they make to the overall experience. Plus, a lot of these are cheap DLC are going to get pirated, because that's the only way that your Shepard is going to get his Umbra visor.

[Thorton_AP]

Regular DRM with a great with me, these cheap gifts DLCs are hurting their own cause.

 

Most of these DLC are overshadowed by some mods out there and these are free. I expect a higher level of quality from game developers, something that will have some bearing on the game's universe not a free potato knife.

 

Most of the people playing the game don't have access to free mods.

 

I doubt that the DLCs are hurting their causes that much. It's probably more likely that they keep doing them because it's more successful than you'd like it to be.

Edited May 12, 2010 by Thorton_AP

[Nepenthe]

Those AAA games are not an RPG in which I want to become immersed.

 

So? Different rules apply to RPGs and, say Modern Warfare 2 or whatever else the kids play these days? Let's keep our expectations (borderline) realistic.

 

Besides, I think they could have easily doubled the length of Awakening by adding some pointless filler dungeons with 3-4 types of darkspawn in the vein of the original game. I think it's much better this way, and I'm rather sorry if your immersion requires this sort of thing.

[Orogun01]

Those AAA games are not an RPG in which I want to become immersed.

 

So? Different rules apply to RPGs and, say Modern Warfare 2 or whatever else the kids play these days? Let's keep our expectations (borderline) realistic.

 

Besides, I think they could have easily doubled the length of Awakening by adding some pointless filler dungeons with 3-4 types of darkspawn in the vein of the original game. I think it's much better this way, and I'm rather sorry if your immersion requires this sort of thing.

They could had instead of adding dungeons just throw a few sidequest your way. The aspect of ruling was pretty much undermined they just throw a few choices your way once in a while, it's pretty much a hands-free arling. It rules itself

How is not realistic to ask for expansions of the same quality as their previous works?

 

@Thorton_AP: Check the Nexus site or the BiowareSocial, myriads of free mods. Some of them better than official DLC, and it's hurting their cause because its more likely that players that want an enhanced experience, yet have the previous experience of disappointing DLC will just download the pirated version. So the reward becomes useless.

[Thorton_AP]

Check the Nexus site or the BiowareSocial, myriads of free mods. Some of them better than official DLC, and it's hurting their cause because its more likely that players that want an enhanced experience, yet have the previous experience of disappointing DLC will just download the pirated version. So the reward becomes useless.

 

So how do I load those up onto my 360 or PS3 again?

 

That's what I meant by "most people don't have access to it."

 

 

Origins DLC sales exceed $1 million in November 2009. Since you're talking about stuff being "more likely," I'm surprised you haven't recognized that it's more likely that a DAO player owns it for a console.

 

Or am I just missing something?

Edited May 12, 2010 by Thorton_AP

[Orogun01]

Check the Nexus site or the BiowareSocial, myriads of free mods. Some of them better than official DLC, and it's hurting their cause because its more likely that players that want an enhanced experience, yet have the previous experience of disappointing DLC will just download the pirated version. So the reward becomes useless.

 

So how do I load those up onto my 360 or PS3 again?

 

That's what I meant by "most people don't have access to it."

 

 

Origins DLC sales exceed $1 million in November 2009. Since you're talking about stuff being "more likely," I'm surprised you haven't recognized that it's more likely that a DAO player owns it for a console.

 

Or am I just missing something?

I'm sorry I though we were talking about DLC as a DRM measure, which one assumes is PC not console.

[Thorton_AP]

People can (and do) pirate console games too.

 

 

Regardless, you're very clear on your position of not liking BioWare's game style, writing, and so forth. There are a lot of people that do, and to these people free Day One DLC is a definite positive to these people. Sounds like some of them post on this very board for that matter.

 

And even focusing on the PC, I'm still exceptionally skeptical that the release of DLC undermine's BioWare's cause any significant shape. Maybe for those such as yourself that don't really care for BioWare writing and design. It's probably no real skin off BioWare's back to release DLC for the PC if they're already doing it for the consoles, and you know they'd get heavily criticized if they didn't bother releasing the DLC for the PC.

Edited May 13, 2010 by Thorton_AP