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Well, they're trying to kill used sales because they get no money for used copies sold of a game. instead all the money goes to the pocket of the seller.


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Well, they're trying to kill used sales because they get no money for used copies sold of a game. instead all the money goes to the pocket of the seller.

 

Although there has been a few signs that customers buy more new games because they can trade in older titles to help pay for it, which is actually good for the publisher.

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When you buy a used Ford, do you have to send a percentage of the money to Ford to get new keys so it'll start again?

 

When you buy a second hand book, do you have to send money to the author because someone else read it before you?

 

If you buy a movie someone else has seen before you, should the movie industry expect to be paid again too?

 

Why on earth should games be any different? Why do game publishers expect to be paid several times for every single item they sell?

 

The greed in this industry knows no limits. It's nauseating.


Swedes, go to: Spel2, for the latest game reviews in swedish!

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The greed in this industry knows no limits. It's nauseating.

 

 

Indeed.


Notice how I can belittle your beliefs without calling you names. It's a useful skill to have particularly where you aren't allowed to call people names. It's a mistake to get too drawn in/worked up. I mean it's not life or death, it's just two guys posting their thoughts on a message board. If it were personal or face to face all the usual restraints would be in place, and we would never have reached this place in the first place. Try to remember that.

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EA tries to find a way to profit from used console game sales by limiting the ability to access online content for used game purchasers unless they purchase online access.

 

Interesting development of the scheme they pioneered with the two Bio games. Might be taking it a bit far, but frankly, I haven't played a "sports" game since Face Off about 20 years ago and an online multiplayer in ~5. I'd probably be all in uproar if it touched me in some way, but can't rustle up an iota of indignation as it is.

 

Re: movie sales: I think the studios are definitely aiming for non-transferable digital distribution. Current optical disc systems do not (thankfully) support such schemes, but I'm sure if they did, we'd be in that boat. Kind of happy they don't, I've unloaded about quite a few DVD movies to switch over to blu-ray.


You're a cheery wee bugger, Nep. Have I ever said that?

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You guys are really naive if you think that you're safe because you're not big multiplayer fans. This is just the start. If this works as intended, prepare to see games in shops for like.. $5. But then you will need a code to activate the game ($60), if you want a full featured game ($10 extra), if you want all the "extra content" (that's peculiarly enough already on the disc..) $15 and so on.

 

This is a test. If noone reacts, they will introduce it to every part of the business model.


Swedes, go to: Spel2, for the latest game reviews in swedish!

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You guys are really naive if you think that you're safe because you're not big multiplayer fans. This is just the start. If this works as intended, prepare to see games in shops for like.. $5. But then you will need a code to activate the game ($60), if you want a full featured game ($10 extra), if you want all the "extra content" (that's peculiarly enough already on the disc..) $15 and so on.

 

This is a test. If noone reacts, they will introduce it to every part of the business model.

 

and then they will be wondering, why did the piracy of their products skyrocketed so high...


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You guys are really naive if you think that you're safe because you're not big multiplayer fans. This is just the start. If this works as intended, prepare to see games in shops for like.. $5. But then you will need a code to activate the game ($60), if you want a full featured game ($10 extra), if you want all the "extra content" (that's peculiarly enough already on the disc..) $15 and so on.

 

This is a test. If noone reacts, they will introduce it to every part of the business model.

 

That's my way of thinking. Yeah this only effects sports games and online content now, but if successful its going to expand to all games and all content.

 

As someone who routinely buys used games and sales used games to buy new games (and who above that still buys new games straight out if it something I'm particularly interested in) this worries me that its going to ultimately kill the used game market. If people aren't buying used games because of a ridiculous activation fee to access all the game content then why would used game dealers keep accepting them?

 

It also makes me worried that game makers are a step closer to instituting monthly fees for all their games.

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This isn't the test-- as Nepenthe pointed out, the day-one DLC for Dragon Age and ME2 were the tests.

 

The biggest effect will be that people trying to sell used games won't be able to get as much money for them.

 

The interesting part is that EA has managed to get retailers like Gamespot on-board by cutting them into the distribution of these activation codes. (That is, they'll be able to sell the codes in-store to people who buy second-hand games.) That's imporatnt for EA because in-store promotions are still a part of their marketing efforts. If the policy remained a simple "FU" to used-game retailers, they risked losing window displays, advantageous shelf placement, employees pestering customers about pre-ordering, etc.

Edited by Enoch

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You guys are really naive if you think that you're safe because you're not big multiplayer fans. This is just the start. If this works as intended, prepare to see games in shops for like.. $5. But then you will need a code to activate the game ($60), if you want a full featured game ($10 extra), if you want all the "extra content" (that's peculiarly enough already on the disc..) $15 and so on.

 

This is a test. If noone reacts, they will introduce it to every part of the business model.

 

 

Couldn't agree more. Like 1000%.

 

It is absolutely a test to see how far gamers can be pushed. And I'll tell you right now, gamers are not, as a group, the most savy consumers on the planet.

 

Lemmings is a better word, I think.

 

Publishers know this, and now the technology is now in place to really exploit the heck out of it.

 

 

It also makes me worried that game makers are a step closer to instituting monthly fees for all their games.

 

 

It's coming. The MMORPG model will be applied to all games. Games will no longer be a product that is bought once and used; they will be a service that is subscribed to and paid for on a recurring basis.

 

 

The ironic thing is that games today are so weak compared to 5 years ago, that there is little motivation to play them.

 

 

The interesting part is that EA has managed to get retailers like Gamespot on-board by cutting them into the distribution of these activation codes. (That is, they'll be able to sell the codes in-store to people who buy second-hand games.) That's imporatnt for EA because in-store promotions are still a part of their marketing efforts. If the policy remained a simple "FU" to used-game retailers, they risked losing window displays, advantageous shelf placement, employees pestering customers about pre-ordering, etc.

 

 

And what the retail stores don't get is that they are living on borrowed time. As soon as the publisher controlled content becomes accepted and embraced by the consumer, BOOM!, the retail stores are going to get cut out and die. Publishers aren't sharing their cash with anyone they don't have to. But for the moment, they need the retail stores to enable the transition.

Edited by Slowtrain

Notice how I can belittle your beliefs without calling you names. It's a useful skill to have particularly where you aren't allowed to call people names. It's a mistake to get too drawn in/worked up. I mean it's not life or death, it's just two guys posting their thoughts on a message board. If it were personal or face to face all the usual restraints would be in place, and we would never have reached this place in the first place. Try to remember that.

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When you buy a used Ford, do you have to send a percentage of the money to Ford to get new keys so it'll start again?

 

When you buy a used Ford, do you get the exact same warranty coverage that the person who bought the car new received?

 

Just looking at this from a different angle... so let's skip the posts that flame me for wholeheartedly supporting this plan (I don't), etc etc.

Edited by skuld1

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The interesting part is that EA has managed to get retailers like Gamespot on-board by cutting them into the distribution of these activation codes. (That is, they'll be able to sell the codes in-store to people who buy second-hand games.) That's imporatnt for EA because in-store promotions are still a part of their marketing efforts. If the policy remained a simple "FU" to used-game retailers, they risked losing window displays, advantageous shelf placement, employees pestering customers about pre-ordering, etc.

And what the retail stores don't get is that they are living on borrowed time. As soon as the publisher controlled content becomes accepted and embraced by the consumer, BOOM!, the retail stores are going to get cut out and die. Publishers aren't sharing their cash with anyone they don't have to. But for the moment, they need the retail stores to enable the transition.

I don't think the retailers are stupid-- they probably know better than anyone else the competitive pressures that their business model faces. The end may well be in sight for brick-and-mortar game specialty shops regardless of any deals they make with publishers. Download services like Steam and XBLA, online retailers like Amazon and publisher-run stores, and big-box retailers like Best Buy, Wal-Mart, and Target are all competing for their market share. The current advantage that the Gamestops of the world have in this market is that the public sees them as the place to go to trade in old games for credit to buy new ones. This new EA policy is a direct strike at that advantage, but they agreed to this because they know that there's little they can do to stop it, and getting a tiny cut for themselves is probably the best way to preserve their business for the time being.

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This isn't the test-- as Nepenthe pointed out, the day-one DLC for Dragon Age and ME2 were the tests.

 

The biggest effect will be that people trying to sell used games won't be able to get as much money for them.

 

The interesting part is that EA has managed to get retailers like Gamespot on-board by cutting them into the distribution of these activation codes. (That is, they'll be able to sell the codes in-store to people who buy second-hand games.) That's imporatnt for EA because in-store promotions are still a part of their marketing efforts. If the policy remained a simple "FU" to used-game retailers, they risked losing window displays, advantageous shelf placement, employees pestering customers about pre-ordering, etc.

 

It's impossible to tell what the full implications of this are. Some conspiracy theorists are indeed going to push the "you pay 60 $ for the media, and then 10 $ to actually play the game in the future" angle (I used to joke that if it were up to studios, dvds and blu-rays would only include the audio tracks in SDDS format - which can't be decoded by home players), but I think this is more an attempt to target Gamestop and similars re-retailers and redistribute the money generated by the used games market (so that the profit gets divided between the retailer and the publisher). The interesting part is what this does to the pricing of the used games, will they try to sell used "crippled" copies for ~5 $ less than retail, or will the price for those go down, and what will the effect be on the buy-in price.

 

When the game companies pull something like the Assassin's Creed DRM scheme, I'll definitely join in on the uproar. But when something does not touch me in any way, I refuse to join in on the "sky is falling" groupthink just because somebody tells me that it's the beginning of the end. I'm perfectly okay with what EA is doing right now, and I'm not seeing anything even close to an "escalation" in the scheme right now, it's just the ME2/DAO scheme applied in a sports game context.


You're a cheery wee bugger, Nep. Have I ever said that?

ahyes.gifReapercussionsahyes.gif

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I don't think the retailers are stupid-- they probably know better than anyone else the competitive pressures that their business model faces. The end may well be in sight for brick-and-mortar game specialty shops regardless of any deals they make with publishers. Download services like Steam and XBLA, online retailers like Amazon and publisher-run stores, and big-box retailers like Best Buy, Wal-Mart, and Target are all competing for their market share. The current advantage that the Gamestops of the world have in this market is that the public sees them as the place to go to trade in old games for credit to buy new ones. This new EA policy is a direct strike at that advantage, but they agreed to this because they know that there's little they can do to stop it, and getting a tiny cut for themselves is probably the best way to preserve their business for the time being.

 

 

You're probably right. Around where I live brick and mortar record and book stores are pretty much all gone. Crunched out-of-buisness-by both online DLing and on-line shopping. Some of the big chains are hanging in, but they can afford to provide additional services beyond straight retail. So it's probably inevitable that dedicated video retail are all ready looking at their last days.

 

It seems rather silly of them to just agree with whatever schemes publishers come up with though. They should be fighting to keep as much control out of the publisher's hands as possible, just to ensure their own survival. Maybe there just isn't really a choice.

 

Anyway, I don't think its going to be too long until hardcopy games aren't even made anymore. AT this point Best Buy and Wal Mart simply won't have anything to sell. WHich frankly isn't a bad thing. Wal Mart all ready has way too much power over the entertainment industries. Nopt having to depend on getting shelf space from them would probably be an overall good thing for games.


Notice how I can belittle your beliefs without calling you names. It's a useful skill to have particularly where you aren't allowed to call people names. It's a mistake to get too drawn in/worked up. I mean it's not life or death, it's just two guys posting their thoughts on a message board. If it were personal or face to face all the usual restraints would be in place, and we would never have reached this place in the first place. Try to remember that.

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It looks like Steam lifted an .exe from pirate group for their Max Payne 2 release.


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Eschalon: Book 2 was released today! I just bought it and am downloading it now.. 13-14KB/s.. I'm guessing their servers are getting hammered by eager fans or something.

 

If you didn't play the original Eschalon (Book 1), I can recommend it. It's extremely old school, but very charming and clever.


Swedes, go to: Spel2, for the latest game reviews in swedish!

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Anyway, I don't think its going to be too long until hardcopy games aren't even made anymore. AT this point Best Buy and Wal Mart simply won't have anything to sell. WHich frankly isn't a bad thing. Wal Mart all ready has way too much power over the entertainment industries. Nopt having to depend on getting shelf space from them would probably be an overall good thing for games.

 

I don't really see that ever being the case, unless they figure out some way to get super high speed internet to pretty much everyone. I agree that it will be marginalized eventually, but I think we will always have a presence in stores.

 

Music would probably be the first to make the fully digital transition, as a song is a relatively small amount of data and can be downloaded faster than movies or games. But I think there will always be a market for CD's, even if it shrinks considerably.

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Eschalon: Book 2 was released today! I just bought it and am downloading it now.. 13-14KB/s.. I'm guessing their servers are getting hammered by eager fans or something.

 

If you didn't play the original Eschalon (Book 1), I can recommend it. It's extremely old school, but very charming and clever.

They couldn't wait for another month. This is month is hell.

 

Oh well. Do tell your impressions once you play it a little.


1.13 killed off Ja2.

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Anyway, I don't think its going to be too long until hardcopy games aren't even made anymore. AT this point Best Buy and Wal Mart simply won't have anything to sell. WHich frankly isn't a bad thing. Wal Mart all ready has way too much power over the entertainment industries. Nopt having to depend on getting shelf space from them would probably be an overall good thing for games.

 

I don't really see that ever being the case, unless they figure out some way to get super high speed internet to pretty much everyone. I agree that it will be marginalized eventually, but I think we will always have a presence in stores.

 

Music would probably be the first to make the fully digital transition, as a song is a relatively small amount of data and can be downloaded faster than movies or games. But I think there will always be a market for CD's, even if it shrinks considerably.

 

 

I totally agree that there will most likely be those outside the range of high speed internet for a while still. However, at some point, it won't be financilally worthwhile for publishers to print up and ship a small number of hardcopy games just for those folks. I'm not sayiong iot will happen tomorrow, but within a few years I expect it will be no longer possible to purchase hardcopy games.

 

Music, I think is a little different in that there will always be "audiophiles" who insist on having a piece of music on a piece of plastic. I've never met any "gameophiles" who insist games plays better out of the box then when downloaded. lol.

 

Although I'm sure there are a few.


Notice how I can belittle your beliefs without calling you names. It's a useful skill to have particularly where you aren't allowed to call people names. It's a mistake to get too drawn in/worked up. I mean it's not life or death, it's just two guys posting their thoughts on a message board. If it were personal or face to face all the usual restraints would be in place, and we would never have reached this place in the first place. Try to remember that.

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Anyway, I don't think its going to be too long until hardcopy games aren't even made anymore. AT this point Best Buy and Wal Mart simply won't have anything to sell. WHich frankly isn't a bad thing. Wal Mart all ready has way too much power over the entertainment industries. Nopt having to depend on getting shelf space from them would probably be an overall good thing for games.

 

I don't really see that ever being the case, unless they figure out some way to get super high speed internet to pretty much everyone. I agree that it will be marginalized eventually, but I think we will always have a presence in stores.

 

Music would probably be the first to make the fully digital transition, as a song is a relatively small amount of data and can be downloaded faster than movies or games. But I think there will always be a market for CD's, even if it shrinks considerably.

 

 

I totally agree that there will most likely be those outside the range of high speed internet for a while still. However, at some point, it won't be financilally worthwhile for publishers to print up and ship a small number of hardcopy games just for those folks. I'm not sayiong iot will happen tomorrow, but within a few years I expect it will be no longer possible to purchase hardcopy games.

 

Music, I think is a little different in that there will always be "audiophiles" who insist on having a piece of music on a piece of plastic. I've never met any "gameophiles" who insist games plays better out of the box then when downloaded. lol.

 

Although I'm sure there are a few.

 

After thinking on it a bit, you are probably right that eventually stores will stop selling hardcopy games. People will probably just order them online if they really want it on DVD's.

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