F3: Mothership Zeta screens & short article

[Malcador]

I think this is really their approach to any game and setting, it seems to me that they are much more interested in what's fun and cool and not so much if it all fits together. Now alot of bad can be said about that, but there are some companies that forget their games need to be playable and not just have a coherent and good idea. Both approaches are bad, but the former at least works.

 

Yep, all about the "cool sh**" it seems. Sad, but I guess all gaming's that way.

[TwinkieGorilla]

And missed the point completly again..

 

yeah, you got me. let's have it then. your point for correcting me would have been what, exactly?

[Rosbjerg]

And missed the point completly again..

 

yeah, you got me. let's have it then. your point for correcting me would have been what, exactly?

 

Okay I was just being an asshat..

 

It was two seperate points, I did think you were serious at first, so my second post was just to prove how hard it is to tell wether people are joking or being serious and how easy it is to say that you were only joking when people call you on it.. Not the best way to do it though..

[Pop]

As far as content fitting or not fitting the Fallout setting, I'm of the mind that all that's really needed for something to be acceptable in a Fallout game is to look a the established vision that was created, as a gestalt conception, and consider if it's possible that the content being added could exist in the same gameworld. As far as Mothership Zeta goes, there were aliens in the first two games, both as encounters in F2 and an "easter egg" of a sort in F1, although since you could take the blaster out of that easter egg encounter and use it throughout the gameworld, I'm inclined to call it "hidden content" rather than an "easter egg", unless we're willing to argue that acquiring the alien blaster turns all game content after that into an extended joke, and that sort of leap seems pointless to me. Aliens could certainly exist in Fallout I think. The criticism that their plan in MZ doesn't make sense is a valid one, however. I think that's one thing you can definitely discredit Bethsoft for in Fallout 3 and elsewhere - you meet Mr. Burke in Megaton and he doesn't really have any reason at all to destroy Megaton aside from the fact that he hates it, and he's evil, and the sequence of blowing it up would look cool. If they were going to include an alien plot that made sense internally, they'd be, I don't know, beings who can survive in polluted and irradiated areas, and so they invade rather than destroy.

 

But given the criteria I outlined (again, possibility of existence) the DLC thus far doesn't really break the Fallout setting. Weird mutations are par for the Fallout course - the original game was going to have talking, mutated raccoons. Some of the stuff in the OC does, however, like the android. Robotics in Fallout have been of the huge and metallic type, towards the prehistoric end of the spectrum (even with the use of live brains as hard drives / processors), so it doesn't make much sense that Canterbury Commons would suddenly be able to advance all the way to synthetic flesh, which is far-future tech. I think we can reasonably assume that Obsidz will not make the same mistakes. Bethsoft failed in other respects, such as making super mutants simple and uninteresting, but few of the things they've done can be said to have actually broken the setting.

Edited July 15, 2009 by Pop

[Kjarista]

You know, with Point Lookout and now this, it's like Bethesda doesn't even really care about the Fallout franchise anymore. Why did they even buy the right's to Fallout when they are now completely ignoring it all together now?

 

They should have just made a game called Capitol Wasteland.

 

Cry more?

 

Seriously, I don't understand the alien thing, but Point Lookout was a blast...the best yet, and FO3 is one good game, despite the lamentations of the self proclaimed RP(g) Nazis.

 

So...

 

Can't really get beyond

 

Cry More?

[newc0253]

I think I'd be a lot more into all the Fallout DLC if it weren't such an enormous pain to install via Windows Live.

 

Not only do you have to log into Windows Live to download it but you've also gotta log in to play it. It's a frakking grind.

[Malcador]

You know, with Point Lookout and now this, it's like Bethesda doesn't even really care about the Fallout franchise anymore. Why did they even buy the right's to Fallout when they are now completely ignoring it all together now?

 

They should have just made a game called Capitol Wasteland.

 

Cry more?

 

Seriously, I don't understand the alien thing, but Point Lookout was a blast...the best yet, and FO3 is one good game, despite the lamentations of the self proclaimed RP(g) Nazis.

 

So...

 

Can't really get beyond

 

Cry More?

 

Sweet, we're Nazis now (kind of fitting given my avatar...well not to slur the entire Wehrmacht).

Edited July 16, 2009 by Malcador

[bhlaab]

You know, with Point Lookout and now this, it's like Bethesda doesn't even really care about the Fallout franchise anymore. Why did they even buy the right's to Fallout when they are now completely ignoring it all together now?

 

They should have just made a game called Capitol Wasteland.

 

Cry more?

 

Seriously, I don't understand the alien thing, but Point Lookout was a blast...the best yet, and FO3 is one good game, despite the lamentations of the self proclaimed RP(g) Nazis.

 

So...

 

Can't really get beyond

 

Cry More?

 

Don't cry for Fallout 3, it's already dead

Edited July 16, 2009 by bhlaab

[Syraxis]

Not only do you have to log into Windows Live to download it but you've also gotta log in to play it. It's a frakking grind.

 

That's all a thing of the past.

[Killian Kalthorne]

I think I'd be a lot more into all the Fallout DLC if it weren't such an enormous pain to install via Windows Live.

 

Not only do you have to log into Windows Live to download it but you've also gotta log in to play it. It's a frakking grind.

 

No, you don't.

 

I have played Fallout 3 on the PC without activating live. You also don't need to buy the DLCs on live either. They have put the first two DLCs on disc and the others will be following soon enough.

[TwinkieGorilla]

who's crying? i'm ****ing laughing my ass off!

[Killian Kalthorne]

Don't cry for Fallout 3, it's already dead

 

No, its not. Its a freaking good game getting better and better DLCs. I don't see how Mothership Zeta isn't any worse than the constant pop culture references in Fallout 2. So far Fallout 2 is the worse of the bunch in the series, not counting FOPOS and FOT. It was either J.E. or Chris Avellone that once said that game companies don't make games just for you and twelve angry pygmies. They make games and expansions to make money. Don't like it. Don't buy it. Problem solved. All the bi**hing in the world won't change a thing.

Edited July 16, 2009 by Killian Kalthorne

[Malcador]

Great game, hah right. It was an ok game - then again, the games called great these days... Haven't bothered with the DLC as I'm opposed to that nickel and dime concept (granted I can get it via RELOADED or something but feh). Pop culture references are one thing (they weren't constant, frequent maybe) but an entire quest to save the earth from alien invasion is a bit off to me. Funny though, how discussion's for those that only like, heh.

 

Also, Twinkie - what the hell is your avatar ? Some sort of demonic owl?

Edited July 16, 2009 by Malcador

[Killian Kalthorne]

It is the second best game I have played so far on the XBox 360. I am for the DLC system if the DLCs add in substantial material while OA was lacking the others are decent. The pop culture references were too frequent and broke the mood of the game. Way too many for my tastes. They pretty much ruined Fallout 2 for me.

Edited July 16, 2009 by Killian Kalthorne

[bhlaab]

Don't cry for Fallout 3, it's already dead

 

No, its not. Its a freaking good game getting better and better DLCs. I don't see how Mothership Zeta isn't any worse than the constant pop culture references in Fallout 2. So far Fallout 2 is the worse of the bunch in the series, not counting FOPOS and FOT. It was either J.E. or Chris Avellone that once said that game companies don't make games just for you and twelve angry pygmies. They make games and expansions to make money. Don't like it. Don't buy it. Problem solved. All the bi**hing in the world won't change a thing.

 

You don't see how a character happening to say a line that was also said by someone in the Goonies is different than going into outer space and killing the space aliens on the mothership? You don't see how that kind of, I dunno, conflicts with the whole "dirty low-fi science fiction struggle for survival" thing? Just a little bit?

 

Fine. Aliens worked so well for Indiana Jones; why not?

[Malcador]

Hey, wouldn't it be awesome if one of those abductees you meet in the DLC is....the Vault Dweller!.

[Killian Kalthorne]

Its the whole 1950s alien invasion plot. I don't see anything wrong with it. No one is forcing you to buy it so don't. Me, I don't really care as long as it is fun to play. Life is too short to get hung up on such trivial matters.

[bhlaab]

Hey, wouldn't it be awesome if one of those abductees you meet in the DLC is....the Vault Dweller!.

 

If that happens i will put a knife into my ear.

 

You know, the end of Van Buren was gonna be you go into outer space. The idea kind of makes me "ehhh", but here's the major difference: They had a good reason to go. They had good reasons why the space station was there, and how you would get to it.

The talking death claws in Fallout 2 I can deal with because they explained where they came from, what their motivations are. Yeah "Enclave experiments" is kind of a lazy explanation, but at least it's there.

 

Zeta looks to be: "The aliens are pissed! Go and take 'em out, soldier!"

I'm really really hoping there's some sort of twist at the end of this DLC where it's like "oh, the aliens were just mutants all along" which would make it sort of okay... but I know it's not gonna happen.

[Malcador]

Its the whole 1950s alien invasion plot. I don't see anything wrong with it. No one is forcing you to buy it so don't. Me, I don't really care as long as it is fun to play. Life is too short to get hung up on such trivial matters.

 

Who's getting hung up. And really, bashing the idea here with the varying levels of intensity isn't akin to us rallying folk to sack and pillage Bethesda's offices (or just getting really angry over it I guess). Alien invasion is a 50's theme, but as somone said - not everything that was big in the 1950's will fit in Fallout. Not to mention the aliens seem a bit weird, assuming they're coming to conquer the planet as it's in pretty awful shape.

Edited July 16, 2009 by Malcador

[bhlaab]

Its the whole 1950s alien invasion plot. I don't see anything wrong with it. No one is forcing you to buy it so don't. Me, I don't really care as long as it is fun to play. Life is too short to get hung up on such trivial matters.

 

gee, thanks for sharing your passionate convictions

[Jaesun]

You know, with Point Lookout and now this, it's like Bethesda doesn't even really care about the Fallout franchise anymore. Why did they even buy the right's to Fallout when they are now completely ignoring it all together now?

 

They should have just made a game called Capitol Wasteland.

 

Cry more?

 

Seriously, I don't understand the alien thing, but Point Lookout was a blast...the best yet, and FO3 is one good game, despite the lamentations of the self proclaimed RP(g) Nazis.

 

So...

 

Can't really get beyond

 

Cry More?

 

r00fles!

[jjc]

In the first Fallout, they're satirizing some of the attitudes of 1950s America in materials like the Vault-Tec ads but the actual visual design of a lot of the pre-war stuff in the world is rooted in the 30s and the 40s. Look at the ruined skyline in the opening video. Those buildings resemble the gothic deco cathedral the Children were using. The first two games indicate that the pre-apocalyptic world was a lot like Blade Runner or Brazil, which the team cite as major influences. You don't find the ruins of idyllic 50s TV suburbia because that's not what was there. It's why Tenpenny Tower doesn't look like anything you saw in the first game.

 

Since Fallout 3 tossed a lot of the original design ideas in favor of a more prominent 50s theme, you can argue that referencing more 50s sci-fi movies is fair game. There's lots of territory that hasn't been mined, since Fallout 1 and 2 drew from 50s films far less frequently than they did those of the 60s through the 80s. If your choice is a laser battle against little green men, then your point of reference is probably something along the lines of Invasion of the Saucer Men and your goal is probably high camp. I would point to THQ's success with the Destroy All Humans! series as a validation of this approach.

Edited July 16, 2009 by jjc

[Tagaziel]

But given the criteria I outlined (again, possibility of existence) the DLC thus far doesn't really break the Fallout setting. Weird mutations are par for the Fallout course - the original game was going to have talking, mutated raccoons.

 

Which were cut, duhh.

 

Bethsoft failed in other respects, such as making super mutants simple and uninteresting, but few of the things they've done can be said to have actually broken the setting.

 

I can name a dew:

 

* Reappearance of the Enclave with the exact same MO

* Brotherhood being an Oblivionesque Paladin Order, instead of hardcore professionals pursuing their goal singlemindendly (arguably, Outcasts make up for that to a degree)

* Brotherhood being on the East Coast due to receiving reports of Supermutant activity in the DC ruins

* Vault-Tec doing FEV research (plot device from FOPOS)

* Vault dedicated to FEV research (FOPOS)

* Allistair Tenpenny arriving in the US and A from Great Britain. Whiskey Tango Foxtrot, over.

* Town built around a nuclear bomb with a perfectly good pre-war settlement a five minute walk from it. (no city in the previous games commited such an idiocy)

* Carefree, juvenile use of nuclear energy (Megaton's nuke, the Fat Man nuclear catapult and its unique variant, the Experimental MIRV, exploding nuclear weapons, a warehouse full of nuclear bombs, Vertibirds with nuclear minibombs and a massive robot throwing nuclear bombs at everything that moves.)

 

The last one requires some elaboration. In all other games (even FOT), nuclear energy was feared and respected. In Fo1, Fo2 and FOT, the very weapons that extinguished most of human civilization are used to save what remains of it and feature inly in the very endgame. In short, their use can be summarized by this quotation from a Supermutant Sergeant guarding the nuke underneath the Cathedral:

 

{201}{}{Hey, this looks like a nuclear bomb. Why is it here?}

{202}{}{This is our Master's weapon of last resort. If we find an enemy we cannot defeat in battle, then we will destroy them with this. But I doubt this will ever happen. Even our Master does not want to unleash the dreaded power of the atom again!}

 

Source: http://fallout.wikia.com/wiki/GENSARG.MSG

[213374U]

Yeah, they respected and feared nuclear energy so much, that the only place they could store a 80 year old nuke was under the nose of their revered and irreplaceable leader. No chance it would go off, no sirree. No chance in hell. I mean, the President feels perfectly safe doing that too, so keeping nuclear explosives within arm's reach must be a staple of the setting or something.

 

But yeah, Bethesda's "everything is nucular!" approach is fairly retarded. AND it serves no purpose, unlike in FO1/2.

[Tagaziel]

Yeah, they respected and feared nuclear energy so much, that the only place they could store a 80 year old nuke was under the nose of their revered and irreplaceable leader. No chance it would go off, no sirree. No chance in hell. I mean, the President feels perfectly safe doing that too, so keeping nuclear explosives within arm's reach must be a staple of the setting or something.

 

Uh, if you read the dialogue file, it's stored in the Cathedral because:

 

a. It's the most secure location the Unity has

b. It's their ultimate last resort weapon

c. The nuclear detonation key is in a separate location - on the opposite end of the game map, actually

d. They keep it in top condition at all times

e. They monitor it 24/7/365/100

 

So yeah, there is no chance in hell that it'd go off on its own or someone to sneak in and detonate it. Unless he's the player character, but as we all know, PCs are a very special case.