TSL Story From a Writers Perspective

[Althernai]

1) Your Character Does Not Have Amnesia

 

This is one of the major problems with TSL from the start because while the Exile doesn't have amnesia... You, as the player, are forced to play the game as if you did and that, right there, is why this game feels disjointed because I don't think Obsidian properly balanced discovering your past with living in your present.

 

I partially agree. It was highly annoying to have no idea what your character is talking about because you didn't talk to one of the NPCs about the subject. However, consider this: how else could you do this? They wanted to do a character with a history. How else would you do this without having the player start at a relatively high level and without having the player read a biography before the beginning of the game? Determining the past with dialogue options is actually one of the better ideas I can think of.

 

The problem is that this is not done very well in TSL. You simply don't get large portions of the game's story unless you have high Influence with your companions. And here is the really bad part: if you roleplay certain kinds of characters (e.g. a fully LS Jedi) and you roleplay them without metagaming for Influence, you will miss out on a lot. There is no option to be persuasive while sticking to your ideals; you have to say what the characters want to hear (even if it contradicts your character's personality) or you might not know what's going on.

 

(Aside: Personally, I am growing very, very tired of "I have a dark past, but you don't know that" and, more specifically, "In the past, thousands have died due to my actions, but you don't know that either." PS:T, KotOR, TSL... enough is enough. Think of something new.)

 

2) Most of The Party Members Have No Motivation to Join You and Vice Versa

 

I realize that this is an RPG and you have to make some sacrifices in order to have a game...

 

You answer your own complaint. That said, let's look at them individually:

 

You have no problem with Kreia, Visas or G0-T0.

 

Handmaiden joins you because Atris orders her to and you have the opportunity to change her mind. I haven't played with a female character, but I get the impression that the Disciple is serving the Republic and he joins you to observe. Also, both could be attracted to the protagonist.

 

Mira/Hanharr... I agree with you. I have no idea why they join.

 

HK-47 and T3-M3 just come with the ship.

 

Bao-Dur is quite loyal to you because of the past. He also has very little to do when you meet.

 

Mandalore... he makes sense for the missions that you have to take him on, but not for the rest of the time. Perhaps he has learned from experience that where there is a Jedi on a quest, there is some serious combat and he wants to take part?

 

Atton: See the posts above. You interpreted him very differently from most people.

 

However, being ambiguous is not an excuse for not delivering a solid and emotionally satisfying ending.

 

And that is the real problem. If they had come up with a good ending, you would have gotten a very different reception here had you come with your first two points. The ending is the last part people see and often the reaction at the ending is what remains with the audience. I agree with you here. The ending was simply not of the same quality as the rest of the game. The cut bits and pieces... well, for one thing it is not absolutely clear what they intended and for another, perhaps there was more that simply wasn't included. Also, it might be that they realized killing everyone off was not the best of ideas.

 

A lot is missing from this game and while it is not bad, it is far from being great. Too bad... it had potential.

[Zilod]

I think that the point of view of the game is not a force perspective at all, i don't think they want to address a grey vision of the force, but a human vision of it.

 

In my opinion most of the things that Kreia points too are these, she is trying to show you how a man to be complete have to draw from his inner strenght, on what he is.

 

The example of the beggare is interesting for the vision it gives to consequences of actions and to some point even to the bad that can result from a kind action, this is a digression i agree, but i think that the central point storywise is another.

 

Kreia is trying to demostrate that what a man gain from fate or kindess is not a real gain, i man to grow have to face his problem and his situation and should try in first person to face it and fight to resolve it.

 

It could be a similar tought as the prince of Macchiavelli, what the fate gives the fate can take back so a man should rely on his own strenght to forge his luck.

 

It could be quite a cinical tought, but is very appropriate for Kreia.

 

You can apply also all of this with the force... (and it makes even more sense for the game perspective)

In the game the force is presented as something usefull but also as an obstacle that prevent to men to develope themselves. Jedis use the force to see, to act, to understande, for them is no more a tool, but something that replace their judgment, their vision, their skill. They fill their weakness with it and for this reaon they are no more able to rely on themselves.

 

Is like that someone that have his leg damaged, he have to do exercises to walk again but as he will rely on pegs (?) to walk, he will never walk again with his legs.

 

 

The journey of the Exile is this, is to understand what he really is, probably is the player himself that have to understand that... is not the level gain important, is what he represent for others.

 

As said in the other post, considering how important is the force in SW universe this is an antitetical point of view of the hero, what makes him great is not his power is that he is a man that fight with his own strenght.

 

Probably is true what you say about that the Exile doesn't change too much, but actually he doesn't have to change, he have to understand his choices, to understand what he is but not to change.

He changed on Malachor V when he chose to cut his bound with the force, in the beginning both the Exile and the player see this lack of force as a weakness, a jedi whitout the force is nothing, in the end he realize (or should do that) that the force is actually not so important and what do a Man.

 

My gaming experiance was really like that so for my experience the plot was really successfull, as i said i think that it is really a difficult one, but even the things it speak about are quite difficult, expecially considering our prejudices.

 

Then as you say a game have is limits, the cut endings have for sure not helped to make the story clearer and more compat, but i can't say anything about the story, is deep, complex and mature, for sure is difficult to understand and is not the kind of game you have to play as a normal game, but this makes it more worth in my opinion.

 

We are surrounded by banality so i can only appreciate something that try to get out of mediocrity trying to make people even think a bit and not just to entertain them.

[Aurora]

Mandalore joins because of Kriea mentioned the orders Revan gave him, he says we better watch her to his cronies. Not to mention the fact you say you served with Revan and he's obessed with Revan. And you are taking *his* ship to Onderan.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

 

Oh, that's right, I'd forgotten that scene. Still, it seemed like Mandalore was pushed around too easily, perhaps? But then, I only played LS with him so far (haven't gotten him yet in my DS game). I'll actually be able to learn more about him when I play through as a DSer. Theoretically.

 

You liked the ending of Buffy more than that of Angel? That's shocking... Angel's ending was purely fantastic, and it fit the entire mood of the series and the personality of the characters. I loved every minute of Angel's ending.

 

I didn't think it fit the series at all. The first few seasons were very much about redemption and justice and fairness and what those really meant or could mean, as ideals and in reality. The end of season 5 was about Our Heroes realizing that not only were they a bunch of idiot puppets for TPTB just LIKE THEY'D BEEN SAYING ALL SEASON TO EACH OTHER, but that everything ever was hopeless.* The hint of "life is hard, but we do what we can to make it better" was brutally crushed, IMO, by the "life is hard, and we do what we can, and it's all hopeless and gee I hope that Hell isn't as bad as they say 'cause that's where we're going since we can never make up for the bad things we did, ever" theme. Oh, plus the whole Circle of the Black Thorn Club tossed in at the last minute, and all the dangly unresolved plotlines.

 

Wes died pointlessly and stupidly, in a manner that was very unfair to the character even if he had turned kinda crazy. Fred's soul was utterly destroyed, just to show that Bad Things Happen To Good People Haha. Spike and Angel are damned to hell forever, because *nothing they do will ever be good enough.* Gunn's going to die, who knows what'll happen to him. Lindsay wanted to redeem himself in some manner but had to be killed by Lorne because Angel decided he might've been wishy-washy and they couldn't take the risk, the risk that ultimately wouldn't have mattered anyway. Lorne actually had the fairest ending: he ran away because he didn't ultimately care too much about good versus evil. Illyria might be killed, or might survive by punching the hell out of everything. Harmony ran off, because she was never meant to be redeemed and a joke of a character anyway. Cordelia died in her sleep, ultimately the result of a demon pregnancy (which is the WORST plot device ever, although I adored the Jasmine arc), because Joss was pissed at the actress: at least she got to say goodbye in a way, I suppose.

 

I didn't hate it as much as it probably sounds from this post, but I think the show deserved a lot, lot better.

 

And KotOR I isn't really about redemption, because you can be pretty evil - I know, last time I played through, I was probably quite a bit more needlessly malevolent than pre-mind-raped Revan.

 

Redemption is still the largest overall theme I can find - you were given a chance to redeem yourself in a way, and you either accepted that and went "yay redemption" or grumbled "redemption is hard" and "proved" to the world that some people can't be redeemed. I was vaguely fond of the DS ending, myself, particularly with Carth rushing in to try and save me. Ouch.

 

 

 

*Handled SO MUCH better in the fantastic elevator scene in season 2's "Reprise."

[Aurora]

Well, GO-TO and HK-47 aren't scarred; they're both perfectly content with themselves. But I don't suppose that's quite what you were looking for. :D

 

Yeah, I also said that someone who wasn't going to be a total jerk (or obviously something worse than that, as I got all censored) to me. Although HK is really quite polite... bah!

 

The character-angsty-backgrounds felt very similar to those in PST: but it made more sense there, at least. I wasn't particularly thrilled with it popping up here, though not because it's Star Wars.

 

I do agree that the scrapped endings are *more* emotionally satisfying than the current ending and I'd prefer them. Still unecessarily negative, unless the self-sacrifice bits are still in there somewhere. If they'd been in, I would have felt like it was far more of a complete game than it is now.

 

 

(Aside: Personally, I am growing very, very tired of "I have a dark past, but you don't know that" and, more specifically, "In the past, thousands have died due to my actions, but you don't know that either." PS:T, KotOR, TSL... enough is enough. Think of something new.)

 

Totally agree: granted, those games are all in my top ten (along with BG2, where even if you're good you're somewhat indirectly responsible for the deaths of thousands of innocents), but it's getting pretty tiresome. And this is coming from someone who isn't particularly tired of amnesia as a plot point.

 

When I heard that the PC for NWN2 was going to have a set background, my first thought was "Great! I get to play a mass murderer again!" I hope this isn't true.

[gamesneal]

The constant Deus Ex Machinas in the game was poor writing. Kreia developing a magic power to off the Coucil with a flick of her wrist, at the end she has all kinds of skills with a lightsaber even if you never leveled her up in that way. Sion automatically coming back to life on Korridan. If you do that planet towards the end my crew was stomping him in one round.

Likewise handmaiden stomped Atris in my game but in a cutscene Atris winning. Mira taking out your jedi, no matter the level difference. The reason your followers join you is your "magic" power to attract followers.

Of course the main thing is you can not get rid of Kreia even thought you think she is a Sith Lord.

[Tanuvein]

I didn't think it fit the series at all. The first few seasons were very much about redemption and justice and fairness and what those really meant or could mean, as ideals and in reality. The end of season 5 was about Our Heroes realizing that not only were they a bunch of idiot puppets for TPTB just LIKE THEY'D BEEN SAYING ALL SEASON TO EACH OTHER, but that everything ever was hopeless.* The hint of "life is hard, but we do what we can to make it better" was brutally crushed, IMO, by the "life is hard, and we do what we can, and it's all hopeless and gee I hope that Hell isn't as bad as they say 'cause that's where we're going since we can never make up for the bad things we did, ever" theme. Oh, plus the whole Circle of the Black Thorn Club tossed in at the last minute, and all the dangly unresolved plotlines.

 

Wes died pointlessly and stupidly, in a manner that was very unfair to the character even if he had turned kinda crazy. Fred's soul was utterly destroyed, just to show that Bad Things Happen To Good People Haha. Spike and Angel are damned to hell forever, because *nothing they do will ever be good enough.* Gunn's going to die, who knows what'll happen to him. Lindsay wanted to redeem himself in some manner but had to be killed by Lorne because Angel decided he might've been wishy-washy and they couldn't take the risk, the risk that ultimately wouldn't have mattered anyway. Lorne actually had the fairest ending: he ran away because he didn't ultimately care too much about good versus evil. Illyria might be killed, or might survive by punching the hell out of everything. Harmony ran off, because she was never meant to be redeemed and a joke of a character anyway.  Cordelia died in her sleep, ultimately the result of a demon pregnancy (which is the WORST plot device ever, although I adored the Jasmine arc), because Joss was pissed at the actress: at least she got to say goodbye in a way, I suppose.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

 

I wouldn't say the first few seasons were about justice or fairness at all, but rather how, despite trying for redemption, evil can corrupt and destroy. Never were the good guys ever on the winning side. Season 1 was very episodic and still trying to find its own style. Season 2, Angel was responsible for more cruelty than most other characters in the show.

 

I don't think the 'life is hard, we'll do what we can' changed at all. Because life was still hard. And what did they do? Everything they could. They destroyed Wolfram and Hart's hold on the world, at least for a good time. And that's the best you can do. Evil will never be destroyed, no more than good, and one side can never triumph permanantly over the other. The best you can do is make the world better for a while.

 

What unresolved plot lines are you talking about, by the way? And the Circle of Black Thorns had been hinted at since the beginning of the season.

 

I wouldn't say Wes died pointlessly and stupidly, but I would have preferred to see it more elaborate. However, this ties into my next point: Fred's soul was destroyed? What? Did you watch the show? Illyria, the evil hell demon, became more and more human BECAUSE of Fred's soul. She learned to care, to fight for something greater than herself, and ultimately to love... she wanted revenge for Wes' death, and his falling showed how much she had grown.

 

And who says Spike and Angel are damned to hell? Spike considers himself redeemed. The only person who thinks Angel needs to keep suffering and struggling for redemption was Angel himself.

 

As for Lindsey, the fact Angel hated him probably had something to do with it. Angel had no problem killing people he hated, especially if he thought it was for the best. Sure, sometimes he tried to redeem people... but not all the time. He loved Darla, once, in an evil sort of way. That's why he tried for her. He intended to murder Holtz until the man said he wanted the best for Connor and that he'd leave (tricksy bastard), he intended to murder Wes for taking Connor even though Wes obviously did what he thought was right.

 

When did Cordy die? I never saw that. When the show ends, she's still being cared for elsewhere as far as I knew. Also, how was the pregnancy the worst plot device ever? It made perfect sense.

[ShadowPaladin V1.0]

When did Cordy die? I never saw that. When the show ends, she's still being cared for elsewhere as far as I knew. Also, how was the pregnancy the worst plot device ever? It made perfect sense.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

 

Couple of episodes from the end. She's in the episode and kinda wakes Angel up to what is going on. It's the one where everyone thinks she has woken up from the coma , but right at the very end Angel gets a phonecall to say that she died and never woke up <spooky music here>

[kbned]

No offence but I'd stick to more straightforward games If I were you.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

wtf are you talking about? i dont mind a good story however it's told but this story and dialog has a lot of problems. i even exited the game every once in awhile to take a break from the bad dialog. i'll give you another example: you're flying to the northern cap of telos which happen to have hk50's patrolling in the area (even though they say your ship if you landed it outside of the shielded areas would be eaten by the atmosphere, these hk50's without any kind of ship seem to be fine. this shielded area is even bigger than the other place but it barely registers on the sensors) when you get shot down. the crew is thrown through the front of the ship and as they finally get up they see the ones who obviously shot them down. now my first dialog option is something like "why did you shoot us down" or equivalently lame. second option is "what are you doing out here". its bad enough that they were too lazy to think of a decent way to meet/recruit baodur and then go to the telos acadamy that they had your ship shot down twice. (they never explain why the lasers shot at me even though i helped cerzka) the hk50's should never have even been there but if even if they were there should be no dialog from the pc to the hk50. they shot you down, that means kill on sight not lets talk about it. wtf other reason could he possibly be thinking of that these droids shot him down? the hk50's dialog is not much better. one of them got killed by a practically unarmed jedi with no powers. how can they think they have the upperhand now? and about about the stuff hk47 said about killing jedi, if they are from his programming why dont they use any of his advice like not fighting a jedi head on with blasters?

 

 

 

 

 

and btw, stop using more blank space than actual words.

 

its really annoying.

[Tanuvein]

When did Cordy die? I never saw that. When the show ends, she's still being cared for elsewhere as far as I knew. Also, how was the pregnancy the worst plot device ever? It made perfect sense.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

 

Couple of episodes from the end. She's in the episode and kinda wakes Angel up to what is going on. It's the one where everyone thinks she has woken up from the coma , but right at the very end Angel gets a phonecall to say that she died and never woke up <spooky music here>

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

 

I somehow forgot about that

[AlanC9]

Sion automatically coming back to life on Korridan. If you do that planet towards the end my crew was stomping him in one round.

 

But that's what Sion does. Why should Sion be less powerful on Korriban than on Malachor V?

 

    Of course the main thing is you can not get rid of Kreia even thought you think she is a Sith Lord.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

 

I thought about this, but decided it didn't bug me. Even if you think she's a Sith Lord - and that's not quite true in her case - letting her run around loose isn't an improvement over keeping her on your ship. At least you can keep an eye on her aboard the Hawk.

[Taran'atar]

No offence but I'd stick to more straightforward games If I were you.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

wtf are you talking about? i dont mind a good story however it's told but this story and dialog has a lot of problems. i even exited the game every once in awhile to take a break from the bad dialog. i'll give you another example: you're flying to the northern cap of telos which happen to have hk50's patrolling in the area (even though they say your ship if you landed it outside of the shielded areas would be eaten by the atmosphere, these hk50's without any kind of ship seem to be fine. this shielded area is even bigger than the other place but it barely registers on the sensors) when you get shot down. the crew is thrown through the front of the ship and as they finally get up they see the ones who obviously shot them down. now my first dialog option is something like "why did you shoot us down" or equivalently lame. second option is "what are you doing out here". its bad enough that they were too lazy to think of a decent way to meet/recruit baodur and then go to the telos acadamy that they had your ship shot down twice. (they never explain why the lasers shot at me even though i helped cerzka) the hk50's should never have even been there but if even if they were there should be no dialog from the pc to the hk50. they shot you down, that means kill on sight not lets talk about it. wtf other reason could he possibly be thinking of that these droids shot him down? the hk50's dialog is not much better. one of them got killed by a practically unarmed jedi with no powers. how can they think they have the upperhand now? and about about the stuff hk47 said about killing jedi, if they are from his programming why dont they use any of his advice like not fighting a jedi head on with blasters?

 

 

 

 

 

and btw, stop using more blank space than actual words.

 

its really annoying.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

 

I'd have to agree with him. Stick to more "straight forward" games.

[AlanC9]

the hk50's should never have even been there but if even if they were there should be no dialog from the pc to the hk50. they shot you down, that means kill on sight not lets talk about it. wtf other reason could he possibly be thinking of that these droids shot him down?

 

Wow.... wrong from start to finish. The HK-50s aren't trying to kill the PC. They want him alive. Asking why they're after him hardly seems unreasonable.

 

 

and btw, stop using more blank space than actual words.

 

its really annoying.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

 

 

Someone who doesn't understand the concept of sentences really shouldn't be critical of other people's posting styles.

[Mondo]

The constant Deus Ex Machinas in the game was poor writing. Kreia developing a magic power to off the Coucil with a flick of her wrist, at the end she has all kinds of skills with a lightsaber even if you never leveled her up in that way. Sion automatically coming back to life on Korridan. If you do that planet towards the end my crew was stomping him in one round.

    Likewise handmaiden stomped Atris in my game but in a cutscene Atris winning. Mira taking out your jedi, no matter the level difference. The reason your followers join you is your "magic" power to attract followers.

    Of course the main thing is you can not get rid of Kreia even thought you think she is a Sith Lord.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

 

Kreia was a Sith Lord beforehand, her whole purpose in this game was figuring out how to get rid of the force. You think she wouldn't know anything besides what she learns with you?

 

Sions whole thing is he can't die. Just look at the guys skin. Not to mention them saying HE CANT DIE several times in the game.

 

Handmaiden stomps Atris if you train her I believe and in my game Atris said "enough" and uses force Lightining on Handmaiden to stop her if your beating Atris down.

 

The whole purpose you wouldn't want to be away from Kriea is your character thinks if she dies you will die because of the force bond.

[Zilod]

wtf are you talking about? i dont mind a good story however it's told but this story and dialog has a lot of problems. i even exited the game every once in awhile to take a break from the bad dialog. i'll give you another example: you're flying to the northern cap of telos which happen to have hk50's patrolling in the area (even though they say your ship if you landed it outside of the shielded areas would be eaten by the atmosphere, these hk50's without any kind of ship seem to be fine.

If you don't see their ship there it doesn't mean that they have not a ship near.

That group of hk50s is not just a patrol who is there by luck.

 

When you leave talos underground base some HK50 analyze the terminal discovering where you are going and they call for a group to intercept you in the polar area.

 

I think is likelly that they are contacting another base on the planet or on the citadel, trasmitting your coords so they can arrive there before you (with their own ship) and shot you down.

 

 

this shielded area is even bigger than the other place but it barely registers on the sensors)

Bao-dur also tells that the area seem to be cloaked and hidden.

 

and about about the stuff hk47 said about killing jedi, if they are from his programming why dont they use any of his advice like not fighting a jedi head on with blasters?

ehm and what they should use?

that model seem to have not meele capacity, they use what they are good to, also consider that at this point the Exile is considered a "half jedi" so not a powerful jedi master that reflect bolts force push like crazy and so on.

 

 

about Sion, is his nature to not to die is the same on Korriban as on Malachor V, if ininfluential if you and your comrades hammer him.... you have to crush his will, not his body.

 

 

Kreia and her powers...

I really think that Kreia is holding back (even in the final fight), is ininfluential how you make her grow, shw have her own powers, is just not showing them to you during most of the game.

She is also a bit different than a deus ex machina, she doesn't intervene (?) just to save the Exile when needed.

Is Kreia to have the control, she put that tests in front of the Exile so he can face them and "grow up", she is a player of the game and most of the other characters/enemies seem to be just pawns on her deck.

[ShadowPaladin V1.0]

Is Kreia to have the control, she put that tests in front of the Exile so he can face them and "grow up", she is a player of the game and most of the other characters/enemies seem to be just pawns on her deck.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

 

She says as much to Atton on Telos.

[kbned]

I'd have to agree with him.  Stick to more "straight forward" games.

i dont think you even know what you're saying.

Wow.... wrong from start to finish. The HK-50s aren't trying to kill the PC. They want him alive. Asking why they're after him hardly seems unreasonable.

they want him dead or alive. he's not coming with them alive so then it's got to be dead. usually people dont use a blaster on someone they intend to keep alive. the only times they do, they use a non lethal blast which these droids were not doing.

Someone who doesn't understand the concept of sentences really shouldn't be critical of other people's posting styles.

i do understand the concept of sentences. that should be pretty obvious since i've been using them quite a bit. some of what i wrote has bad grammer but still works perfectly well for what i intended.

I think is likelly that they are contacting another base on the planet or on the citadel, trasmitting your coords so they can arrive there before you (with their own ship) and shot you down. Bao-dur also tells that the area seem to be cloaked and hidden.

i thought of that though it doesnt make sense why they'd land, get out, then shoot you down. it would make more sense to shoot you once you land in person or to shoot you with their ship. i dont want to argue about their technology but it doesnt seem possible to hide their energy usage. they said they werent making their own power but taking it from another location on the planet. and shielded areas are visably shielded from the corrosive atmoshphere. i think i even saw sheild structure there though i may be wrong.

ehm and what they should use?

that model seem to have not meele capacity, they use what they are good to, also consider that at this point the Exile is considered a "half jedi" so not a powerful jedi master that reflect bolts force push like crazy and so on.

i believe he was saying suprise indirect attacks. kinda like that rocket to the ship as they were arriving but then they met them with blasters. they should not be so confident and attack head on if they see the jedi are not noticibly injured.

about Sion, is his nature to not to die is the same on Korriban as on Malachor V, if ininfluential if you and your comrades hammer him.... you have to crush his will, not his body.

you'd think his spirit would be crushed when he sees he cannot defeat anyone, even a bunch of non-jedi. still, i would prefer to just slice him in pieces and let him live out eternity in sealed containers.

[Mondo]

kbned, the HKs want him alive, why do you think the entire beginning of the game the HK was talking about how he wanted him alive so he captured him and killed the entire plant just to make sure he can take the Exile alive.

[kbned]

and i wanted to kick kreia off the ship, we dont always get what we want. they can not take the pc alive so dead is the next option. i'm pretty sure the droid on peragus said dead was fine too. one of them said it, dont know which one.

[SteveThaiBinh]

The HK-50 droids are working for Goto, aren't they? And he definitely wants you alive, to save the Republic. So they need to take you alive, which makes their choice of attack strategy at Telos (shooting down the shuttle) seem, well, overkill. Atton says it's only his flying skills that kept you from certain death. Still, I guess the HKs know their weaponry better than I do.

[witchzenka]

I write too, and as a writer found the story well done and interesting, especially as it is a video game and not literature. The characters were finely drawn, the dialogue superb. If I'd come up with Kreia I'd be patting myself on the back, let me tell you.

I'm not sure what "semi" professional is, but I don't find you "conceded" or conceited.

The droid on Peragus specifically says alive, though it mentions the possibility of fracturing the Exile's skeleton to achieve this. The HKs definately want the Exile alive. It's the meatbag mercs who decide to interpret G0T0's orders to their liking.

[Zilod]

I think is likelly that they are contacting another base on the planet or on the citadel, trasmitting your coords so they can arrive there before you (with their own ship) and shot you down. Bao-dur also tells that the area seem to be cloaked and hidden.

i thought of that though it doesnt make sense why they'd land, get out, then shoot you down. it would make more sense to shoot you once you land in person or to shoot you with their ship. i dont want to argue about their technology but it doesnt seem possible to hide their energy usage. they said they werent making their own power but taking it from another location on the planet. and shielded areas are visably shielded from the corrosive atmoshphere. i think i even saw sheild structure there though i may be wrong.

Why not, both tactics have pro and cons, maybe if they attacked the ship with their own they risked to totally destroy or that they where able to escape if they saw their ship on radar.

 

they way they acted seemed quite good to me, they ambushed the Exile and shot down the ship, then they come to capture him (if alive) while uncounscious, problem is that the exile awake before they reached him.

 

 

ehm and what they should use?

that model seem to have not meele capacity, they use what they are good to, also consider that at this point the Exile is considered a "half jedi" so not a powerful jedi master that reflect bolts force push like crazy and so on.

i believe he was saying suprise indirect attacks. kinda like that rocket to the ship as they were arriving but then they met them with blasters. they should not be so confident and attack head on if they see the jedi are noticibly injured.

I was just pointing to that probably they had not many choices, they are equipped with blasters they know to use that weapon and nothing more effective for a jedi and they used it.

 

 

about Sion, is his nature to not to die is the same on Korriban as on Malachor V, if ininfluential if you and your comrades hammer him.... you have to crush his will, not his body.

you'd think his spirit would be crushed when he sees he cannot defeat anyone, even a bunch of non-jedi. still, i would prefer to just slice him in pieces and let him live out eternity in sealed containers.

 

You don't know if you where able to crush his spirit in that moment, force can end, more siths can come to join the battle, maybe in the long time he had won. (and is why Kreia stop you)

 

But the idea to let him live in sealed containers is funny

[Sir Cedric]

I know there are a lot of threads about this topic, but this topic is going to be a little different because I am a semi-professional [fiction] writer and I am going to analyze three main factors where I think Obsidian really did drop the ball... Regardless of the content that was cut.  ETC....

 

I agree completely with your first post. In fact if you read the other two posts I have made this year, your post was almost word for word my own opinion. With that said, I think they could have formed a compromise between rote history and an empty background for the player to choose. This could be done similar to the Jedi trial and the joining of Revan in the Korriban tomb. Use a flashback movie to set up the events that ultimately led to using the "magic widget" at Malachor V, and then let the character make the choice of WHY he did what he did.

 

The main advantage is that I now know what exactly my motivation was for nuking the planet. As it is now, I am unsure as to whether I did it because it was a last ditch effort to win the war, or if it was Revan's plans all along. (KOTOR I led me to believe Revan's tactics and brilliance won the war, not Bau-Dor's Deus Ex Machina. I am unsure what to think now) Using this compromise between history and choice, when I finally get to Malchor V at the end, the big reveal would be more poignant. I would see, first hand, the effects of the "choice" I made at the beginning and it would tie me emotionally to the place.

 

After that, the ending can simply be the denounment that it is. I have now come full circle to face the effects of the choice I made in the Mandolorian Wars.

[Zilod]

If i'm right the plan was to lure the mandalorean fleet near the planet and then to activate the generator to trap them in the gravity hole and make them crash on the planet.

 

this is under the military aspect and it worked well because even with great casualities the mandalorean fleet was destroyed and the war won.

 

 

there is also another goal in that battle. Revan needed to corrupt his troops so they will follow him against the republic and the true siths.

s/he knew of the dark power of the academy (and probably of malachor itself) and he knew how to feed that power to relase a corruption unable to be sustained by anyone.

So the deaths of the mandaloerans and republic soldiers/jedis on the planet are also meant to fuel that energy that will bring the final corruption to his/her own army.

[Mondo]

and i wanted to kick kreia off the ship, we dont always get what we want. they can not take the pc alive so dead is the next option. i'm pretty sure the droid on peragus said dead was fine too. one of them said it, dont know which one.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

 

But if Kriea dies you die, at least from the Exiles thinking, your gonna let a old frail lady with Sion hunting her out of your sight?

[Rambutaan]

The original post is really good and it helps describe why even though this game is really good, there are significant plot holes in it that leave a bitter-sweet taste in your mouth after you've finished the game.