Cliff Hanger or Tidy ending.

[ntime60]

In movies and books I don't mind cliff Hangers because the development to market time is so short.

 

In computer games I prefer tidy endings. Keep each game within its own story arc. It generally takes 2 to 4 years to develop sequels and depending on new technology like Doom 3 and Half-Lif2 2 considerably longer like 6 years. It is way too long to wait to see the end of the story.

 

What to the rest of you think?

[213374U]

Movies and books don't have to have their bugs fixed so a cliffhanger ending might work depending on the story. However, if at the end of a buggy game I am awarded a cliffhanger, I will be rather pissed because I will most likely not be buying the next installment of the saga. Movies and books aren't as expensive as games either.

[NeverwinterKnight]

cliffhanger only if it is stated and guaranteed that well get closure in the next installment (and that there will definitely be a next installment). otherwise, a tidy ending is what i want if that current story is in fact not going to be continued in the next game/movie/book.

[agentdeadlyangel]

I like tidy endings but cliffhangers leave me coming back for more.

 

I was insane for a long time trying to figure out what the hell happened after Metal Gear Solid 2: sons of liberty. Snake Eater really cleared a lot of that up. In that case, I enjoyed having a cliffhanger, even though it made me insane.

 

I like both types of endings, it just depends on the game and how they handle it.

[Gromnir]

cliffhangers is ok... but the questions posed by such an ending should make the player wonder what will happen next as 'posed to making us ponder, what the hell just happened?

 

use Empire Strikes Back as an example of cliffhanger... you know exactly what has happened to luke and leia and han and the rebellion, but you not know what the future has in store for them. is the way such things can and should be done in a computer game or movie where possible sequel may be years away.

 

HA! Good Fun!

[Judge Hades]

I like cliffhangers if there is definitely a sequel coming that will tie off lose ends. Otherwise I like closure.

[KOTORFanactic]

Both.

like cliffhangers if there is definitely a sequel coming that will tie off lose ends. Otherwise I like closure.

Basically what he said.

Am I agreeing with Hades_One on something?

Well, it had to heppen one day! " <_<

[OremLittleKing]

A story should never end with a cliffhanger. Ever. You can leave plenty of plot threads open for future sequels, but you must conclude the story you started, or you didn't finish your story, and you put out an unfinished product. At the beginning of any story, it raises conflict, a question, or some source of tension. The end of the story comes when (or right after) that tension is resolved (or released). If you end your story before you release that tension, you have failed as a storyteller.

 

That said, I believe KotOR II tried to answer the question the story started with. It just failed to do so satisfactorily, and that's why everyone is calling it a cliffhanger.

 

And no, in case this comes up, I don't believe ESB had a cliffhanger ending. I believe it was a tragedy. There was still another story to be told (RotJ) after ESB, but ESB itself was a self-contained story with a satisfactory conclusion.

 

Edit: By the way, some things--such as the Lord of the Rings movies--can be considered to be a single story, even though they come in multiple installments. Using that example, the tension Fellowship of the Ring starts with is not concluded at the end of that film, it's concluded at the end of Return of the King. That said, KotOR 1 and KotOR 2 are completely different, self-contained stories, and the plot threads raised at the end of KotOR 2 (regarding Revan) didn't really have anything to do with the story that was being told in that game.

[Gabrielle]

All good things must come to an end. "

[Darque]

cliffhanger only if it is stated and guaranteed that well get closure in the next installment (and that there will definitely be a next installment).  otherwise, a tidy ending is what i want if that current story is in fact not going to be continued in the next game/movie/book.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

 

^^ I'm going with that.

 

IF there will be a KotOR3.. I'm ok with a cliffhanger... if not.. I'd be really unhappy.

[Baneblade]

Cliffhanger ending are for TV Series and Comics only...

 

And sence I don't read Comics or watch much TV, they're not for me.

[Meshugger]

cliffhanger only if it is stated and guaranteed that well get closure in the next installment (and that there will definitely be a next installment).  otherwise, a tidy ending is what i want if that current story is in fact not going to be continued in the next game/movie/book.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

 

The development of KotOR III is apparantly on hold since Lucasarts suffered from financial problems, so don't get your hopes up. Hopefully, the sales from Battlefront, Republic Commando, KotOR II and Episode III will make the situation better.

[OLD SKOOL WHEELMAN]

Well, I wouldn't say that a book is developed shorter than a game, because some people pour out their heart and soul into it, but the way the story is conveyed doesn't truly reflect it the way it should.

 

However, I like to create things. In my mind, in my car, in my house. Whatever. So a cliff hanger doesn't bother me because i think I can imagine what happens more than the stereotypical gamer.

 

But all good things shouldn't ever come to an end, as long as they are always good.

[EnderAndrew]

KOTOR:1's ending was a joke. And in general, I like endings that leave me waiting and wondering.

 

Has anyone here played Ultima 7 and Ultima 7: Part 2?

 

The ending to Part 2 was great.

[Epiphany]

And in general, I like endings that leave me waiting and wondering.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

 

You and about 3 other people in the gaming world.

[Meshugger]

And in general, I like endings that leave me waiting and wondering.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

 

You and about 3 other people in the gaming world.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

 

Make that 4.

[ntime60]

Well, I wouldn't say that a book is developed shorter than a game, because some people pour out their heart and soul into it, but the way the story is conveyed doesn't truly reflect it the way it should.

 

But all good things shouldn't ever come to an end, as long as they are always good.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

 

 

I would agree to a point. Writing a book usually takes me about 8-18 months per book of around 75-100,000 words.. Publishers usually like a writer to have 2 complete works and a thrid started if the book will be a series or trilogy or two complete spearate works.. This way the books can be released on a decent timetable and helps with the typsetting requirements for book runs..

 

Movies and books don't have to have their bugs fixed so a cliffhanger ending might work depending on the story. However, if at the end of a buggy game I am awarded a cliffhanger, I will be rather pissed because I will most likely not be buying the next installment of the saga. Movies and books aren't as expensive as games either.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

 

Books usually have thier bugs fixed by editors, even then some bugs/typos still exist. Computer games aren't necessairly more expensive than say a medium to large budget movie to produce. The problem with computer games, is that as computers have evolved so have the games. All of us in-turn with more powerful systems have demanded better looking realistic games. We also demand deep gameplay, an epic story and unusually high expectations to out do anything else on the market. In my mind this causes some issues.

 

The current trend in the computer publishing industry seems to be - Come to concept, design/develop 12-15 months, 3-9 months test to delivery. The profit point is 100,000 units sold in 90 days. Figure out the numbers based on unit price. I personally believe it is unrealistic to think that a high quality product cam be produced in that time frame. There is just too much code and much of it being experimental in the first place. There WILL be bugs. If we could get the publishers to lighten up a bit then I believe we would see a better products.

 

It didn't used to be that way. Graphics were good enough, the stories were better and gameplay was exceptional and deep in many cases like the original Tie Fighter vs X-Wing games, Wing Commander (except for IV), K2 has great game play, much better than K1 me thinks, yes there are a few bugs, the story could be tightened up a bit - but over all a good game. I think if it had been released with the March 05 timetable then we would have had a better game. There are places very near the end that just look rushed to me. Sorry Devs, I know it probably wasn't your fault. I just believe in the it will be done when it is done and not a moment sooner philosophy.

 

It might be better if the computer games industry would adopt more of a book publishing attitude rather than the movie industry attitude. Complete works first, not the we can patch it later or incomplete.

 

<soapbox off>

[Jad'en]

And in general, I like endings that leave me waiting and wondering.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

 

You and about 3 other people in the gaming world.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

 

Make that 4.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

 

Check your figures <_<

 

 

Its 5 (w00t)

[Fearless_Jedi]

I chose "other" which wasn't an option really but you really cant compare the two endings because a cliff hanger ending is usually for games/movies that will have a sequal and a tidey ending is usually for those that wont.

 

Personally I like Half Life 2's ending because even though it sort of cliffhanged it still made sense and left the game with a fairly tidey ending that coincided with HL2's beginning.

 

But if I had to choose then I would say cliffhanger because most movies I have seen with cliffhanger endings where pretty good.

[Muad'Dib]

Considering that with video games, or even movies for that matter, never have a guarantee that there will be a next installment or that the next game will pick up where the last one left off, I'd always like to see a tidy ending.

 

Can they leave room open for the heroes to come back for another adventure? Sure, that's all fine and good, but seeing as games like RPGs suffer from the whole leveling up ordeal which makes it very difficult to reuse the same characters again, I think the story should always have closure. If they want to continue a related story or spin-off like KotOR 2 was to KotOR 1 then that's great, but KotOR 1 had at least closure for its story and characters. Which is why the changeover to the Exile wasn't a problem in that sense, though I wanted to play Revan again because I liked the character, I didn't have a problem with the new one because for me Revan's story was fulfilled at the end of the first game, the Exile is a completely different story altogether and considering how difficult if not impossible it will be to bring the Exile back as the lead in KotOR 3, they should not have done a cliffhanger there imo.

 

Besides, I liked KotOR so much I will buy KotOR 2 regardless that it's a new story or had it been continuing the original. So for me cliffhangers don't mean I'll keep coming back for more, if I like the game to begin with, I'm pretty certain I'll get the next installment. But right now, depending on how KotOR 3 turns out, if it does at all, and how they choose to deal with the story and protagonists, that will be a very important factor in how I will eventually come to judge and like KotOR 2 in the long run.

 

My two cents.

[envida]

And in general, I like endings that leave me waiting and wondering.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

 

You and about 3 other people in the gaming world.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

 

Make that 4.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

 

Check your figures <_<

 

 

Its 5 (w00t)

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

6 and counting

[Bokishi]

And in general, I like endings that leave me waiting and wondering.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

 

You and about 3 other people in the gaming world.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

 

Make that 4.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

 

Check your figures <_<

 

 

Its 5 (w00t)

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

6 and counting

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

 

d00d, 7

 

 

 

Erm.. what are we counting again?

[EnderAndrew]

I really liked the endings to Ultima 7: Serpent Isle, and Ultima 8. Both had dark, cliff-hanger endings.

[Gromnir]

"And no, in case this comes up, I don't believe ESB had a cliffhanger ending."

 

it is too bad then that Empire is what obsidian were shooting for with the kotor2 ending.

 

HA! Good Fun!

[Volourn]

Cliffhangers are only good if make sense, and it isn't there just to be cool. And, there will be a follow up. We don't know for sure of there will be a KOTOR3 and we also don't know if Obsidian will even develop it so in this case it was a very poor move on their part.