Ukraine Conflict - "Politics is war without bloodshed while war is politics with bloodshed"

[Malcador]

1 hour ago, Lexx said:

Well, he is right. But he is not using it to deflect blame from russia, which is what Z did.

Sure, that's one interpretation I guess.  For infrastructure targets, I didn't see the reason for outrage, others have done it and it was okay then. As for incendiaries, eh, everyone has fainting spells anytime a weapon of that class is used (amusing when I recall US media thumping a bit on thermobarics during Afghanistan/Iraq).   If they were smart they'd use WP, then get the dodge card everyone else plays, heh.

That and well, everyone says it's a war crime everytime, assuming every village is chock full of civilians in the 20 second clip.

Edited September 26, 2022 by Malcador

[BruceVC]

1 hour ago, Malcador said:

Surprised none of the usual people are bleating whataboutism at you

.

Oh dont  worry we will call out whataboutism when its demonstrated and it will happen again on this thread, some people cant help themselves  

[pmp10]

Interesting reactions to Putin's nuclear saber rattling:
Zelenskyy thinks that Putin isn't bluffing.
US warns Russia over nuclear weapons use via private channels.

So what options do they have except let him win?

Edited September 26, 2022 by pmp10

[InsaneCommander]

Neo-Nazi gunman kills 13 during Columbine-inspired Russian school shooting

[Gfted1]

Ukraine Situation Report: Multiple Russian Aircraft Shot Down In A Day (thedrive.com)

Im a little surprised the FIM-92 is still effective.

[Malcador]

13 minutes ago, InsaneCommander said:

Neo-Nazi gunman kills 13 during Columbine-inspired Russian school shooting

Up to 15 now

https://www.reuters.com/world/europe/gunman-opens-fire-school-russias-izhevsk-russian-media-cites-local-police-2022-09-26/

Rookie numbers for school shootings in Russia.

[Darkpriest]

39 minutes ago, pmp10 said:

Interesting reactions to Putin's nuclear saber rattling:
Zelenskyy thinks that Putin isn't bluffing.
US warns Russia over nuclear weapons use via private channels.

So what options do they have except let him win?

This will be a one big hot spot and everything might be on the table. 

Saw this somewhere. 

Now, I wonder if Russians will pull it off and lift a strat bomber in the air, loaded with the munitions and tell UA to cease fire and withdraw. I expect a really bad scenario. They might want to wait for some good weather conditions to make sure that potential fallout will not reach NATO soil, but even that is not given if there are mad ruskies at the helm... 

 

 

[Gfted1]

Would the bomber even make it to its destination? Doubtful. Russia better use an IRBM.

[Darkpriest]

Seems Oil cap already questioned? 

https://www.bloomberg.com/news/articles/2022-09-26/eu-countries-plan-to-delay-russian-oil-price-cap-amid-divisions?srnd=premium-europe

[Darkpriest]

1 minute ago, Gfted1 said:

Would the bomber even make it to its destination? Doubtful. Russia better use an IRBM.

True, might accidentally fall from the sky on a Russian soil, given the state of some of the equipment, but would the missile had well maintained targetting and delivery mechanism? There is a risk there too! 

[Elerond]

Russia already uses strategic bombers, they fly over Black Sea and launch cruise missiles 

https://www.thedrive.com/the-war-zone/russias-secretive-long-range-bomber-operations-against-ukraine

[Malcador]

33 minutes ago, Gfted1 said:

Would the bomber even make it to its destination? Doubtful. Russia better use an IRBM.

Well its destination would probably be in Russian airspace, they've been doing that for the whole war.

Edited September 26, 2022 by Malcador

[kanisatha]

1 hour ago, Gfted1 said:

Ukraine Situation Report: Multiple Russian Aircraft Shot Down In A Day (thedrive.com)

Im a little surprised the FIM-92 is still effective.

The US just delivered the first batch of NASAMS.

[pmp10]

1 hour ago, Darkpriest said:

This will be a one big hot spot and everything might be on the table. 

Let's not get ahead of ourselves.
I doubt anything will happen over Kherson or Zaporizhzhia that Russians have never taken.

Threaten Sevastopol however and we might just see tactical nukes deployed. 

[kanisatha]

Re. Tibet, though technically there are key differences (Tibet in 1950 was not recognized as a sovereign state by other states, and was not a member of the UN), I'm well-known as a hardliner in support of a free Tibet. I've made remarks to that effect in public academic settings, have a sign on my office door at my university saying "free Tibet," and give money every year to a free Tibet activist group. That's why I can never travel to China because I am sure to be on one of their blacklists and would be subject to persecution.

[Gfted1]

1 hour ago, Darkpriest said:

True, might accidentally fall from the sky on a Russian soil, given the state of some of the equipment, but would the missile had well maintained targetting and delivery mechanism? There is a risk there too! 

In another blow to their strategic think tank, the prevailing winds in Europe travel West to East, so theyd wind up huffing the fallout: Understanding and determining prevailing winds – Trees for Energy Conservation (extension.org)

[HoonDing]

Africa, South America and most of Asia are rubbing their hands together in glee at the prospect of the West erasing itself from existence.

[BruceVC]

1 minute ago, HoonDing said:

Africa, South America and most of Asia are rubbing their hands together in glee at the prospect of the West erasing itself from existence.

I doubt it, where would all the people immigrate to when they come from  failed states in those regions?

[Darkpriest]

1 hour ago, BruceVC said:

I doubt it, where would all the people immigrate to when they come from  failed states in those regions?

Import failed states, become failed states? 

[BruceVC]

8 minutes ago, Darkpriest said:

Import failed states, become failed states? 

Yes that can happen but thats not the intention of immigration. I have heard that argument but it doesnt really make sense 

[Chilloutman]

doubt russia will use one nuke, either they bluff or they have to go all in, one nuke on Ukraine and whole world will eat them alive

[Zoraptor]

6 hours ago, Malcador said:

Sure, that's one interpretation I guess. 

I'm still not sure how quoting the relevant rules direct from the treaty('s list of definitions) is deflecting. It's like pointing out that an 'assault' isn't an assault by citing the legal definition; you can argue that it should be an assault morally, but legally...

Fundamentally I think there's a pretty basic misunderstanding of how such treaties work at play. Treaties are written so as to get the maximum number of people to sign up, not to get maximum enforcement. Indeed, in order to get the maximum sign up enforcement is always weak, and there are always numerous loopholes. See any climate agreement, any agreement on military weapons, the UNSC etc.

2 hours ago, Gfted1 said:

In another blow to their strategic think tank, the prevailing winds in Europe travel West to East, so theyd wind up huffing the fallout: Understanding and determining prevailing winds – Trees for Energy Conservation (extension.org)

Though that is not what happened with Chernobyl:

Russia wasn't uneffected, but other places were far more effected.

Europe doesn't really have prevailing winds in the sense many places do. Look at the same data for Fukushima and it's a stereotypical plume heading out over the Pacific, for example.

[Sarex]

Parents had to miss out on strawberries that year.

[Mamoulian War]

Insight to Russian logistics connected to mobilisation…

 

[Lexx]

Go to war and bring your own supplies. lol.