Doppelschwert

I suggested to have a percentual bonus on range in the other thread, but nobody seems to care. Ranged characters benefit, all targeted abilities benefit, engagement range benefits. It's similar to intelligence, but different and independent. It helps in the sense that it makes positioning easier for all classes.

Yeah, it's basically resistance from DnD and supposed to have the effects I described, namely tying breaks for weapons with similiar dps. You're not able to distinguish similiar dps by a multiplication. Deflection, fortitude and the other defensive stuff however changes the percentage of missing, gracing, hitting and critical hitting your actions, similiar to armor class in DnD works.

How about letting resolve increase range of weapons / spells and tying interruption and defence against interruption to perception? I think the range idea is a really good idea as it is a dimension entirely untouched by the other attributes while still useful to have. It's also interesting for most of the classes.

I only partially agree with you karkarov. you describe how it should play out, but even in your scenario the weapons have to be proper balanced against each other. I don't think this is the case at the moment, so sensuki has a point, in particular because ranged weapons require both hands in both cases.

Yeah, that's what I've been claiming in the other thread as well. Currently, the system works like 0/20/40 when it comes to ineffective / neutral / effective weapons, where it should be more like 15/20/25 to not feel like RPS. I remember that josh emphasized that there won't be RPS in earlier descriptions of the mechanics, so I think they need to put this in line. That's alright, but it's a problem as soon as DT = Damagethreshold (which basically means damage resistance in DnD terms) is applied. When you have DT=2, so you soak up 2 damage every hit, you get 2*(4-2) = 4 for the dagger 1*(8-2) = 6 for the 2handed axe with 50% might the discrepancy is even greater, although I can't remember whether is applied before or after DT.

I'm not sure about the argument concerning ranged characters. By the same logic, they don't need to opt into constitution as well, so where do you see the difference? Even then, it's is imaginable that the KI later on might focus the spellcasters and ranged characters with their own ranged attackers. Wouldn't that fix the situation?

that's ok per se, as long as the game maintains some enemies that don't have any DT. it is a problem however, when DT is raised across the board for higher levels, as that will in fact mean that fast low damage weapons will become noninteresting choices.

I agree that deflection should be tied to the attributes somehow. Given the importance it has right now for combat, it is way too static. On the matter of aoe increase, that was clarified by josh at some point in time. I think it was increase of the total area, not of the radius, in order to keep the increase a linear function.

I think one of the main problems is how DT controls the flow of battle too much on both sides. The weapon and armor types are basically not an incentive but rather rock paper scissor. Instead of having say, the damage being ~ 0 / 20 / 40 by using an ineffective / neutral / effective weapon, it should be more like ~ 15 / 20 / 25. At the same time, enemy damage should be toned down so that both sides die more slowly. That would give more time to react and is not as demanding. I think proper weapon balancing like this and getting rid of the bugs would already go a long way to fix the difficulty. At the moment, most part of the damage reduction on your party comes from deflection, not from armor, which again makes every blow either hitting hard or not hard at all. I think the solution would be to tone the variance down, e.g. making graces hit harder and giving enemies higher accuracy instead of higher base damage.

From a mathematical point of view, that makes no sense at all. Might gives a percentage because it scales DPS equally across the board. An absolute value gives an incentive to use faster weapons over slower ones, so pigeonholing again while making it harder to balance. The problem you are refering to is a problem of weapon balance, not of might. Weapons have to be balanced in a way that you have an incentive to use one over another every once in a while so that it is actually a tactical choice. If you don't have any incentive to use hunting bows over arbalests, then well, hunting bows suck and changing might is just a superficial patch of the real problem, not the solution itself. Following joshs approach, weapons have to diversify by attack type and attack rate and attack power to be interesting choices. Because DT works as a substraction, two weapons can still be different although they have the same DPS, so DPS is not a qualifier. In general, for this to work, weapons with little absolute damage should have such a higher rate of fire that their DPS is greatet than the DPS of weapons with high absolute damage so that increasing DT makes a shift of usefulness from light to heavy weapons. If this is not the case for hunting bows, then this is the starting point to adjust them. EDIT: When we are at it, I'm highly sceptical of the DT values and the damage values at the moment. What good is armor that gives 10-12 DT (the top range that I remember) when the enemy hits you for 40+ damage? When the best armor reduces damage by only about 25%, it doesn't make much of a difference how good the armor you are wearing really is, while taking heavy slow down penalties wearing them. Then the main damage reduction comes from converting hits into graces, which is governed by deflection. And guess what, there is no attribute for deflection and it is only tied to class and level. Basically, I feel like there is not enough influence that you can actually have on your defense.

One buff per stat, yes. That's also what the OP claims. You're not arguing that it's intended that wearing a belt makes armor useless, are you? I don't think it's meant that way. The belt should only override the breastplates DT in terms of fire and ice damage, not in terms of physical damage, as the OP claims. The more important question is whether this is a just an error in displaying of the DT in the menu or if it also affects combat the way it is displayed.

First impression: In my first fight, I had the problem that the monk was fairly useless because the enemies all attacked my fighter and so I couldn't generate any wounds to begin with. I think monks need some kind of taunt ability to make their concept more useful. Doesn't even have to be that much of a control effect, e.g. they could only use it on enemies they are engaged with in melee or something like that. Also, on my resolution, the information for wounds is really hard to notice, so I died a horrible death in the second fight without noting the wounds at all. Needs more visceral feedback.

I agree on the general sentiment here. Atmosphere, world design, quest design, that part is fine. Had a long stroll throug the town, was engaging. Was first playing in german, which was kind of a mess, but that was to be expected. Switching to english helped a lot. The first fight in town felt strange but was ok. Then I horribly died against the beetles. Priest died instantly (which was totally my fault), then everyone else. Was stupid of me, but it really goes back to bad information flow, like wtf is going on. Besides the stuff that has already been mentioned, there should be a distinction between per rest and per encounter abilities in the way abilties are lined up, just to help you use your stuff more often. For example, some priest spells of lvl 2 have per encounter in their descriptions, others not, so whats the rule here? Even if I know them, the game should still tell them to me transparently. Also, the GUI was oddly scaled for me which proabably goes back to my resolution. Any settings I saved resetted all the time, especially stuff for dialogues. When I had autopause on activate on low stamina, it would activate also on low stamina for the enemies. I'm going to put the demo on halt to the point were at least the auto attack and pathfinding is fixed. I may come off as negative, but I think this can be improved until launch to a satisfactory level. It will take some effort, however, to make combat feel right and transparent. Still, I'm emerged in the gameworld, which is one of the more important things as well.

got the key, but takes 90 minutes for me. no game today then. *sigh* gonna do some 'homeoffice' tomorrow then...

please fortify your servers in the remaining time.

I'd suggest we start a thread like this for every class, pin them to the top of the forum and then just argue about stuff related. You know, being neatly organized and everything for the devs. I'll just start this thread with monks because I like em. Maybe some mod wanna help with this? Carry on, forumites.

You should be playing D:OS in coop with your family, silly you.

Huh? But it IS Gamescon demo <_< Gamescom You should get a medal for this.

Proof or it didn't happen. Not trying to proof anything here and won't waste my time either.

Right. Your perspective it totally understandable, it is just not logical. One's expectations are derived from their own desires, and so their disappointment is their own fault. I may be sounding a little Buddhist here, but that is at least my perspective. I think it would be nice if developers considered other timezones, and your perspective is an understandable one, as I said. I just don't think we should blame the developers or get disappointed for something like this. Good on you for not being angry at them. I'm sorry if I am a bit blunt in my posts, I am just trying to take a logical standpoint. That's fine, I know that I'm being emotional. I also agree that you can't make everyone happy. However, a lot of the backers are from europe, so I don't think we are an insignificant number of people. For example, I upped my pledge yesterday because I was so pleased with everything so far. I'm not saying that I regret it, but the negative emotion will probably discourage me the next time I think about it, so it's not like it's totally independent of everything when they release it. I think it would've been better to announce the beta for tuesday, prepare it on monday and then release it on tuesday morning in their time, selfish as that may be.

Maybe should have headed your own pessimism from your previous post and waited for tomorrow? Except, I haven't been pessimistic. And if the beta demo comes out tomorrow, I'll wait until tomorrow. If it comes out the day after that, I'll wait until the day after that. Why are you implying otherwise? You must be responding to another poster, but have mistakenly addressed me. I bear no resemblance to the person you are apparently talking to. May have something to do with you constantly hinting at the possibility that the beta is delayed or wont come at all. Nope, no negativity there.

Is it really their fault that the 18th of August in PDT is not the 18th in different parts of the world? I think people in other parts of the world should consider the timezone that the developers are in, just as they are asking the developers to consider the timezone they are in. If a developer in the UK says the it a release will be on the 18th, then why would I be confused if it is released late at night for me? I understand your situation, but isn't it unreasonable for the developers to consider every possible timezone that doesn't align with theirs? Wouldn't it be more efficient if the people in different timezones compared theirs and the devs timezones and took that different into account? No ill will, just my thoughts on the subject. I suppose I could be biased, since I share the same timezone as the devs. It's totally fine that the time zones are different, and I expected the beta to be released during their working hours. Still, their working hours start at 7-8pm of my local time and a lot of the recent updates actually felt into this timeframe, so I naturally expected the beta to come close to this. They now announced the game for 11 pm of my local time. Given that the site is going to break down, steam needs to download the game and all that stuff, it's propably save to say there won't be any game today. It's totally understandable to be upset about it, given that they are using steam: they could've handed out the keys earlier and then unlocked the game via steam at a certain time for everyone, probably even automatically, which would have adressed the issue easily. I'm not really angry at the devs, just disappointed because I'm hyped and I won't have time tomorrow without neglecting work. Thanks for the heads up.

Delay? What delay? When did Obsidian say it was coming at 10 o' clock? They just said it would be coming today, nothing more. Although I would prefer if they mentioned the exact time they would be releasing keys, I suppose we will just have to wait. Delay in the sense that at that time, it's not 'today' anymore in probably most parts of the world.

I know you're right, it's still hard to accept. Gonna do some stuff in the kitchen and play some games for the next hour to kill some time. Probably better than hanging around here and making the server load longer for everyone else.

As I understand their Twitter messages, the team stepped out of the plane from Germany not even two hours ago. They're probably asleep right now and will release the beta in due time, once they awake. Obsidian has a lot more staff then just the people that were at gamescom. It's not that I don't understand the reasons, but i just try to prepare for a let down. If they don't update during the next couple hours, I'm going to lie in my bed thinking about that the updates going to be up anytime while trying to sleep so that my biorythm won't go down. And then I'll neither sleep nor play the demo, although there is a fair overlap between europe and US daytime. That would suck.