Monte Carlo

Sensuki's point might sound obvious, but it is crucial to my mind. Conquering the next dungeon level should be a major achievement. For example, while you are on level 2 you will pick up tidbits of info on level 3. That will guide you as to any specialist spells, equipment or supplies you might need (dammit there are ghouls on level 3, we need holy water and a cleric!). As you descend the challenges and threats get greater. This does NOT (necessarily) mean level-scaling. There might still be relatively weak monsters on lower levels that you might easily defeat if it is logical in the dungeon ecology (say for example that the Ogre Magi on level 6 has an army of stupid Hobgoblin mooks who he uses as fodder for over-confident adventurers, grinding down their spells and supplies before he enters the fray). Ideally, at the end of a level, if you've gauged it right, your party should be battered, have gotten some great loot, used skills and defeated suitably tough foes. When you find the next level down you will almost certainly need to travel back to civilization for a re-org phase. I'm happy to see a level-scaling discussion here, it is very important. But maybe only some boss battles or key events should be scaled. I'm all for the old "this module is suitable for character levels 6-9" spiel. Caveat emptor and all that.

Personally I'm hoping for some unique terrain. IWD showed us how good Obz are at beautifully designed dungeon levels with interesting tactical possibilities. And the lower levels of Dragon's Eye, for example, shows us how they can implement diverse monster types / factions. Of course, I'd like it if you could parley with the inhabitants of the dungeon rather than them attack on sight. Dungeon-dwellers might get used to adventurers and not always view them as a threat. Maybe they'd trade for intelligence about what's going on above the dungeon, for treasure or even for assistance.

You have to remember that 90% of the modern gaming 'press' are brain-dead PR whores. Although RPS is OK and has a dedicated wargaming bloke who is quite good. But, yeah, that "lots of numbers" line made me cringe. You don't have a dig at flight sims because "there's too many dials" do you?

He's a mage, ain't he? Unless he's a rogue with some powaz. It's cool that we don't know exactly, isn't it?

^ Completely agree. In fact, I'd like to see some 'old-skool' lite games specifically designed to introduce the younger gamers who might like this sort of thing to the genre. Diablo shows that fantasy is popular, you need to create that feel but with a story and interactivity then build on it. Like back in the day we all started on basic D&D. Then we'd move up in the world.

This thread isn't about anything other than dungeon level ideas and themes. Feel free to go mad. If you want story-based dungeon stuff describe it. If you want traps share your favourites. If you want to use your skills then describe how. If you want to wade through hordes of monsters armed with a +1 golf club, then tell us about it. I have many ideas but I want to hear yours first! http://grognardia.blogspot.co.uk/2012/10/multi-level-mapping.html This should whet your appetite, hat-tip to the excellent Grognardia blog.

I am not even remotely concerned. I think the people who are so generous should be rewarded. lavishly. And no, I'm not one of them.

Metiman, I'm genuinely not trolling but I am beginning to find your Rainman-like gaming persona genuinely amusing. Maybe we need a truce, like Tommies and Fritz playing football in no-man's land on Christmas Day. And, obviously, I am looking forward to brutally pwning the Codex adventuring party... can you share some of your ideas behind the composition of said group?

Tep, I think the Codex runs a controversial facility where dual-identity-gamers can be made 'natural' again. The techniques are... unusual, and some don't make it through. But if you do, apart from the large scar across your forehead, nobody will ever knew that you had The Treatment.

Metiman... I have a confession. Tears are pricking my eyes, the flush of shame on my cheeks. You see I *liked* parts of the first Dragon Age game. No, not the omnisexual diaper-sex or Ren Fayre dialogue. No, after many years of barren nothingness I just sought solace in the arms of the first party-based CRPG that walked into the room. I guess this means that the Thirty years of tabletop gaming and hundreds of hours of lovingly spent IE gaming counts for nothing. Heck, I even played Fallout. So, Metiman, I have confessed. Can you find it in your flinty heart to forgive me?

Harder to please? You mean impossible to please. You're as bad as "The Biowarian" romance fundies. If you get one concession, you want another. And how dare you call people out on how much they pledged? The fact is people have different economic situations. I think the Codex needs to do a Kickstarter if you are all so desperately passionate and make your own game.

Jesus H Christ. I hate romances. I loather Bioware games. I'm old-skool, just not a head-banging, fundamentalist like you.

^ Dude, Like me you're just in the 95% this guy isn't referencing.

Ha ha ha Turn-based, right? You're the guy who tells others they must despise the IE games if they don't agree with your analysis, yet you want a mechanic that wasn't actually in the IE games. You must despise the IE games. QED. Why not kidnap one of the Dev team member's cats and hold it hostage? Y'know, send ransom notes along the lines of "tUrn-BaSEd Or KitTy GEts It!!!"

Wow. Either / Or generalisations. Strawmen. Smug superiority. Wilful misrepresentation. I take my hat off to you, but would ask what about the 95% of people here who fall inbetween your two not-very-accurate extremes?

My idea was inspired by looking at the musket-toting chick in the new wallpaper. Sawyer said that she was also (usually) armed with a military hammer, but there was no sign of it in the illustration. And, TBH, having a one-shot musket when facing a legion of zombies is about as much use as an ashtray on a motorbike. _____________________ Enchanted Brawler's Musket (Magic Weapon) Even the most skilled musket-shot knows that after one enemy has been felled, there are others to fight. Many warriors are forced to drop their precious black-powder weapons and draw their blades, risking the loss of, or damage to, their firearm. Warrior-Wizards considered the problem at length, the result being the ensorcelled Musket, often known as a Brawler's Musket or a Marksman's Maul. The weapon looks like a standard wheel-lock musket, but the working parts are cleverly protected by a semi-circular bracket of enchanted metal plate. The barrel has a reinforced grip and the stock is equipped with a long, curved hook fashioned from soul-forged steel. Once the weapon is discharged, the user may reverse it and use it as a savage melee weapon, akin to a billhook or staff. Other muskets are equipped with long, barbed magical daggers that slide into a bracket under the muzzle. This device, sometimes known as a bayonet, allows the piece to be used as a short but effective spear. Lastly it is whispered that, in the deepest magical-armouries of the most advanced cultures, that extraordinary enchantments are possible: muskets that fire two or even three balls at once from multiple barrels. War-forged ammunition filled with magical fire. Weapons that have charges designed to mimic an arcane veil...

TBH there isn't anything particularly hardcore about replaying with a custom party --- it's more about fun / trying stuff out / challenges. Completing BG2 with a party of six custom-built thieves and bards, led by a cleric / thief, was a lot of fun. And a challenge. Am pretty hyped that I might be able to do that with this game too.

Obz said that a berserk type powa was a feature of the class.

As long as they ain't Mel Gibson FRREEEEEEDDDOOMMMMM style elves.

As others have said, I don't want 'chaotic stoopid' I want sly, manipulative mo-fo. I want to do Really Bad Stuff and blame it on goody-goody characters. I want to besmirch reputations, poison wells, overthrow governments by sedition and guile. I want to avoid paying taxes, steal, cheat and lie to start pointless wars. I want to, at the zenith of my power, topple faiths and have nations put to the sword on a false premise. And, I want to do all these things while the idiot general populace think I'm good. Basically I want a Politician character class.

My awesome homebrew RPG, Fighting in Tunnels, has an engineer character called 'The Sapper.' The Sapper is a tunnel-fighter, engineer, trickster, combat medic and McGuyver-style skill monkey. I would love to see something akin to your idea as a stretch goal.

Paladins should be exemplars of their faith, be they 'good' or 'evil.' In my D&D campaign (3E) all lawful characters could become paladins. Let us assume that the P:E campaign world might not suit the class. Let me reiterate, I quite like the paladin as a class (although I'd go hardcore and implement the 1E AD&D style limits on material possessions a paladin is allowed to own).

^ That's hideous.

I know we won't get it, but I always wanted a bandit / outlaw class that was like a combat heavy thief with some outdoor survival skillz.

This is my idea of the perfect combat encounter.