Jediphile

Not sure, but I think so. I play both KotORs (or other games for that matter) on the pc using a trackball only. Don't know if that answers your question.

When Kreia says that Revan never fell, but stayed true to himself no matter what mask he wore, I think that she was speaking out of pride of her former student, but I also think she was speaking more about herself than she did about Revan. Kreia was Kreia, no matter what mask she wore. The jedi threw her out because her teachings were too "dark". The sith threw her out because she wasn't ambitious and hateful enough. That speaks volumes, especially when after being thrown out by both extremes, she return to face the council with proof (namely the Exile) of her teachings - through it all, she remained true to her teachings regardless of which side she taught them on.

Another good episode. Is it just me or is death a recurring theme in BSG these days? I have this vague suspicion that Natalie may yet be back, and that death is a core theme in these episodes, given that facing death has created the cylon civil war. And note how number three, D'anna, that the rebel cylons are trying to free "experimented" with death before she was boxed. I doubt that's a coincidence. This seemed very much a "what do we do now"-kind of episode, where the fleet is struggling with the aftermath of the presumed allied basestar jumping away with Roslin, Helo and a bunch of others. I guess we're left in the dark about what became of them because the episode is all about the uncertainty and doubt that follows in the fleet, and we can't connect to that if we know more than Adama and the others left behind do. Clearly something seemed to have destroyed the hub, and there were vipers in the debris, so some kind of battle did take place. I wouldn't be surprised if the next episode then goes back and tells us what happened there. I liked the showdown between Adama and Tigh. They fight hard, but eventually end up embracing each other, as they realise their similar problems. It was nice to see both of them angry at the other for exactly things about themselves that they did not like to admit and then ended up confronting. Lambkin was back. Yeah. Oddly Gaeta was absent despite the growing focus on him in recent episodes. Adama staying behind was a surprise. From the end of one episode to the end of the next, the fleet has gone from being led by Adama and Roslin to being led by a cylon and a fairly inexperienced and idealistic president... Hands up all who think that's going to be the cause of trouble But all in all a good, solid plot-building episode of character growth. I expect the plot to really move forward soon, though.

And that's your proof? The first link makes it very clear that development on KotOR3 was axed. Could it have been resumed? Sure, but where is the evidence to support that? We just don't know, so we remain stuck with LA cancelling the project. Indeed, LA denying that the project they're working on with Bioware has nothing to do with KotOR disproves the one project that most people seemed to assume to be the next KotOR game. Summa summarum: There is still - sadly - no new KotOR game on the horizon.

I doubt it. The exile does not seem to me to instantly "absorb" force power like Nihilus does. The exile's power seems far more gradual to me and strongly based on (ab)using the force bonds formed with others, which then naturally means that these must be formed first. Nihilus has a "supa-power" to instant-drain force all around him. His sith assassins have learned a very, very limited version based on the same principle - they can "drain" force, but only to power conventional force powers. They cannot drain all force and so kill others instantaneously like Nihilus can. The exile has a power very similar to Nihilus', but it's unclear just how similar it is, since the exile remains obviously of his own powers through most of the game. I suspect he actually has just the same ability as Nihilus does, but has not gone anywhere near his potential even by the end of the game.

Nor do I, but regardless LA and Bioware are indeed working together on something. What is it? We don't know. Lots of people thought it was a KotOR MMORPG, but we know it's not, because LA has said so. http://uk.xbox360.ign.com/articles/852/852342p1.html I find it obvious that whatever this game is, it is based on a license that LA owns. It could be Star Wars, but it's not KotOR. My suspicion is that it is a Star Wars MMORPG set in the time between Episodes III and IV due out next year when the Star Wars live action tv show is set to premiere.

I agree. While the old Jedi Order is flawed, at least they didn't allow politics in (I don't like politics in real life). I disagree completely. Politics is a fact of life, and given the power of the jedi order, it will be a political factor whether it wants to acknowledge it or not. That is the real flaw of the old order - they thought they could just stay neutral in a interstellar war waged directly against the Republic. But an organisation as powerful as the jedi order does not - cannot - exist without being a political factor. If they try, they leave a power vacuum for the enemy to exploit. Or to take the Spidey-argument: "With great power comes great responsibility." The jedi order is supposed to be the guardians of the Republic. It's their duty, and the Republic depend on the order to fill that role. The council failed the Republic because they refused to acknowledge this. Revan split the order because he realised this and did something about it. It's a "you're either part of the problem or part of the solution" kind of thing. And by deciding to not get involved and let billions of innocents die at the hands of the Mandalorians, the old jedi order was definitely not part of the solution. Zez-Kai Ell: "I, too, lost a Padawan on Malachor. Not to the battle, but to the alternative - to the teachings that Revan brought from the Unknown Regions. {Quiet}And I was not the only Jedi Master to watch a student turn on them. No, no - they were not to blame, but many of the Order did so - it was a difficult time, a time of strong emotion.Perhaps the Council, perhaps the Order itself had grown arrogant in their teachings. It is easy to cast blame, but it is perhaps time the Order accepted responsibility for their teachings, and their arrogance, and come to recognize that perhaps we are flawed.Not once did I hear one of the Council claim responsibility for Revan, for Exar Kun, for Ulic, for Malak... or for you. Yet... you were the only one who came back from the wars to face our judgment. And rather than attempting to understand why you did what you did, we punished you instead.{Frustrated}Our one chance to see where we had gone wrong, and we cast it aside. And now, that decision has come back to us, and may carry with it, our destruction. Perhaps there is something wrong in us, in our teachings. And though I tried, I could not cause that thought to leave me - so I left the Council. And I was not the only one. That is why many scattered... and why many in the Republic do not trust us. And why we do not trust ourselves. " So for all their flaws and inability to see the obvious right in front of them, I'll take the jedi order of the Clone Wars over the order we've seen in the KotOR games any time, because Yoda and Mace and the rest at least acknowledged that they could not escape their responsibility as guardians of the Republic and the part they play in the politics of the Republic. They tried and failed, but that's still better than the old order who refused to even try and just hid their heads in the sand hoping the problems would go away and by doing so did far more damage - the invasion of the Mandalorians, the order being split, Revan and Malak falling to the dark side, and the Exile becoming a wound in the force are all consequences of their refusal to step up to their responsibilities.

Ahem, and where's your proof about K3 being cancelled, hmm? http://www.gamespot.com/news/2004/08/13/news_6104775.html http://uk.xbox360.ign.com/articles/852/852342p1.html And just to make it clear. LA hired Bioware to develop KotOR1, then LA published it. Being succesful, LA wanted a sequel, but Bioware wouldn't do it and instead recommended Obsidian do it. The only "collaboration" between Bioware and Obsidian was that Obsidian got to use the graphics engine used in K1 for the sequel.

I agree more with you - Kreia sparked the force in the exile. That's the reason they share such a strong force bond that effects on one affect the other. It's only the beginning, though. The exile grows in power because he continues to create force bonds with all the force sensitives in the group and then "siphon" or "leech" force power from those. The exile grows in power because more and more people join the group whom he can than form force bonds with and draw power through. I picture the force as a great central hub from which all living things draw force or "energy" to various degrees - some beings have a very minor connection. Jedi (or Sith), however, have strong connections. But the exile has none, because he cut his force bond at Malachor V rather than fall to the dark side, so his connection is now lost - he can no longer draw force "energy" directly from the central hub. But he can still form force bonds and interact and control force power through those bonds. That the exile might be alone doesn't matter because distance is immaterial to the force - Yoda still feels Anakin's struggles through the force though he is very far away and Vodo-Siosk Bass felt Exar Kun's fall from an equal distance.

Well, that explains much... I suppose you're really asking which side we agree more with - Revan's choice to plunge the galaxy into war, split the jedi order and turn to the dark side to save the republic or the exile's choice to refuse the dark side. Personally I like neither, really, because they are both deeply troubled people with some severely unattractive character flaws. Exile's choice may seem better, because he at least refused to become the thing he hated, but as we see in TSL, his choice was to run and hide, which carries volumes of trouble in its wake that may be just as dangerous - especially Nihilus, who is apparently the direct result from the exile's choice given what the masters tell us. TSL is a story about how running away doesn't help, because eventually you'll still have to face your demons, and by ignoring them you make that confrontation harder and more dangerous. So is Revan better? Well, it may seem better that Revan is prepared to both make hard choices and deal with the consequences, but then Revan is able to do so only by refusing to hear those who suffer and sacrifice the innocent in an "the end justifies the means" or even "might is right" state of mind, which really isn't that much better IMHO. We can argue that Revan did it all because he saw the greater threat of the True Sith looming over the galaxy, but I've never agreed with Kreia that all that Revan did was by choices dictated by the circumstances. If it had been, then why didn't Revan use the Starforge to create an armada to fight the true Sith? Because once Revan became a sith, he stopped caring about the republic except as place to rule or take resources from. He may have chosen to fall for good intentions, but then that is just what the road to hell is paved with... So, do you prefer to the guy who sacrificed his soul to become an interstellar despot for the greater good or the guy who couldn't accept where his choices had taken him or what their consequences would be and so ran and hid for a decade instead? While I like both of the characters, neither of those sound very good. I suppose I'd like Revan a little more, though only because I can take Mission's position and claim that the character we see in the game is no longer the person who accepted turning to the dark side and kill the innocent. The exile cannot make that claim, and subjecting your past to the point of forgetting your choice and ignore its consequences is not very endearing in any event...

Citadel Station... or even Malachor V... Oh wait, I wasn't supposed to answer that, right? Well, never mind then - I'll shut up now

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I know what you mean, but I cannot in good conscience cast my vote for an unfinished game regardless of how much I like the plot. If for no other reason, I will always have to say that KotOR1 is the better game for that reason alone.

There are a number of points in the game when you're supposed to find either a part of a lightsaber or a full lightsaber, like after fights dictated by the plot (like Visas) or as part of a loot you're bound to find (like Vogga's storeroom or upon killing cannocks on Dxun). On those points you'll find lightsaber parts until you have enough to make one, and after that you'll find full lightsabers instead. So no, I wouldn't say they magically appear - the game just sort of acknowledges that you've got a lightsaber now and shouldn't find more parts.

No, it's not impossible. The thing is, there are two sorts of "items" for lightsabers: 1. "quest items" that you'll use to create your first lightsaber 2. parts that you can use to upgrade an existing lightsaber with at a workbench If you're a first time player, this can be confusing to distinguish between, but basically the game will allow you only to find the four (IIRC) items you need to create your first lightsaber - I don't recall what they are, but Bao-Dur can tell you anytime - and once you have them, you begin finding actual lightsabers instead. This can seem strange in light of the fact places like ring in the Mandalorian camp on Dxun allow you to use a lightsaber in a fight, even if you don't have one. The reason for that is that you can play the planets after Telos in any order you like, so if you choose Onderon/Dxun as one of the later ones (as I always do), you'll likely have your lightsaber (or perhaps several) by then.

I do. It was boring going through it again and watching how everything you did in K1 mattered zippo and was turned to ashes. Oh, and it was rehashed - always a no-no. And every bit of Malachor except for the plotted encounters sucked. Not because it looks bad, but because it's designed and plotted terribly, full of stupid storm beasts and batallions of noname, random sith lords... Except for Sion and Traya, it was a pointless, insulting hack-fest I hate Citadel Station but enjoy the rest of Telos, so that balances out for me. Never hated Peragus, however. A little dull and too many droids, but still better than Citadel Station in my book.

This is trufax. Christian Bale can be a good anything, really. I think Christian Bale would make a pretty good Carth. Or a pretty good Atton. Possibly even a pretty good Canderous. Or a pretty good Malak. A pretty good Bao-Dur, maybe. Oh! Or he could voice T-3! Hmm, given how much weight he could lose playing "The Machinist", I wonder if he could put enough on to play G0-T0...

That's total hogwash. The game was clunky because LA decided to cut two months off the already rediculously short development schedule some time after the project was half-way through development. Yes, stuff was not implemented well, but by that time the plot had long, long since been decided upon, or do you think a developer like Obsidian (or anyone else for that matter) begins writing the game without a plan for what sort of places, characters, fights, etc. is required by the plot beforehand? Nonsense. Of course the plot was set by then. But there are two things that must be considered here. 1. LA slashed two monts of the deadline. That meant lots of stuff couldn't be finished by the time the game was to be released, but you can blame neither the plot nor Obisidian for that, because it wasn't their decision - if LA says to put the game out for xmas (which was NOT the original intent), then what they say goes because they own Star Wars. Period. Obsidian have no say in that. They just get to decide how to make it happen. No, it wasn't pretty seeing the droid factory slashed along with the majority of endings for the companions or indeed the highly sad state Malachor V ended up in. But that's LA's choice for deciding to swing the axe on the deadline. Yes, it did mean some stuff wasn't explained as well as it should have been. But it does not change the plot because... 2. TSL is SUPPOSED to be open ended! It was always meant to be. It's an "Empire Strikes Back" sort of ending, not a "New Hope" or "Return of the Jedi" kind of ending. Now, I'd agree that with all the cut stuff, it looks very unpolished, but the plot is there and it's solid on it's own. Elements of the plot are unresolved because they were meant to be - KotOR3 was already in the planning stages, only it then too got axed. But again, that's LA's choice, not the fault of Obsidian's writing, which was far deeper, more original and interesting that Bioware's rehash of the original trilogy in the first game.

Agreed. But people do extreme things, reasonable or otherwise, when they feel their children are threatened. Even the idea of coming between a mother and her child is dangerous sitaution at best.

They didn't choose what gender the exile was canonically until well after the game was out. Indeed, while the game came out in december 2004, there was no official reference to the exile's gender until the New Essential Guide to Droids mentions the character as "a heroine", and that book was - according to Wookieepedia - released June 27, 2006. Personally, I've always felt the male exile made for better plot, both because Atris being in love with the male exile makes for a stronger case regarding Atris' fall with Handmaiden adding to it to form the classic love triangle, and because Sion's love for the exile seems totally out of the blue and highly uncompelling to me. I mean, he was only trying to hunt her down to get rid of the last jedi, hello! I don't mind Disciple as much as some people seem to. He clarifies a few things in the plot before they come clear, but most of the stuff he can tell you about that is learned from other characters and events anyway. The Force Sight bit with Visas was nice, but I don't see it as that special. For me it's mostly for plot reasons that I prefer the male exile. I should thank babydol for writing the above, however, since it means I'm not being entirely sexist when I prefer the male exile. I didn't think I was, but it's good to hear anyway. Besides, considering that all the promotional art for the game consistently shows us a male exile, you might think the developers thought of the exile as male. At least, that's always been my interpretation, but then I guess only Obsidian know that, and they can't say, since deciding gender in a Star Wars game is exclusively the right of LA. Still, I can't quiet escape the suspicion that the exile was declared female simply for the purpose of LA not appearing sexist, given that both Revan and Jaden Korr (from Jedi Academy) were declared officially male. To me that does not seem like a good basis for dediding the exile should be female. Besides, of the three, Jaden Korr makes better sense as female IMHO. Of course, you also need to consider all the cut content that was intended to be in the game. Atton's potential death scene is very sad, and I don't get the impression there is a corresponding scene for Handmaiden or Visas, except that you can sacrifice Visas to Nihilus, of course.

True, but I was replying to Dark Raven who did the same, and while I agree with you, I've taken flak in the past for saying stuff I would never have taken as a spoiler, so I prefer to err on the side of caution. After all, you can't go wrong if you use the spoiler tags, can you? Or do they seem annoying? I'd happily refrain from using them, but then I'm very aware that my defintion of what constitutes a spoiler differs from that of other people.

Yes, but However, I must say that this episode was clearly the best I've seen this year, because something clicked into place. Maybe I'm just slow for not seeing it before, but a penny dropped this episode.

Yes and yes. You can interact with both Disciple and Handmaiden regardless of gender. It's just that only one of them end up joining your party. I'm not absolutely certain what triggers it, but it seems to be whatever side of the force you lean towards (neutral taking the LS path) when you finally get the jedi masters to meet. Unlike KotOR1, there is no climactic part of the game, where you must make a conscious choice to be LS or DS. So yes, in a way you have to actually play the side you want to see come to pass in the endgame. It doesn't trigger until after you've found all the jedi masters, but obviously you're likely so extreme toward one side by then that it'll be difficult to change, though not impossible.

Given how Revan is constantly described as this great strategist and warlord, I'd assume him to be a guardian over a consular or guardian. The same could be said for the exile, "The General". Then again, even if they both began as guardians, that doesn't mean they went back to the class when they began rebuilding their powers and experience from scratch. Personally, though, I think canon will never deal with this. The jedi classes were created solely for the D20 RPG and never had much place in canon, where jedi were just jedi without particular distinction other than individual skills gained by each. I prefer it that way. The only indication of the class-structure sneaking into canon that I've seen is how all the jedi masters on Taris in the KotOR comic book except for Lucien are clearly consulars, but that can be associated closer to their abilities as seers rather than a defined class structure. Personally I prefer to think of the classes as pure game mechanics that have no place in canon. I mean, what's with the nonsense of lightsaber colours for each class? Luke went from a blue lightsaber to a green lightsaber, so does that mean he went from being a guardian to a consular? Nonsense. I just ignore it. Jedi can have whatever lightsaber colours they want and there are no class-distinctions between them IMHO. That was not my intent, and I'm sorry if it was taken as such. That statement merely puzzled me.