How should I spend my Durgan Steel?

[ottffsse]

 

 

 

DiS isn't exactly a high alpha weapon capable of blasting its way thru high DR's. But IIRC, wounding effects aren't affect by DR, though I could be very wrong on that.

Against high DR targets the wounding damage can be higher than your physical damage - that's more than 100% dps increase.

Damn, and I always thought that wounding deals 25% from the final, post-DR damage...

Just checked ingame, and the results show that it takes x0.25 of pre-DR damage, and moreover, it also multiplies that value again with your might modifier.

(as for int, it only increases duration without affecting total damage)

 

If only it would generate bonus focus...

Damn. Thanks for reminding me. I was going to give GM the Persistence hunting bow. But now, why bother.

It's a good bow on cipher but only if you have 22+ might and penetrating shot. Nope GM has low might needs higher base damage weapons or stormcaller. But leadspitter works OK on her with pen shot and a +3 might item. Sabres work too if she is made s+s.

[Kaylon]

Durgan question. There's a shield that provides reflection towards projectiles. Does Durganizing it override the reflection effect, or adds to it? The character sheet seems to indicate the former.

Bonuses on shield always stack... (I don't understand why are you saying the the character sheet indicates something else)

[limaxophobiacq]

I bound the Pargrunen spirits to the forge, and I'm a terminal kleptomaniac so it's safe to assume I'll pick up every iron ingot in the game. That should mean we can assume I'll have the maximum amount of steel at my disposal. The party:

 

Fighter #1 - tank

Paladin - offtank, mostly supporting with auras, Lay on Hands and exhortations

Barbarian (Watcher) - Carnage. I guess that sums her up. I've already forged up her Tall Grass after a recommendation I read here. This is the only steel I've spent so far. I've also put Burning Lash on it; hopefully not a big mistake. There's still enchantment space to pimp it up to legendary.

Fighter #2 - bringing the single target damage. Sporting a few soulbounds, guessing eventually a certain hammer, so don't see myself needing to pimp up a weapon for him.

Cipher - doing cipher stuff. Has Stormcaller.

Priest - a buff turret pretty much like the one from AndreaColombo's guide. I'm all set to pimp up her Unforgiven.

 

I guess what I really want to do is reinforce armor for pretty much everyone, but which armor suits are worth the steel?

 

Durgan re-inforced Angios Gambeson is amazing on a priest to cast more buffs faster in hard fights (without having to spend time drinking a potion) while also giving better DR than robes. With durgan enhanced Unforgiven the Alacrity would also get you 0 recovery melee attacks (would need to durgan the shield as well to get 0 recovery attacks with Vulnerable Attack, maybe not worth it) so your priest would be pretty fearsome.

Edited March 23, 2016 by limaxophobiacq

[Crucis]

 

 

 

DiS isn't exactly a high alpha weapon capable of blasting its way thru high DR's. But IIRC, wounding effects aren't affect by DR, though I could be very wrong on that.

Against high DR targets the wounding damage can be higher than your physical damage - that's more than 100% dps increase.

Damn, and I always thought that wounding deals 25% from the final, post-DR damage...

Just checked ingame, and the results show that it takes x0.25 of pre-DR damage, and moreover, it also multiplies that value again with your might modifier.

(as for int, it only increases duration without affecting total damage)

 

If only it would generate bonus focus...

Damn. Thanks for reminding me. I was going to give GM the Persistence hunting bow. But now, why bother.

It's a good bow on cipher but only if you have 22+ might and penetrating shot. Nope GM has low might needs higher base damage weapons or stormcaller. But leadspitter works OK on her with pen shot and a +3 might item. Sabres work too if she is made s+s.

 

 

I don't particularly like using guns in PoE.  Part of it is that I guess I just like the old D&D no guns paradigm.  But also, I don't like the need to have the Gunner talent just to make the reload time less onerous.  Heck, I don't even like feeling need to use the Gunner talent on crossbows either, though I rarely ever use crossbows or arbalests as anything more than a battle opener where reload speed isn't an issue.

 

As for GM and Stormcaller, I agree it's a great combo.  I used it in my last run thru.  But since I have Sagani in my current party, almost specifically to use Stormcaller to see it in action in a ranger's hands, if/when I have GM in the party, she'll have to make due to with some other bow.  Maybe the RoGF warbow.

 

 

[L4wlight]

 

I bound the Pargrunen spirits to the forge, and I'm a terminal kleptomaniac so it's safe to assume I'll pick up every iron ingot in the game. That should mean we can assume I'll have the maximum amount of steel at my disposal. The party:

 

Fighter #1 - tank

Paladin - offtank, mostly supporting with auras, Lay on Hands and exhortations

Barbarian (Watcher) - Carnage. I guess that sums her up. I've already forged up her Tall Grass after a recommendation I read here. This is the only steel I've spent so far. I've also put Burning Lash on it; hopefully not a big mistake. There's still enchantment space to pimp it up to legendary.

Fighter #2 - bringing the single target damage. Sporting a few soulbounds, guessing eventually a certain hammer, so don't see myself needing to pimp up a weapon for him.

Cipher - doing cipher stuff. Has Stormcaller.

Priest - a buff turret pretty much like the one from AndreaColombo's guide. I'm all set to pimp up her Unforgiven.

 

I guess what I really want to do is reinforce armor for pretty much everyone, but which armor suits are worth the steel?

 

Durgan re-inforced Angios Gambeson is amazing on a priest to cast more buffs faster in hard fights (without having to spend time drinking a potion) while also giving better DR than robes. With durgan enhanced Unforgiven the Alacrity would also get you 0 recovery melee attacks (would need to durgan the shield as well to get 0 recovery attacks with Vulnerable Attack, maybe not worth it) so your priest would be pretty fearsome.

 

Durganized Angious Gambeson is also amazing on a Stormcaller Ranger in those cases.

[sims796]

 

Durgan question. There's a shield that provides reflection towards projectiles. Does Durganizing it override the reflection effect, or adds to it? The character sheet seems to indicate the former.

Bonuses on shield always stack... (I don't understand why are you saying the the character sheet indicates something else)

 

When I Durganized Badgradr's Barricade a while back, rather than having the character sheet say that my guy has 20% reflection from the shield, or 10% from the shield's main effect, 10% from the steel, it just said 10% from the steel, nothing else.

[Kaylon]

 

 

Durgan question. There's a shield that provides reflection towards projectiles. Does Durganizing it override the reflection effect, or adds to it? The character sheet seems to indicate the former.

Bonuses on shield always stack... (I don't understand why are you saying the the character sheet indicates something else)

 

When I Durganized Badgradr's Barricade a while back, rather than having the character sheet say that my guy has 20% reflection from the shield, or 10% from the shield's main effect, 10% from the steel, it just said 10% from the steel, nothing else.

 

Yes, it never says 20%, they're listed separately. 

[Crucis]

 

 

I bound the Pargrunen spirits to the forge, and I'm a terminal kleptomaniac so it's safe to assume I'll pick up every iron ingot in the game. That should mean we can assume I'll have the maximum amount of steel at my disposal. The party:

 

Fighter #1 - tank

Paladin - offtank, mostly supporting with auras, Lay on Hands and exhortations

Barbarian (Watcher) - Carnage. I guess that sums her up. I've already forged up her Tall Grass after a recommendation I read here. This is the only steel I've spent so far. I've also put Burning Lash on it; hopefully not a big mistake. There's still enchantment space to pimp it up to legendary.

Fighter #2 - bringing the single target damage. Sporting a few soulbounds, guessing eventually a certain hammer, so don't see myself needing to pimp up a weapon for him.

Cipher - doing cipher stuff. Has Stormcaller.

Priest - a buff turret pretty much like the one from AndreaColombo's guide. I'm all set to pimp up her Unforgiven.

 

I guess what I really want to do is reinforce armor for pretty much everyone, but which armor suits are worth the steel?

 

Durgan re-inforced Angios Gambeson is amazing on a priest to cast more buffs faster in hard fights (without having to spend time drinking a potion) while also giving better DR than robes. With durgan enhanced Unforgiven the Alacrity would also get you 0 recovery melee attacks (would need to durgan the shield as well to get 0 recovery attacks with Vulnerable Attack, maybe not worth it) so your priest would be pretty fearsome.

 

Durganized Angious Gambeson is also amazing on a Stormcaller Ranger in those cases.

 

 

Dang, using Stormcaller with a low recovery, hastened ranger must be like a freakin' machine gun of lightning bolts! 

 

I just wish that the Gambeson armor looked better.  That sky blue padded armor looks a little odd to my eyes.  Not terrible, but really out of place outside of perhaps a circus tent. 

 

I do have Sagani wearing it right now, and truth be told, I never remember to use its hastening spell.  Frankly, I'll probably just put her in some other armor down the road.  Armor that doesn't require me to remember to use a bound spell to get the most value from it.  (I'm really bad about remembering to use spells that are bound to equipment items, in large part because they're hidden behind that "backpack" button.  Out of sight, out of mind.)

 

 

 

 

[sims796]

See for yourself

 

Edited March 23, 2016 by sims796

[Kaylon]

See for yourself

 

20160323154514_1.jpg20160323161900_1.jpg

You're right, it's a bug... You should post it on the technical forums - maybe it's just a display bug...

[sims796]

But I am getting the benifits of both, right?

[dunehunter]

I think dev should balance Durgan steel a bit, make one hand durgan steel less powerful, or enhance two handed durgan enchantment. Like reduce one hand attack speed bonus to +10% and increase two handed enchant to 20%

[Abel]

See for yourself

 

20160323154514_1.jpg20160323161900_1.jpg

 

You're right. I just saw the same thing after i used durgan's steel on badgradr's barricade. There is no way to know if there are two 10% chance for the effect to proc or if one suppresses the other.

 

Logically, both should apply, because there shouldn't be any script on shields to suppress enchantments (since they should always apply). But there is no way i know about to test it in game in order to be sure. And i agree. For some reasons, even a guy who don't optimize like me don't want to waste an ingot like this

[Loren Tyr]

 

See for yourself

 

20160323154514_1.jpg20160323161900_1.jpg

 

You're right. I just saw the same thing after i used durgan's steel on badgradr's barricade. There is no way to know if there are two 10% chance for the effect to proc or if one suppresses the other.

 

Logically, both should apply, because there shouldn't be any script on shields to suppress enchantments (since they should always apply). But there is no way i know about to test it in game in order to be sure. And i agree. For some reasons, even a guy who don't optimize like me don't want to waste an ingot like this

 

 

Suppression would occur on the wielder rather than the shield itself, actually. But that would show up as "suppressed" on the character sheets. I expect it's just a UI issue, though it might also be that the two item mods are somehow overwriting each other in some sense (seems unlikely though). Personally I wouldn't use Barricade anyway, but if you want to be sure it's easy enough to test; takes a bit of work to get enough data points for a statistically reliable estimate, though.

[Abel]

 

 

See for yourself

 

20160323154514_1.jpg20160323161900_1.jpg

 

You're right. I just saw the same thing after i used durgan's steel on badgradr's barricade. There is no way to know if there are two 10% chance for the effect to proc or if one suppresses the other.

 

Logically, both should apply, because there shouldn't be any script on shields to suppress enchantments (since they should always apply). But there is no way i know about to test it in game in order to be sure. And i agree. For some reasons, even a guy who don't optimize like me don't want to waste an ingot like this

 

 

Suppression would occur on the wielder rather than the shield itself, actually. But that would show up as "suppressed" on the character sheets. I expect it's just a UI issue, though it might also be that the two item mods are somehow overwriting each other in some sense (seems unlikely though). Personally I wouldn't use Barricade anyway, but if you want to be sure it's easy enough to test; takes a bit of work to get enough data points for a statistically reliable estimate, though.

 

 

 

That's what i think too. It's unlikely one suppress the other. About this shield, I'm trying to create a build with my Eothas melee priestess. With Starcaller, vulnerable attack, and Badgradr's barricade. It's actually pretty powerful once starcaller reduces the target's deflection by 30 points, allowing to chain stun the foe with enough attack speed and intelligence (if all goes well). Dire blessing as a per encounter spell should help, too.

 

But i'm defiant about this kind of statistic you speak about. last time i tried, for fun, to make statistics while rolling one six faces dice, out of nearly 200 rolls, i ended up with a 65% chance to get 1. I'm not the guy for this :D

[Loren Tyr]

The probability of getting 130 or more 1's in 200 rolls if it really had been a 1 in 6 chance to roll a 1 with it is effectively zero (it's actually 0.0000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000226%, but I'm rounding down a bit). The fact that you did get that number fairly definitively proves that for thath die, on that surface, and using your rolling technique, the chance of getting a 1 was significantly in excess of 1 in 6. That's no fault of the statistics. The random number generator in PoE has no such bias though, so if the probability of ranged reflection is really 20% rather than 10% this can reliably be verified given enough data points. That's just a matter of firing arrows and counting, really. 

 

The reason I wouldn't use Badgradr's Barricade by the way is that it slows down your main hand attack. The Bash takes time, which means you'll be hitting less frequently with your main hand weapon. Even with the Thrust proc the bashing will generally not do enough damage to compensate in terms of damage output, and the Starcaller proc will also trigger less often. 

[Abel]

I will believe you. I knew the chances to get 65% were really low . Or maybe the fact that some of my friends used to call me "padbol" (cursed) comes from somewhere.

 

Well, my main weapon is still a flail, and my char stats are 14M 11C 12D 15 P 14I 12R. So... the flail does not hurt much (14-20 damage with strenght boost). I could manage more than 50 total damage with the shield (because it's easy to crit with thrust when it procs). The point is that my flal has the benefit of the stun affliction while hitting, too (thx to int that make the stun longer). That helps a lot. i can't chain stun and chain crit every foe, but it works quite smoothly most of the time, but that means that my shield generally do almost as much damage as the flail, so the bash thing is not a waste; while still allowing my prietess to have the benefits of shield+weapon style. I play on hard, by the way.

Edited August 3, 2016 by Abel

[Loren Tyr]

The Thrust does punch through high DR more easily, true. It also takes something like 65% to 75% longer to get to an attack cycle though (a bit more if you Durganized the flail to speed it up), so the Thrust does need to trigger sufficiently often to make up for that (the stunning certainly helps in that regard, of course). On the other hand, in combination with a non-bashing shield you would be hitting with the flail a lot more often, making it easier to chain-stun an enemy. Both options have their advantages but I just thought I'd bring it up, since the game doesn't really tell you that the Bashing ability on shields has this downside.

[Abel]

Yep, thanks for this . Actually, i read a lot these forums. So, i'm pretty well aware of the downsides of bash. It's because of this that i came up with an idea to make it worth. You're right, the feedback in game is not detailed enough on many points. And maybe i would not have understood alone the problems with bash.

 

If i am to use just a fail, and a non bashing shield, i may prefer Unforgiven, because of its +20% attack speed. I have accuracy enough with my priestess to not worry much about her chances to hit in melee. But i looked for an idea to proc thrust often, and to crit it. Actually, chain stunning a foe while hurting him for 5 or 15 damage with the flail seemed laughable to me . Pointless, even. imho, this stun effect makes sense thanks to the thrust. Obviously, this is not an optimal DPS idea. But to some extent, it's still efficient and fun And the shield has good enchantments. Well, if only the durgan steel really does not suppress its enchantments, that is.

[Loren Tyr]

It doesn't suppress them. I ran a quick test (turns out it doesn't take that much time if you pump dexterity to 300 ). Reflection rate came to 19.2% on 120 attacks, so it's clearly not just a 10% chance (p = 0.0017 ).

[Abel]

It doesn't suppress them. I ran a quick test (turns out it doesn't take that much time if you pump dexterity to 300 ). Reflection rate came to 19.2% on 120 attacks, so it's clearly not just a 10% chance (p = 0.0017 ).

 

Oh, thanks for this. I planned to try for a bit next time i play the game, but you just spared me another headache. Millions thanks for that . Now, i'm pretty sure i won't regret my funny idea.

[Lampros]

Great weapons (off the top of my head) that are worth durgan steel. You may or may not use them with your classes though.

Tall grass

Hours of st rumbalt

Tidefall

Vile loners lance

We toki

Rain (warbow from ranger bounty)

Persistence

Cloudpiercer

Leadsplitter

Lenas er hunting bow

 

I will definitely keep this in mind!

[firkraag888]

I have always wanted to enchant leadspitter to max enchantments, Durganise it then duplicate it with the hellwax mould so it can be quick switched.

 

This would be devastating with ryonas vembrace and penetrating shot.

 

Would love to see a YouTube video off this if anyone is aware of one?

[Boeroer]

That is def. a viable setup. I did it with a wizard in combination with Expose Vulnerabilities (lowers AoE DR by 5). Other good options would be cipher with Body Attunement (-7 DR single) or fighter's Sundering Blow (-8 single).

 

You can also dump Devil of Caroc into the Blood Pool for another point of DR bypass.

 

I know no vids of this though.

 

With the wizard and Combusting Wounds (and Runner's Wounding Shot) it was a very powerful setup against single targets because Blunderbuss generates 6 hits at once which is awesome with Combusting Wounds.

Edited September 5, 2017 by Boeroer

[Raven Darkholme]

I have always wanted to enchant leadspitter to max enchantments, Durganise it then duplicate it with the hellwax mould so it can be quick switched.

 

This would be devastating with ryonas vembrace and penetrating shot.

 

Would love to see a YouTube video off this if anyone is aware of one?

 

I don't think any class would come close to a cipher in terms of max efficency with this (ofc that doesn't mean it isn't awesome on other classes.)

I wonder if I should reattempt upscaled magran's faithful solo, which I only barely beat in the past.

Focus gain is a huge problem in that particular fight, while it is absolutely no issue in any other fight, due to "trash" enemies you can focus first (focus, get it).

Ofc you wouold have to take somebody into the party for a second to send them to the stronghold, but I'm most likely to just console it in and if it is super awesome consider doing a regular run in the future. (I still haven't finished my barb, tho and since I picked up Tyranny again I might not have the time for that soon, but I'll probably do the console test later today).