New playable race

[Cantousent]

Of cource but i dind se an option to edit a poll and i created new one so was a bit better to chose questions. New poll was deletad by you, but thats fine i discoverd that i can edit a pol (silly me) regardless of that thanks for merging threads...

No biggie. I noticed that you rearranged your poll, so all is good. I sometimes will edit things at the member's request after it's too late for them to do so, but I think you've got a discussion going at least, so even if the poll can't be all inclusive, folks are discussing things by posting here.

[Katarack21]

 

 

... some evil elfish race ...

Races are not evil. Races cannot be evil or good.

Individuals can be. Either of them.

Cultures and upbringing can tend in a certain direction which may be perceived as either one.

But races are not.

 

P.S. Oh, pleeeeaaase no Drow.

 

 

Races cannot be Evil ? So Demons not Evil ? Undead are not Evil ? Evil worms from undergraoud distroing everything are not evil ? :D Besides, Drows were not evil in general, but their society were....  There were good Drows like Drizzt, but most peaple in D&D have opinion about them from looking at their society... or at least the more visible aspects of it...

 

I'm not sure there *are* Demons or Devils in PoE; there doesn't appear to be any sort of planar set up with any kind of travel between them. Undead are just corpses with souls shoved inside and basically piloting the body like a meat mecha. Worms destroying everything are just animals looking for territory and food.

[ChaosMaker90]

Yeah but Undead are consider an other race becouse ther to much differ from a parent race (undead aumaua, dwarf, human, elf), their evil becose their always do evil (eating humans) and can't do otherwise, Worms destroying everything, if they are a aspect of nature then okey, but if they are designed to distroy everything just as any other biological weapon (not only humans but ecosystem also) then they at least "bad" at least for us don't you think ? :D And im sure in PoE are some evil ghost, gods, spirits etc...or other supernaturals that are generic evil.

[Strange_Trees]

I think we're at risk of falling into some philosophical debate on "What is evil?" If a hunter ventures into the woods, falls into the web of a giant spider and gets eaten, is that giant spider evil? Was the giant spider evil before, if that was the first human it ate? What if the hunter was evil? Is a giant spider eating an evil hunter an act of good? *puts on a monocle and smokes a pipe*
 

Not to say that there can't be evil individuals, but even those we meet in-game had motivations and goals beyond just being moustache-twirling-****.

 

Besides, the developers look to have been very deliberate in avoiding the generic good/evil dichotomy and planet-of-the-hats tropes, I don't see them overturning that just because there are people who want to pretend they're playing Drizzt in every single fantasy universe.

 

(Also: Dammit Katarack, now I wont be able to fight any zombies without thinking "meat mecha" and laughing )

[Katarack21]

Yeah but Undead are consider an other race becouse ther to much differ from a parent race (undead aumaua, dwarf, human, elf), their evil becose their always do evil (eating humans) and can't do otherwise, Worms destroying everything, if they are a aspect of nature then okey, but if they are designed to distroy everything just as any other biological weapon (not only humans but ecosystem also) then they at least "bad" at least for us don't you think ? :D And im sure in PoE are some evil ghost, gods, spirits etc...or other supernaturals that are generic evil.

There are incorporeal undead--souls that attack people, basically. Undead are treated as vessels--really no different from an animated suit of armor. It makes sense--both are souls piloting something, both can be sentient, and both are not always evil. There is a form of undead that involves a normal vampire undergoing a ritual that flays all the skinn off--it's incredibly painful, but the result is an intelligent sentient undead that has no need or desire to eat people.

[ChaosMaker90]

Isint this a evil spirit ? (regardles if we consider or not consider it as undead or not)

http://pillarsofeternity.gamepedia.com/Shadow

[gkathellar]

Xaurips4life

 

There is a form of undead that involves a normal vampire undergoing a ritual that flays all the skinn off--it's incredibly painful, but the result is an intelligent sentient undead that has no need or desire to eat people.

At least until they can't take the jokes. "Hey, Skinless Chuck! How's your skin doing?"

 

I'd eat people if I had to deal with that all the time.

Edited August 16, 2015 by gkathellar

[Katarack21]

Xaurips4life

 

There is a form of undead that involves a normal vampire undergoing a ritual that flays all the skinn off--it's incredibly painful, but the result is an intelligent sentient undead that has no need or desire to eat people.

At least until they can't take the jokes. "Hey, Skinless Chuck! How's your skin doing?"

 

I'd eat people if I had to deal with that all the time.

 

"Man, you are hard to look at. Makes my skin crawl."

[Varana]

Isint this a evil spirit ? (regardles if we consider or not consider it as undead or not)

http://pillarsofeternity.gamepedia.com/Shadow

Can an unintelligent or semi-intelligent being be "evil"?

Can they be a race in the sense of playable or NPC characters?

PoE playing a Shadow: You roam Caed Nua's backyard, and every time something living crosses your path, you fall into a frenzy and have to attack it, because you're hungry.

Very ... satisfying, and I'm sure not many would accept as a viable option for playing an "evil race".

[Fardragon]

There is no good and evil in the PoE setting.

[Rosveen]

There is no good and evil in the PoE setting.

Please explain.

[gkathellar]

 

There is no good and evil in the PoE setting.

Please explain.

There are no magical, objective forces called Good and Evil in the PoE setting.

 

Whether the moral constructs known as good and evil exist in the PoE setting is a question about second-order predicates and how we apply the word "exist" (see also: Kant on the ontological argument).

 

All that said, there are things we can all agree are evil for practical purposes, like eating people, or putting bayonets through babies, or TMZ. Shadows in PoE eat people, which is pretty evil. Does that make them evil? Maybe.

[ChaosMaker90]

 

Isint this a evil spirit ? (regardles if we consider or not consider it as undead or not)

http://pillarsofeternity.gamepedia.com/Shadow

Can an unintelligent or semi-intelligent being be "evil"?

Can they be a race in the sense of playable or NPC characters?

PoE playing a Shadow: You roam Caed Nua's backyard, and every time something living crosses your path, you fall into a frenzy and have to attack it, because you're hungry.

Very ... satisfying, and I'm sure not many would accept as a viable option for playing an "evil race".

 

Yes it can be evil, if everything it does leads to evil (distroying everthing, just for distroying) then it is evil at least from OUR point of view, even if there are no devils or angels... if theres a race that eat people, not becouse their just hungy and their are part of ecosystem, but are killing them then it's "evil race", race can be "evil" if its character can't be difrent ( for example teached by humans)... if someone becoumes evil then we say "he" is evil... evil surely exist in PE, of everyone was kind and just ... the game would be boring

Edited August 17, 2015 by ChaosMaker90

[anameforobsidian]

Yes it can be evil, if everything it does leads to evil (distroying everthing, just for distroying) then it is evil at least from OUR point of view, even if there are no devils or angels... if theres a race that eat people, not becouse their just hungy and their are part of ecosystem, but are killing them then it's "evil race", race can be "evil" if its character can't be difrent ( for example teached by humans)... if someone becoumes evil then we say "he" is evil... evil surely exist in PE, of everyone was kind and just ... the game would be boring

 

 

It sounds like you're conflating harmful and evil.  Galactus is harmful, but not evil; he just wants to nom.  Drow and Demons are evil; they're aware of our morality and choose an inversion of it.  There are already many harmful semi-sentient creatures in PE (wichts and xaurips), but almost no evil ones.  

Dragons are fairly close to an evil race, there are no "good" representatives that we meet.

 

In general, I think evil races are usually unrealistic.  Many of our "good" traits are functionally advantageous.  Societies like orcs and drow are maladaptive, and probably would not survive in the long run.  Sure there are ethical quandaries (lots of interesting possibilities with psionic collectives), but to fit into PE they would have to make sense as a long term survival strategy.  Even if a race displays behavior that is harmful towards humanity, they could only do it within certain bounds.  IE, there would have to be a reason they hadn't wiped humans+all out or humans+all hadn't wiped them out.  And their actions towards other members of their own species should make sense.  Dragons and vithrack are great examples of this.

[Strange_Trees]

Ya'know, not going into spoilers (depending on how far along you are) but one of the major themes in PoE revolves around the concept of causing harm (intentional or accidental) in pursuit of good. The divide between what is good and what is evil boils down to a matter of opinion, and whether you personally were harmed or benefited.

[Cantousent]

The devs intentionally left the fine moral distinctions about good and evil as an argument for the players rather than themselves. I think this was entirely wise. Personally, I believe in good and evil. I'm not a moral relativist, but I also understand that it's possible to make cogent arguments for every scenario. I also believe that, while evil exists, there are usually feasible explanations that lead to grey areas. That's why, even though I'm one o' them ign'rant Christshuns, I appreciate the game leaving out the didactic moral intrusions in order to let me draw my own conclusions, especially since, in the world of computer game software, my backward Christian ways are certainly more complex and nuanced than what virtually always amounts to the blunt force approach by the devs.

 

I despise alignment systems and would gladly be without alignment in any form. However, I do appreciate characters who are able to express complex moral positions and make compelling arguments on behalf of such positions, regardless of whether or not I agree with them.

[evilcat]

I like that PoE dont go for something like: "Paragon (give all your gold to the poor) vs Renegate (Kill everyone, and also make it painful)" but more Belovent vs Cruel vs Rational...

The best morality system in games is not telling player if choose wisely, just bring consequences (or not).

 

Back to topic:

Why i do not miss any particular race it would be fun to see some Adrafolks or Obsidianfolks. The characters which are like humanoids stones, alive statues.

I just think it is cool visually and as concept, no particular society behind it. However that could be done with some Godlike subtype, or with Sculpture Animant.

They could bind soul to statue on throne, binding it into movable statue is just one step more, and power of aniation is unlimited.

That would fall into category "Forgoten and mysterious race, which nobody hear of, aka circus runaway". Probably not good idea.

Edited August 18, 2015 by evilcat

[Cantousent]

I don't want a new playable race, preferring as I said that I would rather have the current races get more references during the game. However, while I would prefer not to have a new race, I don't mind a new race nearly so much as any race being inherently 'evil.' Now, I don't mind some races being inherently more 'hostile' or 'friendly' to other races. The game uses terms like 'benevolent' or 'rational' or 'cruel.' Those terms might imply 'good' or 'evil,' but do not explicitly claim them. In fact, as far as I've seen, any of those terms might be used as a tactic for objectives that could be considered either good or evil.

 

I don't want to have 'drow' that are in and of themselves 'evil,' confined by their very innate natures to act evilly. Even the most benevolent god in the pantheon went gonzo. While his aims may or may not have been good, his means were sometimes most certainly not always clearly benevolent. No angels or demons. Only beings that wade through the muck of life as best they can.

[Katarack21]

Whether the moral constructs known as good and evil exist in the PoE setting is a question about second-order predicates and how we apply the word "exist" (see also: Kant on the ontological argument).

All that said, there are things we can all agree are evil for practical purposes, like eating people,

Eating people is "evil" if you're human. If you are a lion who is starving, eating people is just a natural production of the survival drive and predatory instinct, and can't be considered "evil" because a lion is incapable of any sense of moral judgement. Sea otters will rape baby harp seals to death underwater then keep the bloating corpse around to **** with for days. Is this evil? Can a sea otter be a serial rapist?

[Skie Nightfall]

Unless they're going to update the original game's dialogue trees and lore... I rather they only add subraces rather than a whole races.

[farleybear]

I'd prefer it if race mattered more. Apart from character creation there really isn't any in-game consequences for race. It may as well just have one race with different cultures for all the impact they have.  

[harels84]

if it up to me i would add a few more races, or even more something that fits the companions in the game, for example aloth : in lvl 12 can become archmage and bind to himself a robe of the archmage that made from ivory and gold or maybe in level 14 he will have to choice between the path of the dragonborn or the path of the undead (only if he want to) , if he chooses the path of the dragon , out of his shoulders coming out a nice red wings, if he chooses the path of the undead he can do a ceremony that make him a lich wizard ... both i think can add a real flavour to aloth character...

 

i would add an half-giant race and thri-kreens , half-lizard , for the ranger i would add amazing companions such as : unicorn, hipogrhiff , gryphon...

 

something amazing like that...

[RocketChaser]

Races are so meh.

 

Cultures are more interesting, I'd like to see them expanding on those and the politics, tensions, prejudices and so on between those in following games.

 

Let's explore more of the world, have a game in Dreadfire or Old Vaillia or something.