Jump to content

Steam now has Paywall mods


Shadow_Arms

Recommended Posts

Its disgusting imho, I would gladly support donations etc, but this will stiffle the open source and freedom of the modding community. Reallh hate it and very dissapointed in this development.

  • Like 1

Fortune favors the bald.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Its disgusting imho, I would gladly support donations etc, but this will stiffle the open source and freedom of the modding community. Reallh hate it and very dissapointed in this development.

I don't like it myself, but I don't really see how it stifles open source, it's supposedly up to the creator of the mod whether they want to make it free, donation, or paid? And if someone wants to mod, they can get the same tools if they don't like a price?

 

It does stifle the ability of the player to *use* any mod in their game, if/when some modders get greedy. But the open source/freedom of the modders? Maybe the former is only what you meant? (in which case I do agree).

  • Like 1
“Things are as they are. Looking out into the universe at night, we make no comparisons between right and wrong stars, nor between well and badly arranged constellations.” – Alan Watts
Link to comment
Share on other sites

Borrowing off eachother's assets, using someone else's code with permission. It's all going to end sooner or later with the introduction of a profit motivation. People are going to get more careful and jealous with their work and fewer people are going to do anything just for kicks. 

  • Like 1

Na na  na na  na na  ...

greg358 from Darksouls 3 PVP is a CHEATER.

That is all.

 

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Might discourage people from going for mods. Also, when people pay for something they expect different things versus when they just get a free mod - might be a headache for mod makers to have to deal with support of the mod, anyway.

 

Soon people will be pirating mods :lol:

  • Like 1

Why has elegance found so little following? Elegance has the disadvantage that hard work is needed to achieve it and a good education to appreciate it. - Edsger Wybe Dijkstra

Link to comment
Share on other sites

 

Its disgusting imho, I would gladly support donations etc, but this will stiffle the open source and freedom of the modding community. Reallh hate it and very dissapointed in this development.

I don't like it myself, but I don't really see how it stifles open source, it's supposedly up to the creator of the mod whether they want to make it free, donation, or paid? And if someone wants to mod, they can get the same tools if they don't like a price?

 

It does stifle the ability of the player to *use* any mod in their game, if/when some modders get greedy. But the open source/freedom of the modders? Maybe the former is only what you meant? (in which case I do agree).

 

 

It's very naive and short-sighted to say "well people have a choice". People always have a choice. What matters is what kinds of choices are offered to them and how those choices are weighted. 

 

In principle there's nothing wrong with some modders wanting to be paid for their hard work, but I expect this will further pseudo-professionalise the modding community. It will accelerate the end of the days when modders were purely enthusiastic amateurs, whose work might often have been incomplete, iterative and clumsy but this very fact encouraged them to keep in close and amiable contact with the fans. This is part of a shift where we're going to see more modders let money drive their decision-making, where fans increasingly treat modders like paid service providers (which they are now), where modders fight each other over profit sharing and other monetary issues, and so on. 

 

I doubt this will actually increase the quality or diversity of mods in any way. You never really had that problem where would-be modders stopped modding because they weren't getting $0.99 a pop, and you're not going to have more than a few people try to earn a living off this. What it does change is make the community more adversarial and entitled (even more than it already has become); introduce even more micropayments into gaming so that your gaming life just becomes one continuous cycle of 'want something? pay for it right now', and other negative changes.

  • Like 4
Link to comment
Share on other sites

@Tig - I didn't say "people have a choice" I said letting your mods be free/available to all for free or not was the modder choice.

 

Also, while I said tools may be available for "everyone" of course that = more work for the player who doesn't wish to spend time modding themselves (eg, they just want to download one someone else has made).  Work they probably wouldn't do. So yes, while there is a choice, it's not necessarily a choice going to be used.

 

Your point is valid enough, that's the way monetizing services/products tends to fly and yes it always sucks when one is used to something being free. And I don't like that Steam is encouraging it. But I guess I'm one of those evil people who doesn't see anything wrong with it on a moralistic level. *shrug*

“Things are as they are. Looking out into the universe at night, we make no comparisons between right and wrong stars, nor between well and badly arranged constellations.” – Alan Watts
Link to comment
Share on other sites

Sorry, that was a bit disingenuous. The more precise point would be that Steam endorsing paid mods this way changes the name of the game for all modders and fans in the future - since before then, most people would have considered charging / paying for mods suspicious, etc.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Traditionally it's where would be indie developers get their feet wet. Do you really want to be paying for the efforts of people who are very much still learning everything. Donations are fine of course, but. I dunno. Why can't we just have this one thing to ourselves outside of market forces and considerations. 

 

Not an unfair objection I think. 

  • Like 2

Na na  na na  na na  ...

greg358 from Darksouls 3 PVP is a CHEATER.

That is all.

 

Link to comment
Share on other sites

^ This is (imo) the danger of putting too much reliance on one or a few (digital) distribution platforms. They end up with too much power/influence. A potential price that sometimes occurs when people favor convenience over all.

 

Which is why I've never been fond of Steam, even as I now use it because it's sometimes the only choice if I want to play certain games. (edit - by only choice I mean if there's no non-digital choice and Steam is the platform I have/use for those cases).

  • Like 1
“Things are as they are. Looking out into the universe at night, we make no comparisons between right and wrong stars, nor between well and badly arranged constellations.” – Alan Watts
Link to comment
Share on other sites

And so we turn to GOG, hopefully it'll be at least 6 years until they succumb to the dark side.

GoG still has the issue that they're hardly the place for mainstream/new titles. Yet.

But yeah...I don't think GoG's vaunted rep. status is going to last all that much longer, personally. Not if they're interested in expanding/being more relevant outside of old/ancient and smaller indie titles, at any rate. 

“Things are as they are. Looking out into the universe at night, we make no comparisons between right and wrong stars, nor between well and badly arranged constellations.” – Alan Watts
Link to comment
Share on other sites

Embrace

Extend

Extinguish Monetise

 

Mr Newell learned well the lessons of Bill Gates III. Steam Workshop has always been a cynical attempt to subsume the PC modding scene into Valve's closed steam ecosystem via leveraging market dominance, same as they've tried for PC gaming in general. For people who are 'just fans really' and 'nice guys who love PC gaming' they sure as asterisks love to nickel and dime the people they love.

 

Plus the nexus people (hardly unbiased, to be sure, but probably should know) are suggesting the usual 70/30 split is reversed, with Valve/ Beth getting 75% and the mod creator 25%. Now awaiting the cease and desists against anyone refusing monetisation, my bet is... 2 years, max, before someone tries it.

 

Ceterum censeo Steam delendam esse, as my good bud Marcus Porcius would say.

Edited by Zoraptor
  • Like 5
Link to comment
Share on other sites

I would gladly donate (and have) for a few mods i've used, sometimes they totally eclipse and better the original game, but I can also see a legion of problems inherent in this, not to mention I hardly ever use Steam. For instance will modders be forced to change content that Steam or the publishers don't find agreeable? Or will their mods simply be booted? Well whatever I hope the modmakers don't end up being the fall guys in this.

 

Edit: Would the BG:EE's now be judged as a mod, from what i've read it offers less than my last few runthroughs of a modded BG 1 & 2?

 

Edit 2: Will this incentivise developers to not finish their games? We have all probably downloaded unofficial bugfixes and such for near unfinished games, will we see a rise in this behaviour from developers and publishers knowing that modders will fix it? Some would say Bethesda already do this.

Edited by Nonek

Quite an experience to live in misery isn't it? That's what it is to be married with children.

I've seen things you people can't even imagine. Pearly Kings glittering on the Elephant and Castle, Morris Men dancing 'til the last light of midsummer. I watched Druid fires burning in the ruins of Stonehenge, and Yorkshiremen gurning for prizes. All these things will be lost in time, like alopecia on a skinhead. Time for tiffin.

 

Tea for the teapot!

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Comment retracted (by myself a few seconds after posting). Delete if you desire, o' mods! (P.S. In case it matters, it was just a stupid half-joke comment that I realized may not have been completely on point immediately after hitting post. Sorry!)

Edited by Bartimaeus

Put fascists and sociopaths on your ignore list.

Quote

Never believe that anti-Semites are completely unaware of the absurdity of their replies. They know that their remarks are frivolous, open to challenge. But they are amusing themselves, for it is their adversary who is obliged to use words responsibly, since he believes in words. They even like to play with discourse for, by giving ridiculous reasons, they discredit the seriousness of their interlocutors. They delight in acting in bad faith, since they seek not to persuade by sound argument but to intimidate and disconcert. If you press them too closely, they will abruptly fall silent, loftily indicating by some phrase that the time for argument is past.

 

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Well, it's been a fun ride. Thank you for your participation everyone!

 

Zooraptor is right, within a smaller timeframe we will see the rise of mod-celebrities making some nice amount of dough (eventhough the ridicolous ratio of only 25%) suing each other with seize and desist orders, popular mods getting unexplicitly shut down down and so on. Later, the business models will adapt to the new situation for the examples above, where budgets will be reflected on that.

 

Nexus will completely collapse due to said drama.

  • Like 3

"Some men see things as they are and say why?"
"I dream things that never were and say why not?"
- George Bernard Shaw

"Hope in reality is the worst of all evils because it prolongs the torments of man."
- Friedrich Nietzsche

 

"The amount of energy necessary to refute bull**** is an order of magnitude bigger than to produce it."

- Some guy 

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Can't see anything positive out of this at all. Even the thought of modders getting (often deserved) money is pretty much completely subsumed by those who have done no work getting 75%. Facts seem to be:

  • 25% cut for producer, rest goes to Valve/ Publisher. Hope you enjoy your serfdom, creative types.
  • No payout until you get $100 ($400 gross), don't make that and steam keeps it. From a company that will cheerfully take their cut of that 7c trading card you've just sold
  • Bank details required for everyone
  • Valve employees apparently advising people to monetise other people's free work (!) by changing them slightly (!). If true that is just plain monumental crappiness and they deserve a boot to the gonads, at bare minimum.
  • In those cases disputes will be 'resolved' by an interested party, ie valve, investigating DMCA claims where they benefit if favouring paid mods.
  • per above, actively encourages people to steal other people's work
  • Encourages people to remove mods from nexus and put them behind steam's paywall
  • Encourages even further a 'modders will fix it' attitude. Bethesda giving you a crap UI? Here's a good one for $10, $5 of which goes to... Bethesda, the people who gave you that crap UI in the first place plus $2.50 to the people who made it possible to charge for it
  • Will get the drm/ pirating cycles applied to mods of all things

Having said that, I suspect we may well get some dialling back as PR- upping the cut to 33% or something. Offer people something terrible to see if you can get away with it then rescind a few things so the slightly less horrible alternative suddenly seems a lot more reasonable.

  • Like 7
Link to comment
Share on other sites

Can't see anything positive out of this at all. Even the thought of modders getting (often deserved) money is pretty much completely subsumed by those who have done no work getting 75%. Facts seem to be:

  • 25% cut for producer, rest goes to Valve/ Publisher. Hope you enjoy your serfdom, creative types.
  • No payout until you get $100 ($400 gross), don't make that and steam keeps it. From a company that will cheerfully take their cut of that 7c trading card you've just sold
  • Bank details required for everyone
  • Valve employees apparently advising people to monetise other people's free work (!) by changing them slightly (!). If true that is just plain monumental crappiness and they deserve a boot to the gonads, at bare minimum.

To be fair, the TF2 store has put people through college.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Join the conversation

You can post now and register later. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account.
Note: Your post will require moderator approval before it will be visible.

Guest
Reply to this topic...

×   Pasted as rich text.   Paste as plain text instead

  Only 75 emoji are allowed.

×   Your link has been automatically embedded.   Display as a link instead

×   Your previous content has been restored.   Clear editor

×   You cannot paste images directly. Upload or insert images from URL.

Loading...
×
×
  • Create New...