Update 91: Closing in on March 26th!

[LordCrash]

 

 

 

WOW, COUPLE OF WEEKS after release for Europe?

 

Needless to say that this is highly disappointing and unsatisfying. If that was known a few weeks back I'd voted for joint shipping of the physical package and the DVD.

 

It's pretty sad that my expensive signed copy is kind of worthless in two ways now. I'm not able to enjoy my goodies at release or during the first "couple of weeks" after release (during the time in which I've planed to play and finish the game....) and the sealed (?) package doesn't even contain a DVD with the game files because we had to decide on that via public voting before we even knew that the stuff wouldn't arrive on release day...seems like we Europeans are ****ed again without compensation, thanks.

 

 

The goods would have to be shipped today (or earlier) for a lot of people around the world for them to receive the boxed goods by the 26th. It's why I voted for option 2 because I know I wouldn't be receiving the box by the 26th.

 

And also to receive the box with no dvd after the game is released and then the dvd even longer is not something I was looking forward too. If I'm going to have to wait, I'd much rather wait for the complete item with dvd and sealed for my collectors edition. Not a sealed collectors edition with no dvd and for the dvd to turn up later. But then I suppose there's a lot of naivety from people who voted in the poll. 

 

 

On tops, i think it's quite unfair to let people of various pledge levels vote on the same thing.

 

It's not a huge deal to get a regular physical game pack without DVD if you can get a digital code at release.

 

But a $500 signed collector's edition is a completely different league. People really buy that because they want to COLLECT it. Part of collecting is having an unbroken, unsealed box. A box that won't contain a game DVD now.

 

That way Obsidian really gave a big **** you to their biggest fans, to those who really paid a lot during the kickstarter. Sure, we're just a few, who cares about us. It's a majority poll so let's listen to all those $60 DVD box customers (or just anyone on the forum no matter which box they've pledged for or whether they've pledged for anthing at all...) how they decide how much the collector's edition will be worth in the end...

 

And now we don't even get the boxes on time. That's so ****ed up, I'm really kind of speechless. Huge disappointment for me and probably for most other high tier backers, additionally here in Europe...

 

 

There was always going to be a shipping lag for Europe. The decision to ship the goods sans disc was made to make sure that the lag wasn't extended by a few additional weeks.

 

The realities of shipping into Europe are that things take quite a bit longer to get where they are going and the packages have to go through more taxes and red tape. Hopefully, having Paradox ship from inside of Europe will reduce some of this time/cost, but there wasn't a lot we could do to get it to folks faster.

 

If we have lost your trust in this matter, I apologize, but we are doing everything we can to get European backers their items as fast as possible. Unfortunately, we are kind of at the mercy of shipping speeds at this point.

 

 

1) "There was always going to be a shipping lag for Europe."

 

Great. And cool that you've never mentioned that before although it was obviously clear in the beginning. I don't know about other people but in my books "release day" means that you get your stuff on THAT VERY DAY. It's the responsibility of the publisher/distributor to get the game to everyone on release day, no matter what. If you knew from the beginning that European backers wouldn't get their stuff at release or even close after release (few days) you should have communictad that in all honesty and transparency from the beginning, calling the "release" just "digital release" or "digital and US only release". But it's kind of ridiculous to state that you always knew that there would be a shipping lag for Europe if you never told anybody and instead kept people in the believing that they would get the stuff they've pledged for in time, especially after you partnered with an experienced publisher just for the very reason to handle proper professional shipment and distribution.

 

2) "shipment to Europe is difficult and takes a long time"

 

Yeah. That's what any experienced distributor could have told you a very long time ago. That's what you could have told us a very long time ago. But you didn't. Instead you let us vote on a split shipment on the forum without being fully transparent about shipment times to Europe. And again, it's a weak excuse after all. Since you've apparently knowing for quite some time now that shipment to Europe was difficult and took a long time you could have just started to begin with production of the physical stuff at an earlier date. Again: it's your responsibility to get stuff to customers on time. If shipment takes a long time, start earlier. That's the simple realities of conducting a business that involves exporting goods to other countries. That's how you professionally handle that. "Oh, we just found out 2 weeks before release that we couldn't get the stuff to you on time and you have to wait another few weeks (!!!) for your stuff that is now even a lot less worth because some anonymous people on the internet decided that your sealed box shouldn't contain a game DVD anymore" is not professional. It's actually the opposite and I think you know that.

 

3) "apologies"

 

Yeah, it's easy to apologize once the damage is done. But that doesn't make the situation any better. Truth is that my singed collector's edition is kind of worthless for me personally now and I've wasted a lot of money. You're sorry about that and I'm sorry about that but it's your fault, even if you blame "external influences outside your reach". It's not that easy. You're responsible for not getting ready on time with the game itself (for physical releases). You're responsible for the decision that my CE isn't "full" anymore. You're responsible for not shipping the stuff early enough to get in time to European (and other international backers). So I understand you're sorry and I believe you. But that doesn't "fix" anything for me. I hope you'll understand that as well and that a simple apology won't make me any less disappointed or furious about the topic.

 

 

In Angry Joe's words: you done ****ed it up. Badly.

Edited March 14, 2015 by LordCrash

[perec]

I haven't seen any questions about this so here it is. So in the Pax East presentation they showed us how bounties will work.

 

My question is, can you find these bounty bosses out in the wilderness or you have to get the bounty contract first?

[Bryy]

Now we're blaming shipping speed for games not being "full" anymore.

 

Hm.

[LordCrash]

Now we're blaming shipping speed for games not being "full" anymore.

 

Hm.

 

Ahem, no. I blame them by not getting ready on time for my physical CE box not being full.

[ruzen]

Its really shame that physical goods are coming late but all that money talk and expecting better "services" because of "commitment" is disgusting.

 

In Keith Waldrop's words from poem "...Expectation, endlessly engraved, is a question to beg..."

[Darkpriest]

@BAdler,

 

I am not sure how it works, BUT if you KNEW that there will be a shipping lag of a week or two or even more for international packages anyway, WHY ON EARTH you put up a poll with such a poor description of the situation. I can only assume that a lot if not all International customers who voted for option 1 did so because they wanted to have everything on DAY 1 as described in the poll. That seemed to be the trade off. You should have made it clear that it only applies for the US customers.

 

Now you aggravated basically all of your international customers, because not only they won't get the boxes on day 1 as promised (despite knowing otherwise), but they will also get boxes without the game disc, which adds more salt to the wound. So now you have people who forked out a lot of money for high tier editions who are largely dissatisfied about the lacking collectors edition and all other physical tier backers who are dissatisfied because they won't get what they wonted while putting trust in that poll.

 

IF there is any way to fix that is to simply put the international shipments on hold fill them up with the discs and then go from there. I doubt that anyone will mind if it is 1 or 2 weeks delay if they can get just a one shipment and be done with it. The big selling point of the option 1 was the DAY 1 availability.

 

It's just also a bit of mismanagement issue. You pay more for shipments and yet you create more frustration among your fans/customers...... all due to miscommunication to the fans that was derived from not revealing all the known information about shipments clearly....

[Shiroco]

@crash

 

I'm on your side but it is pretty normal for ks products outside the us to arrive later in europe. The only reason I'm disappointed is because of that poll that suggested that this wouldn't be the case if the majority would be okay with the game discs being sent later. That was the main reason I voted for the split up delivery. That whole poll thing leaves a bad taste in my mouth regarding transperency. I think that this feeling isn't unreasonable and I'm not mad just a bit disappointed. I'm sure that Obsidian had good intentions but I think it is fair to say that the execution (transparency, who is able to vote, what about the special group who backed the signed ce's) leaves much to be desired.

[LordCrash]

Its really shame that physical goods are coming late but all that money talk and expecting better "services" because of "commitment" is disgusting.

 

In Keith Waldrop's words from poem "...Expectation, endlessly engraved, is a question to beg..."

 

It's disgusting to expect products you've paid for on a publicly communicated release day? It's disgusting to be furious that the product you've paid for is a whole lot less valuable? Jesus, what's next? Are people really that sheepish and brainwashed today, defending companies and fighting against consumers aka themselves? You know, I love crowdfunding. But that's just ****ed up, sorry.

 

Good for you if you don't care. But stop about talking about MY money and how I feel about it as if you were someone better. That's none of your business.

 

 

@shiroco

I know. I'm just furious. 500 bucks (it was even more than that) is just a lot of money for me personally. And PoE is a game I really care about so I'm damn emotional right here.

Edited March 14, 2015 by LordCrash

[SirBlackjack]

@crash

 

I'm on your side but it is pretty normal for ks products outside the us to arrive later in europe. The only reason I'm disappointed is because of that poll that suggested that this wouldn't be the case if the majority would be okay with the game discs being sent later. That was the main reason I voted for the split up delivery. That whole poll thing leaves a bad taste in my mouth regarding transperency. I think that this feeling isn't unreasonable and I'm not mad just a bit disappointed. I'm sure that Obsidian had good intentions but I think it is fair to say that the execution (transparency, who is able to vote, what about the special group who backed the signed ce's) leaves much to be desired.

Well put. Just leaves a sour taste. Sigh. Next time I just wait for the parcel to arrive instead of bothering to read the posts.

[kozzy]

Anyone know when we get our steam/gog.com code for the game? Will we get it before release so we can preload or atleast register the key on steam/gog.com?

Thanks! Super excited to play the final game!

[ruzen]

@ LordCrash

Well I belive you misunderstud me about what I called disgusting because I really do think Its shamefull to deliver goods late -as I said before- but bringing the money or the level of pledge or the level of comitment or the service some of us must be getting, shouldnt be relevent about your point. Because there shouldnt be rising from others -individually or a group- in crowdfounding. Hell ! Even I wanted to be everyone have at the same time and I dont have any phsycal goods. Alas, Its decided this way but I find the other parts, you and some others who thinks Its not fare to be at same position as other backers because of the $500+ pladge.

It should only be focused around Obsidians delivering management only. Maybe you (as in general) dragged to talk like this and put the money card but I didnt like that kinda talk. Its been decade since we are having this kinda game and we make It happen together.

While still, my sympathy is with you guys I just hope you guys hear my emotions about my point as I did heard yours.

[armorb]

Apparently our European friends need a tutorial on the mysteries of geography.....

[armorb]

Anyone know when we get our steam/gog.com code for the game? Will we get it before release so we can preload or atleast register the key on steam/gog.com?

Thanks! Super excited to play the final game!

I don't think they've commented yet on when the codes might drop. Presumably that will be part of BAdler's post on Monday....

[Doppelschwert]

@crash

 

I'm on your side but it is pretty normal for ks products outside the us to arrive later in europe. The only reason I'm disappointed is because of that poll that suggested that this wouldn't be the case if the majority would be okay with the game discs being sent later. That was the main reason I voted for the split up delivery. That whole poll thing leaves a bad taste in my mouth regarding transperency. I think that this feeling isn't unreasonable and I'm not mad just a bit disappointed. I'm sure that Obsidian had good intentions but I think it is fair to say that the execution (transparency, who is able to vote, what about the special group who backed the signed ce's) leaves much to be desired.

 

Yeah, this. Now that I know I get the stuff digitally at release, the only issue is the poll. The world won't be coming to an end because of it, but it's a strange aftertaste.

Edited March 15, 2015 by Doppelschwert

[Hiro Protagonist II]

... international customers, because not only they won't get the boxes on day 1 as promised (despite knowing otherwise), but they will also get boxes without the game disc, which adds more salt to the wound.

 

I knew otherwise. It will be an impossible task to get physical box rewards (sans dvd) delivered to all backers within a day or two of the release date. There is no way to do it. And one of those reasons is transit times. Different countries have different transit times. TBH, it wouldn't surprise me if some backers get the dvd before their box.

[LordCrash]

@ LordCrash

Well I belive you misunderstud me about what I called disgusting because I really do think Its shamefull to deliver goods late -as I said before- but bringing the money or the level of pledge or the level of comitment or the service some of us must be getting, shouldnt be relevent about your point. Because there shouldnt be rising from others -individually or a group- in crowdfounding. Hell ! Even I wanted to be everyone have at the same time and I dont have any phsycal goods. Alas, Its decided this way but I find the other parts, you and some others who thinks Its not fare to be at same position as other backers because of the $500+ pladge.

It should only be focused around Obsidians delivering management only. Maybe you (as in general) dragged to talk like this and put the money card but I didnt like that kinda talk. Its been decade since we are having this kinda game and we make It happen together.

While still, my sympathy is with you guys I just hope you guys hear my emotions about my point as I did heard yours.

 

Ok, sorry for the misunderstanding then. I certainly didn't want to play the money card in a way that I had "more rights" than others in terms of how the game turns out for example. I certainly don't have. It also wasn't meant as some way of expressing that I were someone more important. But I do think that getting an expensive signed CE might follow a different motivation than getting the standard game box - apart from just pledging more of course. I think it's a much bigger issue for collector's that their version isn't "complete" than it is for most people (though perhaps not all) who pledged for standard box version or only just a digital version. An on a very personal level, spending 500 bucks can be a much bigger investment than spending 50 or 100 bucks (although that depends a lot on personal circumstances so I only talk about my personal situation here). So to get that out of the door: I think everyone in Europe (and elsewhere) and especially the ones with collection motivations are kind of ****ed, no matter how much they've pledged. It's just unfair to them that the box won't contain a game DVD and the box won't even arrive on time internationally now. So it's not just a money issue, it's more a "motivation" issue, if you just want to play the game or if you value your physical stuff or even collect game stuff.

[Darkpriest]

 

... international customers, because not only they won't get the boxes on day 1 as promised (despite knowing otherwise), but they will also get boxes without the game disc, which adds more salt to the wound.

 

I knew otherwise. It will be an impossible task to get physical box rewards (sans dvd) delivered to all backers within a day or two of the release date. There is no way to do it. And one of those reasons is transit times. Different countries have different transit times. TBH, it wouldn't surprise me if some backers get the dvd before their box.

 

 

I realize there are different transit times, but then why to make such vague points, where one might conclude that it will be at the same time when he will have the digital key in his hands.

 

1. We ship everything out except the game disc, which we then ship to you after finalizing the 1.0 version. Wait a minute. That sounds crazy. You’re going to ship me a game with NO DISC inside at first?! Here’s why we think that’s good: Anyone who pledged to a physical reward tier will get a digital copy. You’ll be able to get a Steam or GOG.com key on our site and play the game at the same time as everyone else. You’d be able to take out your Collector’s Guidebook, your cloth map, your mousepad and enjoy all of it at the same you’re playing Pillars of Eternity.

 

This should have been worded in other way, clearly stating, that it is a choice between a week or two and two to four depending on the region of the world with exception to US where you may have it most likely on day 1.

[LordCrash]

 

 

... international customers, because not only they won't get the boxes on day 1 as promised (despite knowing otherwise), but they will also get boxes without the game disc, which adds more salt to the wound.

 

I knew otherwise. It will be an impossible task to get physical box rewards (sans dvd) delivered to all backers within a day or two of the release date. There is no way to do it. And one of those reasons is transit times. Different countries have different transit times. TBH, it wouldn't surprise me if some backers get the dvd before their box.

 

 

 

1. You’d be able to take out your Collector’s Guidebook, your cloth map, your mousepad and enjoy all of it at the same you’re playing Pillars of Eternity.

 

This should have been worded in other way, clearly stating, that it is a choice between a week or two and two to four depending on the region of the world with exception to US where you may have it most likely on day 1.

 

 

Actually, that was just not true for every non-US backer. We won't be able to take out our collector's guidebooks, our cloth mapy or mousepads because we won't have all these stuff while playing Pillars. The time the stuff will arrive ("couple of weeks after release") I will most likely already have finished Pillars for once which will render all these physical things rather uninteresting, to put it mildly...

 

 

Oh yeah, and who really cares about those backers? These guys have already paid a long time ago. Getting the game in time to the new customers is obviously much more important. That's probably why customers on Amazon and co get their physical boxes on release day here in Europe. I guess that's the proper way to thank the backers...

 

Edited March 15, 2015 by LordCrash

[HozzM]

If you can order from Amazon today and get the physical goods ahead of people that spent hundreds of dollars, over two years ago now, to support the game...that sucks.  Bad.  I am sure Obsidian is not ****ing people intentionally but hopefully they will do something to try and make this right.

[Valmy]

I remember the bad old days fretting about getting the physical box in time for release day.  No idea why people were expecting things to go any differently than they did back then.  There were always furious people and delays outside the power of anybody to prevent.  I mean geez a dock workers strike? Now Obsidian is screw all their backers while shamelessly selling out to new customers. Unless Obsidian has some sort of suicidal tendency or pathological need to destroy their company right on the verge of success I don't think they are scheming such a thing.

 

So glad all my games are digital now.

 

 

 

Oh yeah, and who really cares about those backers? These guys have already paid a long time ago. Getting the game in time to the new customers is obviously much more important. That's probably why customers on Amazon and co get their physical boxes on release day here in Europe. I guess that's the proper way to thank the backers...

 

 

Yeah ok let me know if that actually happens.  I bet I am playing my digital copy days before those people are.  My guidebook thing I ordered off Amazon is not getting here until well after release and live in the US.

Edited March 15, 2015 by Valmy

[Namutree]

 

 

 

Understandable.

 

Just so everyone is aware, the physical rewards are all finished (and signed, for those items that required signatures). I realize you aren't looking for excuses, but we had some pretty serious issues shipping into the port of Los Angeles due to labor unions shutting down the docks. It was resolved, but it put a crimp into our shipping plans. We are trying our hardest to get those items shipped to you as quickly as possible.

 

Dang it labor unions. You made Doppleshwert sad.

[vrykyli]

Good evening community, first and probably last time posting on this forum.

 

I have been following POE's development with great enthusiasm. Regardless moot public response with first backers beta, I've been 110% sure that Obsidian can give us the game which we all have been waiting for since BG2. However, I do think that this confusion is remarkably disastrous failure on Obsidian's part, and quite clearly points out that publishing game consist more variables than only developing the game itself. Delivering actual game should not be regarded as a nuisance.

 

I've been now truly perplexed about this whole voting process and when people are going to get their physical editions.

 

It probably was only because my unfounded optimism – for which I can only put blame on myself – but I truly think that previous poll was misleading. At least I was under the impression that non-US backers would receive their physical stuff at somewhere around 26^th and get their fair chance to hype themselves up before submerging into the adventures of Eora.

 

This comes down to the poll mentioned – now obsolete of course – but I really think that Obsidian should have clearly stated that they are shipping physical goods only after 26^th March.

 

Retrospectively, in my point of view, there were thus only two options:

1. “Life-is-unfair” – a**ra** to all non-US backers with only cons.
2. “Communism” – slight delay for all, at the “cost” that backers receive their stuff intact.

Perhaps I misread/misunderstood meaning of the poll or did not pay enough attention, but I currently think it is somewhat outrageous that non-US backers get only the worst of both options – discs might now even come before box thus making “choice” obsolete. The delays are quite common in cases like this and I understand it, but still I would like to have known what I'm really voting.

 

I’m only somewhat disappointed, because I do have time to wait for physical manuals (also my elf cloak and boots of speed replicas from Amazon haven't arrived yet), but I fully understand people who express their concerns more vocally - LordCrash I feel your pain. Also it can be said that everyone has still possibility to play the gog/steam version and read electronic manual. However, back in the days it was integral part of the BG2 experience to get to know world and mechanics by reading them from the handbook, looking details from the paper map and being super enthusiastic about adventures and the world I would be soon immersed into. Okay, blame me being autistic for not getting same feeling with electronic manuals, but that was the reason why I even backed the way I did, and would figure that others would feel the same way.

 

To summarize, I really do feel for the guys, who have invested vast amounts of the money to project, only to realize that they still have to wait couple of weeks while knowing that their boxes is not intact (or does not include discs). And this only for the reason that people in the US can get their stuff sooner.

 

In hindsight if those two options have been more explicit, there would have been greater fuss about whether options are even viable or comparable with each other.

 

I do not want to be regarded being ass, neither hear proposals whether I should study more about geography of different continents: like said I can manage even few weeks delay, and as a big boy already, I can probably even handle the possible situation where the discs arrive before other collectibles. But it still quite difficult to forgive that voting were based on faulty premises.

 

And about that Amazon edition - that would defy the physics and (union politics) if they are able to deliver it at the 26th? Right? Right...?

 

 

 

[W.MacKinnon]

Being one of the guys that ordered a Signed CE; I never thought the game would be sealed. Isn't the box signed? Not on the plastic wrap but the package itself? Was Obsidian supposed to re-wrap the boxes in plastic after the developers signed them? Figured it was always going to be just pop open the box and put the disc inside after delivery; type deal. (Am I wrong?)

[Shiroco]

@crash

 

Well, to be fair your version isn't available from retailers. Your version isn't produced in europe. Your versions is signed by the devs. So comparing the amazon delivery date with your delivery date isn't fair.

[Shiroco]

Being one of the guys that ordered a Signed CE; I never thought the game would be sealed. Isn't the box signed? Not on the plastic wrap but the package itself? Was Obsidian supposed to re-wrap the boxes in plastic after the developers signed them? Figured it was always going to be just pop open the box and put the disc inside after delivery; type deal. (Am I wrong?)

 

Hmmm, havn't thought about that. But a true collector would want it to be sealed and I automatically assumed that only true collectors would back at that pledge lvl. Therefor the signatures would be on the plastic wrap. But technically your interpretation is a valid one...