Backer Reward Shipment Poll

[Flow]

I guess I should have asked this prior to answering, but does anyone know if we'll be charged extra shipping if the shipping is split into 2?

 

http://forums.obsidian.net/topic/70458-backer-reward-shipment-poll/?do=findComment&comment=1568414

[Lephys]

I guess I should have asked this prior to answering, but does anyone know if we'll be charged extra shipping if the shipping is split into 2?

As a New Zealander we do tend to get screwed with shipping costs.

No extra charge to you. Obsidian stated in the official project Update that they're willing to "eat the shipping costs" for the second shipment. Well, themselves and Paradox, collectively, I suppose. But, the preemptive plan is for them to just pay for it themselves.

 

EDIT:

 

Dangit, Flow! You rendered my post redundant by like 5 seconds!

Edited February 12, 2015 by Lephys

[The_Patrix]

I don't even care about the game discs. You can ship me the physical goods only .

[Kamos]

 

 

I am an international backer. Please DO NOT send the items in two separate shipments.

Whatever value you declare for the package, I will pay close to 100% taxes upon. If you send it in two parts, I get to pay taxes twice. So please, just don't.

Both items will take at least a month to get here, and then be held in a customs facility, so in my case all these ideas about sending stuff early are irrelevant (I appreciate the thought, and I can see how it can be cool for others - but PLEASE do not send me two packages).

I would also be interested in knowing what value would be declared for the packages. I am hoping it is the actual "product value", not the value spent on Kickstarter. This is very important for me to know, since the difference could be several hundred dollars in taxes.

 

Thank-you. Since my two posts before were in review for a while before accepted, when they were approved (cheers, by the way!) they were 'posted' in-place at the time they were made. Meaning, a lot of people didn't get to see my point.

PLEASE address this issue, Obsidian. Marking it as a gift doesn't always work and is technically a false declaration. Customs (in the UK at least) can ignore it if they wish,

I would not worry. With Paradox doing the fulfillment, they will likely dispatch from a warehouse inside the EU. Therefore no customs check or duty fees for that matter.

That only solves the problem for european backers.

 

What I'm worried most with option #2, is that pirates get they hands on the game before it's even released. Spreading it all over torrents sites.

It would be a shame if people who just leech from the work of others, would play the game before the backer even do. Even more since it will be a pre 1.0 version, not yet patched to the finale release day version. Which could possibly contain the one or other severe bug. Those pirates then will based on those bugs, which are fixed in the final 1.0 version, spread bad reviews.

From previous reports we already know, a game that gets leaked/pirated before release will suffer from a big drop in sales. This is something a precious old school RPG in the spirit of Baldur's Gate don't deserve. There are not enough made of those these days, to risk it further development by pirates. After all, I want see a POE2 one day.

Read carefully option #2:

 

"Alternatively, we delay shipping everything out to you once we have the final 1.0 version ready. For some parts of the world, this could mean a delay of some real significance. Not just a week or two, but multiple weeks after it’s released."

 

A lot of people seem to be voting on #1 on grounds that #2 would lead to piracy. I have counted four people who have mentioned it, so far.

 

Edit: and I just saw someone answered the same. Still, other people have been saying the same (#2 = more piracy), so I suppose it's valid saying it again.

Edited February 12, 2015 by Kamos

[makryu]

I'm short on time (working overtime), maybe this was mentioned in some of the 13 pages, so sorry for asking again if that's the case:

 

Have Obsidian and Paradox given any thought to the possibility that splitting the shipments could incur extra import taxes? My reasoning is that if I receive two shipments identified as a "collector's edition game" I could be doubly charged import taxes for the amount I donated, which would be particularly disastrous in my case (effectively doubling the amount I donated to the kickstarter, at least). I'd be all for #1 if that weren't the case.

[w0_od]

i do not really care either way, being a non crazy anti DRM nut job , getting the rewards and patching in is fine or getting the rewards later after i already downloaded the game is also fine. And if the DRM nutbars have any issue, well that is their little loony world problem.

[ModernModron]

Why is this an either/or option? This is a "dilemma" that existed back before Steam, so while I understand that it's been long enough without it coming up that many people don't remember, it also doesn't mean that the problem is unsolved.

 

Why not go back to the same solution that developers used to use back then? You can pre-determine a URL for the 1.0 patch, and then put it in the game installer to be downloaded and applied automatically, or put it in the manual and tell people to go there to download it. There's no need to delay shipping the physical goodies or game disk while retaining the DRM-free promise.

 

I suspect the issue is that in order to be DRM-free, the game has to be playable off the disc without any further patching.  But that means that, if the disc is to be delivered on time, it will need to be manufactured with a v0.9-ish version of the game that might be obsolete by the time the game launches.  Thus the disc (which is the most likely copy for early pirate-wannabes to get) might still be buggy, which could lead to morons people complaining about bugs that have actually been fixed it legitimate copies of the game. 

 

This could all be avoided if the game disc cannot be run without patching.  The problem then is that the game disc will only be functional as long as Obsidian maintains the server(s) that handle the patching.  Now I'm sure Obsidian is not out to screw players and would keep the server up as long as possible.  But nothing lasts forever; eventually Obsidian will close, or we'll all switch to a totally new internet, or what have you.  At that point, the autopatcher has become the worst sort of DRM: the kind that prevents honest customers from using the product.

 

That's why Obsidian feels the need to send the DRM-free game disc to customers well after the official release date.

[ModernModron]

Oops, meant to add that if it turns out to impractical to let people opt out of the 2 shipments, I very much hope Obsidian can split the state value of the whole box between the two shipments properly.  Regardless of who pays it, it would be a shame to pay taxes on the same items twice.

[Valsuelm]

This poll should have been conducted through the backer portal methinks and only opened to those of us who actually have physical goods coming to us.

 

Also, if Paradox and Obsidian go with option one, I hope that those who would prefer to wait for the disks can be accommodated.

[Mystryon]

Went for #1

[Mystryon]

Went for #1

[junk11]

As a backer living in Asia, option 1 is definitely the best option. I mean I only received WL2 physical items last weekend… It does take a long time…

but then I don't really want to play too much before the game patches few more times after launch… anyway I am fine with either way :D

Edited February 13, 2015 by junk11

[Varana]

Have Obsidian and Paradox given any thought to the possibility that splitting the shipments could incur extra import taxes?

 

There hasn't been any statement regarding that issue, so we don't know yet whether they had thought of that or have a solution in mind.

It may well be that the involvement of Paradox means that European backers will be getting their shipments from within Europe, but that's only an assumption. And it doesn't really help backers from outside the U.S. and Europe.

[Vesko]

I don't mind waiting longer for the game together with the disc. I can start playing the digital version. I ordered the box to have something to put on the shelf. Option 2 for me.

[lambertjon]

As an Australian backer of Wasteland 2 I only got my signed collectors copy of Wasteland 2 last week, I've waited until now to play it because I wanted to sit down and read the paper manual 'old school style' before diving in, just like I did in the old days.

 

Having to wait 4.5 months after it was released to receive my CE after backing it so big was a massive disappointment to me.

 

Please, please ship it without the physical disc (very) early so I have it in my hands ready to dive in day one!

[Stoibs]

Personally, for my part at least, I have a second option for you:

 

I don't honestly care if I get a game disc at all, even though I am a physical backer.  I wanted all the extras in the Collectors Edition, but whether or not I have a physical game disc makes me no nevermind since I'm going to have at least one copy on Steam.  As long as I get a total of two digital codes for purchasing a CE (my wife wanted to play too!), I'm totally cool with not receiving a game disc at all and saving you guys a little extra money.

 

Perhaps a backer poll to see who else might agree with me?  If its a statistically significant number, you might save a fair bit of money (or not, depending on discounts per amount of discs created).

 

Yup, this is the idea I already came up with both in this thread and as one of the first responders on the KS update as a third choice. I just want the Cool box and physical manual (Plus whatever else my physical tier/addon's entitled me to)

 

I would be 100% fine with this and it would actually be preferable since I too am hoping for just 2 steam codes on the day of release for me and someone else who joint backed at this tier.

[madglee]

Definitely option 1. Too many games recently where I finish the GOG version before my physical copies come. I'll play, but still be able to use the manual and map and what not. Very good idea!

[madglee]

As an Australian backer of Wasteland 2 I only got my signed collectors copy of Wasteland 2 last week, I've waited until now to play it because I wanted to sit down and read the paper manual 'old school style' before diving in, just like I did in the old days.

 

Having to wait 4.5 months after it was released to receive my CE after backing it so big was a massive disappointment to me.

 

Please, please ship it without the physical disc (very) early so I have it in my hands ready to dive in day one!

I'm in Cali, and that happened to me, too. I had finished the game weeks before the physical stuff came. 

[Desslock]

Option 1 for sure.    Having waited too long for my physcial CE copy of Divinity Original Sin, I appreciate this alterative option.

[Ferrante]

What about send a no-playable version of the game. It could be then activated via a patch, which could be downloaded (automatic if you are on-line or just saved in a file to be transported) and installed. That patch would have the activation AND the update for v1.0. It is hard because people can just play around it, but it could be need some priority data. 

[Ink Blot]

As an Australian backer of Wasteland 2 I only got my signed collectors copy of Wasteland 2 last week, I've waited until now to play it because I wanted to sit down and read the paper manual 'old school style' before diving in, just like I did in the old days.

 

Having to wait 4.5 months after it was released to receive my CE after backing it so big was a massive disappointment to me.

 

Please, please ship it without the physical disc (very) early so I have it in my hands ready to dive in day one!

On the bright side, you've had to wait long enough that you're now able to reap the benefit of a number of patches that would have likely made you want to start over if you'd been able to play from the release date.

[Darkpriest]

I voted 2.

 

1st - I'd rather not deal with extra customs or potentially misplaced/lost disc on shipment #2

 

2nd - as a few people stated here already. It will be a huge bummer for collectors and possible future value of the boxed versions, especially the CE ones

 

3rd - I do not even live at the address Ive given. It's my old family house used to stash various physical goodies, where one of my parents still lives. Being 9 timezones away from there currently, would make resolving any possible issues.with double shipment extremely difficult.

 

For playing the game I will be using the digital Steam version so as long asnI get the code on the release day I have no problems with getting a full shipment later on.

 

Perhaps an opt out option can be taken into consideration?

[JoniOdin]

I think #1 is the better option.
But I can see both options have their advantages.

[Umbaglo]

 

Why is this an either/or option? This is a "dilemma" that existed back before Steam, so while I understand that it's been long enough without it coming up that many people don't remember, it also doesn't mean that the problem is unsolved.

 

Why not go back to the same solution that developers used to use back then? You can pre-determine a URL for the 1.0 patch, and then put it in the game installer to be downloaded and applied automatically, or put it in the manual and tell people to go there to download it. There's no need to delay shipping the physical goodies or game disk while retaining the DRM-free promise.

 

I suspect the issue is that in order to be DRM-free, the game has to be playable off the disc without any further patching.  But that means that, if the disc is to be delivered on time, it will need to be manufactured with a v0.9-ish version of the game that might be obsolete by the time the game launches.  Thus the disc (which is the most likely copy for early pirate-wannabes to get) might still be buggy, which could lead to morons people complaining about bugs that have actually been fixed it legitimate copies of the game. 

 

This could all be avoided if the game disc cannot be run without patching.  The problem then is that the game disc will only be functional as long as Obsidian maintains the server(s) that handle the patching.  Now I'm sure Obsidian is not out to screw players and would keep the server up as long as possible.  But nothing lasts forever; eventually Obsidian will close, or we'll all switch to a totally new internet, or what have you.  At that point, the autopatcher has become the worst sort of DRM: the kind that prevents honest customers from using the product.

 

That's why Obsidian feels the need to send the DRM-free game disc to customers well after the official release date.

 

 

In other words, you're saying that their intent is that the DRM version will never ever get another patch. I somehow doubt this is the case; they're clearly going to patch the DRM-free version, so the exact same method they're going to use after launch can be used to ensure that the 1.0 patch is available for players that receive the disk.

 

Hell, some people are suggesting that the intent for wanting to delay is to prevent someone from ripping the game from the disk and putting it up for piracy. Releasing a somewhat non-functional pre-1.0 version to the manufacturer and expecting the players to download a patch that completes it seems like the BEST solution; if the early access version basically won't work, then it doesn't matter if someone leaks it from the factory! The version on the disk could even be basically the whole game as it exists right now, but forced to run the current beta until it gets the 1.0 patch, if they wanted to be fancy about the whole matter (but that would be a lot of work).

 

If the manual or installer says "Go to this URL to get the release patch", or even checks there automatically (which is not a DRM service), then it's the person's fault for not paying attention. This is not an unsolved problem; players used to deal with this before the Steam days, and while Steam and other DRM services fixed the problem conclusively, that doesn't mean the old methods don't work.

[Prasse]

As long as i get the game DRM free i don't really care =). Went with #2 since it would cost Obsidian less.