Please Change the Might Attribute

[wpmaura]

Might Attribute is just all wrong a Wizard is just as Strong as a fighter and then on top of that a can wield more power full spells.

 

Dont try to re invent the attribute system and stream line it its not what the old BG or RPGs were about. I am suprised you just didnt create 2 atributes power and reflex and leave it at that.

 

Bring back Strength for how strong some one is and will power and inteligence for magic user classes.

[archangel979]

Small chance they will. If it stays as it is, I hope they rename it to Power or something more fitting.

Bigger problem is that it is useful for all classes unlike some other attributes or that it does not matter much how much point you put into it.

Edited September 5, 2014 by archangel979

[mutonizer]

While I agree with you "overall", I've actually turned to see things differently now, let me explain.

 

- The game considers that all individuals of all races are of about the same physical strength, with very little variants. Therefore, actual physical strength is ignored in all matter of things, but the Athletic skills

- Might is a misnomer and it should instead be called "Soul Strength". According to lore (afaik), each soul can vary in strength and with it, bring almost supernatural powers not only physically, but also magically (since souls are the source of all magic, afaik).

 

If you view it this way, with Might (Soul Strength) being only the "supernatural" part of any given potency, either physical or magical, then it makes more sense. All in all, even a 18 Might wizard is NOT a buffy muscle wizard, his soul is just very strong, allowing him to perform supernatural feats of strength (even if he's a weakling in appearance) and magic.

Likewise, a 3 Might barbarian is not a small weakling but instead could be a massive 2m tall guy, but his soul is very weak, therefore he cannot perform much supernatural feats, just the average norm.

Edited September 5, 2014 by mutonizer

[Sensuki]

Might is actually the best attribute at the moment IMO. No reason to change it.

[Mayama]

so strength showing how strong someone is AND how good he is at hitting things was better?

[Zansatsu]

Might Attribute is just all wrong a Wizard is just as Strong as a fighter and then on top of that a can wield more power full spells.

 

Dont try to re invent the attribute system and stream line it its not what the old BG or RPGs were about. I am suprised you just didnt create 2 atributes power and reflex and leave it at that.

 

Bring back Strength for how strong some one is and will power and inteligence for magic user classes.

I see the logic here.  Wizards, Cyphers, Druids, Chanters can all carry 2handed weapons and deal high damage, wear Heavy armor, And blast people with very powerful spells.......Granted there is accuracy differences but your point if valid.  Seems very lop sided.

[mutonizer]

so strength showing how strong someone is AND how good he is at hitting things was better?

 

It's more logical, and remember, AC in D&D is not always hitting something, but penetrating the armor as well, which fits strength to some degree.

Plus you could go DEX and instead really on precision/finesse striking (which actually is hitting with precision, not penetrating the armor).

 

Once you accept that there are no actual physical Strength factor whatsoever in PoE and it's about Souls, it's all good.

 

Of course, all good means you're ready to accept that a spiderling soul is potentially more powerful than you, the "watcher" and main character. And then you're really ****ed because you start to realize that the bigger mobs are, the bigger their Might attribute is, which turns the entire logic around, making it totally meaningless.

 

But hey, who cares right

[Mayama]

 

so strength showing how strong someone is AND how good he is at hitting things was better?

 

It's more logical, and remember, AC in D&D is not always hitting something, but penetrating the armor as well, which fits strength to some degree.

Plus you could go DEX and instead really on precision/finesse striking (which actually is hitting with precision, not penetrating the armor).

 

Once you accept that there are no actual physical Strength factor whatsoever in PoE and it's about Souls, it's all good.

 

Of course, all good means you're ready to accept that a spiderling soul is potentially more powerful than you, the "watcher" and main character. And then you're really ****ed because you start to realize that the bigger mobs are, the bigger their Might attribute is, which turns the entire logic around, making it totally meaningless.

 

But hey, who cares right

 

 

Yeah in AD&D melee fighters always hit. Its one of those weird decisions where you ask yourself why? But well it was one of the first systems ever made.

[mutonizer]

Yeah in AD&D melee fighters always hit. Its one of those weird decisions where you ask yourself why? But well it was one of the first systems ever made.

Because most people HATE missing and feel "empowered" (or more involved/active/etc) when they hit something, even if they need to hit it 10000000 times to kill it.

[Hamenaglar]

 

While I agree with you "overall", I've actually turned to see things differently now, let me explain.

 

- The game considers that all individuals of all races are of about the same physical strength, with very little variants. Therefore, actual physical strength is ignored in all matter of things, but the Athletic skills

- Might is a misnomer and it should instead be called "Soul Strength". According to lore (afaik), each soul can vary in strength and with it, bring almost supernatural powers not only physically, but also magically (since souls are the source of all magic, afaik).

 

If you view it this way, with Might (Soul Strength) being only the "supernatural" part of any given potency, either physical or magical, then it makes more sense. All in all, even a 18 Might wizard is NOT a buffy muscle wizard, his soul is just very strong, allowing him to perform supernatural feats of strength (even if he's a weakling in appearance) and magic.

Likewise, a 3 Might barbarian is not a small weakling but instead could be a massive 2m tall guy, but his soul is very weak, therefore he cannot perform much supernatural feats, just the average norm.

 

 

Okay, so how do I make a buffy muscle wizard? Or a weakling barbarian? How will the world know if I'm a weakling or a powerhouse physically? 

 

Not to mention, according to your explanation a massive 2m tall guy pounding you with his fists will actually do less damage than a weakling wizards hitting you with his fists. 

 

According to you, a stat that has been a core stat for almost all cRPGs in the last decade and a half (since I remember), doesn't have a representation in this game, meaning it doesn't exist.

 

Oh, and where does it say that Might is actually Soul Strength? I've never ever read something like this from devs or from game. If Might is Soul Strength, why isn't it named that way. Soul power would be far more intuitive and clear name than a Might, don't you think so?

[mutonizer]

According to you, a stat that has been a core stat for almost all cRPGs in the last decade and a half (since I remember), doesn't have a representation in this game, meaning it doesn't exist.

Welcome to 2014 game design 101: "There is indeed no spoon anymore. Spoons sucked and were totally unbalanced vs meat so some people could really mess up if they didn't know about it! But here, use a Knspork instead, no bad build with that baby!!"

 

As a note, I think I failed to make some of my sarcasm transpire previously, so hopefully this reply will correct the matter.

[Captain Shrek]

Might attribute should be renamed: Damage modifier.

[Ang]

I seem to vaguely remember a stat named Power and the forums having a hissyfit over "Power is not an IE like name", after which Power was promptly renamed to Might...

Edited September 5, 2014 by Ang

[Mayama]

Seriously I think stuff like "uh I cant play a weak fighter/barbarian" can be ignored because they are extreme cases. Those guys fight for their living, its basicaly their job. Its like saying "u I want to play a carpenter, but he is really ****ty at working with wood". Even the weakest guy in the army has decent strength. A weak fighter is almost a paradox.

[archangel979]

I seem to vaguely remember a stat named Power and the forums having a hissyfit over "Power is not an IE like name", after which Power was promptly renamed to Might...

My guess people didn't really understand what they were voting for. Now they do.

[Mayama]

 

I seem to vaguely remember a stat named Power and the forums having a hissyfit over "Power is not an IE like name", after which Power was promptly renamed to Might...

My guess people didn't really understand what they were voting for. Now they do.

 

Then they should have put some points into reading instead of maxing all combat stats

[Seari]

When I first saw Sawyer's attribute system I was naive like you. "Change might! It doesn't make any sense!" I said.

 

But in time you will abandon your grognard ways and accept Sawyer as your Lord and Savior.

 

Join Sawyerism, the only religion that matters.

 

From the holy scrolls of Sawyerism:

~Balance in all things, fun is a not needed emotion, it only stops you from fully achieving a complete Single-player cRPG experience.~

[Cantousent]

I don't think I have anything new to add, so I'll just reiterate some arguments in support of their points.

 

Might has non physical connotations, but it by and large seems to be commonly used in reference to physical prowess.  As such, it's jarring to have it affect my spells in better ways than intelligence, since I think sheer spell power has been more important in what I've played so far than increasing the aoe (which just hits more of my people anyway) or duration.

 

If Might covers the power of the soul, then how do they represent actual physical strength?  The idea that all races are roughly the same strength is idiotic.  Members of the same species vary *wildly* in strength.  If we're to gauge intelligence in the game, why the hell are we not doing so for sheer physical power?

 

It is so absolutely counter-intuitive to use the term 'Might' to represent magical ability that I can't help but find it distracting every time I look at my character sheet.  I could accept it, but I'll always look on it as a design flaw and simply ridiculous.

[archangel979]

They should add a 3rd thing that each attribute affects to make the this core system more interesting and give physical strength to Constitution. In real life the strongest men are more often than not big and burly (if we go by the strongest men competitions or Ultimate Fighting or Boxing) so it would be a fitting place to put it. Or leave things as  they are, remove bonus Health from Constitution and base it on class only and give physical strength to Constitution instead

[Seari]

so strength showing how strong someone is AND how good he is at hitting things was better?

"My **** tastes better than your ****!". No it still tastes like ****.

 

DnD attributes were/are very flawed, but this is not any better, actually it's worse. Maybe if dnd attributes are ****, then this is diarrhea. They both taste the same, but this one looks worse.

 

LOL

[Naurgalen]

 

 

While I agree with you "overall", I've actually turned to see things differently now, let me explain.

 

- The game considers that all individuals of all races are of about the same physical strength, with very little variants. Therefore, actual physical strength is ignored in all matter of things, but the Athletic skills

- Might is a misnomer and it should instead be called "Soul Strength". According to lore (afaik), each soul can vary in strength and with it, bring almost supernatural powers not only physically, but also magically (since souls are the source of all magic, afaik).

 

If you view it this way, with Might (Soul Strength) being only the "supernatural" part of any given potency, either physical or magical, then it makes more sense. All in all, even a 18 Might wizard is NOT a buffy muscle wizard, his soul is just very strong, allowing him to perform supernatural feats of strength (even if he's a weakling in appearance) and magic.

Likewise, a 3 Might barbarian is not a small weakling but instead could be a massive 2m tall guy, but his soul is very weak, therefore he cannot perform much supernatural feats, just the average norm.

 

 

Okay, so how do I make a buffy muscle wizard? Or a weakling barbarian? How will the world know if I'm a weakling or a powerhouse physically? 

 

Not to mention, according to your explanation a massive 2m tall guy pounding you with his fists will actually do less damage than a weakling wizards hitting you with his fists. 

 

According to you, a stat that has been a core stat for almost all cRPGs in the last decade and a half (since I remember), doesn't have a representation in this game, meaning it doesn't exist.

 

Oh, and where does it say that Might is actually Soul Strength? I've never ever read something like this from devs or from game. If Might is Soul Strength, why isn't it named that way. Soul power would be far more intuitive and clear name than a Might, don't you think so?

 

 

What if I told you that a Barbarian with 2 constitution will be a weakling like you want?

[Infinitron]

I don't know where you guys are getting the idea that Might doesn't represent physical strength. It absolutely does.

 

Yes, in the world of Eora, strong young wizards generate more intense spells that do more damage.

Edited September 5, 2014 by Infinitron

[Seari]

I don't know where you guys are getting the idea that Might doesn't represent physical strength. It absolutely does.

 

Yes, in the world of Eora, strong young wizards generate spells that do more damage.

Might is the strength/power of your soul. It seems that having a strong soul=physically strong body. So all people in Eora are born with either a physically weak or strong body.

 

This is from the wiki, no idea how accurate it is: "Might represents a character's physical and spiritual strength."

 

So if a single attribute represents the strength of your soul and physical strength, then you can't have a character with a strong soul and a physically weak body.

 

That's how I understand it, it's ****ing confusing, please explain.

[Infinitron]

That's correct. The issue addressed by Josh Sawyer here: 

 

 

answering silkvalley's question "Do you think it is important for attributes to allow certain archetypes? For example, a clumsy and physically weak wizard, yet she deals tons of damage with her spells. The priest who's outstandingly accurate with his spells, but is not a master in sleight of hand and pickpocketing (Dexterity). Similarly, should increasing the damage he deals with spells (via attribute) also increase the number of items he can carry?"

 

Edited September 5, 2014 by Infinitron

[Mayama]

VW product placement?