The August Update creeping ever closer - hopes and fears

[IndiraLightfoot]

As the next update is approaching like a comet on a collision course with Eora, I'm starting to get content creep, since there's a number of things that may get revealed (most of them being excellent stuff, to be sure):

 

Here are a few examples that may or may not be included or at least mentioned or hinted at:

-More delicious PoE-in-the-making insights

-Beta test build info

-Beta testing instructions

-How to update pledges to get a beta add-on

-News on WL2 keys for those having backed at those tier levels

-Hints about Obsidian's next Kickstarter project

 

The list probably goes on and on...

 

What are you looking forward to the most? In the good spirit of Sensuki, please regard this as the official August update camp out thread!

 

 

EDIT: And Obsidian are probably getting update scope creep! Perhaps they'll divide all this up in several small August updates, but why not just be bombastic?

Edited August 6, 2014 by IndiraLightfoot

[Osvir]

I'm hoping for "Beta test instructions" of some kind.

Are we getting an update today or are we getting one next week? That's what I'm speculating about... an update on the 13th regarding the Beta, pre-buffing us for the Beta, seems both more realistic and more "actual" in time to the Beta on the 18th.

Will Obsidian create a private forum under the "Pillars of Eternity" category for Beta testers? (private and exclusive as to avoid any "clog" or "spoilers" for non-beta testers). "If you're not part of the Beta test, you have no purpose in this place"-place kind of deal. Will we get any instructions in how to submit bugs, feedback and suggestion in the best possible way?

How can I aid you, Obsidian, in the best possible way when the Beta begins? What sort of format should I use when I report? Will you provide a "template" bug reporting format? Will there be a bug reporting tool available? (a program or application, drag-n-drop save-file, screenshot, write a short and direct description) Will we be able to write and send bug files in-game to Obsidian?

Will there be a chat function in-game like D:OS? Will I be able to report bugs on the fly from some online in-game bug reporting diagnostics tool? Can the In-Game Journal become tweaked to become an In-Game Beta Journal and could it be possible to attach save files and screenshots to a Journal entry?

These are things I would like to know

Edited August 6, 2014 by Osvir

[Hiro Protagonist II]

Probably easier for Obsidian to create a new sub forum called 'Technical Support' like they have for their other games where everyone can create threads and report bugs with screen shots, etc. than to contact Obsidian direct through other means like email.

[Deiranoth]

I'd opt for in-beta bug report tooling, allowing you to make an immediate code dump onto Obsidian's server, including tester description and possible screenshots. Seen this work in another (can't seem to recall which game's) beta, and it was a dream!

[Osvir]

Probably easier for Obsidian to create a new sub forum called 'Technical Support' like they have for their other games where everyone can create threads and report bugs with screen shots, etc. than to contact Obsidian direct through other means like email.

Of course Hiro. My suggestion applies to a sub-forum idea. I just think it should be exclusive, private, closed.

 

A) A "Template Format" for Beta backers allows us to provide feedback in a way that Obsidian wants it in the best way. This way we can make the best kinds of first posts in a New Thread to give the best kinds of feedback. It'll make it easier for Obsidian to organize the feedback.

 

B) An exclusive Beta backer forum is good as to avoid non-Beta backers to take up space/volume, by making irrelevant threads and/or obstructing the Beta process by commenting on Bug Threads with negative attitude. If I post a bug, and then 10-20 non-Beta backers comment on it "That's a thing? F**k you Obsidian for ruining the game!" or whatever, that just takes away from productivity for Obsidian.

 

People who aren't part of the Beta, shouldn't be a part of the Beta. It sounds more harsh than I mean it, but I don't know how to formulate it in any better way.

[Hiro Protagonist II]

I'm not sure how you would make the forum inclusive of backers only. It seems like a lot of work with cross-referencing of what backers have paid for. I don't think Obsidian would put the time in to do this. They'd just open a new sub-forum and look at the threads being created with screen shots, youtube videos of bugs being replicated, and presumably address those bugs.

 

Also, people will be streaming their gameplay videos on twitch and youtube. Non-backers will be watching these video and someone might come up with a suggestion to balance something, or other legitimate suggestions. Should we ignore those people who have valid suggestions? But it is a good point with what threads should be created. Purely bugs or will the new forum be flooded with opinions and whining instead of constructive criticism and suggestions. I wouldn't want to see threads created with 'why you make Barbarian so OP???' and the bug threads being buried.

 

Maybe have two forums. Technical Support for bugs only. And a second forum for Beta General Discussion for other things like suggestions, balancing, etc. and the usual 'Why no love for the Mage???' threads.

 

Also, excluding non-backer members from the beta forums would only make those backers create threads in the other forums like the PoE General Discussion. It would be a mess. Best to keep it all in one spot. eg Technical Support for Bugs and Beta General Discussion for the rest including all those whine threads. We're still going to get threads complaining about stuff regardless of which sub forum it's in.

Edited August 6, 2014 by Hiro Protagonist II

[Sensuki]

I hope they fixed the pathfinding issues with combat before the beta goes live, but we'll see.

[Nonek]

With twelve days left I don't particularly mind if there is another update before the beta or not, with Sensuki and C2B providing us the lowdown as well as the developers ocassionally discussing what they consider pertinent in the forums, I personally think we will have enough information to tide us over.

[Osvir]

Valid points Hiro

[Karkarov]

I would like some sort of brief update before the 18th telling us how the beta is going to be downloaded and how to report bugs sure.  Beyond that I just want the beta itself, ayup.

[curryinahurry]

All good posts so far...I will just chime in and say that fairly detailed objectives and instructions about the Beta should be the focus at this point.  I would have liked a bit more information about character creation and levelling mechanics, but maybe the folks at Obsidian are waiting for our feedback about core issues (levelling wise) and mechanics (game in broader aspects).

[Bryy]

I hope they fixed the pathfinding issues with combat before the beta goes live, but we'll see.

But this is an old school RPG!

 

[W.MacKinnon]

Have the stated the system requirements of the game yet? I've been wondering if I should man up and buy a new video card. Currently running on a GT630, which isn't very good but get's the job done for most of my PC gaming needs. Tend to play mostly on my Playstation rather then my PC so I haven't really considered buying a newer one. I figure my CPU's good enough as it's 2.66quad. You guys know if expected specs were posted anywhere? I didn't notice them in any of the updates.

[Sensuki]

Wouldn't be surprised if the next update is tomorrow.

[nzmccorm]

Have the stated the system requirements of the game yet? I've been wondering if I should man up and buy a new video card. Currently running on a GT630, which isn't very good but get's the job done for most of my PC gaming needs. Tend to play mostly on my Playstation rather then my PC so I haven't really considered buying a newer one. I figure my CPU's good enough as it's 2.66quad. You guys know if expected specs were posted anywhere? I didn't notice them in any of the updates.

They haven't been stated explicitly, but Sawyer said over on SA that it should run just fine on weaker/older boxes. He also said that if anything'll be a problem it'll be RAM.

 

e: Specifically he said that his personal goal was for it to run well on machines 5 or more years old, so I think a lower end but recent card isn't going to be a big problem.

Edited August 7, 2014 by nzmccorm

[Flow]

I hope they fixed the pathfinding issues with combat before the beta goes live, but we'll see.

 

Curious what you mean by this. I've watched the recent videos, and I'm not quite sure where you see pathfinding problems.

[Sensuki]

There's a couple of instances in combat where Brandon tries to move a character past two units grouped together. The character runs into the units and runs on the spot due to the pathfinding being able to detect unobstructed navmesh between the two characters, but the gap not being wide enough to fit the character.

 

The game's pathfinding obviously does not have a check for width of navmesh being obstructed by other units in the game, or just width of navmesh in general (eg. if there was a 1 pixel gap of navmesh that went through a fence, characters may try to walk through it and run on the spot).

 

Pretty easy fix, just need to either make units try to walk around by default IF the units are visible (preferred), or walk around once they run into the gap. 

[BAdler]

I hope they fixed the pathfinding issues with combat before the beta goes live, but we'll see.

 

The pathfinding and game state code is being completely redone. We have been reworking it since before E3, but it is pretty extensive. Unfortunately, it won't be ready in time for the initial Backer Beta launch. It is about 90% ready, but it needs to be 100% before we can integrate it back into our main code branch. I would expect that it will go into one of our first beta updates.

[Karkarov]

 

I hope they fixed the pathfinding issues with combat before the beta goes live, but we'll see.

 

The pathfinding and game state code is being completely redone. We have been reworking it since before E3, but it is pretty extensive. Unfortunately, it won't be ready in time for the initial Backer Beta launch. It is about 90% ready, but it needs to be 100% before we can integrate it back into our main code branch. I would expect that it will go into one of our first beta updates.

 

Just to throw this out there Mr. Adler but when the BB hits how reserved do you want us to be with sharing information, posting video, talking about it, etc etc?  It is going to be a real beta so all of us who are sane know there will be rough edges, would you peeps at Obsidian prefer we hold back until a few Beta patches go in to fix things like the path finding?

[Sensuki]

Cool, cheers for the heads up.

[Adam Brennecke]

There's a couple of instances in combat where Brandon tries to move a character past two units grouped together. The character runs into the units and runs on the spot due to the pathfinding being able to detect unobstructed navmesh between the two characters, but the gap not being wide enough to fit the character.

 

The game's pathfinding obviously does not have a check for width of navmesh being obstructed by other units in the game, or just width of navmesh in general (eg. if there was a 1 pixel gap of navmesh that went through a fence, characters may try to walk through it and run on the spot).

 

Pretty easy fix, just need to either make units try to walk around by default IF the units are visible (preferred), or walk around once they run into the gap. 

 

Nothing is a pretty easy fix. Pathing and unit movement is a complex problem with many edge cases. It also needs to be run-time and memory efficient, which can make it even a more challenging problem to solve. 

[BAdler]

 

 

I hope they fixed the pathfinding issues with combat before the beta goes live, but we'll see.

 

The pathfinding and game state code is being completely redone. We have been reworking it since before E3, but it is pretty extensive. Unfortunately, it won't be ready in time for the initial Backer Beta launch. It is about 90% ready, but it needs to be 100% before we can integrate it back into our main code branch. I would expect that it will go into one of our first beta updates.

 

Just to throw this out there Mr. Adler but when the BB hits how reserved do you want us to be with sharing information, posting video, talking about it, etc etc?  It is going to be a real beta so all of us who are sane know there will be rough edges, would you peeps at Obsidian prefer we hold back until a few Beta patches go in to fix things like the path finding?

 

 

You should share and post about it as much as you like. There are lots of bugs, but that shouldn't stop anyone from taking about the game and things they find wrong with it.

[Sensuki]

Nothing is a pretty easy fix. Pathing and unit movement is a complex problem with many edge cases. It also needs to be run-time and memory efficient, which can make it even a more challenging problem to solve.

Fair enough.

 

Moving forward, how does the pathfinding correspond to the fog of war? Does it take units obscured by it into account? (I don't think that's a common practice in modern RTS games).

Edited August 8, 2014 by Sensuki

[Adam Brennecke]

 

Nothing is a pretty easy fix. Pathing and unit movement is a complex problem with many edge cases. It also needs to be run-time and memory efficient, which can make it even a more challenging problem to solve.

Fair enough.

 

Moving forward, how does the pathfinding correspond to the fog of war? Does it take units obscured by it into account? (I don't think that's a common practice in modern RTS games).

 

 

Units don't change their pathing behavior if they are obscured by fog. Most of the time, the units that are doing the heavy pathing calculations are revealed - party members and creatures in combat.

[Pray]

The way moving your character feels in the game can really make or break a game. A good feel makes the game feed silky and well polished, but a sluggish, poorly implemented pathing system makes the player feel hamstrung and bogged down in something that they should not even be thinking about.

 

Good luck guys, do your best!