Woldan Posted August 12, 2014 Share Posted August 12, 2014 (edited) However weight bearing activities like Yoga and running decrease your need for lifting weights, and someone doing Yoga every day is going to be just fine competing strength wise with your typical person lifting weights. Unless you are talking about low-level lifters or average-joe-gym-guy I couldn't disagree more. I want to see someone doing only yoga being able to dead lift 2.5 times their own body weight 4 reps, shoulder press their own body weight 3 times or doing 15 commando pull ups. Or 3/4 body weight bent forward rows 10 reps. Also bone density only increases through breaking the crystalline structure in your bones which then heals, which happens when you run (in your legs), punch sand bags or put really heavy weights on them. If Yoga was that effective in strength building and easy all the competing strongmen and athletes would do that and not waste their time with pumping iron. I think its funny how people desperately try to find alternatives to weight lifting using all kinds of strange logics. I know so many people doing that, its like they're scared of it and don't want it to be true. And the people with those theories usually have very little sports experience under their belt and cannot prove it. All I can say is that lifting weights is a quick, efficient and direct no-BS way to strengthen your whole body. Edited August 12, 2014 by Woldan I gazed at the dead, and for one dark moment I saw a banquet. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Blarghagh Posted August 12, 2014 Share Posted August 12, 2014 What's the downside to cardio only ? There are two: Not curing what 99% of the western civilization suffers from: bad posture. Muscular imbalances on your body that lead to bad posture which later down the road leads to a back so screwed up that it looks like it had been used as an unsuspended bridge on a busy highway. Huh, my physical therapist said that bad posture causes the muscular imbalances, not the other way around. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sarex Posted August 12, 2014 Share Posted August 12, 2014 If that was true athletes that need strength and bone density would go swimming, instead they all do rigorous weight exercises, the sprinters, the MMA and UFC fighters, boxers, pole lifters, hammer throwers and strongmen..... I don't say it doesn't build muscle, it does, but compare threading water to squatting 3x8 130 kilograms and you might see and especially feel a difference. If you don't believe me, try it. I do it, I also go swimming. *edit* And if treading water would build any considerable amount muscle mass those Tour De France cyclists would have gotten legs the size of giant dinosaurs by now, from all the heavy mountain cycling for hundreds of kilometers. They don't. Too many repetitions, too little resistance, it builds endurance, not strength / size. I really don't know what you are talking about. My brother trained water polo for 10 years, never did any lifting and is built like a truck. After that he switched to judo and he still doesn't do any lifting. Worth noting that he was at one point third place in the national tournament. Now days he has his own club and he still doesn't do any lifting and is still strong as a truck. I will never get you body builders, you always think that lifting is the be all end all of training when it's at best a supplement training which helps you focusing on some type of muscles. 1 "because they filled mommy with enough mythic power to become a demi-god" - KP Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Malcador Posted August 12, 2014 Share Posted August 12, 2014 I think its funny how people desperately try to find alternatives to weight lifting using all kinds of strange logics. "Desperately" ? You have an interesting view on weight lifting, heh. Returned to work today after a day off. New guy's phone still doesn't work, been a week now, hah. Having a day filled with needless worry so far. Why has elegance found so little following? Elegance has the disadvantage that hard work is needed to achieve it and a good education to appreciate it. - Edsger Wybe Dijkstra Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Blarghagh Posted August 12, 2014 Share Posted August 12, 2014 Well, water polo is an exception I would think. If I put the three water polo players I know in a room with the six* body builders I know, the water polo players would kick their asses to hell and back twice over without breaking a sweat. Those dudes are monsters. *Well, I only really know 4 now. I stopped hanging out with two of them because they were super boring and talked about nothing else but muscle groups and diet. Quickest way to get rid of all possibility of making friends is to talk non-stop about bodybuilding. Or cycle racing. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mkreku Posted August 12, 2014 Share Posted August 12, 2014 This discussion makes me happy. It should make it quite clear to everyone the amount of truckloads of salt you should take Mr Survival Bayonet's advice with. Swedes, go to: Spel2, for the latest game reviews in swedish! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Woldan Posted August 12, 2014 Share Posted August 12, 2014 (edited) I will never get you body builders, you always think that lifting is the be all end all of training when it's at best a supplement training which helps you focusing on some type of muscles. I'm not a body builder. I don't count calories, I do very few isolation exercises, I don't do it for aesthetics, I do strength training to get as strong as possible without supplements, odd diets or roids. There is a difference between body building and strength training, both visual and in the exercise regime. How do you measure your brothers strength? How do you know he is strong? Judo doesn't require tons of strength, its mostly reflexes, technique and leverage effect, thats why even small women can beat a larger guy with judo techniques. This discussion makes me happy. It should make it quite clear to everyone the amount of truckloads of salt you should take Mr Survival Bayonet's advice with. Ah, the guy with all the experience has arrived! Come in, take a seat, enlighten us with your expertise. *Snickers* Edited August 12, 2014 by Woldan I gazed at the dead, and for one dark moment I saw a banquet. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sarex Posted August 12, 2014 Share Posted August 12, 2014 I'm not a body builder. I don't count calories, I do very few isolation exercises, I don't do it for aesthetics, I do strength training to get as strong as possible without supplements, odd diets or roids. There is a difference between body building and strength training. How do you measure your brothers strength? How do you know he is strong? Judo doesn't require much strength, its mostly reflexes and leverage effect, thats why even small women can beat a guy with judo techniques. Yeah I was generalizing, sorry if I offended. I know how strong he is because when I fight him I get my ass handed to me. Also he can lift heavy things. Also as far as I can see your knowledge of judo is purely theoretical otherwise you wouldn't say that judo doesn't require much strength. A heavily trained women (in judo) can surprise a man in a conflict and throw him and then she will run like hell. Only in movies do you see a small women throw a 120 kg man and put him in to a submission hold, it just doesn't work like that, you need strength to put behind your technique, doubly so if your opponent is trained in judo too. In judo tournaments both contestants know judo and they will defend them selves to throws in a fight. In a judo fight it's 60% strength, 30% technique and 10% the state of mind. If judo didn't require strength then there wouldn't be weight classes. "because they filled mommy with enough mythic power to become a demi-god" - KP Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Woldan Posted August 12, 2014 Share Posted August 12, 2014 (edited) As far as I know you hardly ever need to move things heavier than your opponents body weight in Judo, but my experience with Judo is rather limited, I have to admit. Fun fact: did you know that Bruce Lee was an avid weight lifter? He found that lifting made him perform much better in martial arts and stunts when filming. Also all the MMA and UFC fighters are lifters, and I'm sure they don't lift because they're bored. Edited August 12, 2014 by Woldan I gazed at the dead, and for one dark moment I saw a banquet. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sarex Posted August 12, 2014 Share Posted August 12, 2014 As far as I know you hardly ever need to move things heavier than your opponents body weight in Judo, but my experience with Judo is rather limited, I have to admit. Fun fact: did you know that Bruce Lee was an avid weight lifter? He found that lifting made him perform much better in martial arts and stunts when filming. Also all the MMA and UFC fighters are lifters, and I'm sure they don't lift because they're bored. I know about Bruce Lee and I'm a big fan of his, but he lifted, ran, swam, stretched, worked his fingers on a steering wheel while he drove and ultimately died at the age of 32. People will push their bodies to the limit in pursuit of victory no matter the price, but for us ordinary folks who only want to look good and stay healthy I recommend swimming and running. "because they filled mommy with enough mythic power to become a demi-god" - KP Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hurlshort Posted August 12, 2014 Share Posted August 12, 2014 However weight bearing activities like Yoga and running decrease your need for lifting weights, and someone doing Yoga every day is going to be just fine competing strength wise with your typical person lifting weights. Unless you are talking about low-level lifters or average-joe-gym-guy I couldn't disagree more. I want to see someone doing only yoga being able to dead lift 2.5 times their own body weight 4 reps, shoulder press their own body weight 3 times or doing 15 commando pull ups. Or 3/4 body weight bent forward rows 10 reps. Also bone density only increases through breaking the crystalline structure in your bones which then heals, which happens when you run (in your legs), punch sand bags or put really heavy weights on them. If Yoga was that effective in strength building and easy all the competing strongmen and athletes would do that and not waste their time with pumping iron. I think its funny how people desperately try to find alternatives to weight lifting using all kinds of strange logics. I know so many people doing that, its like they're scared of it and don't want it to be true. And the people with those theories usually have very little sports experience under their belt and cannot prove it. All I can say is that lifting weights is a quick, efficient and direct no-BS way to strengthen your whole body. Woldan, what exactly is your education? Have you taken any kinesiology classes on this stuff? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gorgon Posted August 12, 2014 Share Posted August 12, 2014 He got his back injury lifting. You could say it killed him because the painkiller overdose was definately related. I'm guessing it looked good on camera and gave him a boost to do the shoot if he pumped rigth before. Na na na na na na ... greg358 from Darksouls 3 PVP is a CHEATER. That is all. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Woldan Posted August 12, 2014 Share Posted August 12, 2014 (edited) I know about Bruce Lee and I'm a big fan of his, but he lifted, ran, swam, stretched, worked his fingers on a steering wheel while he drove and ultimately died at the age of 32. People will push their bodies to the limit in pursuit of victory no matter the price, but for us ordinary folks who only want to look good and stay healthy I recommend swimming and running. Bruce Lee died from a cerebral edema which he developed from an allergic reaction to painkillers. Woldan, what exactly is your education? Have you taken any kinesiology classes on this stuff? I've been lifting, cycling, swimming and climbing mountains for ten years, also most of my best friends are active performance-oriented athletes including one rehabilitation physician, a personal trainer and a strongman. He got his back injury lifting. You could say it killed him because the painkiller overdose was definately related. I'm guessing it looked good on camera and gave him a boost to do the shoot if he pumped rigth before. He was doing ''Good-Mornings'' with very heavy weights, a controversial exercise very few people recommend. Personally I've done them twice and never did them again. They hurt and pain is never good. Bruce mentioned that it was this exercise that injured his back and I agree. You CAN and WILL ruin yourself if you don't lift properly. You also can and will ruin yourself with any other sports if you screw up. Also if you ''pump iron right before a shoot'' you wont magically resemble a blow-up doll.... I'm sure he had other reasons to do weights than to look good in front of the camera, for example to prevent injuries when doing stunts which is pretty freaking damn important for someone like him. ''Good-mornings'', an exercise I do NOT recommend: BTW, I'm growing tired of this discussion, talking with completely unexperienced people about weight lifting is very tiring and it could drag on for many many more pages. Edited August 12, 2014 by Woldan I gazed at the dead, and for one dark moment I saw a banquet. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Woldan Posted August 12, 2014 Share Posted August 12, 2014 (edited) If you have never touched any weights and you are interested in extending your knowledge about resistance training beyond hearsay and the opinion of the masses get this book, it should cover all your questions, how it works, what it does. Highly recommendable book. Edited August 12, 2014 by Woldan I gazed at the dead, and for one dark moment I saw a banquet. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Malcador Posted August 12, 2014 Share Posted August 12, 2014 (edited) BTW, I'm growing tired of this discussion, talking with completely unexperienced people about weight lifting is very tiring and it could drag on for many many more pages. Yes, the untermensch are indeed tiresome. Today has been funny, client raises issue...2 mins later, client fixes issue. PEBKAC bugs abound! Edited August 12, 2014 by Malcador 2 Why has elegance found so little following? Elegance has the disadvantage that hard work is needed to achieve it and a good education to appreciate it. - Edsger Wybe Dijkstra Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sarex Posted August 12, 2014 Share Posted August 12, 2014 TIL that I am an untermensch. Point me to the nearest gas chamber. "because they filled mommy with enough mythic power to become a demi-god" - KP Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Woldan Posted August 12, 2014 Share Posted August 12, 2014 (edited) TIL that I am an untermensch. Point me to the nearest gas chamber. If being an untermensch means being highly reistant to other peoples first hand experiences then I applaud to your self-discovery. Edited August 12, 2014 by Woldan 1 I gazed at the dead, and for one dark moment I saw a banquet. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Calax Posted August 12, 2014 Share Posted August 12, 2014 All this talk of lifting and excersize makes me feel fat... and lazy... and have bad time management skills. Leaving for California in two days. Victor of the 5 year fan fic competition! Kevin Butler will awesome your face off. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ManifestedISO Posted August 13, 2014 Share Posted August 13, 2014 It'll be here, waiting for you, hot and humid dammit. All Stop. On Screen. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Woldan Posted August 13, 2014 Share Posted August 13, 2014 Anyway, had a badly infected wound on my palm, the size of a € 2 coin, didn't stop oozing and bleeding, wanted to go to the doc. Rubbed salt into it, the pain was far worse than expected but it worked like a damn miracle. Pain gone, infection gone, wound is dry, no need to see a doc. Bad infection cured in 10 minutes. I gazed at the dead, and for one dark moment I saw a banquet. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sarex Posted August 13, 2014 Share Posted August 13, 2014 If being an untermensch means being highly reistant to other peoples first hand experiences then I applaud to your self-discovery. Right back at you. Anyway, had a badly infected wound on my palm, the size of a € 2 coin, didn't stop oozing and bleeding, wanted to go to the doc. Rubbed salt into it, the pain was far worse than expected but it worked like a damn miracle. Pain gone, infection gone, wound is dry, no need to see a doc. Bad infection cured in 10 minutes. Get that hand checked out, better to get some antibiotics just in case then lose a hand. People have lost fingers because of ****ing split cuticles. "because they filled mommy with enough mythic power to become a demi-god" - KP Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Malcador Posted August 13, 2014 Share Posted August 13, 2014 Trying to figure out how early to leave today, usually take the birthday off but...it's Wednesday, just annoying. And hey, not like I do work anyway Why has elegance found so little following? Elegance has the disadvantage that hard work is needed to achieve it and a good education to appreciate it. - Edsger Wybe Dijkstra Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sarex Posted August 13, 2014 Share Posted August 13, 2014 Trying to figure out how early to leave today, usually take the birthday off but...it's Wednesday, just annoying. And hey, not like I do work anyway Heh, mine was yesterday. Happy Birthday! "because they filled mommy with enough mythic power to become a demi-god" - KP Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gfted1 Posted August 13, 2014 Share Posted August 13, 2014 Happy Birthday Malcador!!!! Happy Birthday Sarex!!!! 2 "I'm your biggest fan, Ill follow you until you love me, Papa" Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Woldan Posted August 13, 2014 Share Posted August 13, 2014 (edited) Right back at you.NO U! Get that hand checked out, better to get some antibiotics just in case then lose a hand. People have lost fingers because of ****ing split cuticles.Really, the salt has worked so well that no further treatment is required, it worked like magic. It literally burned away all the bacteria and festering flesh, now all thats left is a clean, dry red spot that is getting better quickly. And happy womb departure day to Malcador and Sarex. Edited August 13, 2014 by Woldan 2 I gazed at the dead, and for one dark moment I saw a banquet. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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