Chilloutman Posted June 17, 2014 Posted June 17, 2014 am not certain who this is directed at, but we will note that there is valid reasons for including rape and sexual assaults in stories. rape is violent and ugly. other than a handful of extreme twisted persons, and perhaps those who like japanese pr0n manga, people understand that rape is evil. is one o' those few acts that ain't subject to moral relativism. the most depraved and irredeemable villains 'mongst us has had a mother or sister. as such, it takes very little empathy to be understanding that forced sex is a brutal and dehumanizing act. perhaps modern medias has ruined us all a bit. heck, look at crpgs and see that our heroic characters is mass murderers who could stack up their copses high 'nuff to challenge nimrod's tower. thieves and arsonists is as likely to be good guys as bad in our games. but rape is different. rape is evil, and so little is these days. yeah, there is some broken children on this board who might argue for rape as something other than vile and ugly, but do you think it is even remote possible that obsidian developers would follow such a lead? HA! Good Fun! except for some parts of world where its moraly completely ok to rape women, but she have to have correct clothes of course irony of morality in stoneage cultures, oh wait... I'm the enemy, 'cause I like to think, I like to read. I'm into freedom of speech, and freedom of choice. I'm the kinda guy that likes to sit in a greasy spoon and wonder, "Gee, should I have the T-bone steak or the jumbo rack of barbecue ribs with the side-order of gravy fries?" I want high cholesterol! I wanna eat bacon, and butter, and buckets of cheese, okay?! I wanna smoke a Cuban cigar the size of Cincinnati in the non-smoking section! I wanna run naked through the street, with green Jell-O all over my body, reading Playboy magazine. Why? Because I suddenly may feel the need to, okay, pal? I've SEEN the future. Do you know what it is? It's a 47-year-old virgin sitting around in his beige pajamas, drinking a banana-broccoli shake, singing "I'm an Oscar Meyer Wiene"
Nonek Posted June 17, 2014 Posted June 17, 2014 (edited) Another reason why I respected the Viper as an antagonist, he bested competition that was in and of itself fearsome, and could be said to have won the game simply with Foltest's assassination. Except that he was just working for someone else. As has always been the plot with the Witcher the real enemy is Nilfgaard, and as usual they are pretty much winning. Nilfgaard isn't my Geralt's enemy, Emhyr proved his good intentions the last time they met and my Witcher has no interest in politics or loyalty to the north. In fact as Ciri's father i'd say that there's a degree of respect there, especially after his decision to abandon prophecy and power for the sake of morality. Edit: Now the Aen Elle, those I would say are Geralt's enemy. Edited June 17, 2014 by Nonek 1 Quite an experience to live in misery isn't it? That's what it is to be married with children.I've seen things you people can't even imagine. Pearly Kings glittering on the Elephant and Castle, Morris Men dancing 'til the last light of midsummer. I watched Druid fires burning in the ruins of Stonehenge, and Yorkshiremen gurning for prizes. All these things will be lost in time, like alopecia on a skinhead. Time for tiffin. Tea for the teapot!
JFSOCC Posted June 17, 2014 Posted June 17, 2014 (edited) I think nothing should be taboo, I don't think Obsidian should care too much about sensitive sensibilities of its customers if it wants to have any artistic integrity. However if it doesn't add to the narrative or to gameplay it has no purpose and shouldn't be in the game. I highly doubt we'll see porn scenes in PoE, I just can't envision a scene where it would be relevant. (not precluding sexually explicit content, just think it is highly unlikely) Edited June 17, 2014 by JFSOCC Remember: Argue the point, not the person. Remain polite and constructive. Friendly forums have friendly debate. There's no shame in being wrong. If you don't have something to add, don't post for the sake of it. And don't be afraid to post thoughts you are uncertain about, that's what discussion is for.---Pet threads, everyone has them. I love imagining Gods, Monsters, Factions and Weapons.
Gromnir Posted June 17, 2014 Posted June 17, 2014 (edited) am not certain who this is directed at, but we will note that there is valid reasons for including rape and sexual assaults in stories. rape is violent and ugly. other than a handful of extreme twisted persons, and perhaps those who like japanese pr0n manga, people understand that rape is evil. is one o' those few acts that ain't subject to moral relativism. the most depraved and irredeemable villains 'mongst us has had a mother or sister. as such, it takes very little empathy to be understanding that forced sex is a brutal and dehumanizing act. perhaps modern medias has ruined us all a bit. heck, look at crpgs and see that our heroic characters is mass murderers who could stack up their copses high 'nuff to challenge nimrod's tower. thieves and arsonists is as likely to be good guys as bad in our games. but rape is different. rape is evil, and so little is these days. yeah, there is some broken children on this board who might argue for rape as something other than vile and ugly, but do you think it is even remote possible that obsidian developers would follow such a lead? HA! Good Fun! except for some parts of world where its moraly completely ok to rape women, but she have to have correct clothes of course irony of morality in stoneage cultures, oh wait... we knew this were coming. *sigh* there isn't any such place. really. sure, there is places in sub-saharan africa where rape happens frequently, but even there it is considered a bad thing. murder also happens in such places. just 'cause it happens frequent, don't think the people there is unaware that rape is bad. yeah, we suspect there was, in the distant past, times and places where women were considered less than human. and there Is some cultures even today wherein women is considered little better than property, but rape is still considered a violation in such places. exception: even today there is a suprising wide held belief that a wife cannot be raped by a husband, but again, am doubting obsidian would engage in such nonsense. *shrug* regardless, we knew some yutz would try the moral relativism shtick. grats. HA! Good Fun! ps portion o' post didnt post. Edited June 17, 2014 by Gromnir 1 "If there be time to expose through discussion the falsehood and fallacies, to avert the evil by the processes of education, the remedy to be applied is more speech, not enforced silence."Justice Louis Brandeis, Concurring, Whitney v. California, 274 U.S. 357 (1927) "Im indifferent to almost any murder as long as it doesn't affect me or mine."--Gfted1 (September 30, 2019)
BruceVC Posted June 17, 2014 Posted June 17, 2014 I dont understand once again what rape or sexual assault has do with "sexual content" in a game... are some of you obsessed with violence you never witnessed yourself but would certainly do as long as your not the victim? When we add these things why dont how to carve out unborn babys from pregnant woman... or how to torture the saw way like in medieval times... this was reality yes. So if i think it is ok and UP TO DATE to be free from all common sense let me dictate the future as a sicko what games should "advertize" my messed up mind tales in a subtle fashion. Reality is just that reality and there are many things that some might consider as horrible then one can imagine that happens day after day here but that doesnt mean that the "torture porn" trend is something good... no it is not! If you think it is cool then go out, look for the right person and insult him.... then you see how cool it is to sit behind a monitor and talk about these things. Fantasy games are not the witch hammer or mein kampf! And to make things clear... if you want these real storys go look around in the I-net and you find alot of these horrible things. That doesnt mean i have to be bombarded with tthat in a game i want to relax too. Search for silence of conspiracy etc. and have a nice day... And for you who think that rape is sex and not torture... hear some interviews from children who have witnessed that or grown up man coming out with these storys... you will see how much sex that was. Grow up! The church argued the same way btw about torture during the inquisition. It was HOLY and for the good thing. There you see how messed up you can be without common sense! am not certain who this is directed at, but we will note that there is valid reasons for including rape and sexual assaults in stories. rape is violent and ugly. other than a handful of extreme twisted persons, and perhaps those who like japanese pr0n manga, people understand that rape is evil. is one o' those few acts that ain't subject to moral relativism. the most depraved and irredeemable villains 'mongst us has had a mother or sister. as such, it takes very little empathy to be understanding that forced sex is a brutal and dehumanizing act. perhaps modern medias has ruined us all a bit. heck, look at crpgs and see that our heroic characters is mass murderers who could stack up their copses high 'nuff to challenge nimrod's tower. thieves and arsonists is as likely to be good guys as bad in our games. but rape is different. rape is evil, and so little is these days. yeah, there is some broken children on this board who might argue for rape as something other than vile and ugly, but do you think it is even remote possible that obsidian developers would follow such a lead? HA! Good Fun! Gromnir what are saying? Do you mean there is no point discussing our utter contempt for topics like including rape in the game because Obsidian will never include them in the game anyway? Oh and in almost cases rape is not about sex but rather a form of power over women, this is directed at anyone who has the absurd idea that rape is about sex "Abashed the devil stood and felt how awful goodness is and saw Virtue in her shape how lovely: and pined his loss” John Milton "We don't stop playing because we grow old; we grow old because we stop playing.” - George Bernard Shaw "What counts in life is not the mere fact that we have lived. It is what difference we have made to the lives of others that will determine the significance of the life we lead" - Nelson Mandela
WotanAnubis Posted June 17, 2014 Posted June 17, 2014 A pity if the world does not contain bawdy houses and strumpets, not for the titillation factor, as i'm not particularly attracted to pixels or text descriptions, but for the depth and cohesiveness of the world as a whole. One can imagine doxies and madames being excellent sources of information and possible informants, especially if they're an unusual take on the profession. I suddenly had this vision of the possibility to change part of your Stronghold into a bordello in order to get information. Information that you could also get other ways, because player options and whatnot, but still... you could employ a torturer, but why would you when you could hire a madam instead? Besides, think of the increased revenue. I don't think it's going to happen, but it was an amusing mental image. 3
Gromnir Posted June 17, 2014 Posted June 17, 2014 I dont understand once again what rape or sexual assault has do with "sexual content" in a game... are some of you obsessed with violence you never witnessed yourself but would certainly do as long as your not the victim? When we add these things why dont how to carve out unborn babys from pregnant woman... or how to torture the saw way like in medieval times... this was reality yes. So if i think it is ok and UP TO DATE to be free from all common sense let me dictate the future as a sicko what games should "advertize" my messed up mind tales in a subtle fashion. Reality is just that reality and there are many things that some might consider as horrible then one can imagine that happens day after day here but that doesnt mean that the "torture porn" trend is something good... no it is not! If you think it is cool then go out, look for the right person and insult him.... then you see how cool it is to sit behind a monitor and talk about these things. Fantasy games are not the witch hammer or mein kampf! And to make things clear... if you want these real storys go look around in the I-net and you find alot of these horrible things. That doesnt mean i have to be bombarded with tthat in a game i want to relax too. Search for silence of conspiracy etc. and have a nice day... And for you who think that rape is sex and not torture... hear some interviews from children who have witnessed that or grown up man coming out with these storys... you will see how much sex that was. Grow up! The church argued the same way btw about torture during the inquisition. It was HOLY and for the good thing. There you see how messed up you can be without common sense! am not certain who this is directed at, but we will note that there is valid reasons for including rape and sexual assaults in stories. rape is violent and ugly. other than a handful of extreme twisted persons, and perhaps those who like japanese pr0n manga, people understand that rape is evil. is one o' those few acts that ain't subject to moral relativism. the most depraved and irredeemable villains 'mongst us has had a mother or sister. as such, it takes very little empathy to be understanding that forced sex is a brutal and dehumanizing act. perhaps modern medias has ruined us all a bit. heck, look at crpgs and see that our heroic characters is mass murderers who could stack up their copses high 'nuff to challenge nimrod's tower. thieves and arsonists is as likely to be good guys as bad in our games. but rape is different. rape is evil, and so little is these days. yeah, there is some broken children on this board who might argue for rape as something other than vile and ugly, but do you think it is even remote possible that obsidian developers would follow such a lead? HA! Good Fun! Gromnir what are saying? Do you mean there is no point discussing our utter contempt for topics like including rape in the game because Obsidian will never include them in the game anyway? Oh and in almost cases rape is not about sex but rather a form of power over women, this is directed at anyone who has the absurd idea that rape is about sex 1) as to first point, that is not what we is saying at all. 2) as to second point. so what? is complete beside the point. rape is evil but it is, by definition, sexual in nature. HA! Good Fun! "If there be time to expose through discussion the falsehood and fallacies, to avert the evil by the processes of education, the remedy to be applied is more speech, not enforced silence."Justice Louis Brandeis, Concurring, Whitney v. California, 274 U.S. 357 (1927) "Im indifferent to almost any murder as long as it doesn't affect me or mine."--Gfted1 (September 30, 2019)
aluminiumtrioxid Posted June 17, 2014 Posted June 17, 2014 Personally I thought that was a bonus, I like good and challenging antagonists And I think it would have been better if you could hear them out, go "wait a minute... this actually kinda makes sense", then shrug and let them do whatever they were planning to do "Lulz is not the highest aspiration of art and mankind, no matter what the Encyclopedia Dramatica says."
Nonek Posted June 17, 2014 Posted June 17, 2014 (edited) Personally I thought that was a bonus, I like good and challenging antagonists And I think it would have been better if you could hear them out, go "wait a minute... this actually kinda makes sense", then shrug and let them do whatever they were planning to do You wanted to let their enslaved Dragon eat you? That's a bit silly, I mean i'm fine with helping Sile, but i'm not commiting suicide for them. Edit: Though personally I think they were just as short sighted as the rest of the northern monarchs, barring Radovid, to be raising rebellion in Aedirn with Nilfgaard practicaly salivating on the norths doorstep. Edited June 17, 2014 by Nonek Quite an experience to live in misery isn't it? That's what it is to be married with children.I've seen things you people can't even imagine. Pearly Kings glittering on the Elephant and Castle, Morris Men dancing 'til the last light of midsummer. I watched Druid fires burning in the ruins of Stonehenge, and Yorkshiremen gurning for prizes. All these things will be lost in time, like alopecia on a skinhead. Time for tiffin. Tea for the teapot!
Blarghagh Posted June 17, 2014 Posted June 17, 2014 except for some parts of world where its moraly completely ok to rape women, but she have to have correct clothes of course irony of morality in stoneage cultures, oh wait... we knew this were coming. *sigh* there isn't any such place. really. sure, there is places in sub-saharan africa where rape happens frequently, but even there it is considered a bad thing. murder also happens in such places. just 'cause it happens frequent, don't think the people there is unaware that rape is bad. yeah, we suspect there was, in the distant past, times and places where women were considered less than human. and there Is some cultures even today wherein women is considered little better than property, but rape is still considered a violation in such places. exception: even today there is a suprising wide held belief that a wife cannot be raped by a husband, but again, am doubting obsidian would engage in such nonsense. *shrug* regardless, we knew some yutz would try the moral relativism shtick. grats. HA! Good Fun! As much as I wish it was true, I'm not sure that is entirely accurate. 1
Gromnir Posted June 17, 2014 Posted June 17, 2014 except for some parts of world where its moraly completely ok to rape women, but she have to have correct clothes of course irony of morality in stoneage cultures, oh wait... we knew this were coming. *sigh* there isn't any such place. really. sure, there is places in sub-saharan africa where rape happens frequently, but even there it is considered a bad thing. murder also happens in such places. just 'cause it happens frequent, don't think the people there is unaware that rape is bad. yeah, we suspect there was, in the distant past, times and places where women were considered less than human. and there Is some cultures even today wherein women is considered little better than property, but rape is still considered a violation in such places. exception: even today there is a suprising wide held belief that a wife cannot be raped by a husband, but again, am doubting obsidian would engage in such nonsense. *shrug* regardless, we knew some yutz would try the moral relativism shtick. grats. HA! Good Fun! As much as I wish it was true, I'm not sure that is entirely accurate. is getting attention 'cause the guy said something stoopid... though we did mention in another thread that the parliamentary elections in india were far more relevant than the euro ones for precise the reason we see above. women and gays is gonna have things rough in india for near future. terrible. the good/bad o' parliamentary elections is that we get guys like the schnook above, and the clown in russia that did... http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-2609016/Six-month-pregnant-journalist-taken-hospital-treatment-pro-Kremlin-political-leader-ordered-aides-violently-rape-press-conference-asked-sanctions-against-Ukraine.html HA! Good Fun! "If there be time to expose through discussion the falsehood and fallacies, to avert the evil by the processes of education, the remedy to be applied is more speech, not enforced silence."Justice Louis Brandeis, Concurring, Whitney v. California, 274 U.S. 357 (1927) "Im indifferent to almost any murder as long as it doesn't affect me or mine."--Gfted1 (September 30, 2019)
Darji Posted June 17, 2014 Posted June 17, 2014 (edited) I dont understand once again what rape or sexual assault has do with "sexual content" in a game... are some of you obsessed with violence you never witnessed yourself but would certainly do as long as your not the victim? When we add these things why dont how to carve out unborn babys from pregnant woman... or how to torture the saw way like in medieval times... this was reality yes. So if i think it is ok and UP TO DATE to be free from all common sense let me dictate the future as a sicko what games should "advertize" my messed up mind tales in a subtle fashion. Reality is just that reality and there are many things that some might consider as horrible then one can imagine that happens day after day here but that doesnt mean that the "torture porn" trend is something good... no it is not! If you think it is cool then go out, look for the right person and insult him.... then you see how cool it is to sit behind a monitor and talk about these things. Fantasy games are not the witch hammer or mein kampf! And to make things clear... if you want these real storys go look around in the I-net and you find alot of these horrible things. That doesnt mean i have to be bombarded with tthat in a game i want to relax too. Search for silence of conspiracy etc. and have a nice day... And for you who think that rape is sex and not torture... hear some interviews from children who have witnessed that or grown up man coming out with these storys... you will see how much sex that was. Grow up! The church argued the same way btw about torture during the inquisition. It was HOLY and for the good thing. There you see how messed up you can be without common sense! I am a bit different. I do not want to relax while playing story heavy games. I want emotions. When I played the last of us I really had a ****ty time but not because the game was bad but rather because it was brutal, bleak and hopeless and they did a perfect job to transfer it though the game. I also think that games should shy away from make every game fun. Just like the movie industry Gaming needs these emotional and bleak and shocking scenes and games to mature in my opinion at least. Of course fun is also important but if I want to relax I rather play a mindless jump and run or indy game. Story heavy heavy games are great for also showing a different vibe in games. Same goes for movies or TV series. Why do so many people watch stuff like Walking dead or Game of Thrones? Not because it is cool but because they want emotion and literally feel bad. It is part of human nature. That is also why the Walking Dead won so many GOTY Awards as well. Edited June 17, 2014 by Darji
Gromnir Posted June 17, 2014 Posted June 17, 2014 I dont understand once again what rape or sexual assault has do with "sexual content" in a game... are some of you obsessed with violence you never witnessed yourself but would certainly do as long as your not the victim? When we add these things why dont how to carve out unborn babys from pregnant woman... or how to torture the saw way like in medieval times... this was reality yes. So if i think it is ok and UP TO DATE to be free from all common sense let me dictate the future as a sicko what games should "advertize" my messed up mind tales in a subtle fashion. Reality is just that reality and there are many things that some might consider as horrible then one can imagine that happens day after day here but that doesnt mean that the "torture porn" trend is something good... no it is not! If you think it is cool then go out, look for the right person and insult him.... then you see how cool it is to sit behind a monitor and talk about these things. Fantasy games are not the witch hammer or mein kampf! And to make things clear... if you want these real storys go look around in the I-net and you find alot of these horrible things. That doesnt mean i have to be bombarded with tthat in a game i want to relax too. Search for silence of conspiracy etc. and have a nice day... And for you who think that rape is sex and not torture... hear some interviews from children who have witnessed that or grown up man coming out with these storys... you will see how much sex that was. Grow up! The church argued the same way btw about torture during the inquisition. It was HOLY and for the good thing. There you see how messed up you can be without common sense! I am a bit different. I do not want to relax while playing story heavy games. I want emotions. When I played the last of us I really had a ****ty time but not because the game was bad but rather because it was brutal, bleak and hopeless and they did a perfect job to transfer it though the game. I also think that games should shy away from make every game fun. Just like the movie industry Gaming needs these emotional and bleak and shocking scenes and games to mature in my opinion at least. Of course fun is also important but if I want to relax I rather play a mindless jump and run or indy game. Story heavy heavy games are great for also showing a different vibe in games. Same goes for movies or TV series. Why do so many people watch stuff like Walking dead or Game of Thrones? Not because it is cool but because they want emotion and literally feel bad. It is part of human nature. That is also why the Walking Dead won so many GOTY Awards as well. darji pov is... odd. am simply not gonna be able to have meeting of the minds with him/her. gaming doesn't need bleak and shocking more than any other kinda media. for some games, shocking may be appropriate. is possible that "bleak" can enhance a game. that being said, am not gonna say that the industry needs shocking or bleak. shock needs a point. bleak needs a point. am not even gonna retread the wacky taboo craziness we dealt with earlier, but while we do not want developers to feel that controversial is off-limits, over-indulgence or forced use of "shock" and "bleak" is an even greater crime. you can make a very good game that ain't the least bit controversial, but a game that does controversial badly or forcibly is gonna end up as a poor game. HA! Good Fun! "If there be time to expose through discussion the falsehood and fallacies, to avert the evil by the processes of education, the remedy to be applied is more speech, not enforced silence."Justice Louis Brandeis, Concurring, Whitney v. California, 274 U.S. 357 (1927) "Im indifferent to almost any murder as long as it doesn't affect me or mine."--Gfted1 (September 30, 2019)
BruceVC Posted June 17, 2014 Posted June 17, 2014 I dont understand once again what rape or sexual assault has do with "sexual content" in a game... are some of you obsessed with violence you never witnessed yourself but would certainly do as long as your not the victim? When we add these things why dont how to carve out unborn babys from pregnant woman... or how to torture the saw way like in medieval times... this was reality yes. So if i think it is ok and UP TO DATE to be free from all common sense let me dictate the future as a sicko what games should "advertize" my messed up mind tales in a subtle fashion. Reality is just that reality and there are many things that some might consider as horrible then one can imagine that happens day after day here but that doesnt mean that the "torture porn" trend is something good... no it is not! If you think it is cool then go out, look for the right person and insult him.... then you see how cool it is to sit behind a monitor and talk about these things. Fantasy games are not the witch hammer or mein kampf! And to make things clear... if you want these real storys go look around in the I-net and you find alot of these horrible things. That doesnt mean i have to be bombarded with tthat in a game i want to relax too. Search for silence of conspiracy etc. and have a nice day... And for you who think that rape is sex and not torture... hear some interviews from children who have witnessed that or grown up man coming out with these storys... you will see how much sex that was. Grow up! The church argued the same way btw about torture during the inquisition. It was HOLY and for the good thing. There you see how messed up you can be without common sense! . Of course fun is also important but if I want to relax I rather play a mindless jump and run or indy game. Story heavy heavy games are great for also showing a different vibe in games. Same goes for movies or TV series. Why do so many people watch stuff like Walking dead or Game of Thrones? Not because it is cool but because they want emotion and literally feel bad. It is part of human nature. I don't think people watch a series like Game of Thrones to feel bad, I don't think that's a valid reason for most people. They watch the series because its an exciting and epic fantasy saga where we become attached to various characters and the story. And we want to see how the various plots develop. These are positive and typical reasons why people generally follow popular genres like fantasy. But I don't get why you would feel bad by watching Game of Thrones? "Abashed the devil stood and felt how awful goodness is and saw Virtue in her shape how lovely: and pined his loss” John Milton "We don't stop playing because we grow old; we grow old because we stop playing.” - George Bernard Shaw "What counts in life is not the mere fact that we have lived. It is what difference we have made to the lives of others that will determine the significance of the life we lead" - Nelson Mandela
Darji Posted June 17, 2014 Posted June 17, 2014 I dont understand once again what rape or sexual assault has do with "sexual content" in a game... are some of you obsessed with violence you never witnessed yourself but would certainly do as long as your not the victim? When we add these things why dont how to carve out unborn babys from pregnant woman... or how to torture the saw way like in medieval times... this was reality yes. So if i think it is ok and UP TO DATE to be free from all common sense let me dictate the future as a sicko what games should "advertize" my messed up mind tales in a subtle fashion. Reality is just that reality and there are many things that some might consider as horrible then one can imagine that happens day after day here but that doesnt mean that the "torture porn" trend is something good... no it is not! If you think it is cool then go out, look for the right person and insult him.... then you see how cool it is to sit behind a monitor and talk about these things. Fantasy games are not the witch hammer or mein kampf! And to make things clear... if you want these real storys go look around in the I-net and you find alot of these horrible things. That doesnt mean i have to be bombarded with tthat in a game i want to relax too. Search for silence of conspiracy etc. and have a nice day... And for you who think that rape is sex and not torture... hear some interviews from children who have witnessed that or grown up man coming out with these storys... you will see how much sex that was. Grow up! The church argued the same way btw about torture during the inquisition. It was HOLY and for the good thing. There you see how messed up you can be without common sense! I am a bit different. I do not want to relax while playing story heavy games. I want emotions. When I played the last of us I really had a ****ty time but not because the game was bad but rather because it was brutal, bleak and hopeless and they did a perfect job to transfer it though the game. I also think that games should shy away from make every game fun. Just like the movie industry Gaming needs these emotional and bleak and shocking scenes and games to mature in my opinion at least. Of course fun is also important but if I want to relax I rather play a mindless jump and run or indy game. Story heavy heavy games are great for also showing a different vibe in games. Same goes for movies or TV series. Why do so many people watch stuff like Walking dead or Game of Thrones? Not because it is cool but because they want emotion and literally feel bad. It is part of human nature. That is also why the Walking Dead won so many GOTY Awards as well. darji pov is... odd. am simply not gonna be able to have meeting of the minds with him/her. gaming doesn't need bleak and shocking more than any other kinda media. for some games, shocking may be appropriate. is possible that "bleak" can enhance a game. that being said, am not gonna say that the industry needs shocking or bleak. shock needs a point. bleak needs a point. am not even gonna retread the wacky taboo craziness we dealt with earlier, but while we do not want developers to feel that controversial is off-limits, over-indulgence or forced use of "shock" and "bleak" is an even greater crime. you can make a very good game that ain't the least bit controversial, but a game that does controversial badly or forcibly is gonna end up as a poor game. HA! Good Fun! I play games because of the story. Gameplay especially in AAA or RPG games is secondary to me . And personally I would love more mature and better written stories. Stories in Games still feel like Movies from the 70s: mostly pretty bad stories and execution. And yes you are right Gaming does not need more bleak or shocking moments than any other media But right now they have almost none. A lot of things are a taboo which are totally normal in movies and series which is quite sad since I believe that games through the interaction could have a much bigger impact on your emotions than movies ever could do. But for that we also need much better writing. We are slowly getting there but as long these writers are afraid of trying something never before done in terms of story and video games we will sadly never reach that point. That is why I am very grateful for games like the Last of Us, Walking Dead or the Wolf Among us. Obsidian also does really really well in terms of writing so that is why I hope they could push these taboo topics at least a bit further. I am quite tired of all dudebro action and emotionless games. There is nothing wrong with such games but if 95% of game stories are terrible I have no other choice than support such games^^ As I said gaming does not always need to be fun and relaxing.^^ PS: Oh and I am a guy by the way.
Failion Posted June 17, 2014 Posted June 17, 2014 I think rape would make for a powerful plot device. A high ranking male paladin part of a order gets captured by Bugbears and gets raped turns him fallen and demented. Blames his order for his rape and secretly plots to destroy it by seeking a paladin with slightly rebellious nature and tricking him to further his agenda. If I can suspend my disbelief and not feel like a giant douche killing thousands of humanoids who have families in the sword coast I can handle rape being used in game also.
rjshae Posted June 17, 2014 Posted June 17, 2014 A few thoughts regarding the subject: In a setting that mixes soul magic, backwards superstition, and diverse humanoid races, much unique lore may have arisen regarding sexual practices. For example, some might (falsely) believe that the godlike are the result of illicit unions with different races, or that the type of soul your child receives is dependent on your past sexual practices. The races could each have unique sexually transmitted diseases that can not be directly communicated to other races. In civilized nations, this could have come to provide a motive to engage in casual sex with a different race. Some may exploit this by recruiting (or enslaving) non-human prostitutes for brothels in human-dominated areas. Some form of sex-related soul magic may have developed, which results in unique empowerment lasting for some period of time. Strange cults may have developed around this effect, while sexual predators may be motivated to gain additional soul power. "It has just been discovered that research causes cancer in rats."
Lephys Posted June 17, 2014 Posted June 17, 2014 Just my two cents: Maturely handled sexual content does not = "sex scenes." Just because there's violence in the game doesn't mean there's an action cam that zooms in on all the sword blows, and you're constantly slicing people in half and chopping up their arms even after they're dead, and urinating upon their severed heads. It's the same with sexual content. Not-avoiding it means that they can have it in a context/setting/situation. There can be some assassin loose in the castle, and you start checking all the rooms, and burst in on some noble's daughter and some other guy in a bed. And/or you can have situations in brothels, etc. Doesn't mean there have to be any specific scenes or focuses specifically on a bunch of naked people or sexual acts. 1 Should we not start with some Ipelagos, or at least some Greater Ipelagos, before tackling a named Arch Ipelago? 6_u
Darji Posted June 17, 2014 Posted June 17, 2014 Just my two cents: Maturely handled sexual content does not = "sex scenes." Just because there's violence in the game doesn't mean there's an action cam that zooms in on all the sword blows, and you're constantly slicing people in half and chopping up their arms even after they're dead, and urinating upon their severed heads. It's the same with sexual content. Not-avoiding it means that they can have it in a context/setting/situation. There can be some assassin loose in the castle, and you start checking all the rooms, and burst in on some noble's daughter and some other guy in a bed. And/or you can have situations in brothels, etc. Doesn't mean there have to be any specific scenes or focuses specifically on a bunch of naked people or sexual acts. Yeah totally agree. I think this sexual expicit content is exactly stuff like that. These could be themes, topics not the act itself.
Faerunner Posted June 17, 2014 Posted June 17, 2014 I think rape would make for a powerful plot device. A high ranking male paladin part of a order gets captured by Bugbears and gets raped turns him fallen and demented. Blames his order for his rape and secretly plots to destroy it by seeking a paladin with slightly rebellious nature and tricking him to further his agenda. If I can suspend my disbelief and not feel like a giant douche killing thousands of humanoids who have families in the sword coast I can handle rape being used in game also. I disagree, because rape gets used in fiction so much as a quick, cheap, easy stab at drama or plot point that it's lost all meaning. Overuse and casual use makes it less shocking, not more. Which is bad, because in real life rape is traumatizing. It's emotionally devastating to the victims, and often creates post-traumatic stress, trauma triggers, emotional scars, etc. Not for nothing many people and cultures view it as "a living death." I think if the writers can create drama without including rape, I would prefer they did. I think it would force them to come up with more innovative and emotionally charging storylines and scenarios, rather than just using rape as a quick ticket to emotional angst. (Like the above scenario of the paladin getting kidnapped by Bugbears becoming disillusioned with his order and going on a rampage against them. Rather than just slapping a rape sticker on him, they should make a more involved scenario, like he was kidnapped and tortured for weeks, but his order didn't come save him because they had other pressing concerns, or due to politics, or corruption higher up, then he became disillusioned that way.) Also, I worry about the blithe way you dismiss rape as being easy to sit through. If sexual assault has never happened to you or someone you know, sure it's easy to sit through it without feeling anything. For those with personal experience, or have a loved one who went through it, it's not as easy. I wouldn't recommend just throwing things like that out there because for a lot of people, it can be horrible to sit through, set off a trigger, make them relive their own pain, etc. 3 "Not I, though. Not I," said the hanging dwarf.
Calmar Posted June 17, 2014 Posted June 17, 2014 I think rape would make for a powerful plot device. A high ranking male paladin part of a order gets captured by Bugbears and gets raped turns him fallen and demented. Blames his order for his rape and secretly plots to destroy it by seeking a paladin with slightly rebellious nature and tricking him to further his agenda. If I can suspend my disbelief and not feel like a giant douche killing thousands of humanoids who have families in the sword coast I can handle rape being used in game also. I think rape is among the most boring devices to establish someone as a villain. Worse are only burning orphanages and kicking puppies. Your example is basically a scenario about a guy who's unable to cope with his suffering. That's fine. Having him being a man of virtue and reputation who's raped by monsters looks more like morbid excitement about and fascination with the violence and humiliation itself, as opposed to the effect it had on him. Also, I worry about the blithe way you dismiss rape as being easy to sit through. If sexual assault has never happened to you or someone you know, sure it's easy to sit through it without feeling anything. For those with personal experience, or have a loved one who went through it, it's not as easy. I wouldn't recommend just throwing things like that out there because for a lot of people, it can be horrible to sit through, set off a trigger, make them relive their own pain, etc. I agree with you, but at the same time I wonder if violence and war (tried and true story devices) don't have the same effect on those who had to endure them in real life. Age of Wonders III !!!
Darji Posted June 17, 2014 Posted June 17, 2014 I think rape would make for a powerful plot device. A high ranking male paladin part of a order gets captured by Bugbears and gets raped turns him fallen and demented. Blames his order for his rape and secretly plots to destroy it by seeking a paladin with slightly rebellious nature and tricking him to further his agenda. If I can suspend my disbelief and not feel like a giant douche killing thousands of humanoids who have families in the sword coast I can handle rape being used in game also. I disagree, because rape gets used in fiction so much as a quick, cheap, easy stab at drama or plot point that it's lost all meaning. Overuse and casual use makes it less shocking, not more. Which is bad, because in real life rape is traumatizing. It's emotionally devastating to the victims, and often creates post-traumatic stress, trauma triggers, emotional scars, etc. Not for nothing many people and cultures view it as "a living death." I think if the writers can create drama without including rape, I would prefer they did. I think it would force them to come up with more innovative and emotionally charging storylines and scenarios, rather than just using rape as a quick ticket to emotional angst. (Like the above scenario of the paladin getting kidnapped by Bugbears becoming disillusioned with his order and going on a rampage against them. Rather than just slapping a rape sticker on him, they should make a more involved scenario, like he was kidnapped and tortured for weeks, but his order didn't come save him because they had other pressing concerns, or due to politics, or corruption higher up, then he became disillusioned that way.) Also, I worry about the blithe way you dismiss rape as being easy to sit through. If sexual assault has never happened to you or someone you know, sure it's easy to sit through it without feeling anything. For those with personal experience, or have a loved one who went through it, it's not as easy. I wouldn't recommend just throwing things like that out there because for a lot of people, it can be horrible to sit through, set off a trigger, make them relive their own pain, etc. Yeah totally agree do not use these heavy topics in a longer storyline or some major theme of a questline etc. Do not use it strictly because it is a taboo. Make it meaningful. Make people feel uncomfortable by seeing and playing these scenarios. But on the other hand do not shy away from it because it is a taboo in gaming. If its meaningful and you thought a lot about how to include this heavy thematic do it. Movies use these heavy themes a lot games rarely or not at all. That is where I see a big difference. Interactive media can be way more intense than any movie could and that is were I see big potential. 1
Lephys Posted June 17, 2014 Posted June 17, 2014 (edited) I definitely think it's probably quite sufficient to merely say "this bad guy is a person who does that sort of thing/wouldn't think twice about having his way with folks," without ever specifically focusing or spotlighting the act itself. I don't think much is really gained at all (even by people for whom it doesn't hit close to home) by actually simulating the experience/process/act. Honestly, it'd be pretty seemingly beneficial to have a character written (from actual research/experience) as having gone through it in their past, and currently carrying on with their lives and finding ways to cope, etc. I mean, that's the story of humanity: Bad things happen in the world (whether it's other humans or nature that's the cause), and we see our greatest strength in the form of cooperation in the same struggle. We find our most meaningful connections via common experience. *shrug* It's just one thing for the game world to be a world where the people throughout suffer from the same things people in reality suffer from, and another thing to have it present the happenings to us, "on-stage" so to speak. That's one of the coolest things about RPG characters, though. They can emulate the human struggle, in a positive way. This character's all tiny and not strong, and gets made fun of? But look, mechanically/mathematically, how useful/helpful they are! They can do things others' cannot! This other character went through crazy stuff in a war and has only one arm? Look how you can help him, and how he can choose to fight on, anyway, for what's right in the world. Etc. When they're well-written, they can show us what humans are capable of, in a good way. We don't really need any help finding out what humans are capable of in a negative sense. Edited June 17, 2014 by Lephys 1 Should we not start with some Ipelagos, or at least some Greater Ipelagos, before tackling a named Arch Ipelago? 6_u
Gromnir Posted June 17, 2014 Posted June 17, 2014 (edited) I dont understand once again what rape or sexual assault has do with "sexual content" in a game... are some of you obsessed with violence you never witnessed yourself but would certainly do as long as your not the victim? When we add these things why dont how to carve out unborn babys from pregnant woman... or how to torture the saw way like in medieval times... this was reality yes. So if i think it is ok and UP TO DATE to be free from all common sense let me dictate the future as a sicko what games should "advertize" my messed up mind tales in a subtle fashion. Reality is just that reality and there are many things that some might consider as horrible then one can imagine that happens day after day here but that doesnt mean that the "torture porn" trend is something good... no it is not! If you think it is cool then go out, look for the right person and insult him.... then you see how cool it is to sit behind a monitor and talk about these things. Fantasy games are not the witch hammer or mein kampf! And to make things clear... if you want these real storys go look around in the I-net and you find alot of these horrible things. That doesnt mean i have to be bombarded with tthat in a game i want to relax too. Search for silence of conspiracy etc. and have a nice day... And for you who think that rape is sex and not torture... hear some interviews from children who have witnessed that or grown up man coming out with these storys... you will see how much sex that was. Grow up! The church argued the same way btw about torture during the inquisition. It was HOLY and for the good thing. There you see how messed up you can be without common sense! I am a bit different. I do not want to relax while playing story heavy games. I want emotions. When I played the last of us I really had a ****ty time but not because the game was bad but rather because it was brutal, bleak and hopeless and they did a perfect job to transfer it though the game. I also think that games should shy away from make every game fun. Just like the movie industry Gaming needs these emotional and bleak and shocking scenes and games to mature in my opinion at least. Of course fun is also important but if I want to relax I rather play a mindless jump and run or indy game. Story heavy heavy games are great for also showing a different vibe in games. Same goes for movies or TV series. Why do so many people watch stuff like Walking dead or Game of Thrones? Not because it is cool but because they want emotion and literally feel bad. It is part of human nature. That is also why the Walking Dead won so many GOTY Awards as well. darji pov is... odd. am simply not gonna be able to have meeting of the minds with him/her. gaming doesn't need bleak and shocking more than any other kinda media. for some games, shocking may be appropriate. is possible that "bleak" can enhance a game. that being said, am not gonna say that the industry needs shocking or bleak. shock needs a point. bleak needs a point. am not even gonna retread the wacky taboo craziness we dealt with earlier, but while we do not want developers to feel that controversial is off-limits, over-indulgence or forced use of "shock" and "bleak" is an even greater crime. you can make a very good game that ain't the least bit controversial, but a game that does controversial badly or forcibly is gonna end up as a poor game. HA! Good Fun! I play games because of the story. Gameplay especially in AAA or RPG games is secondary to me . And personally I would love more mature and better written stories. Stories in Games still feel like Movies from the 70s: mostly pretty bad stories and execution. And yes you are right Gaming does not need more bleak or shocking moments than any other media But right now they have almost none. A lot of things are a taboo which are totally normal in movies and series which is quite sad since I believe that games through the interaction could have a much bigger impact on your emotions than movies ever could do. But for that we also need much better writing. We are slowly getting there but as long these writers are afraid of trying something never before done in terms of story and video games we will sadly never reach that point. That is why I am very grateful for games like the Last of Us, Walking Dead or the Wolf Among us. Obsidian also does really really well in terms of writing so that is why I hope they could push these taboo topics at least a bit further. I am quite tired of all dudebro action and emotionless games. There is nothing wrong with such games but if 95% of game stories are terrible I have no other choice than support such games^^ As I said gaming does not always need to be fun and relaxing.^^ PS: Oh and I am a guy by the way. everything you say doesn't make sense to us. movies from the 70s you see as some how inherent flawed? on our top twenty movie list, near 1/2 are from the seventies alone. just as we can name 100 great novels Not challenging taboo, we can name literal dozens of great movies from the 1970s. we still don't get your weir pre 1900 literature comment. also, while we understand why you want better writing, we don't see how you insist on linking this with mature, or your own odd definition o' taboo. ... based on an earlier post, we did get that you don't seem to like harry potter. fine. we don't like harry potter neither. however, perhaps you is having the popular but misguided notion that harry potter is representative of fare for kids, and you want something more adult... maybe. dunno as you is all over the place. we will observe that harry potter is now the first books many people think o' when considering the merits o' children books. if harry potter is written for those who ain't mature and it is bad, then clearly mature is good... or somesuch flawed logic... or who knows. since this is our list reference post o' the day, we will observe that if we were to compile a list o' the best fantasy written in the last 100 years, many o' the books would be children's books. madelene l'engle, norton juster, phillip pullman, neil gaiman, as well as c.s. lewis and tolkien would be prominent authors on that list and it would be 'cause o' their works for kids. kids books is frequent as dark and as sad (since you seem preoccupied with sad as a good thing) as works written for adults, but they is necessarily written without much o' the pretension that writers wanna heap on adult readers. am having no idea what the hell "mature" means nowadays, but am damn certain we can do without it if that left us nothing but more o' the best so-called children's fare. you says you play games for story? great. go read wrinkle in time or phantom tollbooth or the graveyard book and then tell us what game has ever done superior story. HA! Good Fun! Edited June 17, 2014 by Gromnir "If there be time to expose through discussion the falsehood and fallacies, to avert the evil by the processes of education, the remedy to be applied is more speech, not enforced silence."Justice Louis Brandeis, Concurring, Whitney v. California, 274 U.S. 357 (1927) "Im indifferent to almost any murder as long as it doesn't affect me or mine."--Gfted1 (September 30, 2019)
Failion Posted June 18, 2014 Posted June 18, 2014 I think rape would make for a powerful plot device. A high ranking male paladin part of a order gets captured by Bugbears and gets raped turns him fallen and demented. Blames his order for his rape and secretly plots to destroy it by seeking a paladin with slightly rebellious nature and tricking him to further his agenda. If I can suspend my disbelief and not feel like a giant douche killing thousands of humanoids who have families in the sword coast I can handle rape being used in game also. I disagree, because rape gets used in fiction so much as a quick, cheap, easy stab at drama or plot point that it's lost all meaning. Overuse and casual use makes it less shocking, not more. You can call anything a quick, cheap, easy stab at drama or plot lol. I think rape would make for a powerful plot device. A high ranking male paladin part of a order gets captured by Bugbears and gets raped turns him fallen and demented. Blames his order for his rape and secretly plots to destroy it by seeking a paladin with slightly rebellious nature and tricking him to further his agenda. If I can suspend my disbelief and not feel like a giant douche killing thousands of humanoids who have families in the sword coast I can handle rape being used in game also. I think rape is among the most boring devices to establish someone as a villain. Worse are only burning orphanages and kicking puppies. Your example is basically a scenario about a guy who's unable to cope with his suffering. That's fine. Having him being a man of virtue and reputation who's raped by monsters looks more like morbid excitement about and fascination with the violence and humiliation itself, as opposed to the effect it had on him. Uh how about no then about the fascination with violence and humilation then? I don't see how its a boring device. It could act as a gateway drug to someones dark side and not necessarily be the sole reason they go rouge. That same paladin could of killed in the past in the name of his order and subconsciously liked to kill, the paladins rape simply acted like alcohol added mixed his new found hatred of his order made him into monster he was all along.
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